ABU Wear Test

[Sapper168]

Okay, speaking as someone who is personally very familiar with the line between can and can't wear AF-style uniforms, I do have to wonder about whether that line has been crossed by those pictured in the wear test.  But, yep, I'm going to be "that guy" and go there...

It's all good, the tested 'prototype' uniforms are not official CAP uniforms so no regs are broken.     

[Storm Chaser]

It's beginning to look like we are falling in 3 camps: Those who want ABUs (mostly cadets, but some seniors as well); those who don't, and want to keep BDUs; and those who don't, and want to move away from the AF style and stay with corporate BBDUs.

What about the fourth camp of those of us who don't really care whether we wear BDUs, BBDUs, or ABUs, but would like a single utility uniform that all members can wear.

[Shuman 14]

What about the fourth camp of those of us who don't really care whether we wear BDUs, BBDUs, or ABUs, but would like a single utility uniform that all members can wear.

:clap:

[Майор Хаткевич]

It's beginning to look like we are falling in 3 camps: Those who want ABUs (mostly cadets, but some seniors as well); those who don't, and want to keep BDUs; and those who don't, and want to move away from the AF style and stay with corporate BBDUs.

What about the fourth camp of those of us who don't really care whether we wear BDUs, BBDUs, or ABUs, but would like a single utility uniform that all members can wear.

Could be resolved if the #TotalForce allows CAP ABUs for all.

[TheSkyHornet]

It's beginning to look like we are falling in 3 camps: Those who want ABUs (mostly cadets, but some seniors as well); those who don't, and want to keep BDUs; and those who don't, and want to move away from the AF style and stay with corporate BBDUs.

What about the fourth camp of those of us who don't really care whether we wear BDUs, BBDUs, or ABUs, but would like a single utility uniform that all members can wear.

Could be resolved if the #TotalForce allows CAP ABUs for all.

Does that apply to the grooming and weight standards as well?

[nomad129]

Transitioning to ABUs is probably inevitable. For what it's worth, my opinion is that unlike our active duty brethren nothing in our mission requires any type of camouflage. Luckily ABUs, just like their ACU counterparts, don't actually blend in with anything, anywhere. I think we should drop camouflage uniforms entirely for blue BDUs, maybe in a more modern cut like ACUs though. I also think it's time to adopt orange shirts for search and rescue because wearing camouflage in these missions to totally counter productive...

[Garibaldi]

Transitioning to ABUs is probably inevitable. For what it's worth, my opinion is that unlike our active duty brethren nothing in our mission requires any type of camouflage. Luckily ABUs, just like their ACU counterparts, don't actually blend in with anything, anywhere. I think we should drop camouflage uniforms entirely for blue BDUs, maybe in a more modern cut like ACUs though. I also think it's time to adopt orange shirts for search and rescue because wearing camouflage in these missions to totally counter productive...

I hate to say I agree with you. Especially in the North Georgia mountains, where the foliage is so thick in places we can barely see a person two feet from you. Orange would definitely be safer.

[PHall]

Transitioning to ABUs is probably inevitable. For what it's worth, my opinion is that unlike our active duty brethren nothing in our mission requires any type of camouflage. Luckily ABUs, just like their ACU counterparts, don't actually blend in with anything, anywhere. I think we should drop camouflage uniforms entirely for blue BDUs, maybe in a more modern cut like ACUs though. I also think it's time to adopt orange shirts for search and rescue because wearing camouflage in these missions to totally counter productive...

I hate to say I agree with you. Especially in the North Georgia mountains, where the foliage is so thick in places we can barely see a person two feet from you. Orange would definitely be safer.

Of course if you were wearing the orange vest that you are required to wear during ES activities you would be visible.
But I guess following the regs can be inconvenient.

[lordmonar]

Transitioning to ABUs is probably inevitable. For what it's worth, my opinion is that unlike our active duty brethren nothing in our mission requires any type of camouflage. Luckily ABUs, just like their ACU counterparts, don't actually blend in with anything, anywhere. I think we should drop camouflage uniforms entirely for blue BDUs, maybe in a more modern cut like ACUs though. I also think it's time to adopt orange shirts for search and rescue because wearing camouflage in these missions to totally counter productive...

I hate to say I agree with you. Especially in the North Georgia mountains, where the foliage is so thick in places we can barely see a person two feet from you. Orange would definitely be safer.

And neither one of you understand why so many want the ABU and BDU in the first place. 

[Garibaldi]

Transitioning to ABUs is probably inevitable. For what it's worth, my opinion is that unlike our active duty brethren nothing in our mission requires any type of camouflage. Luckily ABUs, just like their ACU counterparts, don't actually blend in with anything, anywhere. I think we should drop camouflage uniforms entirely for blue BDUs, maybe in a more modern cut like ACUs though. I also think it's time to adopt orange shirts for search and rescue because wearing camouflage in these missions to totally counter productive...

I hate to say I agree with you. Especially in the North Georgia mountains, where the foliage is so thick in places we can barely see a person two feet from you. Orange would definitely be safer.

Of course if you were wearing the orange vest that you are required to wear during ES activities you would be visible.
But I guess following the regs can be inconvenient.

You ain't seen the foliage we gots here. Even a orange vest ain't always visible

[Майор Хаткевич]

Transitioning to ABUs is probably inevitable. For what it's worth, my opinion is that unlike our active duty brethren nothing in our mission requires any type of camouflage. Luckily ABUs, just like their ACU counterparts, don't actually blend in with anything, anywhere. I think we should drop camouflage uniforms entirely for blue BDUs, maybe in a more modern cut like ACUs though. I also think it's time to adopt orange shirts for search and rescue because wearing camouflage in these missions to totally counter productive...

