Misdemeanor

[Devil Doc]

PC? 

[JeffDG]

PC? 

Probable Cause. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Probable_cause

[Flying Pig]

Unless the officer already has PC..... but thats a whole 'nuther thread   Any time I had PC, I would always ask for consent anyway.

Yep. And if consent is given, then you don't have to bother showing PC later.  If consent is refused, and you search, then I preserve the right to litigate PC later on.

That would be a pretty poor tactic.  If I have consent, but also have PC, when I write the arrest report, my PC is documented along with your consent.  Nothing to hide and doesnt allow for anything to come up later.  The more facts the more solid the case.  Its great when facts flow right along with my suspicions. 

Not saying you wouldn't document. But once the driver consents to search, he loses his right to contest whether you had PC or not, as a consensual search requires no PC.

They can deny consent at any time during the search as long as you havnt found anything.  But yes,  in the case of my report blurb, it was going to be a search incident to arrest regardless.  Or if I had obtained consent, and then located it, same thing.  But I have had many people give consent, and then after I find something, they think they can turn back the clock.  Nope.

Devil Doc... PC= Probably Cause. 

[JeffDG]

And don't forget, if the Officer asks "Do you have anything illegal in the car?" you don't have to answer.  In fact, about the only question you have to answer is your name.  In a car, you have to provide your license, registration and insurance, but you don't have to answer any questions whatsoever.

"Do you know how fast you were going?"  There is no "good" answer to this.  You answer "85" and you've admitted to speeding.  If you say "No", then you're admitting to reckless driving, as you're not aware of the environment in which you're driving. 

[Flying Pig]

And don't forget, if the Officer asks "Do you have anything illegal in the car?" you don't have to answer.  In fact, about the only question you have to answer is your name.  In a car, you have to provide your license, registration and insurance, but you don't have to answer any questions whatsoever.

"Do you know how fast you were going?"  There is no "good" answer to this.  You answer "85" and you've admitted to speeding.  If you say "No", then you're admitting to reckless driving, as you're not aware of the environment in which you're driving.

Naaaaaaah.... not true.   Reckless driving involves a lot more than not knowing the speed you were traveling.  As far as thee other stuff, you dont have to say anything other than provide the information you agreed to provide when you got your license. 

But in reality.... do what you want.  From personal experience, people sound like goof balls when they try and act like robots.  But yes, Jeff is right.... Im not there to chit chat, there usually is a reason behind the questions Im asking.  In many cases, if I ask someone how fast they were going, and they actually tell me the right answer, I rarely write a cite.  But thats just me, however several other cops I know do the same thing.  But again, Im not a traffic cop.  I use traffic violations to catch bigger fish.  If I decide you are just a guy or gal out living your life like a normal person, Im usually on my way.

[Mitchell 1969]

"Do you know how fast you were going?"  There is no "good" answer to this.  You answer "85" and you've admitted to speeding.  If you say "No", then you're admitting to reckless driving, as you're not aware of the environment in which you're driving.

No. Not at all. But I'll wait if you want to site an actual statute that so states. I just won't wait for long.

[Private Investigator]

Unless the officer already has PC..... but thats a whole 'nuther thread   Any time I had PC, I would always ask for consent anyway.

Yep.  And if consent is given, then you don't have to bother showing PC later.  If consent is refused, and you search, then I preserve the right to litigate PC later on.

If the cop has PC, he's going to search with or without consent.  Might as well make it without so you can challenge PC later anyway.

I'm not saying do anything to interfere, but simply say "I don't consent to any search, but will not interfere with you." and hold firm on it.

I've heard the California Vehicle Code described as 687 pages of PC to pull you over.

Actually 40001 Sections I can cite you on, no pun intended sir    

[SARDOC]

When I was working the jails, I never met an inmate who was guilty.

Worked with a Deputy whose favorite line was "That's Right, You're the first person in the History of the American Criminal Justice System who says they 'didn't do it'"

[Mitchell 1969]

Unless the officer already has PC..... but thats a whole 'nuther thread   Any time I had PC, I would always ask for consent anyway.

Yep.  And if consent is given, then you don't have to bother showing PC later.  If consent is refused, and you search, then I preserve the right to litigate PC later on.

If the cop has PC, he's going to search with or without consent.  Might as well make it without so you can challenge PC later anyway.

I'm not saying do anything to interfere, but simply say "I don't consent to any search, but will not interfere with you." and hold firm on it.

I've heard the California Vehicle Code described as 687 pages of PC to pull you over.

Actually 40001 Sections I can cite you on, no pun intended sir   

Glib, but inaccurate. Your claim is that if someone states "I don't know how fast I was driving" then they're "...admitting to reckless driving." I say "BS."

