Anyone ever suggest something other than shirt epaulet insignia for jackets?

[N6RVT]

Especially shirt epaulets worn on a RAINCOAT.  Not only does it make the wearer look like a moron who has no clue how a uniform goes together, but that slide on insignia was never meant to be exposed to the weather like that. 

Also consider the lightweight jacket, where the top of the epaulet does not even detach, and we have to have some bizarre Velcro wrap around insignia made just for it

The grey slides on a shirt look just fine.  But they are very obviously intended for wearing on a shirt.

I'm not even going to suggest what should replace it, I am sure there are a dozen good ideas out there.

[TheSkyHornet]

The fact that we don't use pin-on insignia bewilders me.

[PHall]

The fact that we don't use pin-on insignia bewilders me.

We used to wear pin on insignia before the maroon at first and later grey epaulets were forced on us because of some member's misbehavior.

[Shuman 14]

So do like CAP did in the early days, change the color of the epaulet itself on the Service Coat and use pin-on rank. Make it grey or make it maroon like on the USAAF style uniform.

As to outerwear, pin-on rank with a CAP cutout worn centered between the rank insignia and the epaulet button.

Grey slides on blue or white shirts and sweaters only.

[Eclipse]

The fact that we don't use pin-on insignia bewilders me.

Even more odd is that metal grade is still worn on the blue field caps.

Don't understand how this is still a thing, let alone ever was.

[N6RVT]

So do like CAP did in the early days, change the color of the epaulet itself on the Service Coat and use pin-on rank. Make it grey or make it maroon like on the USAAF style uniform. As to outerwear, pin-on rank with a CAP cutout worn centered between the rank insignia and the epaulet button. Grey slides on blue or white shirts and sweaters only.

Changing the epaulet itself would be the best choice heritage wise but would also be prohibitively expensive.   

Wearing a CAP Cutout on the epaulet along with rank was tried, but the USAF did not like it.

To anyone with actual military time, the slide on shirt rank worn on a jacket or coat makes you look like a moron.

However, doing research into this I find we have been wearing shirt rank on the coats for 30 years.  I now have zero hope in this ever changing.

[NovemberWhiskey]

So if you're wearing the raincoat over Class A uniform as a senior, you're wearing ... three stacks of grade slides on top of each other?

[TheSkyHornet]

The fact that we don't use pin-on insignia bewilders me.

Even more odd is that metal grade is still worn on the blue field caps.

Don't understand how this is still a thing, let alone ever was.

Which is my "The insignia already exists. Let's apply it elsewhere" M.O.

[Shuman 14]

Changing the epaulet itself would be the best choice heritage wise but would also be prohibitively expensive.   

How so? I could have sworn I saw a conversion kit for an enlisted coat to officer coat that offered two epaulets, two buttons and the thread needed to sew them in place for less than twenty bucks at the Exchange.

This one even throws in the cuff piping for under thirty.
http://www.uniforms-4u.com/p-usaf-officer-jacket-conversion-kit-18231.aspx

Of course Vanguard has one too, at a higher price.
https://www.vanguardmil.com/products/civil-air-patrol-air-force-shoulder-loop-conversion-kit-officer

 A grey or maroon epaulet would be an easy do. It also has no effect on cadets, they could wear any color and not every senior has a Service coat. Technically a short sleeve shirt and trousers in light blue/blue or white/grey is all that is required.

Changing out or adding epaulets to Service coat would run about another twenty bucks at most tailors so say less than fifty bucks total for parts and labor.

That's not prohibitive.

[NIN]

Also consider the lightweight jacket, where the top of the epaulet does not even detach, and we have to have some bizarre Velcro wrap around insignia made just for it

Five minute fix: Unstitch the top of the epaulet, sew on some velcro. No need for those awful-looking shoulder marks with the velcro there.

The grey slides on a shirt look just fine.  But they are very obviously intended for wearing on a shirt.

Over the years, the bottom of the shoulder marks has "opened up" a little to accommodate the service coat epaulet width.

