March 07 National Board Meeting Live Web Stream

[A.Member]

Okay, after the guy from Ghana finished talking, he gave MG Pineda a traditional warriors outfit which he put on over his TPU.  Everyone laughed a bit and he said,
"You laugh...another uniform change coming later".

Also heard him joking earlier about Vanguard being in the lobby with "fashion by Tony" to sell.

So, he has got a sense of humor about the TPU issue.

Actually, I don't find this funny.  I wish I would've seen it first hand so I could judge for myself.  However, assuming this happened as described, I find it very disturbing that a "leader" apparently recognizes that there are concerns about the number of uniform changes, yet, continues to move forward full steam ahead without addressing any of those concerns.  That represents inept leadership at even the most basic level.

The question now is, how do we get a bunch of sheep come up with a two-thirds vote.   

[DNall]

By "our" do you mean CAP, membership, or leadership... cause I know how they feel about some of the people & things that have been happening. It doesn't matter though, if Congress orders AF to take charge of CAP & fix it in a 3-5 year period, then they'll do it. They've been fighting for increased control forever, that's what the 2000 changes were about was their attempt to grab more control & Congress going another way.

[A.Member]

By "our" do you mean CAP, membership, or leadership... 

The impression I get is that our leadership has CAP-USAF's support.

[SAR-EMT1]

I merely wish to say that I support our being back as the USAF-Aux
FULL TIME and if we as an organization need to be given to USAF total control for a time so that to happen; so be it.

I do not intend for that statment to be an attack on anyone, however I do not support our corporate identity at all, nor anything to do with it, or anything suggesting a move away from the Air Force.

[DNall]

I think the great overwhelming majority of members would agree with that statement. It's a little harder to stick to your principles when you're a corporate officer voting to reliquish power over your own area of influence to a higher command that will have the national interests always ahead of your organization's. That's why I say it should be temporary for reorg purposes & then handed back to CAP with a new governance structure that can still stand up for the long-term when the AF wants to cut us in half to pay for a new missile fin or something.

[LtCol White]

ABU (per CAP/USAF CC)- Not yet decided by USAF if CAP will wear them or not.  Transition will be over next few years, with first priorities to overseas USAF personnel.  It won't be a practical question for us for a while.

My prediction is CAP won't see them for at least 5 years, if ever. I'd be less surprised to see us go to an all-Blue BDU organization.

Though it has not & will not soon be formally stated, it is an absolute certainty that CAP will where the same uniforms as the AF, strictly because surplus availability keeps costs down & making CAP accessible to people of all backgrounds is a major priority. The date on the other hand is very much up in the air. When the AF is fully transitioned including the guard & reserve, and when enough surplus has built up, then CAP will get an initial wear date.

I would predict though that when we move to that uniform the tapes will change. Personally I think white on OD tapes would look the most professional (ABU tapes are tigerstripe), but dark blue is an option as well, either way I think we'll move to ditch the glow in the dark girl scoutness we've made BDUs into. Just guessing though, it may actually be the same as moving from ODs to BDUS, in which we had to beg so hard to get teh uniform we didn't want to press our luck with the tapes.

Perhaps when the time comes to have this discussion seriously with USAF, the leadership will be different and approach it in a manner more amenable to USAF.

I'm starting to think again that Congress should step in to put CAP into reorganization recievership under AF for a period of 3-5 years & let a decent organization come out the back side of that, rather than continuing to witness behavior that came out the backside of something else.

I agree strongly

[ZigZag911]

It seems to me that the main topics pursued at the winter board meeting were:

1) changing the terms for national, region and wing commanders
2) a whole bunch more minuscule uniform matters

As for the second, I have to agree with whoever (I think it was the 2000 GAO study) said that a board of directors of a national organizationought not be getting mired in such trivia....they should set policy and assign others to put it into effect.

As for the first one -- when the amendment to the US Constitution was passed in the late 40s limiting Presidents to two terms, (following FDR's election to four terms, although he barely began the last one when he died), the language of the amendment specifically EXCLUDED the incumbent of the day, Harry S Truman (who could have run for  and served as many terms as he could get elected!).

In that same spirit, perhaps this change in term limits ought to EXCLUDE current office holders...their terms would end as normal. The change would apply, let's say, to those entering CAP office on or after 1 January 2008.

[lordmonar]

I agree that uniform issues should not be decided by the NB.....as they should not decide any regulation issue.  NHQ "airstaff" should write the regulations and the National Commander signs them and puts them into effect.  One of the problems with CAP is that it is too democratic.  Sure they should get input from the field on how to do buisness.  But basically the guys at the top should give us our marching orders and we should salute and move on.

[ZigZag911]

I agree that uniform issues should not be decided by the NB.....as they should not decide any regulation issue.  NHQ "airstaff" should write the regulations and the National Commander signs them and puts them into effect.  One of the problems with CAP is that it is too democratic.  Sure they should get input from the field on how to do buisness.  But basically the guys at the top should give us our marching orders and we should salute and move on.

