Hawk Mountain Ranger School

[lordmonar]

Put that in the form of an acronym and slap it on a nametape and I'm sold!

CAPMWAATFTGOAPWMCCARJWAWRSARTFTMPPMAAGTCFI

Senior CAPMWAATFTGOAPWMCCARJWAWRSARTFTMPPMAAGTCFI

Master CAPMWAATFTGOAPWMCCARJWAWRSARTFTMPPMAAGTCFI

Expert CAPMWAATFTGOAPWMCCARJWAWRSARTFTMPPMAAGTCFI

Medic CAPMWAATFTGOAPWMCCARJWAWRSARTFTMPPMAAGTCFI

Did I get them all? 

[Spike]

^ haha  :clap:

Good work.  I was way too lazy to do that.

[SarDragon]

It looks like it, but they aren't really acronyms, since they don't make pronounceable words. They are, more properly, initialisms.

Radar and laser - acronyms.

GPS - initialism.

[lordmonar]

It looks like it, but they aren't really acronyms, since they don't make pronounceable words. They are, more properly, initialisms.

Radar and laser - acronyms.

GPS - initialism.

I can pronounce it!  So there! 

[Dracosbane]

Gesundheit!

[hkumich]

Hi! Everyone knows course from HMRS is physically demanding, can I get some examples about it? E.g. Full Gear hiking is different from Full gear running, and what are the typical morning PTs are? How long and in what intensity?

I am interested in the course contexts but it is the physically part making me to consider...

(I am referring to the Officer (Senior) Basic Course)

Thanks!

[Eclipse]

They do "full gear runs"?

[FW]

^Yes....... of back packs full of 6 packs.      
(I'm only kidding, guys.)

Actually, you can get all the information you need from the HM website.

[sarmed1]

Senior PT is always taken with a grain of salt..... do what you can that doesnt produce chest pain, fainting or shortness of breath (prolonged anyway)

AM PT is typically stretching and the usual calesthetics (ie push-ups, sit ups, jumping jacks etc etc) followed by a daily dose of the obstacle (confidence) course.....for a quick tour: 6ftish jump (over water), tires, balance beam, rope climb, inverted ladder, rope swing (over water) concrete tunnel, pull up bars, monkey bars (over water) "rope" bridge (technically steel cable, and yes over water) then a run (or three ball soccer, though I dont think the senior squadron plays, cadets only)

There is no full gear run as part of any official curriculum (that I am aware of) there have been a few instances where one or two of the advanced squadrons may airborne shuffle back to the base after the 3 day field excercise...but thats more of a motivational thing than part of the "plan"

mk

[HMRSRANGER]

For those of you who have better things to do than download the PDF:

The pink belt was tired of hanging in the operations room for a year and it choose its new owner for the day. C/Maj Giles, Charlie Cadet Squadron Commander, was the pink belts best choice according to the inspection team and the overall performance for the day. The Pink Belt is given to the squadron that doesn't do the best throughout the day. Who will get it next?

Squadron Alpha, lead by C/Maj McDonough, earned honor squadron for July 12. Can they keep it up?

As if the torture of the English language isn't bad enough ("and it choose its new owner..."), the taunting in the last two sentences sure seems like singling someone out for embarrassment to me — a good case could be made for a CPPT violation. A certain Cadet McDonough ought to feel shamed, since he's singled out by name.

Why pink? Is it effeminate? Does its use here imply that female members are less capable? Is it representative of a false bravado that should be reviewed? Discuss.

[HMRSRANGER]

A response to the earlier arguement on the fact of the pink belt, and how it suposebly is offensive to females and how it is sexist, well if you ever took a white belt and tried to bleach it it turns pink. i was always told that someone a longtime ago wore a pink belt after bleaching it and it kinda stook as a joke(in between staff not in any kind of hazing way) and turned into a tradition that what ever squadron did the worst throughout the day gets the pink belt. the squadron commander is the bearer of the pink belt and all staff understand what it represents and they no its not in a hazing manner its a motivation to work harder for the next day and make improvements on what the squadron staff is doing so that they can make the expericence better for there cadets so they can get as much tarining out of the school as they can, because i mean jeez they pay alot of money to come and learn as much as they can so the pink belt is basically a motivation for squadron staff to work harder for their cadets and not slack so they can make the expericence ten times better for there students.

