Hypothetical Situation

[Devil Doc]

I am very Active spotting  and uncovering Phony Veterans, nothing despises me more than stolen Valor. The other thing I have noticed if a veteran did serve, he always tries to ellaborate on his service, when there service alone is pretty impressive.

[wuzafuzz]

Even if the guy "lost" his DD214, or it was lost in a house fire, flood, or alien attack, there are ways to get copies.  I had to do that when my Dad passed away, in order to get the honor guard for his funeral services.  It wasnt free, but it can be done.  (I found an original copy later.)  Go ahead and demand that fellow show the DD214 to wear the claimed military decorations on a CAP uniform, and to justify any CAP "benefits" derived from said service.

If he is PROVEN a liar, then scorch the earth he is standing on (figuratively speaking of course).  CAP doesn't need people like that.  Permitting posers in our midst makes all of us look bad.

[Critical AOA]

Reiterating what some others have contributed and adding a bit of my own thoughts.

I was only in the Army for three years, 1982 – 1985, but I still have my original DD-214.  Someone with such a long & stellar record would most certainly still have it.

Asking specific questions such as what aircraft did you fly, when and where, etc. are real easy questions to ask and are usually asked in normal causal conversation by others and even more so when someone smells a rat.  I am really surprised this has not happened.

NPRC has a lot of information that is for the public eyes through FOIA requests.  The information available does include: name, branch of service, dates of service, final rank and awards & decorations among other information.   Should be fairly easy to verify.

If military decorations were not allowed on the CAP uniform in the first place wearing unauthorized ones would not even be an issue.

This would seem like an easy enough situation to deal with in a polite and professional manner without being overly confrontational.  However, if it does take a bit of confrontation to get him to put up or shut up then it must be done. Integrity must be maintained.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

If he's a fake, don't let him get away with this. I would hate to find someone faking service, it's just not right.

[Eclipse]

If military decorations were not allowed on the CAP uniform in the first place wearing unauthorized ones would not even be an issue.

From military decs and badges, yes, but we have plenty of fakers on the CAP side as well.

There should be no issue with a member substantiating what they are wearing, and everyone should be able to from a personal perspective.

[ColonelJack]

I was only in the Army for three years, 1982 – 1985, but I still have my original DD-214.  Someone with such a long & stellar record would most certainly still have it.

I was on active duty in the AF for seven weeks in 1975 and I have my original DD-214.  If they don't have theirs, I'd be willing to bet they never had one at all.

Jack

[MSG Mac]

Many times the military service sends a copy of the DD214 to the State Veterans Affairs office. Try going to the state he used as a Home of Record to look him up.

[MSgt Van]

I'd love meet him. It would be a hoot.

[sarmed1]

...I lost my original DD214 from initial entry and AIT as an Army reservist, I was a dumb 19yo and had no idea what it was or why it would be important to keep around; besides thats what I had a 201 file for.  Now I wish I had it because it is a pain in the rear to get one....but I can still get one. (luckily there  are only like 2 medals on there thats it, and the info is verifiable with other documentation)

Now the current dude if he really is a BTDT he might be mildly put off if you ask for one, but would understand why you need it and likley produce it at some point in the near future.  If he's exceissively pissed about it or gives the whole "classified" discussion id say very likely a poser.

mk

[Garibaldi]

...I lost my original DD214 from initial entry and AIT as an Army reservist, I was a dumb 19yo and had no idea what it was or why it would be important to keep around; besides thats what I had a 201 file for.  Now I wish I had it because it is a pain in the rear to get one....but I can still get one. (luckily there  are only like 2 medals on there thats it, and the info is verifiable with other documentation)

Now the current dude if he really is a BTDT he might be mildly put off if you ask for one, but would understand why you need it and likley produce it at some point in the near future.  If he's exceissively pissed about it or gives the whole "classified" discussion id say very likely a poser.

mk

Just like to know exactly what would be classified on a DD-214. I don't see any area on mine at all except for maybe remarks where there'd be a potential for classified information. I'm just saying, that if he took that route, he obviously has never seen a 214. Also, mine has a checkmark beside "member requests copy be sent to ____ director of veteran's affairs" so if someone was REALLY interested, they could petition the VA in his home state on the form to see what exactly his service entailed.

Man...that was a long time ago. My signature has even changed drastically since 1986.

[RogueLeader]

...I lost my original DD214 from initial entry and AIT as an Army reservist, I was a dumb 19yo and had no idea what it was or why it would be important to keep around; besides thats what I had a 201 file for.  Now I wish I had it because it is a pain in the rear to get one....but I can still get one. (luckily there  are only like 2 medals on there thats it, and the info is verifiable with other documentation)

Now the current dude if he really is a BTDT he might be mildly put off if you ask for one, but would understand why you need it and likley produce it at some point in the near future.  If he's exceissively pissed about it or gives the whole "classified" discussion id say very likely a poser.

mk

Just like to know exactly what would be classified on a DD-214. I don't see any area on mine at all except for maybe remarks where there'd be a potential for classified information. I'm just saying, that if he took that route, he obviously has never seen a 214. Also, mine has a checkmark beside "member requests copy be sent to ____ director of veteran's affairs" so if someone was REALLY interested, they could petition the VA in his home state on the form to see what exactly his service entailed.