We ought to take a page from the armed forces (most recently, I believe, the Navy).

When they want to make sweeping uniform changes, they have a process:

1) survey the troops, get some input
2) field test options to see if they work
3) get recommendations to the brass, who DECIDE!

[DNall]

I agree that uniform issues should not be decided by the NB.....as they should not decide any regulation issue.  NHQ "airstaff" should write the regulations and the National Commander signs them and puts them into effect.  One of the problems with CAP is that it is too democratic.  Sure they should get input from the field on how to do buisness.  But basically the guys at the top should give us our marching orders and we should salute and move on.

I got no problem with that if you make the Nat/CC fully accountable up the chain for his actions, and put the selection authority the BoG (confirmed by AF).

[lordmonar]

I agree that uniform issues should not be decided by the NB.....as they should not decide any regulation issue.  NHQ "airstaff" should write the regulations and the National Commander signs them and puts them into effect.  One of the problems with CAP is that it is too democratic.  Sure they should get input from the field on how to do buisness.  But basically the guys at the top should give us our marching orders and we should salute and move on.

I got no problem with that if you make the Nat/CC fully accountable up the chain for his actions, and put the selection authority the BoG (confirmed by AF).

Concure.

P.S.

Hell just called...the cows are coming home and some flying pigs are looking at the heating system at this time. 

[DNall]

Hell just called...the cows are coming home and some flying pigs are looking at the heating system at this time. 

You mean cause we agreed on something? I think you'd be suprised. We talk a lot about a few fundamental differences, but beyond that I'm sure we have more in common than not.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Someone please bring back the "1505" uniform with "C-A-P" cutouts, black nameplate and "hershey bar!"

Those were the days!

That was the best uniform EVER!

Even better once we went to the Hershey bar and got rid of the Pepsi-Cola patch.

[Psicorp]

So to summerize (while we await, and wait, and wait for the actual memos):

New rules issued for Testing Officers

A School enrichment program approved

DDR Track and DDR specialty badge approved

Orange triangles eliminated

Civil Air Patrol changed to U.S. Civil Air Patrol

CAC ribbons can be worn by SM Officers who earned them as cadets, not authorized for advisors.

Cadet NCOs will wear grade insignia on both sides of service coat, mandatory wear date of March 2008

HLS ribbon approved

IC badge approved, worn forever once earned

New MAJCOM patch for AF uniforms, Corporate MAJCOM plus little U.S. letters.


Did I miss anything?

 

[Pylon]

So to summerize (while we await, and wait, and wait for the actual memos):

New rules issued for Testing Officers

A School enrichment program approved

DDR Track and DDR specialty badge approved

Orange triangles eliminated

Civil Air Patrol changed to U.S. Civil Air Patrol

CAC ribbons can be worn by SM Officers who earned them as cadets, not authorized for advisors.

Cadet NCOs will wear grade insignia on both sides of service coat, mandatory wear date of March 2008

HLS ribbon approved

IC badge approved, worn forever once earned

New MAJCOM patch for AF uniforms, Corporate MAJCOM plus little U.S. letters.

Did I miss anything?

Looks fairly good, except the first item -- my understanding was the proposed rules for TCOs and testing were shot down like a rookie MiG.

And Civil Air Patrol changed to U.S. Civil Air Patrol only insofar as our BDU nametapes and press releases.  Not as the organizations actual name, as far as I can tell.

Mandatory wear dates set for new MAJCOM patch and the CAP tapes.

[Hammer]

Cadet NCOs will wear grade insignia on both sides of service coat, mandatory wear date of March 2008

Just on the Service Dress jacket or all blues?

[PhoenixRisen]

Cadet NCOs will wear grade insignia on both sides of service coat, mandatory wear date of March 2008

Just on the Service Dress jacket or all blues?

I'm assuming they were referring to all forms of the blues.  (That makes sense to me, anyways, as it wouldn't just to change it on the Svs. Dress, BDU's, and not the blue service uniform.)

[DNall]

What's the offical name for blues? Yeah it's all versions of blues. Cutouts only for basics & C/officer service coats, and of course the new corporate alternative service coat.

[MIKE]

What's the offical name for blues?

Service Uniform

[Pylon]

Cadet NCOs will wear grade insignia on both sides of service coat, mandatory wear date of March 2008

Just on the Service Dress jacket or all blues?

I'm assuming they were referring to all forms of the blues.  (That makes sense to me, anyways, as it wouldn't just to change it on the Svs. Dress, BDU's, and not the blue service uniform.)

I just started phasing out the CAP cutouts with my own troops.  Had a handful of cadet promotions last night -- just removed their CAP cutout and replaced with appropriate grade insignia.  Hope to have everyone phased in within six months this way.

The good news is the squadron is going to get a nice supply of cutouts for incoming recruits!