When I get a set of shoulder marks intended solely for my shirts, I flip them inside out and add an extra  stitch along the seam to tighten them up by about a quarter of an inch.  Flip them right side out and give them a nice press between two clean pressing cloths. They look a whole lot more like many of the "new old stock" shoulder marks I have from the "before times" after that.

[NIN]

So if you're wearing the raincoat over Class A uniform as a senior, you're wearing ... three stacks of grade slides on top of each other?

Hmm. Yeah. Which is why if I'm wearing my service coat, I'm often not wearing shoulder marks on my shirt.

[Eclipse]

Flip them right side out and give them a nice press between two clean pressing cloths.

Careful on the heat, or avoid the insignia itself altogether, too much
heat will take the metallic sparkle right off of them.

[NIN]

Careful on the heat, or avoid the insignia itself altogether, too much
heat will take the metallic sparkle right off of them.

Spoken like a man with experience.

Same experience I have.

I once received a set of aircrew wings for one of my officer's uniforms. They were pre-sewn, and badly at that. I unstitched and went to "press out the creases" so they could be correctly folded.  Well, one (badly) scorched set of aircrew wings later, I'm on Vanguard's site to buy another set for her.

And this was the "White on dark blue" days for the BBDU.



I was tres unhappy with myself. Rookie move.

[Eclipse]

Spoken like a man with experience.

Sadly yes, with an epaulet sleeve.

[N6RVT]

Changing out or adding epaulets to Service coat would run about another twenty bucks at most tailors so say less than fifty bucks total for parts and labor.

That's not prohibitive.

Conceivably this would actually make things cheaper, as we could all use enlisted service coats which can be had SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper than the officer ones.  This is basically an enlisted coat conversion kit, just with different color epaulettes.  But also requires access to a tailor to get it done.

[Jester]

Makes it easier to get a service coat too, since now you can either swap out epaulets on an officer coat or add them to the cheaper and more available enlisted service coat.

[Shuman 14]

But also requires access to a tailor to get it done.

Doesn't need to be a military tailor, most police uniform stores and civilian dry cleaners have a tailor on staff that can complete the work.

Most towns in America have drycleaner/tailor shop/uniform store within commutable distance.

[biomed441]

Lots of ways to skin this cat.  Lots of ideas I've seen through the years. Go back to the pin on rank and CAP cutouts, epaulet color modification, shoulder boards... even seen something like the US army leadership epualet loops but placed under the grade insignia.  I like all of these options (except the shoulder boards) better than grey slides on the coat. 

... side note wouldn't mind if we did something about our shoulder boards too.  The blue on blue gets lost and just looks boring to me. If you're gonna spend 40+ on shoulder boards at least make the braid a contrasting color... my 2 cents. Pardon the minor derailment there. 

[Capt Thompson]

I wouldn't mind the 80's maroon slides on the shirt, with maroon epaulets and pin on rank for the coat, I think that would look sharp, and the red is a throwback to our early days. There would be absolutely no mistaking a CAP member for actual Air Force.

While we're on the subject, the Cadet Officer shoulder boards are hideous and always have been. The only issue there is a lot of Cadets have the NCO service coats, which the shoulder boards are compatible with, but for what they cost you could easily convert to epaulets and do pin on rank for them as well.

[TheSkyHornet]

I wouldn't mind the 80's maroon slides on the shirt, with maroon epaulets and pin on rank for the coat, I think that would look sharp, and the red is a throwback to our early days. There would be absolutely no mistaking a CAP member for actual Air Force.

While we're on the subject, the Cadet Officer shoulder boards are hideous and always have been. The only issue there is a lot of Cadets have the NCO service coats, which the shoulder boards are compatible with, but for what they cost you could easily convert to epaulets and do pin on rank for them as well.

I'm on the opposite side. I think the maroon is hideous. The cadet shoulder boards on the service coat are visually a nice touch. I like the blue/black combo.

I still fully endorse pin-on insignia across the board, though. That is, unless a miracle occurred and we finally got OCPs and Velcro'd our way into the future...