I hate to say I agree with you. Especially in the North Georgia mountains, where the foliage is so thick in places we can barely see a person two feet from you. Orange would definitely be safer.

Of course if you were wearing the orange vest that you are required to wear during ES activities you would be visible.
But I guess following the regs can be inconvenient.

You ain't seen the foliage we gots here. Even a orange vest ain't always visible

And how would a small triangle at the neckline help in BBDUs?

[Storm Chaser]

It's beginning to look like we are falling in 3 camps: Those who want ABUs (mostly cadets, but some seniors as well); those who don't, and want to keep BDUs; and those who don't, and want to move away from the AF style and stay with corporate BBDUs.

What about the fourth camp of those of us who don't really care whether we wear BDUs, BBDUs, or ABUs, but would like a single utility uniform that all members can wear.

Could be resolved if the #TotalForce allows CAP ABUs for all.

Does that apply to the grooming and weight standards as well?

I think relaxing weight standards is definitely possible, but grooming standards are a different issue. While there may be religious or health reasons for not meeting certain grooming standards, most of the time is a matter of choice. I'm not sure the Air Force would go for that. 

[Luis R. Ramos]

Garibaldi-

If the thick foliage prevents people from seeing an orange vest, an orange shirt may not make that big of a difference...

[PHall]

Transitioning to ABUs is probably inevitable. For what it's worth, my opinion is that unlike our active duty brethren nothing in our mission requires any type of camouflage. Luckily ABUs, just like their ACU counterparts, don't actually blend in with anything, anywhere. I think we should drop camouflage uniforms entirely for blue BDUs, maybe in a more modern cut like ACUs though. I also think it's time to adopt orange shirts for search and rescue because wearing camouflage in these missions to totally counter productive...

I hate to say I agree with you. Especially in the North Georgia mountains, where the foliage is so thick in places we can barely see a person two feet from you. Orange would definitely be safer.

Of course if you were wearing the orange vest that you are required to wear during ES activities you would be visible.
But I guess following the regs can be inconvenient.

You ain't seen the foliage we gots here. Even a orange vest ain't always visible

If it's that thick then how can you see what you're looking for?  I don't think tripping over them is a viable option!

[abdsp51]

Folks are forgetting one thing that's the big issue with this.  The DoD has to allow it not the AF and Total Force is not the cure all and be all you think it is or is going to be.  And should we transition to it the H&W and grooming will probably stay the same. 

[Garibaldi]

Transitioning to ABUs is probably inevitable. For what it's worth, my opinion is that unlike our active duty brethren nothing in our mission requires any type of camouflage. Luckily ABUs, just like their ACU counterparts, don't actually blend in with anything, anywhere. I think we should drop camouflage uniforms entirely for blue BDUs, maybe in a more modern cut like ACUs though. I also think it's time to adopt orange shirts for search and rescue because wearing camouflage in these missions to totally counter productive...

I hate to say I agree with you. Especially in the North Georgia mountains, where the foliage is so thick in places we can barely see a person two feet from you. Orange would definitely be safer.

Of course if you were wearing the orange vest that you are required to wear during ES activities you would be visible.
But I guess following the regs can be inconvenient.

You ain't seen the foliage we gots here. Even a orange vest ain't always visible

If it's that thick then how can you see what you're looking for?  I don't think tripping over them is a viable option!

You would be surprised at the number of missing persons searches I've been on. The terrain rough, foliage thick, and it was our assigned AO due to the LKP/place last seen, etc.

As a lot of people say, it's all well and good to think its not a good idea, but you weren't there. Our last save in 1989 had members in the worst possible terrain imaginable, and pretty lousy wx to boot.

[goblin]

Folks are forgetting one thing that's the big issue with this.  The DoD has to allow it not the AF and Total Force is not the cure all and be all you think it is or is going to be.  And should we transition to it the H&W and grooming will probably stay the same.

This.

Total Force means absolutely nothing.

[TheSkyHornet]

Folks are forgetting one thing that's the big issue with this.  The DoD has to allow it not the AF and Total Force is not the cure all and be all you think it is or is going to be.  And should we transition to it the H&W and grooming will probably stay the same.

This.

Total Force means absolutely nothing.

Exactly. It's a recognition and morale booster. That's all.

The subject of uniforms is about uniformity, feasibility, and purpose, not what we're entitled to.

I'm personally not a fan of opening military uniforms to all personnel because of the H&W/Grooming concerns. Yes, while we do have mission needs, we also need to strongly consider the public perception of a 300-lb person with a beard in a military uniform. This isn't to insult anyone's physical fitness or appearance. This is just societal norms. The public doesn't look kindly upon seeing someone in a uniform that looks completely out of place. We need to be very mindful of how this portrays the Air Force or any other branch.

Personal story:
Had a cadet show up in blues one day with a goatee and side burns. His uniform looked great, but his appearance looked like hell. I pulled him aside, and asked him what was going on with the facial hair, and followed up with "When you go out, people don't know that you're a CAP cadet or that you're not Air Force. They know none of this. They see a person in a uniform that looks the way you do right now. Now what do you think their perception of this would be?"

So think about that when we consider what uniform we want and who's going to wear it.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Guess the AF doesn't quite have the same hold ups on this as some members in CAP.

[winterg]

That general is Air Guard (I believe) and was ordered by Christie to shape up after this.  If it is the recent story I am remembering.