Man...that was a long time ago. My signature has even changed drastically since 1986.

Nothing is classified on a 214.  Posers will usually say that their 214 is classified for reasons such as Spec ops, all sorts of secret squirrel bravo sierra. About the only sensitive info is social security number, and MAYBE unit left (I highly doubt.)

[NIN]

I filed an SF180 and got my DD-214 & NGB Form 22.  And then filed a record correction with DA to get the Korean Defense Service Medal added, and got a pretty sweet DD-215 for my troubles. That took like 3 stamps and about 20 minutes of paperwork.

If you can't get your DD-214/215 or NGB Form 22 (supposing you have/should have one post-ETS) in about 3 weeks, you're not tryin' hard enough.

[Private Investigator]

I was wondering is this an older gentleman in his 80s WWII generation or in his 60s from the Viet Nam era.

I have known WWII Veterans who added ribbons they think they deserve because the Army Service Ribbon, NCO Prof Dev Ribbon and Overseas Ribbon was not created until the early 80s.

I think the crazyest story I ever heard was a Squadron that gave a guy Lt Col and no one in the chain of command ever saw a DD-214.   

[Eclipse]

I think the crazyest story I ever heard was a Squadron that gave a guy Lt Col and no one in the chain of command ever saw a DD-214.   

How do you "give" someone Lt Col - that has to be approved by Region.

[Private Investigator]

I think the crazyest story I ever heard was a Squadron that gave a guy Lt Col and no one in the chain of command ever saw a DD-214.   

How do you "give" someone Lt Col - that has to be approved by Region.

By passing on bogus paperwork and saying, he is a credit to his unit! 

Group, Wing and Region all fooled = EPIC FAIL

[sarmed1]

There is one floating around out there that I have seen that claims GO rank (MG actually last I saw when he was in AF uniform)  but cant seem to find him listed on the USAF list of appointed or retired GO.  He for sure used his rank to get a CAP appt as a Lt Col.  A few years back could have sworn he was either recently retired or IRR caliminmg one star, saw him a few months back with 2 stars....someone else commented and he said he got called back for an assignment and promoted to the second star.....but now is officially retired.... that kicked the BS meter into the red zone....just havent had the time to do anything more than a causal internet search.

mk

[NIN]

I was wondering is this an older gentleman in his 80s WWII generation or in his 60s from the Viet Nam era.

Young guy. Well, younger than me.

[Eclipse]

I think the crazyest story I ever heard was a Squadron that gave a guy Lt Col and no one in the chain of command ever saw a DD-214.   

How do you "give" someone Lt Col - that has to be approved by Region.

By passing on bogus paperwork and saying, he is a credit to his unit! 

Group, Wing and Region all fooled = EPIC FAIL

Nothing says they can't ask now...

[bosshawk]

Just to throw a monkey wrench into this discussion, here is my story.

When I joined CAP in 1993, I couldn't find my 214(it was safely hidden in a safety deposit box), but I had copies of my retirement orders.  Orders said that I retired as an O-6.  Since my 214 was issued when I transferred to the Reserves as a Major, it would have been a non-starter.  CAP accepted my retirement orders and I was "awarded" the rank of LtCol after I had served six months.

The 214 is not necessarily the best place to go to determine highest rank held.

[NIN]

Just to throw a monkey wrench into this discussion, here is my story.

When I joined CAP in 1993, I couldn't find my 214(it was safely hidden in a safety deposit box), but I had copies of my retirement orders.  Orders said that I retired as an O-6.  Since my 214 was issued when I transferred to the Reserves as a Major, it would have been a non-starter.  CAP accepted my retirement orders and I was "awarded" the rank of LtCol after I had served six months.

The 214 is not necessarily the best place to go to determine highest rank held.

This isn't about military rank, though, Paul, even though I do take your meaning.

This is about guy claiming:

* Service (thus far unable to confirm)
* Decorations (fairly high-level decs, and ones that require certain kinds of action to achieve)
* Badges (we're talking aviation badges here, like "Completed UPT" stuff)

Also, the narrative is off. 
* The timing doesn't work. College completion and claimed service aren't quite matching up.   You should be a college graduate to be an officer, yet we appear to have a disparity as to when these things occurred.   Then there is "how it occurred."  ROTC is out, so that leaves OTS.
* UPT and advanced aircraft training take time.  Time that doesn't fit into the timeline.   There is no good gap for "I finished college in May, completed OTS in September, started UPT in November, moved to advanced training the following October , then was deployed with my first unit six months later, and did all this neato stuff" fits into a whole 'nuther series of datapoints that this person has supplied to other people, or CAP training events that this person was at as confirmed by people in the old wing.
* There are some claims to participation in well-known or well-documented actions in a deployed location that don't jibe with the above.  So, if you were junior in high school in 2001 (this guy wasn't, just illustrating), chances are you were NOT one of the bearded SF guys riding horses out of the hills near Mazar-i Sharif, or you weren't in the squadron with the guy who dropped the JDAM accidentally on Hamid Karzai & Jason Amerine, or your former co-pilot isn't the guy who crunched the Herk in the runway under construction in Northern Iraq in 2004.

Subsequent information I have is that this guy's chain of command is aware of the issues with his claims of service, but no request for documentation is forthcoming from above.