What happened to the Homeland Security mission?

[RVT]

Using California wing as an example - most of the information on our website dates from between 2001 and 2004.  From this I get the idea that following 9/11 there was a flood of interest and activity - and then when the actual Department of Homeland Security was formed - it suddenly stopped.

Based on no further information than the above - it looks to me like CAP ramped up to be an active part of DHS and then were told to go away.  I have never seen the Homeland Security ribbon on anybody, even in my own squadron where CD ribbons are fairly common.

39-3 now says the criteria for it are:"Awarded for participation in ten actual Homeland Security sorties as defined by the tasking organization as being in the interest of the security and/or defense of the nation", but this is all gray so the previous standards were different.  My guess was that it used to actually refer to DHS missions and was changed because these never happened.

[RiverAux]

I never noticed any widespread flood of missions.  The ones that have been discussed (such as the air intercept missions over DC) are all fairly limited.  I think that if you were expecting every unit to be doing a lot of homeland security missions you were sadly mistaken.  Like with a lot of specialty CAP missions these are going to be very dependent on local needs.  One unit may get a ton of work because there actually IS a ton of work.  Most units probably won't ever see much at all. 

I don't think we were ever expecting a whole lot of work directly with DHS.  They've got their own growing Air Force and probably don't have much need of our capabilities in general. 

[ammotrucker]

I agree with RiverAux on this.  I am from FLWG and there are plenty of HLS missions going on.  But they are limited to certain areas of the Wing.  You stated that you have not seen any HLS ribbons on members, I know that FLWG has quite a few.  There are many types of HLS mission that go further then just the Intercept missions that are advertised.  Many which the requesting agencies would prefer to keep out of the limelight. 

[SABRE17]

I've heard through the CAP grape vine that the air force wants to put the predator sensor balls on either all, or a large majority of our aircraft. if this were to happen perhaps we would be called more.

just what I saw on a piece of paper somewhere.

[Eclipse]

^ I'll believe that when they buy like the third one.  Based on comments here and elsewhere, at least currently
the USAF is holding this pretty close to the vest and in some cases building CAP units of current and former
military to run the systems instead of pushing this out to the general membership, which is not, exactly, the
CAP model.

As to HLS in general - it is being done where it is being done, I know of a few, but like CD, most of the
time it is either prohibited to discuss, or just not a good idea, so you won't see much about it in the Volunteer.

[SARDOC]

I've heard through the CAP grape vine that the air force wants to put the predator sensor balls on either all, or a large majority of our aircraft. if this were to happen perhaps we would be called more.

just what I saw on a piece of paper somewhere.

The Air Force bought two C172 non G1000 aircraft and they are fitted with the permanently mounted Sensor Balls.  Configuring an Aircraft for the predator mission makes it impractical to use the Aircraft for anything else.  With The Cost of the predator balls this will be VERY limited.  From what I understand these Aircraft are in Nevada and Alabama.  I heard in a briefing the other day that Qualified MP's and MO's who were interested in participating and could spend some time to travel to these locations they would train members to fly the mission but that you had to contact your wing Homeland Security Officer for information.

[SARDOC]

I know in my wing and in the National Capital wing the Homeland Security missions occur on a pretty regular basis.  I think if you are trying to get involved ask your wing Homeland Security Director.  Some states are very limited unless you have an MOU with the Air National Guard to help them meet their training objectives

[Flying Pig]

I've heard through the CAP grape vine that the air force wants to put the predator sensor balls on either all, or a large majority of our aircraft. if this were to happen perhaps we would be called more.

just what I saw on a piece of paper somewhere.

The Air Force bought two C172 non G1000 aircraft and they are fitted with the permanently mounted Sensor Balls.  Configuring an Aircraft for the predator mission makes it impractical to use the Aircraft for anything else.  With The Cost of the predator balls this will be VERY limited.  From what I understand these Aircraft are in Nevada and Alabama.  I heard in a briefing the other day that Qualified MP's and MO's who were interested in participating and could spend some time to travel to these locations they would train members to fly the mission but that you had to contact your wing Homeland Security Officer for information.

They were 182's and I believe they are being upgraded to Turbo 206 G1000's.   The sensor ball used is about $800K not including the instal and the mapping system that usually comes with it.  So I dont see that other CAP units will cruising around with them.  Besides, the MX15 WAAAAAAAAAY overkill for what we would need.  I think how they mounted it was completely ridiculous also.  I dont know who came up with that.  If you mount it right, for example, where the camera is on the plane I fly, you can do anything you want.  I fly a plane all over the state with a very large camera mounted to the fuselage and it hasnt restricted me from doing anything.  Additionally, it takes me about an hour to completely strip out all of my sensor equipment and reconfigure the plane bck to a stock C206 with back seats and all.   Theres a photo of it at the bottom of this thread.  The CHP flies with the same ball CAP is using, and they mounted it on the fuselage, not under the wing.  Perhaps when CAP changes aircraft, they can change the ball placement. 

http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=12449.0

[davidsinn]

INWG is quite busy with IDHS. We fly damage assement missions for flooding and provide ground teams to do the same from a van as well as provide manpower for filling sandbags. My EMA director swears by the local unit. They did twice the work of the state's sandbagging machine.

[RVT]

They were 182's and I believe they are being upgraded to Turbo 206 G1000's.   The sensor ball used is about $800K not including the instal and the mapping system that usually comes with it.  So I dont see that other CAP units will cruising around with them.

Since the USAF does not fly drone missions over the continental US I just didn't consider it to be a homeland security mission.  Thats direct USAF support for mission training which is in a whole new category.  Or if you prefer, a really old category.

