Tornado response

[NCRblues]

Given the large outbreak of tornados last evening in Kansas, Missouri and Illinois, what is the CAP response if any from those wings?

I have just recently seen the Ill governor asking for volunteer disaster relief workers, and was wondering if CAP has been involved yet.

And, if CAP is not involved, I beg to ask the question....why not? This is a perfect thing for CAP to help out with.

[stillamarine]

The MO Wing PAO sent an email to the list-sere earlier that said they had 2 aircraft up doing damage assessment for two different county EMAs.

[ol'fido]

Well, I live about 25 miles from Harrisburg, IL and my stepson works about 5 miles north of there at a coal mine. They were underground when the storm hit and they're fans got hit along with several of their surface structures.

I was in Harrisburg myself a couple of weeks ago at the Walmart and strip mall that got hit. That area was also hit very bad in '09 by flooding.

So far, I haven't heard of any CAP response here in Illinois. I had heard that they were saying that they didn't need anymore volunteers at this time. That may change after the initial SAR efforts are over.

[Eclipse]

Word was that the sirens were going off again a few hours ago, and now it's turning thick and white up North again.

[RiverAux]

And, if CAP is not involved, I beg to ask the question....why not? This is a perfect thing for CAP to help out with.

While there is no disaster that CAP couldn't provide some help, it doesn't follow that we must be at every disaster or that we should be offended when we don't get called after something happens.  There are a couple of things we are really, really good at and a whole bunch of things that we're really not any more qualified or prepared to do than the local church.  And even the sort of thing we do really well, isn't always needed in every disaster. 

In regards to tornados in particular, I've yet to see our wing get called to do true damage assessment flights.  As best I can tell, when we get called for these our purpose is just to provide some photos to stick in post-disaster powerpoint presentations.  All the real assessment is being done from the ground. 

[coudano]

CAP, generally speaking isn't fast enough, organizationally, to respond to something like a tornado.
If you want to be a first responder to stuff like that you should join your local VFD or CERT.

[Eclipse]

Looks like it was Indiana's turn today...

[GTCommando]

Authorities reported the three deaths in southern Indiana, where Clark County Sheriff's Department Maj. Chuck Adams said the 1,900-person town of Marysville is "completely gone." Extreme damage was also reported in the nearby town of Henryville, home to about 2,000 people.

Sometimes, it's almost too easy to forget how much damage a storm like this can cause. Then, we hear something like this. My thoughts and prayers go out to all of them.

[RiverAux]

CAP, generally speaking isn't fast enough, organizationally, to respond to something like a tornado.

Depends on what they ask us to do.  Heck, even if they just wanted some folks to hand out water I bet CAP could get a team out there faster than other non-ES oriented organizations. 

[coudano]

CAP, generally speaking isn't fast enough, organizationally, to respond to something like a tornado.

Depends on what they ask us to do.  Heck, even if they just wanted some folks to hand out water I bet CAP could get a team out there faster than other non-ES oriented organizations.

I don't think so,
in the amount of time it takes someone to realize something like this has happened and even START the ball in motion for a full CAP activation, your CERT and VFD are already going to be on site, and those in two tiers, the people who just drive around with their scanners on 24x7 get there first, and then those who get a call show up 5 minutes later (already too late to get the first punch and in some cases, like a fire or an accident, make any response at all).

By the time we roll a fully authorized mission number, spin up a minimal mission base, and start dispatching teams, the immediate response is basically over.  That doesn't count time for the teams to alert, grab their gear, make a rendezvous, and actually transport to the affected area from maybe 30 minutes to 4 hours away.

[wuzafuzz]

It simply depends on the need and whether the local emergency managers know about CAP.  If the impact is large enough there will be things to do for several days, if not longer.  After a day or two the first round of volunteers are ready for relief.  CAP isn't going to replace a VFD, but there are plenty of ways to help.

Been there, done that, with CAP.  In fact, it was a tornado response.  My wing has also helped with logistical tasks at shelters for wildfire evacuees.  It's not glamorous and probably won't get you on TV, but it is a valuable community service. 

[RiverAux]

CAP, generally speaking isn't fast enough, organizationally, to respond to something like a tornado.

Depends on what they ask us to do.  Heck, even if they just wanted some folks to hand out water I bet CAP could get a team out there faster than other non-ES oriented organizations.

