PAWG shuts down

[CAPSGT]

I posted the wing commander's letter to the members.  They expect to be back on station in a week or two. 

My concern with a week or two is that changing a culture takes much more time than a week or two to change.  My unit actually recently had a class on safety cultures using the Challenger explosion as the case study.  While it's certainly not quite comparing apples to apples, after an incident like that, NASA certainly doesn't just ground the fleet for a week or two.

Having worked with PAWG and PAWG members in the past, I think this will take much more than just aknowledging an e-mail and inspecting some equipment to truly correct.  Entire standard operating procedures need to be reviewed and changed.  I saw the SOP of a PAWG GT cause the team to get unecessarily separated on an actual search mission.  I was also scolded by a more junior GTL from PA for myself and my team not moving and driving fast enough (I was going the speed limit on winding mountain roads) on a search for a missing A/C.  Mind you, I had more incentive than most to move fast on that mission, as I personally knew the pilot and had flown in the A/C we were looking for.  These examples are just 2 indicators that it was only a matter of time before this culture rose to this level.

It's certainly a shame to see any wing get grounded, but while they are, PAWG should to take this time to seriously examine their practices and ingrain new practices to ensure they don't have to face this issue again.  I was a little discouraged by the letter from Col Lee asking for responses by the 4th day after being grounded.  To me that shows more of a concern for checking the boxes and less concern for truly trying to change a culture.

YMMV

[FW]

^All good points.  Changing a culture takes months.  But, the wing needs to meet certain specific goals before getting permission to return to mission readiness.  Once these immediate goals are met, culture change will continue with specific long term goals which, I understand, will be identified and achieved.  Continued oversight by command at all levels must be SOP.  Members must continue to recognise their responsibilities and perform to acceptable levels.  I'm sure this can and will be done. 
I have no doubt that the members will rise to the occasion and be successful.

[RiverAux]

Any Wing that goes into a compliance inspection without making 100% sure that all the safety stuff is documented correctly is incredibly stupid and probably deserves to be shut down.  In my opinion, the Chief of Staff should personally look over all that paperwork several months out to ensure it is right and if I was Wing Commander, I'd look at it too.

Not that I think most of this safety paperwork is worth much, just that I have enough common sense to know that if it is wrong, there are going to be some repurcussions that I won't like. 

Dumb, dumb, dumb

[Gunner C]

I've been in a wing that was shut down for being stupid with logistics but later had three (count'em) three accidents in one year - nearly within six months.  One crash was a pilot/CFI check ride.  The CFI scared me a couple of times when I was his observer (I curtailed the mission and we went home - nothing happened).  The second was a (later discovered to be) unauthorized CD mission with two pilots and a sheriff's deputy in the back - too low, too slow, both pilots trying to be observers and no one flying the aircraft.  It ended up in a field with all three dead.  The third was an ELT mission with an instructor observer in the back seat, trainee observer in the front right, and a PIC who wouldn't let anyone call out the checklist.  He forgot to put the gear down (didn't read his own checklist) and had to apply full power to taxi.

The entire wing ignored everything in writing.  It was a flying club.  Outside of the cadet program there were hardly any uniforms.  Those who did wear them usually looked like crap.  Logistics, operational procedures, uniforms, military courtesies, you name it, it was all screwed up.  After the wing king, who had gotten them out of the log hole, got the ax, everything started to turn around, albeit slowly.  It just wasn't safety, it was professionalism.

Everything we do in the air involves risk.  Things like ORM attempt to attenuate the risk.  Lowering the risk is everyone's job.  What gets people killed is moving from risk to the gamble.  With a gamble, you are literally running against the averages - if you gamble long enough, you WILL lose.  Period.  It's only a matter of time.  With properly managed risk, you can count on an accident free career.

Professionalism = Managing Risk
Lack of professionalism = Gambling that will ultimately lead to bent aircraft, vehicles, and members.

PAWG was being unprofessional and gambling with their personnel.

GC

[davidsinn]

I was halfway expecting this. For a wing that can't even get a little thing like the proper color of tshirt under their BDU's right it tends to make one wonder what else they do wrong.

[RH_DelVal_NJ]

well at least us out in NJ get some extra missions   .

[CAPSGT]

Yeah, I saw NJ is the first wing to have pulled any extra missions from this.  I'm wondering when I'm going to get a text message telling me to call AFRCC for something in PA myself.

