Q for the older SMs

[SarDragon]

505 or 1505?

http://cgi.ebay.com/WWII-CADET-CIVIL-AIR-PATROL-KHAKIE-SHIRT_W0QQitemZ110141025630QQihZ001QQcategoryZ4729QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[Camas]

505 or 1505?

Neither.  505's didn't come out 'til the 50's; well after WW II and were around 'til around 1963 or so.  The 1505's were out from the early 60's to around 1978.  Difference?  505's were all cotton and the 1505's were a cotton/polyester blend.  I wore them both.

[PA Guy]

It's what was referred to as a Shade I khaki shirt.  Could be worn with or without a tie. The tie was tucked in between the second and and third button from the top. This shirt is complete except for the collar brass, C.A.P.C.  This uniform was all cotton and worn with a ton of starch.  My guess is this uniform is of late 50s and prior to '65.  Note a C/TSgt with only 4 ribbons, encampment and the red, white and blue training ribbons, very typical of that era. Compare that to the Bolivian admirals we have now.

This was my first uniform.  You could order one through the CAP Times for $11.95 through Weiss & Mahoney in NYC.  That price included evrything you needed except shoes and socks.  Shirt, trousers, belt, patches, collar barss and flight cap $11.95 out the door!!

[BillB]

And the ribbons are out of order.  Encampment should be the lowest priority ribbon, not highest. It's even reversed (green on wrong end)

[alexalvarez]

Those were the day's!!!

[SarDragon]

Well, unless I'm totally whacked, it's one or the other, because I wore that type of uniform as a cadet in the mid to late 60s. I joined 19 Feb 1964. Those ribbons were still kind of current then. My unit did the transition in April of '64, so I did Ach 1 under the olde programme, and the remainder under the new, hence my lack of a Curry ribbon in my cadet rack.

And yes, those were the days!

[shorning]

Well, unless I'm totally whacked, it's one or the other, because I wore that type of uniform as a cadet in the mid to late 60s. I joined 19 Feb 1964. Those ribbons were still kind of current then. My unit did the transition in April of '64, so I did Ach 1 under the olde programme, and the remainder under the new, hence my lack of a Curry ribbon in my cadet rack.

And yes, those were the days!

Do I even need to comment here?

[SarDragon]

Do what you will, Stevie. Far be it for us to spoil your fun.   

[PA Guy]

Well, unless I'm totally whacked, it's one or the other, because I wore that type of uniform as a cadet in the mid to late 60s. I joined 19 Feb 1964. Those ribbons were still kind of current then. My unit did the transition in April of '64, so I did Ach 1 under the olde programme, and the remainder under the new, hence my lack of a Curry ribbon in my cadet rack.

And yes, those were the days!

Neither the 505 or the 1505 shirts were ever available in long sleeves.  The shirt shown on e-Bay is a Shade I khaki.  It was 100% cotton but in a very fine weave.  The 505 was made out of a more coarse weave material and was a lighter shade than Shade I khakis.

[shorning]

Do what you will, Stevie. Far be it for us to spoil your fun.   

Too late...

[SarDragon]

Well, unless I'm totally whacked, it's one or the other, because I wore that type of uniform as a cadet in the mid to late 60s. I joined 19 Feb 1964. Those ribbons were still kind of current then. My unit did the transition in April of '64, so I did Ach 1 under the olde programme, and the remainder under the new, hence my lack of a Curry ribbon in my cadet rack.

And yes, those were the days!

Neither the 505 or the 1505 shirts were ever available in long sleeves.  The shirt shown on e-Bay is a Shade I khaki.  It was 100% cotton but in a very fine weave.  The 505 was made out of a more coarse weave material and was a lighter shade than Shade I khakis.

OK, I guess I can buy that. I'm sitting here looking at a 15 Jan '68 CAPM 39-1, and it only has the 1505s listed for a tan uniform, in short sleeves.

Thanks for the info.

[capchiro]

The shirt in the picture is what I wore in 1963-1964 (with a tie) at Truax Field, Madison, Wisconsin, (meetings in a hanger with F-89's) and at encampment at Chanute Air Force Base.  Got to ride down and back in a C-119 and got to fly a C-47 for about 10 minutes.  Those were the days.

[Chaplaindon]

I've said it before and I'll keep "preaching" that message ... CAP would be well-served IMHO to shift from the rainbow of multiforms into a single UNIFORM and my suggestion would be for an enhanced 1505.

A 21st Century "retro" ... like the 2007 Shelby Mustang.

By enhanced, I am speaking of the vast improvements in fabric technology which now permit stain and wrinkle resistence and much greater fabric durability (e.g. Dress Dockers). Have the creases sewn-in as well.

Wear this short or long-sleeve (LS with blue tie) along with the USAF blue flight cap (or a blue one of CAP generation if the USAF balks), blue web belt, 2-line blue nametag, CAP ribbons & badges (as desired), black shoes,

For grade insignia: Officers (cadet and senior) would wear miniature pin-on METAL grade insignia on the collars (and cap). SM NCO's would wear CAP-modified stripes sewn on the sleeves (no cap device). Cadet enlisted/NCO's pin-on insignia on the collars (cadet cap device).

A Khaki multi-season jacket (with removeable liner) would be available.

Perhaps a khaki 4-pocket (or other) service coat could be made to wear over the shirt and trousers allowing for a dress uniform version too. Put an ultramarine sleeve stripe on it to signify officers and require "USCAP" lapel devices.

It would be a simpler system. It would be one system for everyone ... "learn it, love it, live it."

We'd look good. We'd look military/USAF. We'd be uniform. We'd be more comfortable (try keeping the blue poly-wool USAF trousers from scuffing and "dirting-up" around a mission base). In addition, it wouldn't take a scorecard the size of the stockmarket report to list the various "combinations" and their various options. KISS.

We would also look distinct from the USAF and other services so as to preclude saluting confusion even at 30+ feet as no one else wears khaki and blue together in the military.

For a field uniform, I suggest that we could stick with the blue BDUs or --as a more comfy option for those of us in the near-tropics-- switch over time to Khaki-colored ones (maybe an Omaha Orange crew neck t-shirt underneath). Perhaps including a boonie hat ...

[Chaplaindon]

I'd also allow the black leather flight jacket to be worn with the retro-1505 khaki's by members who have aeronautical ratings in lieu of the khaki all-season jacket.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Right...

"Retro" uniforms for the guys still flying propeller driven airplanes!

Can we wear "Crushed caps," too?

My only heartburn is that it distances us from the USAF, and is another step to re-creating us as "The Flying Coast Guard" or another branch of service.

But the khakis were great uniforms, and the 60's were great times to be a CAP cadet!  World War II was less than 20 years into the history books, and tons of stuff we know now about the war was still classified.  Our officers had all been there.  We were close enough to the formation CAP that we could get the whole story first hand.

I came in in 1963.  CAP was not quite 22 years old yet!