CAPR 60-1, 99 Lead Balloons

Started by Eclipse, November 14, 2017, 04:10:00 AM

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Eclipse

https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/CAPR_601__Cadet_Program_Management__36D2A228D5925.pdf

Let's start calling out the changes...

"2.4.1.4. Standard of Training – Unit Level. Because no cadet unit can succeed without adult
leadership, every cadet unit shall have at least two members who have graduated from a TLC course (any
level). Beginning 1 January 2019, TLC graduation credentials must have been earned within the previous
48 months to satisfy this section's requirement.
Thereafter, members renew their graduation credential
every 48 months by repeating a TLC, completing a higher level TLC, completing TLC Refresher, or serving
as an instructor. Wings are responsible for providing extra mentoring to units that are not in compliance."


"2.10.3. Paint Ball and Simunitions. Cadets may participate in paint ball or simunition-type (force-onforce
marking cartridge) training activities only under the supervision of a law enforcement agency or
military unit
and the HAA guidelines of 2.9. During these activities, cadets must wear protective
equipment to include, at a minimum, head and face protection, plus any additional gear required by the
host agency."


"2.5.3. Alcohol & Recreational Drugs. Cadets will not possess or consume alcohol nor use drugs
prohibited under federal law, even if local law permits their use
. Further, tobacco products and ecigarettes
(vaping) are prohibited for cadets at CAP activities. Seniors will not consume alcohol at activities
conducted primarily for cadets if they can reasonably expect to encounter cadets later that day. Seniors
will not use tobacco products or e-cigarettes in the presence of cadets.
"


"2.6.2.4. Winter Camping. Camping in conditions where the temperature may fall below 30OF may
be conducted only as a high adventure activity (HAA, see 2.9 below) and in accordance with Table 2.3. The
HAA proposal must describe plans for warming cadets, dealing with wet conditions, and evacuation to
indoor facilities."


"2.6.2.5. Uniforms. In cold weather, commanders and activity directors will prioritize protection
from the elements over adherence to CAP uniform standards.
"

So that closes that particular discussion.

"3.1.1. Cadet Recruitment. All cadet and composite squadrons must strive for positive growth, as
measured from year to year. All cadet units must conduct at least one recruiting campaign or open house
each year.
Units that conduct an open house similar to what is suggested in CAPP 60-21, Cadet Great Start,
satisfy this requirement. The group or wing must provide mentoring to leaders whose units are not
showing positive annual growth."


"3.1.2. Cadet and Parent Orientation. Units will provide prospective cadets with a detailed, systematic
orientation that transforms those young people into cadet airmen within 60 days.
A parents' orientation
is also required. Units using CAPP 60-21 satisfy these requirements."

Looks like the death of the white shirt and black pants.  Mom, get out the credit card.
"3.1.6. Cadet Uniforms. Wear of the uniform is an integral part of cadet life (see 1.6.1). Proper wear of
the uniform is a pre-requisite for cadet promotion (see 5.2.3)."


FCU back to being an "if", not a "when".
"3.1.6.2. Curry Blues Voucher. Cadets may be eligible to receive items for the "blues" uniform
through a voucher program upon their completing Achievement 1, if federal funding is available. For
details, see capmembers.com/CurryBlues."


The days of "show up to promote" appear to be over.
"3.3.1.1. Attendance & Promotion Eligibility. Active participation is a promotion requirement
because direct, in-person involvement in the Cadet Program is the most effective way for cadets to
demonstrate their learning. "Active participation" is not precisely defined because the reason for,
frequency of, and duration of absences varies greatly. It is suggested that commanders consider cadets
"active" if they participated in 4 meetings or activities during the previous 8 weeks.
"


As do the days of "phantom cadets".
"3.3.1.4. Extended Absences. If the cadet will be absent for multiple weeks, the cadet is expected
to file a leave of absence with the unit commander, in writing, indicating the expected date of return.
During a leave of absence, participation in special activities beyond the weekly meeting is at the discretion
of the unit commander."


Same goes for cadets in college.
"3.3.1.5. College Students. Cadets who are college students living away from their home unit may,
with permission of the unit commander, assist their squadron or another CAP unit with special projects
via online activity. Cadets who make such contributions, even without attending weekly meetings during
the academic year, satisfy the active participation promotion requirement."


Attendance tracking now mandatory, including contacting absentee cadets.
3.3.2. Tracking Participation & Contacting Absent Cadets. All cadet and composite squadrons will
maintain participation rosters and monitor their cadet retention rate. When cadets do not attend any
activities within the previous 30 days, the unit commander will ensure that the cadet is contacted. For
cadets who have been chronically absent, it is sufficient to contact them only twice (i.e.: at 30 days and
then at 60 days). An optional Participation Tracker is available in eServices


We all know a CC or staffer who needs to read this section in detail:
"3.4. Progressive Discipline. Commanders will respond to cadet misconduct through a system of
progressive discipline that is positive, incremental, and seeks both accountability and behavioral change
from the cadet. To discipline is to teach self-control and that actions have consequences. CAP prohibits
corporal punishment, including the use of exercise as punishment."

That last line still read pretty unambiguous...

Minimum requirements for cadet staff roles:
"4.1.1. Design Considerations. There is no standard organizational structure for a cadet staff. Each unit
will design a staff structure that is appropriate for its mix of cadets, consistent with the broad principles
set forth in CAPP 60-31. Cadets must meet the grade eligibility requirements shown in Table 4.1 below to
serve in cadet staff positions.
To afford units flexibility, minimum grades for some positions are set lower
than their doctrinally pure levels (e.g., flight commander is an officer position by doctrine, but a C/MSgt
may be assigned.)"

The days of the C/SrA Cadet Commander are over.

Training plans, minimum meeting curriculum, monthly activities, and public calendars are now all required.
See page 21, § 4.3.1. Weekly Squadron Meetings.


There appears to be no reason a unit should maintain >any< hardcopy tests in inventory as they are all,
including milestones, available to print on-demand.

SDA's are changing, including staff appointment for each achievement, a requirement to change the document types
and not repeat them per SDA, and an oral presentation at the end of each one.

The reg Calls out a fairly high number of forms and other regs that don't yet exist or haven't been renumbered.
One major one is the new SDA guide.  I have cadets who are completing an SDA, and should be able to finish
them well before 1 Feb, however, the lack of the new guide being available means that these cadets
will have to hold off on starting their next one, since the timing would mean that they would
probably be about 1/2 done and then have to start over on 1 Feb
.


CPFT will radically change - we all knew it was coming. Best to dig in and maybe start a separate thread dedicated to that.

Wingman is required for Curry (not just any CDI).

CAC rules are clarified, including required grade for certain echelons, and discouraging double-posted cadets,
which has been the norm since CAC's were started in 1846.

