Making the BDU the new CAP corporate field utility uniform?

[JC004]

I see a little confusion. For reference:

ACU= Army Combat Uniform
ABU=Airman Battle Uniform

I doubt that National or the Air Force would sign off on Army uniforms.

It would be easier if they did. Just get tapes on Velcro, and I've got five uniforms to work with. Not sure how we would adopt patches, nothing gets sewn on the ACU. I guess badges could get pinned on.

How long do you think it took the AF to find "Battle" in their thesaurus for the naming?   

[jb512]

I really doesn't matter.  We'll end up following behind the AF a few years like we always have and will be in ABUs soon enough.

(Someone please fix the nametape colors though!)

[SarDragon]

The "BBDU" (aka: CAP Distinctive Field Uniform) as CAP uses it is not in major use by any of the Armed Forces, correct?  The Coast Guard and Navy have similar uniforms, but not the same one's we're buying, correct?

So how are we able to get sufficient supply for those who need them?   Guess somebody manufactures them nonetheless.

Other folks wear BBDUs besides CAP, a lot of other folks - SWAT, EMTs, and anyone else who thinks it's a good working uniform. I don't see the supply going away anytime soon.

[jb512]

The "BBDU" (aka: CAP Distinctive Field Uniform) as CAP uses it is not in major use by any of the Armed Forces, correct?  The Coast Guard and Navy have similar uniforms, but not the same one's we're buying, correct?

So how are we able to get sufficient supply for those who need them?   Guess somebody manufactures them nonetheless.

Other folks wear BBDUs besides CAP, a lot of other folks - SWAT, EMTs, and anyone else who thinks it's a good working uniform. I don't see the supply going away anytime soon.

That's right... with the amount of other agencies using the BBDUs, they will be around for quite a while.  The bad thing is that they're not always up to milspec, and they're more expensive than free surplus military uniforms.

[MIKE]

I'm not so sure about that.  The are a lot of options out there in tactical clothing these days 5.11, the TRU (SWATized ACU) etc.

[jb512]

Heh... with the lowest bidder almost always being the BDU knockoffs, you can bet they'll be around just as long as the 5.11s and others.  Only the high-speed professionals rate the name brands...

[BillB]

Somebody manufactures them, but how man CAP members have them? Perhaps 5%?? And your talking about the BBDU for seniors only, cadets will still wear USAF style uniforms, either BDU or when authorized the ABU.

[Hawk200]

I see a little confusion. For reference:

ACU= Army Combat Uniform
ABU=Airman Battle Uniform

I doubt that National or the Air Force would sign off on Army uniforms.

It would be easier if they did. Just get tapes on Velcro, and I've got five uniforms to work with. Not sure how we would adopt patches, nothing gets sewn on the ACU. I guess badges could get pinned on.

How long do you think it took the AF to find "Battle" in their thesaurus for the naming?   

Good question.  The Air Force pushes that they do joint ops, but they won't play well with others. The "Battle" part doesn't make a warrior, anymore than the clothes do. There are a few Airman that I would unquestionably consider warriors, but the Air Force isn't real strong on using that word, and I wouldn't apply it to every Airman.

[JC004]

I see a little confusion. For reference:

ACU= Army Combat Uniform
ABU=Airman Battle Uniform

I doubt that National or the Air Force would sign off on Army uniforms.

It would be easier if they did. Just get tapes on Velcro, and I've got five uniforms to work with. Not sure how we would adopt patches, nothing gets sewn on the ACU. I guess badges could get pinned on.

How long do you think it took the AF to find "Battle" in their thesaurus for the naming?   

Good question.  The Air Force pushes that they do joint ops, but they won't play well with others. The "Battle" part doesn't make a warrior, anymore than the clothes do. There are a few Airman that I would unquestionably consider warriors, but the Air Force isn't real strong on using that word, and I wouldn't apply it to every Airman.

I still think it's silly to have uniforms that don't blend in with anything, but hey, I'm no camo expert.  Maybe they only stand out better than before in pictures or when I see them against foliage because I am imagining things...

[Hawk200]

I still think it's silly to have uniforms that don't blend in with anything, but hey, I'm no camo expert.  Maybe they only stand out better than before in pictures or when I see them against foliage because I am imagining things...

Trust me, you're not imagining things. The Army camo was supposed to be a three environment camouflage (woodland, desert, urban), but it wasn't going to be a perfect fit into any one of those environments. And when you see them in those various environments, you can tell. The Air Force utility uses the same colors, plus one, in their "camo" pattern.

The Marines did better by issuing two separate uniforms. Their woodland works well in those environments, the desert works well in desert. They worked on an urban design, but I don't think it got much into more than the planning stage. The Corps accepts that there is no perfect multi-environment camouflage. Multi-Cam actually works fairly well, better than others, in both woodland and desert, but its not perfect either.

Either way, the ABU will actually be more noticeable in the woods than the previous woodland, there is far less grey in the woods.

