Civil Air Patrol and knifes

Started by dman12323, January 11, 2011, 03:09:03 AM

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coloncapfl

I can see that some people can't be taken serious. This is my last comment on this subject. I guess you can't ask a serious question without somebody making a mockery out of it like adolescents. Thanks for the lack of help of some, and the mature comment from others. Just remember that cadets read this comments too. What an example.

ol'fido

You took your OPINION on the definition of one regulation and proceeded to tell us that was how it should be in CAP. You were disagreed with and explained to why your OPINION differed from most everybody else's opinion. You then accused several of us of failure to follow regulations and now of providing a bad example. The job of a commander is often to "interpret" regulations that are vague or that do not exactly fit the situation at hand. As 60-3 states, these situations should be handled with common sense, prudence, and mindfulness of the safety of our people. In this instance, you have taken your opinion of a regulation and filtered our actions through your opinion and found us wanting. Again, however, this is YOUR OPINION.

After a while of going "round the rose bush" trying to convey this sentiment to you, some members of the forum tried to lighten the mood and pass along a little of that "common sense" via some humor. That's what happens on a forum like this. It's happened to everybody on here. Welcome to the club.
Lt. Col. Randy L. Mitchell
Historian, Group 1, IL-006

FlyTiger77

#122
Quote from: coloncapfl on April 05, 2013, 10:37:57 PM
What I am trying to say is that outside of CAP ES related activities, there is no reason to be carrying a knife...

The regulation you quoted only prohibits "dangerous weapons" under state statute or local ordinance. This definition does not include all knives. In Tennessee, for instance, as long as the knife has a blade less than or equal to 4" and is not a switchblade or inertia (butterfly-style among others) it is not considered a "dangerous weapon." Now, different laws may or may not apply if a CAP event is held at a school as there may be more strict definitions of prohibited items in the vicinity of the school.

Whether or not there is a "...reason to be carrying a knife..." I think it would be difficult to determine a nation-wide standard of what is reasonable. In NYC, perhaps there is never a need for a good, strong pocketknife, but on a farm in NW Georgia that same knife is invaluable.

In the hands of the right person, a knitting needle is a deadly weapon. In the hands of the wrong person, a pair of nail clippers is dangerous (at least to the person holding them).

YMMV.

Disclaimer: I am still not a lawyer and you rely on my legal analysis at your own peril.
JACK E. MULLINAX II, Lt Col, CAP

Eclipse

6"?   You call that a knife?  Now this is a knife...



"That Others May Zoom"

The Infamous Meerkat

The Mark 1 High Capacity Combat Assault Spoon! I had one of those in my kit for this weekend's event, it was my most useful piece of gear.  8)
Captain Kevin Brizzi, CAP
SGT, USMC
Former C/TSgt, CAP
Former C/MAJ, Army JROTC

johnnyb47

It's either a Firearm, a knife (even then Michigan Law doesn't care about hunting knives) or an "Other Dangerous Weapon".
Check your states laws as they usually specify what is considered an "Other Dangerous Weapon" (in Michigan it's: blackjack, billy, metallic knuckles, sand club, sand bag or bludgeon).

Also, check the KB. Clarification on the subject does say there is typically no reason for cadets to be carrying knives to every meeting BUT it does not expressly prohibit it and it further goes to state some of the reasons TO carry knives to regular CAP meetings (IE: Aerospace Projects).

IMHO the intent of the regulation is to keep members from wandering the woods with Billy Clubs and Brass Knuckles during a search. "If' I cant carry a gun I'm carrying my OTHER boomstick!"
It's still left open ended and forces you to check your local laws for "updates" in case someone comes out with a new instrument of death that can neither be defined as a firearm or a bladed instrument of some sort.

I'm not a lawyer but I DID get arrested for carrying a butterfly knife (read: Messing around with it in my front yard) when I was 12. Great gift, DAD!
Thank goodness the local police didn't live by todays zero tolerance laws. They took my knife and sent me home.
Since then I've been pretty careful and regularly read up to see if there is anything else I can't play with in my front yard.
I mean KNIVES, you sickos. KNIVES.
Capt
Information Technology Officer
Communications Officer


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Blackjack

After sitting back and enjoy reading through this little discussion, I found my deer knife meets regs. So it looks like I have a new SAR knife.
C/CMSgt Marshall Bellizzi
SER-TN-173
MRO, GTM3

PHall

I have found that 99% of my cutting needs in the field have been handled either by my Swiss Army Knife (Tinkerer model) or my Gerber Multitool.

Dracosbane

Quote from: ol'fido on April 05, 2013, 09:35:44 PM
Quote from: flyer333555 on April 05, 2013, 04:19:16 PM
Eclipse,

The laws of each sate define that.

Usually they agree that any knife with a blade larger than 3 inches is a dangerous weapon.

See http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-dangerous-weapon.htm

And http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deadly_weapon

And http://definitions.uslegal.com/d/deadly-weapon

Flyer
Knives, like firearms, are only as dangerous as the person wielding them. Any knife is dangerous in the hands of someone who knows how to use it. Most of the people I have seen carrying completely outrageous knives were more dangerous to themselves than anyone else. What I see far more than somebody showing up with the "survival samurai sword" is cadets and seniors showing up with super cheap pocket and kitchen(yes, I said kitchen) knives that are useless and like I said dangerous to the user. And yes, 99.99% of the time, you will not need anything more than a pocket knife for ground team, but when you need something more, you REALLY need it!

Most serious bushcrafters recommend a knife blade be no longer than the width of your hand at the palm and just below the knuckles or about 3 1/2" to 4". It should have a thickness to allow the back of the blade to be struck without damaging it(batoning), be high carbon steel, and full tang.

http://www.amazon.com/Esee-Knives-Desert-Micarta-Handles/dp/B004DTRERG

They also make this model with a blaze orange micarta handle.

Esee also makes the blade in blaze orange (IIRC; I know they do for the Izula), so you can accessorize it with the blaze micarta handles.  However, I prefer (and really really want) and Esee 5.  It was designed with the USAF in mind and is meant to be a knife used to survive.  I really want a Junglas too, but that may or may not be a part of my gear.

lordmonar

Quote from: PHall on April 15, 2013, 11:15:55 PM
I have found that 99% of my cutting needs in the field have been handled either by my Swiss Army Knife (Tinkerer model) or my Gerber Multitool.
+1  In my Aircrew Surivival Kit....I carry an USAF surival knife.....and a pocket knife....but for GT and everyday use....i just use my Benchmade 3" folding knife and a Leatherman Multi-tool.

Like I said before......Ask your chain of command/GTL/GBD if in doubt if your knife is legal.   If you absolutely have to go into the feild with a pig sticker......put it in your pack, out of sight, out of mind.  ;)
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP