Basic, Senior and Master EMT/Paramedic Badge

[Eclipse]

This is an interesting concept because both arguments are valid. I wear earned badges that I am qualified to wear however, I understand the argument to remove them when you are no longer current. But the downside to this argument is with the obvious point with the doctors and pilots, were they qualified - yes  are they currently qualified - no. Now with that said assuming that they have not become completely incoherent in the last few years since they were current in their qualifications, could they perform the task if it were a necessity - I would think that they could - would they most likely use the most current tools - no but none the less if my choice were a retired doctor vs. no doctor, well I know which I am going to choose.

Current qualifications are irrelevant to wear of the badge - qualify once, wear it for life.  This is supported by both CAP regs and military tradition.

We don't task people during missions based on what they have on their uniform, we do it based on their 101 card and/or eServices, so the fact that they have wings or a GBD badge doesn't make any difference in any operational role.

Now, if someone asks a former EMT to start an IV because they see a SoL badge, and the (now) unlicensed, unqualified member is dumb enough to do it without saying he's out of currency, then the member deserves all the heat he will gets.

The badges simply indicate that a person did "x" to the satisfaction of a CAP evaluator once, nothing more (or less).

[ZackN]

And they are approved for wear at  this time? As for using their 101 card, I may be incorrect as I have been out of the picture for awhile, but I do not recall seeing the option for placing health care qualifications on it?

[Eclipse]

And they are approved for wear at  this time? As for using their 101 card, I may be incorrect as I have been out of the picture for awhile, but I do not recall seeing the option for placing health care qualifications on it?

There aren't because there are currently no health care ES qualifications.  CAP is not a medical responder agency.

The wear of the EMT, Medical, are recognition of service and certification outside CAP, nothing more - they confer no special abilities
or standing beyond that.

I think you can buy the badges, but since there's no objective definitions of the levels of badge, wearing them is an issue.

[JohnnyT]

OK, here is another question, maybe someone can answer. I am aware of a member who dosen't have his EMT rating anymore, but still wears the badge. I asked if I could also wear the badge since I was previously a registered/licensed EMT as was told I could not. Why is that? I would have met the same qualification standards as this other member? I still have copies of my certificate, registration and license to prove I was an EMT.

Thanks

Johnny T

[Major Lord]

Johnny,

Seriously? You can't wear it because you are not a current EMT in your State. End of story.  Just because the other guy is doing it does not give you a waiver to wear it. It sounds like you are more interested in burning the other guy, which is understandable, but not necessarily prudent to do directly.

Major Lord

[Flying Pig]

I dont recall where it is.  And I cant find it right now, but it does (or did) state that you must be current.  Thats why I dont wear mine anymore.  Unless they dropped the currency requirement since then. 

[SARDOC]

Below is the Quote from the March 2005 National Board Meeting Minutes

3. Modification to EMT/Paramedic Badge.
COL ROBINSON/RMR MOVED and COL GLASGOW/NCR seconded the committee
recommendation that the National Board  approve the 3-level EMT/Paramedic
badges and eliminate the wear of an EMT patch on the left BDU pocket.  March 2005 National Board 
16
MOTION CARRIED WITH NO DISSENTING VOTES.
FOLLOW-ON ACTION:  Implementation of policy, notification to the field, and change to
regulation.  There was agreement that the phase-in date would be set by National
Headquarters.
NOTE:  There was clarification that members would wear these badges according to
their individual state licensure levels as an EMT.

[Hawk200]

I would hope that a former EMT (as in not currently certified) would not wear that badge on an operational uniform. On a dress uniform, it's a different manner. Even a formerly certified EMT can do things, and even more importantly, knows what not to do in the case of an emergency.

These things need to be codified into publications. We have pubs for a reason. We run on those, not Board minutes. And, not everybody sees Board minutes (I know they're readily accessible to someone who truly wants to find them and knows how, but not everyone does.)

I have no problem with someone doing something approved by the Board, first: they should be able to produce the Boards approval, second: that should only be used until the pub is updated (this is where our greatest failure seems to be regularly occuring.)

[lordmonar]

Okay....question.....


If your EMT quals lapse.....you have to take off the badge.
But if you FAA medical lapses....you don't have to take off your pilot wings.

Why the difference?

[arajca]

Below is the Quote from the March 2005 National Board Meeting Minutes

3. Modification to EMT/Paramedic Badge.
COL ROBINSON/RMR MOVED and COL GLASGOW/NCR seconded the committee
recommendation that the National Board  approve the 3-level EMT/Paramedic
badges and eliminate the wear of an EMT patch on the left BDU pocket.  March 2005 National Board 
16
MOTION CARRIED WITH NO DISSENTING VOTES.
FOLLOW-ON ACTION:  Implementation of policy, notification to the field, and change to
regulation.  There was agreement that the phase-in date would be set by National
Headquarters.
NOTE:  There was clarification that members would wear these badges according to
their individual state licensure levels as an EMT.

Based on that line, even though I am a current EMT, I cannot wear the EMT badge because I am not licensed. I have a certification, not a license. For those who would say it's the same thing, it is not. A medical doctor is licensed. An EMT, of any level in CO, is merely certified.