[RiverAux]

Now, it seems we have a split decision on my original proposal to make the BDU a corporate uniform when it is no longer in use by the AF and to make it the only "field" uniform (in other words, CAP would all be in BDUs and would not switch over to the ABU).

What would you say if I proposed eliminating the BBDU, making the BDU the new corporate uniform, but still making the switchover to ABUs for those who meet weight and grooming standards?  In other words, our field uniforms would be ABUs for the fit and cleanshaven and the BDU for the fat and fuzzies? 

This would put everybody in a military style uniform and rather than having the fat and fuzzies wear something entirely unmilitary, they would be in a military style uniform, just one a little out of date.  They wouldn't look nearly as out of place with the other CAP members then. 

[JC004]

I guess it WOULD be an advantage to have an AF style combo that doesn't blend in with anything... 

[RogueLeader]

I guess it WOULD be an advantage to have an AF style combo that doesn't blend in with anything... 

Hey, if it DOESN"T blend in with anything, why is there any objection about us being seen.  This would be an IMPROVEMENT.  Right?

[DrJbdm]

Now, it seems we have a split decision on my original proposal to make the BDU a corporate uniform when it is no longer in use by the AF and to make it the only "field" uniform (in other words, CAP would all be in BDUs and would not switch over to the ABU).

What would you say if I proposed eliminating the BBDU, making the BDU the new corporate uniform, but still making the switchover to ABUs for those who meet weight and grooming standards?  In other words, our field uniforms would be ABUs for the fit and cleanshaven and the BDU for the fat and fuzzies? 

This would put everybody in a military style uniform and rather than having the fat and fuzzies wear something entirely unmilitary, they would be in a military style uniform, just one a little out of date.  They wouldn't look nearly as out of place with the other CAP members then. 

   I have often thought this would make the most sense.  I can actually see something along these lines happen one day. I would vote for it.

[0]

Chances are likey that once the Air Force phases out the BDU that we will then get authorizatio to wear the ABU. 

[Ricochet13]

Blue BDU - Senior sand cadets.= Never

If anything I would recommend just the opposite.

Blue BDU - Cadets and Seniors

I see great advantage in the "One Uniform" concept, at least as far as the field uniform is concerned.
Have both styles myself and wear them based on what the majority of my fellow members will be wearing.

What seems to be the aversion to the BBDU?  It's a sharp uniform that looks great.

[Hawk200]

Blue BDU - Senior sand cadets.= Never

If anything I would recommend just the opposite.

Blue BDU - Cadets and Seniors

I see great advantage in the "One Uniform" concept, at least as far as the field uniform is concerned.
Have both styles myself and wear them based on what the majority of my fellow members will be wearing.

What seems to be the aversion to the BBDU?  It's a sharp uniform that looks great.

My aversion is that I don't want to go buy them. I have BDU's, I like them. I can wear my military badges on it, and I like that. I was Air Force for awhile, intend to be again in the future, and I like wearing what they wear.

If people want to wear BBDU, I got no problem with it. But I think I should be allowed the choice.

Chances are likey that once the Air Force phases out the BDU that we will then get authorizatio to wear the ABU. 

Already been discussed at the National level. From what the Air Force has said, we'll get it.

[baronet68]

What seems to be the aversion to the BBDU?  It's a sharp uniform that looks great.

My aversion is that I don't want to go buy them...

Chances are likey that once the Air Force phases out the BDU that we will then get authorizatio to wear the ABU. 

Already been discussed at the National level. From what the Air Force has said, we'll get it.

Sounds like everyone currently wearing BDUs will be required to buy new uniforms pretty soon.  So, if people are going to be buying uniforms anyhow, why not have then buy uniforms that everyone can wear instead of continuing our tradition of uniform segregating based on members' physical characteristics?

[SAR-EMT1]

Weight and grooming aside...

I would like to get rid of the BBDU and (eventually) the TPU. - I say eventually because I know about the cost.

[ColonelJack]

Weight and grooming aside...

I would like to get rid of the BBDU and (eventually) the TPU. - I say eventually because I know about the cost.

So what do you recommend for those who don't meet AF grooming standards?  Not being members?  Not being uniformed?  I ask this because the uniforms you'd like to see done away with are the only uniforms they can wear that allow the display of their earned CAP grade and awards.

And you can bet the mortgage that the Air Force is not going to relax their uniform rules to allow "fat-n-fuzzies" to wear that particular outfit.

Take away the uniform that these valuable members can wear and you create a demoralization that may cost CAP a large number from its membership.

You say "weight and grooming aside" but it's weight and grooming that are the reasons for these corporate uniforms.  If you put the issue aside, you put the people aside -- and I doubt CAP can afford that.

I wish I could understand why people want to do away with uniform items approved by the National Board, the BoG, and (as far as they have anything to say about it at all) the Air Force.  How is it that these people are right and the people who approved them are wrong?  What is the basis for that logic?

Jack