"7.2.6. Double-Service Discouraged. Because the CAC exists to provide cadets with advanced
leadership opportunities, the program should operate so as to involve the maximum number of eligible
cadets. Therefore, concurrent appointments to multiple CACs is discouraged. (Example: The wing
chairperson should not concurrently serve as the wing's representative to the region.
)"


Also makes its purpose clear, none of which include "fixing the senior program" or "planning wing conference activities":
"7.1. Purpose. Cadet Advisory Councils (CAC) will be established at the national, region and wing levels.
Group commanders may establish CACs, with the wing commander's approval. The three purposes of the
CAC are to:
• Provide a forum where cadets gain leadership experience at higher organizational levels.
• Aid the commander in monitoring and implementing the Cadet Program.
• Make recommendations to the commander for improving and running the Cadet Program."


Requires an "off duty uniform" vs "civilian attire" for activities:
"8.3.1. Off-Duty Attire. When BDUs, ABUs, or blues are not appropriate, such as during fitness
activities, laundry time, downtime, etc., unit commanders and activity directors may designate a
standardized casual "uniform," such as khakis and a special tee shirt, versus non-standardized civilian
attire of the cadets' choosing."


And prohibits gender-based UODs
"8.3.2. Gender-Based Directives. Under no circumstances will an activity's attire rules differ by gender.
(e.g., "Semi-Formal Dress Uniform for males, gowns for females" is impermissible, but "Semi-Formal Dress
Uniform or 'black tie' civilian attire" for all cadets is permissible because both genders are given the same
options.)"


Requires explicit permission to participate at other units (that should be fun):
"8.4. Cadet Participation at Other CAP Units' Activities. Units sometimes open their activities to cadets
from outside units. To participate at an activity hosted by a CAP unit other than their own, cadets must
obtain permission from their parent, home unit commander, and be accepted by the hosting unit.
Commanders will ordinarily approve cadets' requests to attend these activities, denying requests only for
good cause. If approving a cadet to attend an activity hosted by another wing, the unit commander will
inform the wing DCP."


Wings now required to have an O-ride plan and take the lead in getting cadets flying (about time):
"8.9.1.2. Program Coordination. Each wing will develop an annual, written plan to maximize flying
opportunities for cadets in every unit within the wing. The plan will adhere to a "push" model, whereby
the wing takes the initiative to program flying opportunities for each squadron, versus a "pull" model
where squadrons attempt to obtain aircraft and pilots on their own. Wings may assign this responsibility
to either their CP or DO section."


Surplus CEAP must be returned to the wing for general CP use (that >will< be a lead balloon in some places).
"9.2.7. Cadet Encampment Assistance Program. Special funding may be available to assist
disadvantaged cadets with tuition and uniforms. If an encampment accepts CEAP funds, all surplus
encampment money remaining at the conclusion of the encampment shall remain under wing control and
designated for cadet programs.
See capmembers.com/ceap for program details. "


Cadet required sleep time has been reduced at encampments, though interestingly it doesn't say "required",
it says "afforded the opportunity", which would seem to indicate they can stay up later if they want to:

"9.3.5. Personal Needs. Encampments will provide every participant with three full, balanced meals
daily. Students will be afforded the opportunity for 8.5 hours of uninterrupted sleep nightly, and the 30
minutes preceding lights out will be reserved for personal time. Cadet cadre will have an opportunity for
8.0 hours of uninterrupted sleep. "


Other changes / eliminations:
"Eliminates mention of Drug Demand Reduction as a stand-alone program with its own reporting
requirements, although a drug-free message remains a key aspect of cadet character development
(1.9.4.3)"


"Eliminates mention of squadrons having a dual-charter opportunity with the Boy Scouts of
America; individuals may join other organizations, so the section was unnecessary and created confusion"





"That Others May Zoom"

Jester

The AFMAN is the official reference for D&C, not that pesky CAP one we've been trying to get people to use for like a year and a half.

I think the big changes like active cadet fitness program and SDAs are good and these little nitpicks are just that, but knowing how hard it will probably be to correct it (when it could have been put out for this kind of feedback from the field forever ago) is discouraging.

GZCP31

"CAC's were started in 1846"

I did not know our cadet program is 176 years old  :o
Former OK Wing DCL/DCA Mid 90s, Rejoined after 17 years out.
Capt. Communications-Master
Squadron Deputy Commander, Emergency Services Training Officer,  Professional Development Officer,  Administration Officer, Personnel Officer, Communications Officer and Aerospace Education Officer, Texas Wing DOU

Holding Pattern

Quote from: GZCP31 on November 14, 2017, 04:36:09 PM
"CAC's were started in 1846"

I did not know our cadet program is 176 years old  :o

CAPSOC tries hard to hide its origins. on occasion, people let things like this slip. Pretend he said nothing.

Eclipse

Actually there is speculation that the CAC was the cause of the fall of the Incas because
they were not able to find a Senior-Member coordinator, and there was a multi-year war
regarding where to order pizza.

"That Others May Zoom"

NIN

Quote from: Eclipse on November 14, 2017, 05:04:56 PM
Actually there is speculation that the CAC was the cause of the fall of the Incas because
they were not able to find a Senior-Member coordinator, and there was a multi-year war
regarding where to order pizza who could wear a beret or shoulder cord.

FTFY..  8)
Darin Ninness, Col, CAP
I have no responsibilities whatsoever
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2024 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

skyhawkcdr

I have seen cadets go active military, or college, still be on the roster. To me that's dead weight. On paper it looks like high cadet count, 40, when its really only 15 any given week. So what do we do with the dead weight??

Ned

Quote from: skyhawkcdr on November 14, 2017, 07:24:04 PM
So what do we do with the dead weight college students??

Great question!

Start with the guidance in the 60-1:  at a minimum have them participate in special projects online.  They can write up weekly and quarterly schedules, mentor cadets on aerospace and leadership on the phone, draft SOIs and operations plans, draft lesson plans, handle CAC duties, participate occasionally with units at or near the college, and much more.  They can prepare for staff roles for activities at the wing or higher levels (example - preparing for their future job as a flight commander at next summer's encampment) by participating in conference calls and activities when they are home from school for holidays or college breaks.

There is essentially no limit to what motivated but geographically isolated college cadets can do.  The senior member leadership part is identifying possible contributions and working with the remotely located cadet - students.

But I think we agree that they have to do something that is worthwhile and valuable to some part of CAP.

Thank you for working with our cadets.  You are making a difference.

Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager


Eclipse

Quote from: skyhawkcdr on November 14, 2017, 07:24:04 PM
I have seen cadets go active military, or college, still be on the roster. To me that's dead weight. On paper it looks like high cadet count, 40, when its really only 15 any given week. So what do we do with the dead weight??

Unfortunately there is little other option then termination for cadets over 18 who choose not to participate.
You can't turn them into Seniors or Patrons without a Form 12, and their numbers do affect the squadrons
ability to achieves things like QCUA, SOM, etc.

At least now there is verbiage from the program which stresses the necessity to be an asset of some or another.
Personally I've never met a cadet or senior member who was legitimately interested in being of some use who
couldn't find a creative way to do so, just as there is no end to the excuses for those who like the idea of CAP,
but not the work.

"That Others May Zoom"

MSG Mac

Quote from: Ned on November 14, 2017, 07:49:06 PM
Quote from: skyhawkcdr on November 14, 2017, 07:24:04 PM
So what do we do with the dead weight college students??

Great question!

