Requirements to be a CAP Pilot

[simon]

I am interested in a CAP pilot's opinion about the likely progression and timeframe that I would be following to become a CAP pilot.

My principal area of interest is to fly Search and Rescue missions, although I would still be happy to fly as a pilot on other missions.

Re my background, I am a new pilot, so I am wondering with the minimum experience requirements whether SAR is 1 year, 2 years off etc. I learnt to fly last year out of Palo Alto, CA, in a Citabria. Since then I have acquired my complex and high performance endorsements and I have been flying an Arrow, V-Tail Bonanza, Super Decathlon (For aerobatics) and I still have a soft spot for the Citabria. I have done a little Sierra flying as well. South Lake Tahoe etc. I have 160TT and 80PIC and appreciate that in pilot experience terms I really am in the low time category.

I went to a CAP meeting at Palo Alto a couple of weeks ago (A composite group there with a 182) and also went to a Reid-Hillview meeting (Seniors group with a 206) and found everybody very welcoming.

What is the likely progression for me to get into SAR? Is it:

1) Get a few more PIC hours to get me to 100, sit the tests, do a checkout and be entitled to fly the aircraft as a transport pilot.
2) Fly for another year, become a) An observer, then b) A scanner, learn about SAR as I go, then become qualified as a mission pilot once I get to 175 hours PIC. At that point I can do ELT missions.
3) Keep going, study the pilot requirements for SAR, sit the tests, get to 200 PIC at which point I am qualified on paper to be a SAR pilot.

This is my understanding of the minimums as per the CAP regulations. I appreciate that I could actually require more time and training to be qualified in a practical sense. I am just trying to put a timeline on where I will be and when so I can start planning to fly non CAP 182's/206's with instructors to develop a level of competancy before getting into corporate planes. I don't have Cessna time since I'm flying mainly ragwings, Pipers and the Beech.

Could a low time pilot myself who flies weekly expect to spend around 2 years to get to SAR mission pilot level?

[Hammerhead]

I believe the 1 to 2 year estimate is about right.  Again it depends on how quickly you can get to the minimum PIC time.  I would get some instruction from one of the Mission Pilot Check Pilots and take it from there.  I have seen retired airline pilots take two years to become Mission Pilots. 

[davedove]

2) Fly for another year, become a) An observer, then b) A scanner, learn about SAR as I go, then become qualified as a mission pilot once I get to 175 hours PIC. At that point I can do ELT missions.

I don't know the rest, as I'm not aircrew, but Mission Scanner is the first step here.  After that, you can go straight to Mission Pilot, you don't have to do Mission Observer to be a pilot, although it certainly doesn't hurt if you want to do that.

[RiverAux]

Normally, even if you had all the PIC you needed, it takes about a year to get to mission pilot status though this can vary depending on how many missions are available for you to fly on.  However, it sounds as if you've got a lot of flying to do to get up to that level.  But, don't worry about it.  We need good qualified scanners and observers almost as much as pilots, so you should keep busy. 

[jayleswo]

What is the likely progression for me to get into SAR? Is it:

1) Get a few more PIC hours to get me to 100, sit the tests, do a checkout and be entitled to fly the aircraft as a transport pilot.
2) Fly for another year, become a) An observer, then b) A scanner, learn about SAR as I go, then become qualified as a mission pilot once I get to 175 hours PIC. At that point I can do ELT missions.
3) Keep going, study the pilot requirements for SAR, sit the tests, get to 200 PIC at which point I am qualified on paper to be a SAR pilot.

Could a low time pilot myself who flies weekly expect to spend around 2 years to get to SAR mission pilot level?

Hello Simon. I used to be a member of SQ10 in Palo Alto and it is a very good unit.  I am now with SQ14 in Sacramento. I read through your list and it looks pretty good. I just had a few observations. First, concerning #2, you fly most any kind of mission (not just ELT) once you become a Trainee Mission Pilot as long as you have a Qualified mentor Mission Pilot along with you.

Second, continuing on to Observer before Mission Pilot is not a bad thing, especially if you remain short of the 175 hours PIC needed to begin training as a Mission Pilot. Knowing how to work the CAP radio and DF gear plus the added knowledge and skills of a qualified Observer will help you as a Mission Pilot.

Lastly, I would suggest you use more of a progress based approach rather than try to guess at timeframes. Getting to 175 hours PIC from 80 could take you years if you don't fly much or considerably less than that if you fly a lot. Once you get to that 175 hours and can fly as PIC you can build hours very quickly. It depends on the level of personal initiative you have, your availability and flexibility to fly and take missions. In my case (low availability and low flight time) it took 8 years to get to qualified Mission Pilot. I am sure most people could do better than that :-)

-- John

[ray]

I am interested in a CAP pilot's opinion about the likely progression and timeframe that I would be following to become a CAP pilot.