I don't think so,
in the amount of time it takes someone to realize something like this has happened and even START the ball in motion for a full CAP activation, your CERT and VFD are already going to be on site, and those in two tiers, the people who just drive around with their scanners on 24x7 get there first, and then those who get a call show up 5 minutes later (already too late to get the first punch and in some cases, like a fire or an accident, make any response at all).

Note I specifically did not compare our response to other ES organizations like the FD or CERT.  I was referring to local church groups or others that might do the sort of work our ground teams might do. 

That being said, if the disaster is in a CAP town there is reason that a CAP unit couldn't be on scene within 2 hours which is plenty quick enough to help out. 

[Eclipse]

Amazing, and just like "that" it went from killer snow all weekend to "breezy" - it's 36° right now and all the white is gone.

NOAA says 55° on Tuesday.  That massive hook is working its way East and North.

[ol'fido]

Down here this morning we had mid-50's, thunderstorms, and rain. Afternoon was high winds, pea size hail, and lower 50s. Tonight, winds have died down and it's in the 30s. Southern Illinois...if you don't like the weather, wait a few minutes and it'll change.

[Eclipse]

I'm always amazed that it's usually 10 degrees warmer at your end.

[ol'fido]

Well, we are closer to the equator....

Plus the fact that when storms boil up in Tornado Alley down in OK and related areas they seem to follow a line up through Poplar Bluff, MO straight into S. Illinois. The storms up there seem to whip in out of the Dakotas and NE and curl around the southern tip of Lake Michigan.

[LTC Don]

My thoughts and prayers go out to all those affected by these storms.  The scale of the destruction is amazing.

[Eclipse]

^ Looks like you got a few of your own today.

[RADIOMAN015]

Other than an after the incident air support missions such as flying NWS researchers or taking photos for the state emergency management agency, or silencing ELT's at airports after the storm, CAP really is not a primary ground team response.  In our state in was Fire Department Task forces that sent in over 300 fire fighters with specialized equipment (to search EVERY facility that had been damaged), backed up by state police, and the national guard for security.   Local churches, The Salvation Army provided food and the Red Cross provided shelter management.  Security varied in each shelter with local police as well as National Guard military police. 

I know when we got hit back in June of last year (where I work was about 5 miles from where the tornado hit the hardest and I had left work about 20 minutes prior to the storm and heard the tornado warning while mobile and was able to confirm on my ham radio via the storm spotter/sky warn program where the tornado was heading and called my workplace via cellphone to warn them (I had also talked with my boss and had specifically stated about the tornado watch & one of the other guys in the office had started to monitor the local TV news via an internet connection).  They had hail greater than golf ball size & strong winds and had everyone down in the cellar shortly after I had called and they also saw the tornado warning on the internet).  BTW there may be a stronger OSHA standard coming out with a requirement for employers to ensure they take proactive timely action to protect their employees when there is (potential for) severe weather such as tornadoes, strong thunderstorms with winds, flooding, etc.  Regardless of any regulations it is the right thing to do.

I can't emphasize enough to go out and buy a good weather alert radio receiver and have that on ALL the time, especially next to your bed when you are sleeping.  IT can save your life if bad weather approaches and you are sleeping.  When that alert goes out that radio can be programmed to have a siren come on and you will get vital information.  We were very fortunate in our area that more people were not killed (one guy and his girl friend in a camp ground were specifically warned by the camp ground manager to get out of their RV and come into a reinforced building and refused saying the weather looked fine, the girl was killed and the guy was in the hospital for over two weeks).  It was just amazing some of the close calls some people had. 

I would think as a community service type project that cadets and senior members could assist with clean up in an area with appropriate coordination prior to going into the area.
RM 

[ol'fido]

Although CAP members could certainly volunteer to assist in Harrisburg, there is probably no need for an organized CAP response. I say that as someone who believes that CAP should help wherever possible. As bad as it was and in as remote a corner of the state as Harrisburg is, the most severe damage was confined to a relatively small area and not spread out over the entire region although many spots did have some significant damage. The state probably used their own aircraft to survey the damage. There is a Sikorsky S-76 that the Governor uses and he was down the next day. So little or no need for CAP aircraft.

Also, within hours of the tornado, the authorities were turning volunteers away because so many showed up to help. It seems that whenever we have severe weather like this people start checking on the neighbors, guys grab their chainsaws and start clearing the streets, and the local churches(and there are a lot of local churches) start opening their doors to help.