Start with the guidance in the 60-1:  at a minimum have them participate in special projects online.  They can write up weekly and quarterly schedules, mentor cadets on aerospace and leadership on the phone, draft SOIs and operations plans, draft lesson plans, handle CAC duties, participate occasionally with units at or near the college, and much more.  They can prepare for staff roles for activities at the wing or higher levels (example - preparing for their future job as a flight commander at next summer's encampment) by participating in conference calls and activities when they are home from school for holidays or college breaks.

There is essentially no limit to what motivated but geographically isolated college cadets can do.  The senior member leadership part is identifying possible contributions and working with the remotely located cadet - students.

But I think we agree that they have to do something that is worthwhile and valuable to some part of CAP.

Thank you for working with our cadets.  You are making a difference.

Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager

There used to be a requirement that if a cadet moved out of the area he/she was required to transfer to a new unit, if there was one in the area. I know several cadets who had local units, but didn't transfer and stagnated in grade without ever advancing, despite showing up on the active roster.
Michael P. McEleney
Lt Col CAP
MSG USA (Retired)
50 Year Member

skyhawkcdr

In a former squadron, they have 2 at AFA, one in AFROTC, Plus 3 or 4 active duty. Another 3 or 4 in regular college. To my knowledge all are out of the CAP loop. If the squadron knows they are leaving, can they be asked to go Senior before they leave?? all are 18 or 19.

Eclipse

#11
A CC can always ask, but whether or not a cadet, or mom and dad, are interested in the
conversation is another story.

Cadets can "dark-side" for free the first year, but still have to submit a Form 12 and fingerprint card,
complete a BGC

The two you have in the AFA should transfer to the unit there.

The ROTC and regular college would fall into the "you're either here or you're not category" of
participation.

The "3 or 4" on active duty are automatically disqualified from cadet membership and should have
already been terminated.  I have had members in squadrons who were deployed and still
were remote assets to the unit, but on the mean most cadets who have recently joined the
military have enough "real life" on their plate to bother with doing F12's, finding someone to fingerprint them
from Bagram, or even Lackland, etc.  If they cared enough about it, they buttoned things up before they left.

Realistically speaking, unless you're into Phase IV and still aiming at Spaatz, or are an
C/NCO with designs on E3 so want your Mitchell, the ability to progress and promote when you're
away at school are fairly slim.  I know of a few who attended local colleges or "commuter schools"
so they can still come to meetings, even if not as often, that's a different story.
the odds of

"That Others May Zoom"

NIN

Quote from: skyhawkcdr on November 15, 2017, 01:48:33 PM
In a former squadron, they have 2 at AFA, one in AFROTC, Plus 3 or 4 active duty. Another 3 or 4 in regular college. To my knowledge all are out of the CAP loop. If the squadron knows they are leaving, can they be asked to go Senior before they leave?? all are 18 or 19.

There have been many cadets who have gone off to the AFA/ROTC, etc as Phase IV cadets who have completed the Spaatz between 18 and 21.

Most of this is about having a conversation with your member.

A cadet going off to enlist in the Army? Yeah, get that CAPF 12 before he or she goes, sure. (I just did it to 2-3 of my guys who did that).  "Renew your membership, don't forget!"

A cadet heading off to college? They're still going to be a cadet, and potentially be helpful to you/the unit until they're 21. Do you want to say "Ok, you're off to college, you're dead to me now.."? No.

They're still members, treat them as such and be creative. 

Years ago, I horse-traded with other commanders when I had a cadet in their area for college or they had one in mine. It took a couple different tacks, depending on the cadet, the unit, the kind of time they're going to have, their level of expected participation at each end, transportation options, etc.


  • the cadet transfers to the unit nearby for the duration of their college years, coming back to the home unit for the summer and participating, but for all intents and purposes now a member of the sq local to their college. Including for things like commander permission to participate, etc.
  • cadet transfers to the unit nearby for the school year for testing and promotion purposes, transfers back in the summer.
  • cadet remains a member of the home unit, participates and tests at the local unit, with records, promotions, etc being handled at the home unit thru agreement with the local unit

Only happened a small handful of times (3? 4?) but I know I had one cadet at a unit near his college and when he'd test, take a PT test, or participate in Moral Leadership, the local unit would send us the CAPF23s , test scores, or the ML roster for his records, let us know what he'd been doing, etc. He'd come back for Christmas break, participate with us, we'd review him for promotion based on the work he'd done at the local unit, promote or not promote depending on what was going on, let the local unit know what was what.  It worked out pretty well, actually. Cadet managed to get his Mitchell (he was C/SMSgt or something when he left to go to college anyway.. its not like he was a C/SrA or something).

There are options if you're smart and keep the aims of the program in mind.
Darin Ninness, Col, CAP
I have no responsibilities whatsoever
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2024 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

kwe1009

Quote from: skyhawkcdr on November 15, 2017, 01:48:33 PM
In a former squadron, they have 2 at AFA, one in AFROTC, Plus 3 or 4 active duty. Another 3 or 4 in regular college. To my knowledge all are out of the CAP loop. If the squadron knows they are leaving, can they be asked to go Senior before they leave?? all are 18 or 19.

Once a cadet becomes an active duty military member they are no longer allowed to be a cadet.  A 2B should have been done on them after giving them a reasonable amount of time to transfer to SM.  In my squadron we try to get them to become an SM when their ship date is 90 days or less.  That way they get the membership card before they ship out.  We try to keep in touch with them but the first year is usually very busy with BMT, school, first assignment, etc.  If we don't hear from them we transfer them to patron status. 

Eclipse

https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/index.cfm?cadet_regulation_2018_available_for_preview&show=entry&blogID=1857

Summary.  For a summary of the program enhancements and administrative updates, an online presentation is available as a simple PDF and as a recorded webinar.

Fitness. One of the two biggest program enhancements in the regulation is the introduction of the Active Cadet Fitness Program and a revised Cadet Physical Fitness Test. Squadrons that are eager to switch to the new CPFT may do so immediately, but the transition is not mandatory until 1 February 2018. Online CPFT administration tools will be available at that time, and a large variety of fitness activity plans will as well. 
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/library/fitness/

Staff Duty Analysis.  The other big program enhancement in the regulation is the introduction of a revised SDA program. During each Achievement in Phases III and IV, cadets will serve in a support staff role, draft one of eight types of technical documents, and deliver an oral briefing using the technical document as a jumping off point. CAPP 60-32, Staff Duty Analysis, is available now. Squadrons that are eager to switch to the new SDA may do so now, or wait until 1 February. Tools for tracking the completion of SDAs in eServices will soon be updated.
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/cadet_staff_duty_analysis/

Updates to Other Cadet Publications.  As the cadet regulation changes, so too will the library of other cadet-related forms and pamphlets. We will be gradually phasing-in revised publications throughout 2018. For now, the following revised publications are available:

CAPP 60-12, Parents' Guide to the CAP Cadet Program
Replaces the unnumbered Parents Guide. Adds sections on CEAP and Curry Blues Voucher. Adds content about ABUs. Mentions that CAP is open to youth who have special needs and asks parents to bring those needs to local leaders' attention. New cadets receive a copy of the Parents' Guide with their New Cadet Packet. Hardcopies will also be available through Vanguard.
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/parents/

