Drones Grounded in CO

[Check Pilot/Tow Pilot]

Interesting:

http://dailycaller.com/2013/09/16/fema-threatens-to-arrest-volunteer-drone-operators-during-colo-flood-relief/

[Eclipse]

My guess would be that, whatever the story, it's mostly not in that article.

The comments are kind of fun, though.

[Critical AOA]

I have two questions that I hope some of you who are more versed in US law and FEMA can answer for me.

What arresting authority does FEMA have?

What authority does FEMA have over airspace to be able to ground anything?

[Eclipse]

That's what I find amusing about this, and all the talks about "camps" and the other nonsense you find on the web.

None, that I know of - FEMA is primarily a resource aggregation and preparedness agency.  Authority for execution
always stays with the local agencies.

FEMA just writes checks and connects resources.

If a "state of emergency" is declared, which is different from a "declaration of disaster", FEMA has some authority to appoint executives in charge
of response, but I don't know that this gives them actual powers of arrest, etc.  It's probably as much interpretation and bias filter as
actual authority.

IOW if someoe coming in with deep pockets and mondo experience "suggests" you do something, it's likely to get "done".

[Luis R. Ramos]

This is discussed in one of the FEMA classes. IS 800 talks about the Stafford Act, giving responsibility for managing the Federal response to FEMA.

In other words, you ask for Federal money and support in an emergency, you risk giving FEMA authority to manage the scene. Risk, because not all Federal aid requires FEMA response.

Flyer

[Smithsonia]

I was on the mission from beginning to end. There were TFRs. There were Sheriffs, Police, and all sorts of other acronyms everywhere. There were also low flying
Army helicopters, news choppers, CAP planes, and FEMA assigned assets. CAP/we got chased out of the TFR more than once. According to the pilots I talked to "it was busier than a killer bee nest." Deconfliction means the lookee-lous and unassigned get tossed out first. (Likely these are the same threats made by Police as you drive through the pick up lane at a busy Airport terminal.... "Keep it moving or you're getting a ticket." I've gotten a ton of warnings but no tickets.

No one has time to integrate someone who shows up happy to help but without training, credentials, or is unknown to mission command. I had CAP members show up who had time photographing from Radio Controlled airplanes representing themselves as qualified APs and other ES duties. We called them "Flight of the Phoenixers" You'll need to recall the movie to get the reference.

I don't think the members meant harm they were just eager to help. It happens when you sit at home, watch the news, and are caught up in the human drama. We thanked those members and sent them home. That said for OPSEC, Property Security, and just to keep our place somewhat quiet. I moved people out of the Photo Imaging Office all day, everyday.

We sent one guy home and as he left the Regional Coordinator for FEMA passed him at the FBO door. Lucky for us the member wasn't juggling a camera, asking how it worked, and what it did - as the Regional Coordinator went by. If that happened, I'd be in FEMA prison right now. (I am actually kidding about that FEMA jail, I think)

[lordmonar]

I have two questions that I hope some of you who are more versed in US law and FEMA can answer for me.

What arresting authority does FEMA have?

What authority does FEMA have over airspace to be able to ground anything?

If FEMA has lead on the recovery/DR efforts....then they have all the authority to ask (and get) the FAA to declare a TFR which includes Drones.

Drone already need to have special rules on where and when you can fly.  I remember Katrina.....the USAF was all ready to deploy MQ-1s to support the efforts but the FAA and FEMA turned them off.

FEMA as far as I know has power of arrest (but it would not surprise me if they don't have a Law Enforcement Branch....hell the Department of Education has a LE branch.  But if the FEMA IC asks for and gets a TFR all the way to surface.......they most certainly can call on some LE branch of the government to arrest who ever busts the TFR.  No different then the FAA sending out cops to get some dude busting Class B airspace.

As Eclipse first pointed out........90% of the story is NOT in that article.  The "We will arrest anyone flying drones" may have been after the people involved say "FU!  We are going to fly anyways!"  Which usually gets a measured and reasonable response.