My principal area of interest is to fly Search and Rescue missions, although I would still be happy to fly as a pilot on other missions.

Simon - I'm a member of the Palo Alto squadron, sorry I didn't get a chance to meet you when you visited.  Two years is probably a reasonable expectation, but Mission Pilot training is very variable depending on how you prioritize it.  If you put a lot of time into and take advantage of all the training opportunities you can easily become a Mission Pilot within one year - but for most people it's an easy thing to keep putting off and it can take a few years to finish.

I also wanted to say that you shouldn't worry too much about your hours or how long it will take to become a Mission Pilot.  Being an Observer is (in my opinion) as rewarding if not more so than being the pilot.  With a well coordinated crew, the observer is handling most of the SAR activities and the pilot is managing the aircraft - you don't at all feel like you're just along for the ride.  I am one of those people that kept putting off finishing my mission pilot certification, but one of the reasons I wasn't in a big rush was because I was having so much fun as an observer.

Feel free to PM or e-mail me (raywoo@gmail.com) if you have any questions.

[Frenchie]

The more time you spend in CAP aircraft in any capacity, the better prepared you're going to be when you become a mission pilot.

You can do the aircraft checkout (form 5) as soon as you've completed level one and GES.  This enables you to fly CAP aircraft on your own dime for proficiency.  The 182 and 206 are going to require a HP endorsement if you don't already have one and a much more extensive checkout than the 172.

I would encourage you to get transport mission pilot when you're eligible, because depending on your squadron, you may be able to fly quite a few transport missions, which will increase your PIC time.

[CadetProgramGuy]

Not having the reg's in front of me, lets not forget about Transport Pilot.

[simon]

Thanks everyone for your input. This was exactly the kind of response for which I was hoping.

The end comments about transport pilot were interesting. I was conscious of the significant minimum hours between transport pilot and mission pilot - effectively about a year of weekly flying. Can anybody tell me about the role of a transport pilot? I was under the impression that it is merely delivering an aircraft from point A to point B so that it can then be used on a mission. Does one then just hang around at the airport until the mission is complete, then ferry it back? (Effectively a 'ferry' pilot). Can you be stuck out at a location for more than a day in this capacity if the plane is required for longer periods? What is the typical role of a transport pilot? It didn't sound particularly interesting but perhaps someone can enlighten me. All these questions I suppose I could ask at the meetings but the forum seems like a good place to gather perspective from different squadrons.

I am all for the alternate roles in the aircraft - Observer, Scanner. In my view, having the pilot experience the other positions in the aircraft can only give them a better understanding of what the others need (Mainly the scanner of course).

And cheers to the Palo Alto and Reid-Hillview squadrons. Now I know I being watched! :-)

Simon

[CadetProgramGuy]

Transport mission pilots do the "grunt" work of the missions.  In the pre-mission set up you can deliver training elt's to airports, deliver crews to meet up with other crews, fly "high-bird".

Thats just a few of the things I can think of for mission work.  Basically here is what you can't do:

Fly Grid Searches, fly Counter Drug.

[SJFedor]

As a TMP, it all depends on what ratings you've got. Since you're obviously a private pilot (not enough hours for commercial) you're pretty limited. You can deliver CAP aircraft, personnel, and property from A to B, fly "high bird" sorties either with an airmobile repeater in the back, or your MO acting as a relay, like someone else said, deliver CAP property (targets, practice beacons) to areas that they'll be set up, etc. What you can't do is fly non-CAP passengers (requires a commercial ticket), transport non CAP property (blood products, etc, also requires a commercial ticket) or fly sorties that would require a mission pilot (ELT searches, grid searches, route searches, etc)

Being a counterdrug transport mission pilot requires you to have a commercial ticket as well.

Learn everything you can. Become a good scanner, then move up and become a very good MO. The best MPs are ones with extensive MO experience, because learning the panels, how to operate the equipment, and everything else can be tough to remember. Doing that on top of operating the aircraft (when you have inexperienced MO trainees, etc) is even tougher, so you should have a very firm handle on what goes on in the right seat. Remember, as an MP, you're also a teacher to any other aircrew member trainees that get into your plane. If they don't know it/can't perform it, it's your responsibility to make sure it gets done.