CAPF 60-90 series, Cadet Leadership Feedback
Replaces the CAPF 50 series. No substantive changes made.
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/library/leadership-feedback/

CAPVA 60-100, Cadet Super Chart
Updated to reflect the new CPFT and SDA rules. The Super Chart is available online, formatted for printing on two sheets of letter-size paper. We also plan to provide every squadron with a poster-size version in early 2018.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Super_Chart__2017_letter__combined_17CB4F9432F4D.pdf

CAPVA 60-101, Personal Cadet Tracker
Updated to reflect the new CPFT and SDA rules. The suggested best practice for using this document is for each cadet to print a copy, keep it at home, and manually update it as they progress so they can set goals and stay abreast of what they need to do to earn promotions.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Personal_Tracker_26E409B4B484D.pdf

DDR & Future of the Cadet Character Program.  One consequence of the new CAPR 60-1 is that the stand-alone regulation on Drug Demand Reduction, CAPR 52-22, is rescinded. A memo explains how that will affect the future of the cadet character development program.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/DDR_Letter_0E7408635DDA9.pdf

CAPR 60-2, Cadet Protection Policy.
Replaces CAPR 52-10. No major substantive changes are planned. The draft regulation is in the final stages of staff coordination. It is hoped that it will be published by year's end with a 1 February 2018 effective date.

"That Others May Zoom"

Spam



Feedback to Ned et al:

Please don't forget to update the Stripes to Diamonds pages with the changes. A number of units have their people (and local training) pointed that way as an authoritative source.

V/r
Spam



Eclipse

Quote from: Spam on November 15, 2017, 04:52:42 PM
Feedback to Ned et al:

Please don't forget to update the Stripes to Diamonds pages with the changes. A number of units have their people (and local training) pointed that way as an authoritative source.

Quote from: Eclipse on November 15, 2017, 03:42:08 PM
CAPVA 60-100, Cadet Super Chart
Updated to reflect the new CPFT and SDA rules. The Super Chart is available online, formatted for printing on two sheets of letter-size paper. We also plan to provide every squadron with a poster-size version in early 2018.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Super_Chart__2017_letter__combined_17CB4F9432F4D.pdf

"That Others May Zoom"

Spam

Quote from: Spam on November 15, 2017, 04:52:42 PM


Feedback to Ned et al:

Please don't forget to update the Stripes to Diamonds pages with the changes. A number of units have their people (and local training) pointed that way as an authoritative source.

V/r
Spam


Also, and perhaps I missed it but, updates to the TLC materials would also seem in order. I'm conducting a TLC in DEC here in Atlanta and will be augmenting the existing with some slides to summarize the changes for the students.

V/r
Spam




Spam

Quote from: Eclipse on November 15, 2017, 04:58:37 PM
Quote from: Spam on November 15, 2017, 04:52:42 PM
Feedback to Ned et al:

Please don't forget to update the Stripes to Diamonds pages with the changes. A number of units have their people (and local training) pointed that way as an authoritative source.

Quote from: Eclipse on November 15, 2017, 03:42:08 PM
CAPVA 60-100, Cadet Super Chart
Updated to reflect the new CPFT and SDA rules. The Super Chart is available online, formatted for printing on two sheets of letter-size paper. We also plan to provide every squadron with a poster-size version in early 2018.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Super_Chart__2017_letter__combined_17CB4F9432F4D.pdf

Thanks, Eclipse. I did see that. I'm referring to the individual web pages also.

(clickable links - click on the insignia):  https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/stripes_to_diamonds/

Cheers
Spam


Ned

Quote from: kwe1009 on November 15, 2017, 02:56:37 PM
Once a cadet becomes an active duty military member they are no longer allowed to be a cadet. 

A slight qualification.  The regulation uses the term "extended active duty" and makes it clear that cadets undergoing basic training for the Guard or Reserve remain eligible for cadet membership.  Even though the military itself would consider them on a form of active duty, usually "ADT" or Active Duty for Training.  The point is that there are several different flavors of "active duty," not all of which are disqualifying. 

Cadets serving in the Guard and Reserve are normally a "win-win-win" for the cadet, CAP, and Uncle Sam, all of whom benefit from the synergy of the training.


Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager

kwe1009

Quote from: Ned on November 15, 2017, 05:11:09 PM
Quote from: kwe1009 on November 15, 2017, 02:56:37 PM
Once a cadet becomes an active duty military member they are no longer allowed to be a cadet. 

A slight qualification.  The regulation uses the term "extended active duty" and makes it clear that cadets undergoing basic training for the Guard or Reserve remain eligible for cadet membership.  Even though the military itself would consider them on a form of active duty, usually "ADT" or Active Duty for Training.  The point is that there are several different flavors of "active duty," not all of which are disqualifying. 

Cadets serving in the Guard and Reserve are normally a "win-win-win" for the cadet, CAP, and Uncle Sam, all of whom benefit from the synergy of the training.


Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager

Thank you sir, I am aware of that distinction.  That is why I said "becomes an active duty member."  I probably should have made the distinction more clear in my initial post.  We did have a Reservist a few years ago and it was certainly a win-win-win.

MSG Mac

Quote from: kwe1009 on November 15, 2017, 05:37:13 PM
Quote from: Ned on November 15, 2017, 05:11:09 PM
Quote from: kwe1009 on November 15, 2017, 02:56:37 PM
Once a cadet becomes an active duty military member they are no longer allowed to be a cadet. 

A slight qualification.  The regulation uses the term "extended active duty" and makes it clear that cadets undergoing basic training for the Guard or Reserve remain eligible for cadet membership.  Even though the military itself would consider them on a form of active duty, usually "ADT" or Active Duty for Training.  The point is that there are several different flavors of "active duty," not all of which are disqualifying. 

Cadets serving in the Guard and Reserve are normally a "win-win-win" for the cadet, CAP, and Uncle Sam, all of whom benefit from the synergy of the training.


Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager

Thank you sir, I am aware of that distinction.  That is why I said "becomes an active duty member."  I probably should have made the distinction more clear in my initial post.  We did have a Reservist a few years ago and it was certainly a win-win-win.

If their unit gets activated to support current operations, they must transfer to Senior Membership.
Michael P. McEleney
Lt Col CAP
MSG USA (Retired)
50 Year Member

skyhawkcdr

Thank you to everyone for the information given. I understand all issues can be resolved by submitting the right paperwork. 

Ned

Quote from: MSG Mac on November 15, 2017, 06:11:03 PM

If their unit gets activated to support current operations, they must transfer to Senior Membership.

Again, it depends.  I've certainly activated soldiers in my unit to "support current ops" and just had them come on for 30 days to prep & maintain vehicles scheduled for deployment.  In my view such a cadet/soldier would remain eligible for cadet membership.

Even if it is a "all hands on deck" unit deployment to the sandbox, the cadet/service member may be under 18 and thus not deployable OCONUS under US and international law.  Or may be assigned to the rear detachment at the armory.  Or whatever.