I'm also saying that you can't cite a single Vehicle Code section that says anything close to "Failure to know driving speed when asked constitutes reckless driving."

Further - I'm also saying that it would not be a fun experience for a police officer trying to testify to "Your honor, I cited him for reckless driving because, when I stopped him, I asked him if he knew how fast he was going, but he couldn't tell me."

[Devil Doc]

I seriously didnt know i was speeding when i got pulled over. I left work early because i was sick. I was just trying to drive home, the speeds he clocked me at though seemed a bit odd, because for my truck to do that speed musta been when going down hill. Anwyho, that remindes me Court Date is Sept 4th, and i have gotten nos lawyers yet. So... I cant miss work, so maybe i will pay it off, err, hire a lawyer soon?

[PHall]

I seriously didnt know i was speeding when i got pulled over. I left work early because i was sick. I was just trying to drive home, the speeds he clocked me at though seemed a bit odd, because for my truck to do that speed musta been when going down hill. Anwyho, that remindes me Court Date is Sept 4th, and i have gotten nos lawyers yet. So... I cant miss work, so maybe i will pay it off, err, hire a lawyer soon?

Is traffic school an option in your state?

In California on many tickets you can go to traffic school instead of paying the fine.
Completing the school will result in the ticket not appearing on your driving record.

Like I said, I don't know if they have this in your state.

[abdsp51]

Yeah but most times traffic school costs more than just paying the fine.  And idk bout your county but in Solano you get a ticket you have the option of traffic school but you still have to pay the fine. 

[Майор Хаткевич]

I believe the point of traffic school is to avoid court costs (to the gov), avoid points on DL (to the driver), and to, overall, make money on an automated, online system.

[JeffDG]

Pilots...beware of the easy out of "Traffic School" and remember that it's reportable on question 18v on your next 8500-8

History of (1) any arrest(s) and/or conviction(s) involving driving while intoxicated by, while impaired by, or while under the influence of alcohol or a drug; or (2) history of any arrest(s), and/or conviction(s), and/or administrative action(s) involving an offense(s) which resulted in the denial, suspension, cancellation, or revocation of driving privileges or which resulted in attendance at an educational or a rehabilitation program.

If they dismiss the ticket for going to traffic school, that's an administrative action which resulted in attendance at an educational program.

[SarDragon]

I seriously didnt know i was speeding when i got pulled over. I left work early because i was sick. I was just trying to drive home, the speeds he clocked me at though seemed a bit odd, because for my truck to do that speed musta been when going down hill. Anwyho, that remindes me Court Date is Sept 4th, and i have gotten nos lawyers yet. So... I cant miss work, so maybe i will pay it off, err, hire a lawyer soon?

Is traffic school an option in your state?

In California on many tickets you can go to traffic school instead of paying the fine.
Completing the school will result in the ticket not appearing on your driving record.

Like I said, I don't know if they have this in your state.

That might have been true a long time ago, but it ain't that way now. BTDT!

In fact, the law recently changed regarding that. Now you accrue the points, even when you attend driver's school, but they are masked from inquiries from outside the DMV. Also, you pay the fine, and the driving school fee, and the admin fee assessed for attending driving school. BTDT!

[Grumpy]

Sure Dave, take the wind out of their sails.   

[Critical AOA]

Traffic tickets are a real revenue generating machine for many jurisdictions.  It is far more about cash flow than law and order.   If you are a victim of a crime don't be surprised that local law enforcement doesn't have the personnel to investigate but they sure do seem to have plenty of personnel with the spare time to sit around waiting to pull you over to issue a traffic ticket.  Investigating crimes costs money, writing ticket makes money.  That is their game.

[Eclipse]

It's a "game" you do not have to play if, you know, you obey the law.

[SarDragon]

Traffic tickets are a real revenue generating machine for many jurisdictions.  It is far more about cash flow than law and order.   If you are a victim of a crime don't be surprised that local law enforcement doesn't have the personnel to investigate but they sure do seem to have plenty of personnel with the spare time to sit around waiting to pull you over to issue a traffic ticket.  Investigating crimes costs money, writing ticket makes money.  That is their game.

A lot of our local speeding enforcement is in areas that need the enforcement - long streets through 25 mph residential areas where folks like to do 40+, school zones, that kind of thing.

[Private Investigator]

I seriously didnt know i was speeding when i got pulled over. I left work early because i was sick. I was just trying to drive home, the speeds he clocked me at though seemed a bit odd, because for my truck to do that speed musta been when going down hill. Anwyho, that remindes me Court Date is Sept 4th, and i have gotten nos lawyers yet. So... I cant miss work, so maybe i will pay it off, err, hire a lawyer soon?

Doc, you did not get the citation in Hickory did you? Anyways good luck ...