[Hawk200]

Okay....question.....


If your EMT quals lapse.....you have to take off the badge.
But if you FAA medical lapses....you don't have to take off your pilot wings.

Why the difference?

That was pretty much answered here: http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=9431.msg174554#msg174554

How many emergencies are you going to desperately require a pilot to save a life?

[SarDragon]

Below is the Quote from the March 2005 National Board Meeting Minutes

3. Modification to EMT/Paramedic Badge.
COL ROBINSON/RMR MOVED and COL GLASGOW/NCR seconded the committee
recommendation that the National Board  approve the 3-level EMT/Paramedic
badges and eliminate the wear of an EMT patch on the left BDU pocket.  March 2005 National Board 
16
MOTION CARRIED WITH NO DISSENTING VOTES.
FOLLOW-ON ACTION:  Implementation of policy, notification to the field, and change to
regulation.  There was agreement that the phase-in date would be set by National
Headquarters.
NOTE:  There was clarification that members would wear these badges according to
their individual state licensure levels as an EMT.

Based on that line, even though I am a current EMT, I cannot wear the EMT badge because I am not licensed. I have a certification, not a license. For those who would say it's the same thing, it is not. A medical doctor is licensed. An EMT, of any level in CO, is merely certified.

Actually, that card in your pocket that says you are allowed to fly an airplane is also a certificate.

Here's what the FAA has to say: http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/

[lordmonar]

Okay....question.....


If your EMT quals lapse.....you have to take off the badge.
But if you FAA medical lapses....you don't have to take off your pilot wings.

Why the difference?

That was pretty much answered here: http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=9431.msg174554#msg174554

How many emergencies are you going to desperately require a pilot to save a life?

Don't need a badge to save a life.  I have saved many lives....never wore a badge.  That is not the issue I am bringing up.  The question is who can wear the badge.  If the rule say only currently qualifed EMTs.....why is that rule not applied to GT members, pilots, lawyers, MDs, observers, et al?

[Flying Pig]

If you had a badge, maybe you could have saved more?

[lordmonar]

If you had a badge, maybe you could have saved more?

  Nahw.....I didn't like most of the people I saved....

[Hawk200]

That is not the issue I am bringing up.  The question is who can wear the badge.  If the rule say only currently qualifed EMTs.....why is that rule not applied to GT members, pilots, lawyers, MDs, observers, et al?

Because there is a difference in what they can do. A pilot is almost never needed so desperately that there isn't time to check his qualifications. Medical personnel are usually demanded on the spot when identified. Pilots are not.

As an aside, I recall sometype of directive that no longer permits lawyers to wear the badge when not currently serving in that appointed capacity. Something about not offering advice on behalf of CAP, or not involving them somehow. It was another one of those Board minutes things.

[arajca]

That is not the issue I am bringing up.  The question is who can wear the badge.  If the rule say only currently qualifed EMTs.....why is that rule not applied to GT members, pilots, lawyers, MDs, observers, et al?

Because there is a difference in what they can do. A pilot is almost never needed so desperately that there isn't time to check his qualifications. Medical personnel are usually demanded on the spot when identified. Pilots are not.

As an aside, I recall sometype of directive that no longer permits lawyers to wear the badge when not currently serving in that appointed capacity. Something about not offering advice on behalf of CAP, or not involving them somehow. It was another one of those Board minutes things.

OK. So why are doctors and nurses permitted to wear their badges when their license/qualification expire?

[a2capt]

If we were the Civil Medical Patrol, maybe we'd have to yank wings and keep Asclepius on currency expiry?

[Hawk200]

That is not the issue I am bringing up.  The question is who can wear the badge.  If the rule say only currently qualifed EMTs.....why is that rule not applied to GT members, pilots, lawyers, MDs, observers, et al?

Because there is a difference in what they can do. A pilot is almost never needed so desperately that there isn't time to check his qualifications. Medical personnel are usually demanded on the spot when identified. Pilots are not.

As an aside, I recall sometype of directive that no longer permits lawyers to wear the badge when not currently serving in that appointed capacity. Something about not offering advice on behalf of CAP, or not involving them somehow. It was another one of those Board minutes things.

OK. So why are doctors and nurses permitted to wear their badges when their license/qualification expire?

I don't know, are they allowed to? It's a good question if they are permitted to do so. Do their certifications even expire?

There's also differences in how either operate. An EMT/Paramedic is a First Responder, while doctors and nurses are not. That may be why there isn't an issue relating to their badge wear.

Overall, I seriously doubt that you are ever going to have an emergency requirement for a pilot, observer, or ground team member, so an argument against their wearing of a badge after expiration of their qualifications really doesn't seem to be relevent in any manner other than "I can't, so why can they do it?!"

[SarDragon]

I'm don't know why either. In the RealMilitary™, pilots and aircrew can wear their wings after their quals lapse, if there have been no other "for cause" disqualification factors. I'm not sure about some of the other stuff. I think USN warfare badges fit into that, too.