The point is, the military has a lot of rules about "active duty" and change them with some regularity.  We need to look at each case individually to decide if whatever they are doing meets CAP's definition of "extended" active duty found in the regulation.

PHall

Quote from: MSG Mac on November 15, 2017, 06:11:03 PM
Quote from: kwe1009 on November 15, 2017, 05:37:13 PM
Quote from: Ned on November 15, 2017, 05:11:09 PM
Quote from: kwe1009 on November 15, 2017, 02:56:37 PM
Once a cadet becomes an active duty military member they are no longer allowed to be a cadet. 

A slight qualification.  The regulation uses the term "extended active duty" and makes it clear that cadets undergoing basic training for the Guard or Reserve remain eligible for cadet membership.  Even though the military itself would consider them on a form of active duty, usually "ADT" or Active Duty for Training.  The point is that there are several different flavors of "active duty," not all of which are disqualifying. 

Cadets serving in the Guard and Reserve are normally a "win-win-win" for the cadet, CAP, and Uncle Sam, all of whom benefit from the synergy of the training.


Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager

Thank you sir, I am aware of that distinction.  That is why I said "becomes an active duty member."  I probably should have made the distinction more clear in my initial post.  We did have a Reservist a few years ago and it was certainly a win-win-win.

If their unit gets activated to support current operations, they must transfer to Senior Membership.

No, it would be if they get activated. The unit might get activated, but, there are usually some unit members who get excluded for a number of reasons.

s.cap

Any word on how the fitness test for the Spaatz exam may change?

Eclipse

Quote from: s.cap on November 16, 2017, 03:01:58 PM
Any word on how the fitness test for the Spaatz exam may change?

The standards are in the links provided.  it is now purported to be the same as USAFA entrance PT.

                 M     F
SIT-UPS     81    78
PUSH-UPS  62    41
MILE RUN  6:29 7:30

"That Others May Zoom"

wacapgh

Quote from: Jester on November 14, 2017, 04:11:48 PM
The AFMAN is the official reference for D&C, not that pesky CAP one we've been trying to get people to use for like a year and a half.

Found it - it's listed halfway down on the right side of Attachment 3. Haven't found any mention of the Cadet Drill Guide from 2014.

So by regulation, if there is a conflict or question the AFMAN is the final authority.

PHall

Quote from: wacapgh on November 16, 2017, 08:24:13 PM
Quote from: Jester on November 14, 2017, 04:11:48 PM
The AFMAN is the official reference for D&C, not that pesky CAP one we've been trying to get people to use for like a year and a half.

Found it - it's listed halfway down on the right side of Attachment 3. Haven't found any mention of the Cadet Drill Guide from 2014.

So by regulation, if there is a conflict or question the AFMAN is the final authority.

Which manual/regulation is this in?

s.cap

Quote from: Eclipse on November 16, 2017, 03:19:35 PM
Quote from: s.cap on November 16, 2017, 03:01:58 PM
Any word on how the fitness test for the Spaatz exam may change?

The standards are in the links provided.  it is now purported to be the same as USAFA entrance PT.

                 M     F
SIT-UPS     81    78
PUSH-UPS  62    41
MILE RUN  6:29 7:30

Ah, yes.  6:29 looked like 6:23 when I glanced over it, so I thought it hadn't changed.

Thanks!

kwe1009

Quote from: PHall on November 17, 2017, 12:14:38 AM
Quote from: wacapgh on November 16, 2017, 08:24:13 PM
Quote from: Jester on November 14, 2017, 04:11:48 PM
The AFMAN is the official reference for D&C, not that pesky CAP one we've been trying to get people to use for like a year and a half.

Found it - it's listed halfway down on the right side of Attachment 3. Haven't found any mention of the Cadet Drill Guide from 2014.

So by regulation, if there is a conflict or question the AFMAN is the final authority.

Which manual/regulation is this in?

According to CAPR 60-1, both AFMAN 36-2203 and CAPP 60-33 are to be used.  60-33 is mostly just a cut and paste from 36-2203 with some CAP specific stuff added. 

CAPLTC

Good thread, thanks for highlighting the changes.
"Find the enemy that wants to end this experiment (in American democracy) and kill every one of them until they're so sick of the killing that they leave us and our freedoms intact." -- SECDEF Mattis

NEBoom

I noticed in attachment 1, SUI checklist item 2, ("Has the unit adopted a set of annual goals?") under verification it states, "Squadron uploads unit's goals document to eServices."  Then it references paragraph 4.2.1.  But that paragraph does not mention such a requirement, nor does it explain how/where to upload your goals document.

A potential "gotcha" when  your SUI comes around.
Lt Col Dan Kirwan, CAP
Nebraska Wing

Ned

Quote from: NEBoom on November 18, 2017, 08:38:23 PM
I noticed in attachment 1, SUI checklist item 2, ("Has the unit adopted a set of annual goals?") under verification it states, "Squadron uploads unit's goals document to eServices."  Then it references paragraph 4.2.1.  But that paragraph does not mention such a requirement, nor does it explain how/where to upload your goals document.

A potential "gotcha" when  your SUI comes around.

So, the apparent disconnect comes about because it is the SUI process that requires the unit goal upload to eServices, not the reg. Restated, nobody needs to routinely upload their unit goals.  Until they get scheduled for an SUI.  At that point, the unit will receive instructions on how to prepare for the SUI, which will inlculde uploading various documents for review by the inspectors. (Along with other documents in other functional areas.)

Sorry for the confusion.  We will take a close look at trying to explain that more clearly.

Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager

CAPLTC

Quote from: Eclipse on November 15, 2017, 03:42:08 PM
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/index.cfm?cadet_regulation_2018_available_for_preview&show=entry&blogID=1857

Summary.  For a summary of the program enhancements and administrative updates, an online presentation is available as a simple PDF and as a recorded webinar.

Fitness. One of the two biggest program enhancements in the regulation is the introduction of the Active Cadet Fitness Program and a revised Cadet Physical Fitness Test. Squadrons that are eager to switch to the new CPFT may do so immediately, but the transition is not mandatory until 1 February 2018. Online CPFT administration tools will be available at that time, and a large variety of fitness activity plans will as well. 
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/library/fitness/

Staff Duty Analysis.  The other big program enhancement in the regulation is the introduction of a revised SDA program. During each Achievement in Phases III and IV, cadets will serve in a support staff role, draft one of eight types of technical documents, and deliver an oral briefing using the technical document as a jumping off point. CAPP 60-32, Staff Duty Analysis, is available now. Squadrons that are eager to switch to the new SDA may do so now, or wait until 1 February. Tools for tracking the completion of SDAs in eServices will soon be updated.
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/cadet_staff_duty_analysis/

Updates to Other Cadet Publications.  As the cadet regulation changes, so too will the library of other cadet-related forms and pamphlets. We will be gradually phasing-in revised publications throughout 2018. For now, the following revised publications are available:

CAPP 60-12, Parents' Guide to the CAP Cadet Program
Replaces the unnumbered Parents Guide. Adds sections on CEAP and Curry Blues Voucher. Adds content about ABUs. Mentions that CAP is open to youth who have special needs and asks parents to bring those needs to local leaders' attention. New cadets receive a copy of the Parents' Guide with their New Cadet Packet. Hardcopies will also be available through Vanguard.
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/parents/