[mikeylikey]

I was halfway expecting this. For a wing that can't even get a little thing like the proper color of tshirt under their BDU's right it tends to make one wonder what else they do wrong.

The Wing King just put out an email this past weekend explaining that the PAWG orange hats are to be "ranger rolled" or crushed, depending on the unit commander, and cites that since 39-1 does not say anything about crushing or rolling baseball hats, that its legal.  This was put out the same weekend that the Wing gets shut down.  So you can see where his priorities are. 

So, ya....we went from an almost OK Commander, to one that did not even email the membership once in almost 6 months after taking command.  As far as everyone saying he "inherited the problems of the wing", I call BS.  He was the Vice Commander, which means he well knew what the situation was before taking command.  HE may actually be the perpetrator behind the reasons the Wing got cited.   

[SDF_Specialist]

Well Ohio was just put on standby to cover Western PA. We got your backs guys (and gals)!

[sarmed1]

He was the Vice Commander, which means he well knew what the situation was before taking command.  HE may actually be the perpetrator behind the reasons the Wing got cited.

from people I talked to when I moved back up here, no one was excited to hear he was the next in line....but it wasnt like a 180...pretty much just the frying pan into the fire....

despite my obvious stake in the Ranger Program, nothing else excited me about returning to PA wing...after 10 years away and seeing how other wings run thier show, PA as a whole I have found to be behind the 8 ball....

mk

[FW]

^ I've observed the workings of quite a few wings over the last few years and, I've not really found that much real difference from wing to wing.  PAWG operates as well as many if not most.

Ranger hats aside, PAWG's problem, IMHO, is a casual attitude on documentation.  And, a selective "laziness" when it comes to some safety items which could have become dangerous.  However, it seems many wings have the same attitude and may end up in Pa's predicament if not corrected in time.  

Yes, the wing/cc is responsible for the wing and its operation.  However, it takes the entire membership to screw the light bulb into the tail light of a van or to charge or replace an empty fire extinguisher(sic).  We're all in this together and we all need to reevaluate our day to day practices and improve in all we do.  This is not PAWG's problem it is all our problem.

Some interesting safety notes on PAWG:
The wing has not had a mission related fatality or serious injury in over 30 years.
No wing wide aircraft or vehicle maint. issues; ever.
Four Turner Awards in the last 11 years.

[flyerthom]

Slightly off topic...safety is job 1.

We have a fire department in my area where their safety officer responds reds lights and sirens to every call they are dispacted on (and its not a very safe vehicle operation the times I have seen him) under the theory that HE needs to be there to monitor safety.  Where this is an important job, me thinks not so important that I imagine he needs to risk his life and the publics by running code to every call just to monitor safety.  Somewhere I think this task should have failed an ORM assessment.

mk

Remember how I used to rant about those guys with blue lights and red lights. The key points in any safety program:

1) You are responsible for your own safety.
2) You are responsible to help your co workers safety.
3) Safety isn't job one it's job all i.e it's a function of all activities to reduce risk.
4) Risk can not be 100 % eliminated but it can be significantly reduced. This fact is supported by the concept of Paper cuts.

[SJFedor]

I noticed that when I was visiting up there, all the aircraft were placarded as grounded. Now I know why....

[SAR-EMT1]

Anyone done a mission in PA yet?

[ZigZag911]

Why not do a swap - give PAWG to MER or GLR, and give MD and DE to NER?

Because NJ & NY Wings are needed to cover big portions of the PA mission coverage area....Nj has already done a couple of ELT missions.

[tjaxe]

Does anyone know how things are progressing in this matter? 

[Pylon]

Does anyone know how things are progressing in this matter? 

Don't know, except that at a special meeting at Group HQ yesterday, we found out that NYWG is covering large portions of northern PAWG.   Guess we'll find out if we get any calls from AFRCC.

[JC004]

Don't know, except that at a special meeting at Group HQ yesterday, we found out that NYWG is covering large portions of northern PAWG.   Guess we'll find out if we get any calls from AFRCC.

luckily, there is nothing in northern pennsylvania   

[flyerthom]

uckily, there is nothing in northern pennsylvania   Evil

It's 'cause I left. 

I wouldn't say nothing, Lake Wallenpaupack and snow are there. Remember the four seasons along I 80: almost winter, winter, just past winter, construction!

[Tubacap]

I TAKE OFFENSE!  I am in Northen Pennsylvania, almost New York, but definitely still under the Orange Hat!