[RVT]

INWG is quite busy with IDHS. We fly damage assement missions for flooding and provide ground teams to do the same from a van as well as provide manpower for filling sandbags. My EMA director swears by the local unit. They did twice the work of the state's sandbagging machine.

Excellent work, but thats Disaster Relief, not Homeland Security.

[lordmonar]

I am with the Green Flag West Surrogate Preadator program.

We are in fact getting 206's...they are building them right now.  The USAF is very excited about the program and we are expanding operations soons.

That is all I can really say....but if you are anywhere on the west coast talk to your wing ops officer and see what it takes to get involved in the program.

We need lots of instrument rated MPs and Observers.

PM me if you don't get any good information from your chain of command I will get you in touch with our DO and start the process off.

[SABRE17]

My unit CC is a CFI and Ex Huey pilot, he's expressed interest in doing it once he gets his MP rating.

[Flying Pig]

As long as hes got the money to travel to AL or CA/NV wing.

[blackrain]

I saw on the FLIR website a system called the Ultra 8500 FW. Designed for fixed as opposed to rotary wing (hence the FW designation). 29lbs and 9 1/2 inches in Dia with a laptop controller. I also found a price of about 200K. Might be more suited for CAP ops. Not cheap but cheaper.

[Flying Pig]

Yeah, thats what we have on our helicopters.  We have the Ultra 8500.  Theres no difference with the 8500FW.  Its just a marketing name.  Just like the FLIR Talon can only be sold to the military.  However, the FLIR Ultra 9HD is the same exact system but can be sold to the civilian world.

The FLIR 8500 is only good to about 1000 AGL before you really have trouble seeing what your looking at with any detail  For another $30K they will put a better lens in it that can be used very effectively up to about 6000AGL.  You can also put an IR laser in the FLIR so people on the ground with NVGs can see what the camera is pointed at.  Its great for aircrews also.  Actually, its a must for the pilot at night because without the laser and NVGs the pilot has no idea how to orient the airplane based on where the camera is pointed.  I posted a photo I took through my NVGs of the laser I have and put it in the photo gallery.  There is nothing to flying with NVGs.  As soon as I finish my CFI, I will be getting my NVG IP sign off as well for airplanes and helicopters.  NVG lighting (the poor mans version) is only about $800.  However, the NVGs are about $12,000 per set.  Instead of putting bazillions into that Airvan, Id like to see CAP buy a FLIR, a mapping system and 5 sets of NVGs.  Your looking at about $500K or a little less.  Then make the pilot requirements match accordingly.  How much was that ARCHER we never use?  Probably dont want a 300hr commercial pilot flying a night time FLIR mission on NVGs.  Is the G1000 monitor NVG compatible? 

I know its pretty wishful thinking, but thats how the big kids play.

[Mustang]

I am with the Green Flag West Surrogate Preadator program.

...

We need lots of instrument rated MPs and Observers.

Have they dropped the requirement to have a military tactical aviation background?

[blackrain]

Yeah, thats what we have on our helicopters.  We have the Ultra 8500.  Theres no difference with the 8500FW.  Its just a marketing name.  Just like the FLIR Talon can only be sold to the military.  However, the FLIR Ultra 9HD is the same exact system but can be sold to the civilian world.

The FLIR 8500 is only good to about 1000 AGL before you really have trouble seeing what your looking at with any detail  For another $30K they will put a better lens in it that can be used very effectively up to about 6000AGL.  You can also put an IR laser in the FLIR so people on the ground with NVGs can see what the camera is pointed at.  Its great for aircrews also.  Actually, its a must for the pilot at night because without the laser and NVGs the pilot has no idea how to orient the airplane based on where the camera is pointed.  I posted a photo I took through my NVGs of the laser I have and put it in the photo gallery.  There is nothing to flying with NVGs.  As soon as I finish my CFI, I will be getting my NVG IP sign off as well for airplanes and helicopters.  NVG lighting (the poor mans version) is only about $800.  However, the NVGs are about $12,000 per set.  Instead of putting bazillions into that Airvan, Id like to see CAP buy a FLIR, a mapping system and 5 sets of NVGs.  Your looking at about $500K or a little less.  Then make the pilot requirements match accordingly.  How much was that ARCHER we never use?  Probably dont want a 300hr commercial pilot flying a night time FLIR mission on NVGs.  Is the G1000 monitor NVG compatible? 

I know its pretty wishful thinking, but thats how the big kids play.

Yep I wondered about the altitude. It appeared in what I read as about 2000 AGL with I'm guessing 3km or so slant range. Sounds like it won't even make that. I would prefer a little more standoff. I also have a suspicion that the G1000 is not NVG compatable. Of course Cessna advertises Special Mission A/C versions so you would thing they thought of NVG compatability. Maybe a filter is available. Good question

I agree the IR laser is great if the guys on your team (air or ground) have NVGs you can fix the target and they'll never know they're being spotted. Maybe better than a visible spotlight......

On a side note do you have to take off and land with NVGs in a fixed wing scenario? Rotary I can see where you would.

[ol'fido]

Regarding the OP... I think that right after 9/11 a lot of people in CAP thought that the organization would be tasked with many of the roles we had during WW2 such as the "Southern Liaison Patrol" looking for infiltrating terrorists and suicide bombers or guarding dams, airports, etc.

Some of these things have come back such as the use of CAP aircraft to train fighters to intercept low speed aircraft which is kind of analogous to "target towing' missions BITD. But the missions have not come back to the extent and degree that those people thought they would. Most are very low key and area specific.

[RiverAux]

And remember that even during WWII only a tiny percentage of CAP members participated in the "active duty" missions.  The other 95+ percent were doing the same SAR and DR missions that we do today.