CAPF 60-90 series, Cadet Leadership Feedback
Replaces the CAPF 50 series. No substantive changes made.
https://www.capmembers.com/cadet_programs/library/leadership-feedback/

CAPVA 60-100, Cadet Super Chart
Updated to reflect the new CPFT and SDA rules. The Super Chart is available online, formatted for printing on two sheets of letter-size paper. We also plan to provide every squadron with a poster-size version in early 2018.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Super_Chart__2017_letter__combined_17CB4F9432F4D.pdf

CAPVA 60-101, Personal Cadet Tracker
Updated to reflect the new CPFT and SDA rules. The suggested best practice for using this document is for each cadet to print a copy, keep it at home, and manually update it as they progress so they can set goals and stay abreast of what they need to do to earn promotions.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Personal_Tracker_26E409B4B484D.pdf

DDR & Future of the Cadet Character Program.  One consequence of the new CAPR 60-1 is that the stand-alone regulation on Drug Demand Reduction, CAPR 52-22, is rescinded. A memo explains how that will affect the future of the cadet character development program.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/DDR_Letter_0E7408635DDA9.pdf

CAPR 60-2, Cadet Protection Policy.
Replaces CAPR 52-10. No major substantive changes are planned. The draft regulation is in the final stages of staff coordination. It is hoped that it will be published by year's end with a 1 February 2018 effective date.

Great summation.
Thanks for hanging it here.
Helpful.
"Find the enemy that wants to end this experiment (in American democracy) and kill every one of them until they're so sick of the killing that they leave us and our freedoms intact." -- SECDEF Mattis

NEBoom

Quote from: Ned on November 18, 2017, 09:44:52 PM
Quote from: NEBoom on November 18, 2017, 08:38:23 PM
I noticed in attachment 1, SUI checklist item 2, ("Has the unit adopted a set of annual goals?") under verification it states, "Squadron uploads unit's goals document to eServices."  Then it references paragraph 4.2.1.  But that paragraph does not mention such a requirement, nor does it explain how/where to upload your goals document.

A potential "gotcha" when  your SUI comes around.

So, the apparent disconnect comes about because it is the SUI process that requires the unit goal upload to eServices, not the reg. Restated, nobody needs to routinely upload their unit goals.  Until they get scheduled for an SUI.  At that point, the unit will receive instructions on how to prepare for the SUI, which will inlculde uploading various documents for review by the inspectors. (Along with other documents in other functional areas.)

Sorry for the confusion.  We will take a close look at trying to explain that more clearly.

Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager

Ned,
That makes sense, thanks for the clarification.
Lt Col Dan Kirwan, CAP
Nebraska Wing

Spam

Typo catch:
"2.6.2.1. Monitoring Weather Conditions. When cadet activities take place outside a military installation and temperatures are forecast to be below 45O F [sic], commanders and activity directors will monitor the wind chill temperature at least every 3 hours".

Awesome. At 450 degrees Farenheit, at least the injury forms we're filling out won't ignite.   >:D



"2.6.2.4. Winter Camping. Camping in conditions where the temperature may fall below 30OF may be conducted only as a high adventure activity (HAA, see 2.9 below) and in accordance with Table 2.3. The HAA proposal must describe plans for warming cadets, dealing with wet conditions, and evacuation to indoor facilities".

On a more serious note, I'm reviewing two submitted plans for exercises/FTXs in the February time frame, and they'll have to comply with this section (which is good, thinking ahead...). Y'all don't let this sneak up on you, read the new reg and get your HAA request in. The new HAA form isn't yet available, but we can start that process at least.


R/s,
Spam




Spam

Quote from: Eclipse on November 14, 2017, 04:10:00 AM

"2.6.2.5. Uniforms. In cold weather, commanders and activity directors will prioritize protection
from the elements over adherence to CAP uniform standards.
"

So that closes that particular discussion.


In no way does this new section close discussion of compliance with CAPM 39-1.


What this says to me is that activity directors should prioritize member safety outdoors over adherence to a specific uniform of the day (UOD). Examples of applying this could include:


  • Allow members to have the freedom to travel to/report in/depart while wearing warm and safe civilian clothing, rather than require members to purchase USAF style outer wear, or violate existing and approved 39-1 prohibitions against mixing USAF style and civilian clothing. Members can then wear the UOD at the activity.

  • Relaxing adherence to a specified uniform of the day, to include a wider range of acceptable uniforms (e.g. ABU/BDUs with coat, rather than the less common Class A blues coats, or corporates of varying types for adults over 18).


Read otherwise, as a license to mix civilian clothing with USAF style clothes, this would imply a direct and conscious effort by the CP staff to create disharmony with and undermine CAPM 39-1 provisions on the issue. I don't believe that's the case.  I'm of course open to revisiting the issue should NHQ issue a coordinated revision to 39-1 *(with CAP-USAF concurrence) to eliminate requirements for correct wear of USAF style uniforms without civilian gear.


V/r
Spam



Eclipse


"That Others May Zoom"

Ned

Quote from: Spam on November 21, 2017, 06:54:29 PM
Typo catch:
"2.6.2.1. Monitoring Weather Conditions. When cadet activities take place outside a military installation and temperatures are forecast to be below 45O F [sic], commanders and activity directors will monitor the wind chill temperature at least every 3 hours".

Awesome. At 450 degrees Farenheit, at least the injury forms we're filling out won't ignite.   >:D

That's interesting, but I think it is more of a display / font issue than a typo. 

When I look at it, I see "below 45o ".  Which is I'm pretty sure is correct.  I'm guessing that it is displaying differently for you, with the superscript "o" showing either as a capital "O" or a 0, but can't guess the reason.

Is it displaying oddly for anyone else?




LSThiker


Cadetter

Question on PT under the new program (my squadron isn't using it yet). For a cadet with promotion effective 4 Jan or later, but before 1 Feb, who passes the old physical fitness test (that can be used until 31 Jan), does that counts towards their promotion (effective 1 Mar or later), or must they also score HFZ in February to be eligible?
Wright Brothers Award, 2013
Billy Mitchell Award, 2016
Earhart Award, 2018

Cadetter

Bump. And my CDC and CC weren't certain and will look into it - they suggested that I do so too. I'm asking both for me and another cadet (neither of us is in Phase 1).
Wright Brothers Award, 2013
Billy Mitchell Award, 2016
Earhart Award, 2018

NC Hokie

I just reread the relevant parts of CAPR 60-1 and confirmed that the new CPFT becomes mandatory on 1 Feb 2018.  Cadets can complete achievements and milestones using he old CPFT until 31 January.  After that, they must meet the standards of the new CPFT, even if they have already passed the old one.

The same goes for the new SDA program, too.
NC Hokie, Lt Col, CAP

Graduated Squadron Commander
All Around Good Guy

Eclipse

Quote from: NC Hokie on January 02, 2018, 02:30:59 AMAfter that, they must meet the standards of the new CPFT, even if they have already passed the old one.