[isuhawkeye]

-Redacted-

[Fuzzy]

A response to the earlier arguement on the fact of the pink belt, and how it suposebly is offensive to females and how it is sexist, well if you ever took a white belt and tried to bleach it it turns pink. i was always told that someone a longtime ago wore a pink belt after bleaching it and it kinda stook as a joke(in between staff not in any kind of hazing way) and turned into a tradition that what ever squadron did the worst throughout the day gets the pink belt. the squadron commander is the bearer of the pink belt and all staff understand what it represents and they no its not in a hazing manner its a motivation to work harder for the next day and make improvements on what the squadron staff is doing so that they can make the expericence better for there cadets so they can get as much tarining out of the school as they can, because i mean jeez they pay alot of money to come and learn as much as they can so the pink belt is basically a motivation for squadron staff to work harder for their cadets and not slack so they can make the expericence ten times better for there students.

Like doing push ups every time I show up with scuffed boots, can motivate me to shine my shoes. Its not hazing its motivation..... Surrrre

Its all negative reinforcement "You do bad, something you don't like happens to you". Can't the rangers just get the same effect by rewarding the best flight?

Who cares if the flight staff "want to do it" (because they would tell you if they didn't right? /Sarcasm) directives tell you not to do it.

Also as its been probably pointed out. Singling out the worst flight commander by making him wear a Pink belt is the textbook definition of hazing.

Seriously its almost like you guys at hawk were trying specifically to create an example of Hazing.

[Gunner C]

IMO that's what happens when you have amatures (like Hawk Mtn "Ranger" instructors) trying to break bad on the students.  The pros know how to motivate someone.  HMRS "Ranger" instructors just do stuff that they saw on a movie.  Oh please.

If you want to see how the real professionals do it, watch "Two Weeks in Hell" (Special Forces Assessment and Selection).  I'm not talking about how they make students puke and quit in the 1st 20 minutes, but how everything has its training objective.  You'll also notice that after the first two hours, there's no yelling (there was even less when I went through - hardly any).  If HMRS wants to teach something, do it like the later phases in the SFQC.  There's classroom instruction, no harrassment, no yelling.  Just learn it and do it.

You're not running an assessment and selection program, you're trying to teach people how to do "X" and "Y".  Do one or the other, but not both.  But on a uniform note, why not have white spats, too.  Nifty bling! 

[davidsinn]

The responses defending that stupid belt make me wonder if they even do RST out there.

[Eclipse]

It does raise the question as to whether or not anyone is actually awake during those magic two hours.

Some high points of our review this last weekend.

CAP is trying to instill a culture of performance vs. compliance, raising the bar to avoid even the appearance of impropriety, and stressing
remediation which directly addresses the issue, not simply provides punishment.  (i.e. making a cadet clean the latrines because his boots are not shined properly may result in clean latrines but not shiny boots)

But then again...those are just slides right off the NHQ-mandated training for any activity of 4-nights or more...   

[lordmonar]

I recently had a conversation with someone from CAWG about the "tadition" of the CTG commander having to one push up for each of the CTGs...the cadet told me that it was not hazing because he wanted to do it.

I explained that there is a fine line between "wanting to do something" and when peer pressure crosses the hazing line.

I can think of several more appropriate ways of motivating the the flight to do better. 

Loose the belt.

[jimmydeanno]

I explained that there is a fine line between "wanting to do something" and when peer pressure crosses the hazing line.

"Consent does not eliminate the culpability of the perpetrator."

[HMRSRANGER]

How many of you have been to a summer school and  saw how it operated, or are you all just making opinoins on what other people have said about the program.

[FW]

I've been to quite a few and plan to visit this year also.  I hope NOT to see a pink belt in sight. This kind of "show" was to have been purged years ago.  Promises to profesionalize the conduct of the staff has kept HMRS alive.  I sincerely hope this type of "tradition" is gone.