And if you're really interested, I would highly encourage you to look at NESA's Mission Aircrew School (*shameless plug*). They're not taking any more applications for this year's session right now, but for the 09 class, I would highly recommend it, whether you're able to go as an MP candidate (w/ the 175 PIC) or an MO candidiate. The training and experience is top notch, and you'll leave the school with a thorough understanding of how it all works, and moreso, be prepared to bring that knowledge and experience back to your home wing and empart it on others.

http://ngsar.homestead.com/home.html

Welcome!!

[ray]

The end comments about transport pilot were interesting. I was conscious of the significant minimum hours between transport pilot and mission pilot - effectively about a year of weekly flying. Can anybody tell me about the role of a transport pilot? I was under the impression that it is merely delivering an aircraft from point A to point B so that it can then be used on a mission. Does one then just hang around at the airport until the mission is complete, then ferry it back? (Effectively a 'ferry' pilot). Can you be stuck out at a location for more than a day in this capacity if the plane is required for longer periods? What is the typical role of a transport pilot? It didn't sound particularly interesting but perhaps someone can enlighten me. All these questions I suppose I could ask at the meetings but the forum seems like a good place to gather perspective from different squadrons.

Being a TMP isn't really an end unto itself, but it's something that can allow you to get some funded flying and occasionally some interesting missions come up for TMPs.  The most common TMP flights I've seen has been flying to and from search bases.  This would either be just switching seats with the SAR Mission Pilot for the transport portion of the flight, or you may be flying someplace to meet up with the rest of your crew.  Either way, you won't be just delivering a plane and then just sitting around doing nothing.

In the year between when I became a TMP and when I finally got around to finishing my SAR MP, I was actually able to get a fair number of hours as a TMP (around 15).  Among these was a dog transport mission to pick up and deliver a search dog and handler to look for a missing child.  As Steven mentioned, as a private pilot you won't be reimbursed for this kind of mission - but they can still be very rewarding to fly.

- Ray

[Frenchie]

The biggest reason why you would want to get TMP is it's extremely easy to get as the requirements are little more than a bit of paperwork over and above the form 5.

Just having TMP makes you eligible to receive 1 hour of paid proficiency flying if you attend PCT.  You can use that 1 hour to get your form 5, which means your subsequent form 5 rides are free.

[RiverAux]

Being a counterdrug transport mission pilot requires you to have a commercial ticket as well.

Where is that at?

[bosshawk]

River Aux is correct to ask that question.  I am the CDO for CAWG and know of no such requirement.  Perhaps it is true in Tennessee.

[Frenchie]

River Aux is correct to ask that question.  I am the CDO for CAWG and know of no such requirement.  Perhaps it is true in Tennessee.

It's true everywhere as that's what the national reg says.  I'm not sure why, but my guess is it has something to do with the CAP waiver from the FAA for compensated flights.

Edit:

CAP REGULATION 60-6

3-2. Flight Crew Qualifications.

...

a. Pilot-In-Command (PIC).

...

3) Counterdrug Transportation Missions. Counterdrug transportation missions require an FAA Commercial
Pilot Certificate with a current instrument rating and at least a current Second-Class Medical.

[RiverAux]

Please provide the citation 

[SarDragon]

He just did.

Also, from 3.3.k.7) Every transportation flight carrying non-CAP passengers must be piloted by an FAA-certified Commercial Pilot rating with an Instrument rating and at least a second-class medical certificate.

[RiverAux]

Those requirements are specifically for missions where transportation of non-CAP members is envisioned (i.e., Counterdrug Transportation Missions).

However, there are some CD missions that are essentially high-bird missions in which case regular CAP transport pilots can fly them just as they could fly a plane transportation sortie related to a CD mission. 

Incidentally SARDragon, the citation wasn't in his post at the time I asked for it.  He added it later.

[flynd94]

Simon,

I will vouch for both Palo Alto and Reid-Hillview.  I am a little partial to PAO.  I was a member of CA214 for the last 5 years.  They are an extremely busy ES squadron.  We had the best trained pilots and ground folks (I know, I was the ES officer/mentor pilot/Check Pilot).

My advice is keep an open mind, take your time and, ignore the BS.  Remember, that the action is at the squadron level.  You have to develop a filter for what CAP/HQ/wing HQ sends down the pipe.  You won't go wrong at either squadron (these are the only 2 I would recommend in the group).

Try to get your training locally, its much better than what you can get at NESA.  Now, Steven don't get too upset.  I am a NESA grad (03' GSAR/AGSAR and a Distinguished Grad) but, unfortunately I haven't had success dealing with folks who go to the 7 day wonder course.  JMHO.