The same goes for the new SDA program, too.

Cite please - I see the verbiage regarding being able to maintain the old programs at the unit's option,
but nothing regarding caets having to re-do something already completed.

Absent something concrete, my assumption would be that "done is done", regardless of which
program, and only those pieces not completed would be under the new program after Feb.

We have a couple of cadets on the fence and while we're not doing HFZs until our first PT day in Feb
(which is post the new reg), I had them do the new SDAs because I knew they wouldn't be done and
didn't want them to do it twice.

"That Others May Zoom"

Cadetter

I'm just doing my Achievement 12 SDA under the new program (since Earhart is effective in a couple of days) - even though I COULD complete the old one before Feb, the new one will more effectively force me to practice public speaking. The freebie document/presentation (i.e. resume) is awesome, too, although that shall be reserved for the school year (when I don't have loads of free time to spend on unfamiliar documents). Later achievements under the old program seemed quite useful, though, so it's sad to see that one leave...

I'm somewhat doubtful on old, passed PT not counting, but I couldn't find any hard language in 60-1 saying that it doesn't (maybe I'm misreading phaseout language). My CDC isn't certain how eServices will treat old CPFT in the promotions module after 1 Feb.
Wright Brothers Award, 2013
Billy Mitchell Award, 2016
Earhart Award, 2018

Eclipse

Quote from: Cadetter on January 02, 2018, 03:02:31 AMMy CDC isn't certain how eServices will treat old CPFT in the promotions module after 1 Feb.

Optimism says that the new system will be turned on at midnight on 31 Jan.

History says we will be asking "when" in July.

"That Others May Zoom"

TX CAP Mom

I was looking at the Cadet Super Chart:

CAPVA 60-100, Cadet Super Chart
Updated to reflect the new CPFT and SDA rules. The Super Chart is available online, formatted for printing on two sheets of letter-size paper. We also plan to provide every squadron with a poster-size version in early 2018.
https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Super_Chart__2017_letter__combined_17CB4F9432F4D.pdf

My son is a C/Amn. For physical fitness the wording is that he has to have "attempted" CPFT in the last 180 days. What does that mean? If he attends PT night, participates to the best of his ability, but does not make all the HFZ standards, is he still eligible to promote to 1st Class (Arnold), then Sr Amn (Feik), with just "attempts"? But has to have actually achieved HFZ for the Wright Bro? Or is the attempt vs achieve at the discretion of the squadron leadership?

Cadetter

He is eligible for promotion for C/A1C and C/SrA with "attempts" but needs to achieve HFZ for the Wright Brothers. Of course, if he isn't scoring in HFZ, he should work out to meet the standard in order to continue to promote. Attempt vs achieve is not discretionary. :)
Wright Brothers Award, 2013
Billy Mitchell Award, 2016
Earhart Award, 2018

NC Hokie

Quote from: Eclipse on January 02, 2018, 02:40:30 AM
Quote from: NC Hokie on January 02, 2018, 02:30:59 AMAfter that, they must meet the standards of the new CPFT, even if they have already passed the old one.

The same goes for the new SDA program, too.

Cite please - I see the verbiage regarding being able to maintain the old programs at the unit's option,
but nothing regarding caets having to re-do something already completed.

Absent something concrete, my assumption would be that "done is done", regardless of which
program, and only those pieces not completed would be under the new program after Feb.

We have a couple of cadets on the fence and while we're not doing HFZs until our first PT day in Feb
(which is post the new reg), I had them do the new SDAs because I knew they wouldn't be done and
didn't want them to do it twice.

My cite is logic and past experience with CAP program changes.  The new CPFT and SDA protocols go into effect on 1 Feb 18 and there are no provisions in 60-1 for accepting the old protocols after that date.  Your third paragraph indicates that you recognize and accept this with the SDA program, so what's different with the CPFT?
NC Hokie, Lt Col, CAP

Graduated Squadron Commander
All Around Good Guy

Eclipse

Quote from: NC Hokie on January 02, 2018, 03:45:21 PMYour third paragraph indicates that you recognize and accept this with the SDA program, so what's different with the CPFT?

The SDA, being a culmination of the service, would not likely be done yet, the CPFT already is from Dec.

Absent the specific language in the reg, I can't see how NHQ would uncheck boxes already checked, especially
for cadets.  That's penalizing them for the calendar and a sure way to incur the wrath of mom.

That could delay a cadet's progression weeks or even months if things don't alighn.

"That Others May Zoom"

TheSkyHornet

Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

Eclipse

Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 08, 2018, 08:53:22 PM
Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

What level are they waiting on?

And What, specifically, is holding the up now?

"That Others May Zoom"

foo

Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 08, 2018, 08:53:22 PM
Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

I don't know the answer to your question, but "planning a DDR activity" is not currently a requirement for achieving a Technician rating in the Cadet Programs track.

TheSkyHornet

Quote from: Eclipse on January 08, 2018, 09:08:05 PM
Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 08, 2018, 08:53:22 PM
Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

What level are they waiting on?

And What, specifically, is holding the up now?

Technician Rating.

No hold up. Just verifying before I finish up the sign off.


Quote from: foo on January 08, 2018, 09:36:21 PM
Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 08, 2018, 08:53:22 PM
Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

I don't know the answer to your question, but "planning a DDR activity" is not currently a requirement for achieving a Technician rating in the Cadet Programs track.

Yes, it is.

https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/P216_A3EECB272DFF7.pdf

15th item down on the Tech checklist:
Assist in planning and presenting a DDR lecture or DDRx activity at a weekly squadron meeting.


foo

Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 09, 2018, 03:54:41 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on January 08, 2018, 09:08:05 PM
Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 08, 2018, 08:53:22 PM
Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

What level are they waiting on?

And What, specifically, is holding the up now?

Technician Rating.

No hold up. Just verifying before I finish up the sign off.


Quote from: foo on January 08, 2018, 09:36:21 PM
Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 08, 2018, 08:53:22 PM
Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

I don't know the answer to your question, but "planning a DDR activity" is not currently a requirement for achieving a Technician rating in the Cadet Programs track.

Yes, it is.

https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/P216_A3EECB272DFF7.pdf

15th item down on the Tech checklist:
Assist in planning and presenting a DDR lecture or DDRx activity at a weekly squadron meeting.

As you just demonstrated, "planning a DDR activity" is not a "requirement." If you're telling people it is, you may be making it sound like more of a challenge than it needs to be.

Be more precise.

TheSkyHornet

#56
Quote from: foo on January 09, 2018, 04:06:30 PM
Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 09, 2018, 03:54:41 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on January 08, 2018, 09:08:05 PM
Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 08, 2018, 08:53:22 PM
Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

What level are they waiting on?

And What, specifically, is holding the up now?

Technician Rating.

No hold up. Just verifying before I finish up the sign off.


Quote from: foo on January 08, 2018, 09:36:21 PM
Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 08, 2018, 08:53:22 PM
Does anyone know if CAPP 216 (CP Specialty Track) will be changing to reflect DDR, or will planning a DDR activity still be part of the Tech Rating requirements?

I have a couple of seniors who are awaiting sign-offs, and that's really the only thing holding them up at this point.