[lordmonar]

And just for fun!   http://www.businessinsider.com/cop-tickets-blackhawk-pilot-2013-9

[Luis R. Ramos]

Expanding on my post regarding the Stafford Act, http://www.mwcog.org/security/security/otherplans/stafford.pdf

Title VI, Emergency Preparedness, Page 66.

Section 601, Declaration of Policy states that the Federal Government "...shall provide necessary direction, coordination, and guidance..."

Section 602, definitions state "The Administrator is the FEMA Administrator."

Section 622 Security Regulations (42 USC 5197a). (a) The Administrator shall establish such security requirements and safeguards, including restrictions with respect to access to info and property as the Administrator considers necessary.

So, get FEMA involved, and you lost control...

I learned about the Stafford Act when I took IS 800.

Flyer

[Smithsonia]

FEMA is part of Homeland Security. I'm sure that the head of FEMA has the Head of HSD on speed dial should the need arise. If you don't believe me disobey a FEMA order and see what happens. Likely you'll get at least one phone call. Let us know what happened.

I'm pretty sure they can't arrest you if you DON'T want to evacuate. But I am rather certain they can make sure you don't get in their way. - With your drone, UAV, car, horse, boat, ship, airplane, or any other such thing.

[Eclipse]

I'm pretty sure they can't arrest you if you DON'T want to evacuate. But I am rather certain they can make sure you don't get in their way. - With your drone, UAV, car, horse, boat, ship, airplane, or any other such thing.

I've been told on more then one occasion that, at least at the state level, they can't force you to evacuate your home, but once you leave they can
keep you from going back in.

As to the TFRs, we've used them fairly frequently in my wing during missing persons, and of course the people who want "in", whatever they
are, press, other agency, etc., gets their nose out of joint. 

Also, while probably well-intentioned, it shouldn't be missed that the company involved is a commercial endeavor looking to make  name for itself,
so any noise it makes and press it gets probably works in its favor, especially with the less-informed general public.

[38ffems]

The original story was not correct.  There was a TFR for the area so they could conduct helicopter operations and the county EM told the drone operators that it would be unsafe to have the drones flying in the same area.  I don't think it was even an order but rather just asking them to stay grounded.  http://www.9news.com/news/local/article/355477/222/Colorado-Floods-Myths-debunked

[ProdigalJim]

Speaking as a journalist...what a dumb story. We have a saying in the news business: "The large print giveth, and the small print taketh away."

Note that the headline claims, with absolute certainty, that FEMA threatened arrests. Note further that the actual STORY says that the drone manufacturer CLAIMS that the agency threatened arrest. And then, further in, we learn that our fearless reporter didn't even REPORT this story...he's cribbing from IEEE Journal!

So the whole picture is some guy sees another guy's story about what a third guy says a fourth guy did...and we get a headline declaring that the thing went down as it did.

Dumb.

If that had been my shop, young Jeff would have had an interesting afternoon in my office.

[Eclipse]

And the only thing that gets read in the Twitspace is the headline, which then becomes "fact".

[lordmonar]

And the only thing that gets read in the Twitspace is the headline, which then becomes "fact".

They can't put it on the internet if it's not true..........Bon Jour. 

[arajca]

And the only thing that gets read in the Twitspace is the headline, which then becomes "fact".

They can't put it on the internet if it's not true..........Bon Jour. 

Where's you read that? 

[RogueLeader]

And the only thing that gets read in the Twitspace is the headline, which then becomes "fact".

They can't put it on the internet if it's not true..........Bon Jour. 

Where's you read that? 

The internet.   

[Eclipse]

The internet.   

What's the AOL keyword for that?

[RogueLeader]

The internet.   

What's the AOL keyword for that?

What's AOL?

[PHall]

The internet.   

What's the AOL keyword for that?

What's AOL?

I know what SOL is!