I don't know the answer to your question, but "planning a DDR activity" is not currently a requirement for achieving a Technician rating in the Cadet Programs track.

Yes, it is.

https://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/P216_A3EECB272DFF7.pdf

15th item down on the Tech checklist:
Assist in planning and presenting a DDR lecture or DDRx activity at a weekly squadron meeting.

As you just demonstrated, "planning a DDR activity" is not a "requirement." If you're telling people it is, you may be making it sound like more of a challenge than it needs to be.

Be more precise.

Back up..... huh?

What part of "assist in planning and present a DDR activity" is not a requirement. The checklist literally says that's a must for a Tech Rating.

If you're getting caught up on the semantics of a lecture vs. activity, you're reading too much into this.

My question:
Is DDR going to remain a part of the CP Specialty Track qualification requirement for the Technician Level rating?

If I am working on a training schedule, do I need to include time to cover something DDR-related so that this box will be checked for our CP Officers seeking their Tech Rating?




foo

It's not about semantics, sir. Both terms are used, separated by the conjunction "or." They are obviously distinctly different events. And the requirement is to assist (as in help another more experienced officer) to plan and present one of those events.

If that checklist item is holding people up from getting the rating, let's not make it seem more involved than it needs to be to get it done.

TheSkyHornet

Quote from: foo on January 09, 2018, 05:16:59 PM
It's not about semantics, sir. Both terms are used, separated by the conjunction "or." They are obviously distinctly different events. And the requirement is to assist (as in help another more experienced officer) to plan and present one of those events.

If that checklist item is holding people up from getting the rating, let's not make it seem more involved than it needs to be to get it done.

::)

DDR. Period. On any level. Whether a DDR lecture, or DDR activity.

I'm reading this as, while the DDR program is being overhauled and not a stand alone program as it used to be, the DDR lesson is still a requirement for the specialty track.

If that's accurate, I'll coordinate with our staff to have a DDR topic during a meeting. If not, we'll bypass it and move on. It sounds like the former.

And that's all I'm asking---which I'm regretting at this point.

Eclipse

Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 09, 2018, 06:23:57 PM
I'm reading this as, while the DDR program is being overhauled and not a stand alone program as it used to be, the DDR lesson is still a requirement for the specialty track.

If that's accurate, I'll coordinate with our staff to have a DDR topic during a meeting. If not, we'll bypass it and move on. It sounds like the former.

And that's all I'm asking---which I'm regretting at this point.

My comment was essentially based on "Why is this a question?" 

DDRx, such that it is, still exists, and the DDRx activities are still a part of the specialty track, so
what difference does it make if NHQ might change things tomorrow?

Until the pamphlet changes, or their is a relief from a requirement such as with the ECI tests,
you just do what it says to the subjective approval of your CC and move on.

"That Others May Zoom"

Paul Creed III

Quote from: TheSkyHornet on January 09, 2018, 06:23:57 PM
Quote from: foo on January 09, 2018, 05:16:59 PM
It's not about semantics, sir. Both terms are used, separated by the conjunction "or." They are obviously distinctly different events. And the requirement is to assist (as in help another more experienced officer) to plan and present one of those events.

If that checklist item is holding people up from getting the rating, let's not make it seem more involved than it needs to be to get it done.

::)

DDR. Period. On any level. Whether a DDR lecture, or DDR activity.

I'm reading this as, while the DDR program is being overhauled and not a stand alone program as it used to be, the DDR lesson is still a requirement for the specialty track.

If that's accurate, I'll coordinate with our staff to have a DDR topic during a meeting. If not, we'll bypass it and move on. It sounds like the former.

You are accurate.
Lt Col Paul Creed III, CAP
Group 3 Ohio Wing sUAS Program Manager

TheSkyHornet


Fester

Cadet required sleep time has been reduced at encampments, though interestingly it doesn't say "required",
it says "afforded the opportunity", which would seem to indicate they can stay up later if they want to:

"9.3.5. Personal Needs. Encampments will provide every participant with three full, balanced meals
daily. Students will be afforded the opportunity for 8.5 hours of uninterrupted sleep nightly, and the 30
minutes preceding lights out will be reserved for personal time. Cadet cadre will have an opportunity for
8.0 hours of uninterrupted sleep. "



If sleep time were "required," how would SM's go about forcing a cadet to sleep 8.5 hours?   :o
1stLt, CAP
Squadron CC
Group CPO
Eaker - 1996

Fester

And it's about time NHQ put the Wings in charge of O'Rides.  When I was a Cadet in 1997, I was the PO for a Joint O'Rides Day with my Squadron and two others.  I had 5 corporate aircraft slated for the event which was planned to fly 40 O'Rides in one day.  Not a SINGLE one of the corporate a/c showed for the event.  Back then, member owned a/c were acceptable with Wing/CC approval.  Scrambling to get those approved so that the 40 cadets that showed up for their O'Rides was a major PITA.
1stLt, CAP
Squadron CC
Group CPO
Eaker - 1996

TheSkyHornet

Quote from: Fester on January 29, 2018, 04:54:11 AM
Cadet required sleep time has been reduced at encampments, though interestingly it doesn't say "required",
it says "afforded the opportunity", which would seem to indicate they can stay up later if they want to:

"9.3.5. Personal Needs. Encampments will provide every participant with three full, balanced meals
daily. Students will be afforded the opportunity for 8.5 hours of uninterrupted sleep nightly, and the 30
minutes preceding lights out will be reserved for personal time. Cadet cadre will have an opportunity for
8.0 hours of uninterrupted sleep. "



If sleep time were "required," how would SM's go about forcing a cadet to sleep 8.5 hours?   :o

"Afforded" means you are given the opportunity, not that you use that opportunity. The cadets must be allotted time on their schedule for 30 minutes of personal time/hygiene followed by 8.5 hours of rest where they are not disturbed by cadre (no surprise wakeups, no midnight PT, pranks, etc.). If a cadet "can't" get to sleep (i.e., difficulty falling asleep, up studying/ironing, chatting with roommates, etc.), then that is on the cadet.


Ned

Quote from: Fester on January 29, 2018, 04:54:11 AM
If sleep time were "required," how would SM's go about forcing a cadet to sleep 8.5 hours?   :o

Perhaps reading CAP regulations aloud?   :P

Fester

Quote from: Ned on January 29, 2018, 05:13:46 PM
Quote from: Fester on January 29, 2018, 04:54:11 AM
If sleep time were "required," how would SM's go about forcing a cadet to sleep 8.5 hours?   :o

Perhaps reading CAP regulations aloud?   :P

I'm glad someone sensed the sarcasm.

Ned, I somehow came across the "Be An Ally" presentation you did at National Conference (I believe.)  It was fantastic.  Thank you for  creating, and giving, it.  And thank you for being an ally.
1stLt, CAP
Squadron CC
Group CPO
Eaker - 1996

Luis R. Ramos

NOW I get the comment of "reading the regulations" and the connection with getting cadets to sleep.

Boy am I dense! It is either my age or lack of sleep.  :P

It IS a good one, though.  >:D
Squadron Safety Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer