Um, Lordmonar?

[Major Carrales]

Sir, couldn't this be sent in a PM?

Actually...was the epic fail "smack down" really necessary?  It seems a little presumptuous.

I mean...and I want you to think about this.

Now, because you presumed and came across as you did...the next few posts you make will be tainted by people recalling that you had to presume you had some authority to send people off to PM.

This is a good one for everyone on here...when people make less than civil posts (be they rants, and hominem attacks, or other insolence) credibility tends to drop on other more important issues.

[Private Investigator]

I've considered going for SMSgt, but cannot justify it until National HQ actually comes up with a SM NCO program.

I considered just being a SSgt and just having fun. I doubt NHQ can figure out a SM NCO program, JMHO   

[flyboy53]

PATRICK M. HARRIS, MSgt, CAP
Nellis Composite Squadron

MSgt?  Did you trade officer rank in for your AF rank in CAP?

Considered this myself once.

There's a lot more prestigue being a senior NCO than a CAP officer.

Congrats, good luck and remember your new role, Sergeant

[cadetesman]

I think it's pretty cool that you became an SNCO, I mean, honestly, this is just an observation, but anyone can put in the time and effort and become a Lt. Col, while an SNCO is so much different.


It's silly though, how only "officers" can be in charge of things and how some 2nd or 1st Lt is in charge of an SNCO.... the SNCO, who has been in CAP forever, and could easily be a Lt. Col, is not allowed to have authority, just because they want to display their service in a unique way...

On an unrelated note, could an SNCO theoretically become a Wing CC?

[Extremepredjudice]

Yes, but they would become a colonel.

[RogueLeader]

I think it's pretty cool that you became an SNCO, I mean, honestly, this is just an observation, but anyone can put in the time and effort and become a Lt. Col, while an SNCO is so much different.


It's silly though, how only "officers" can be in charge of things and how some 2nd or 1st Lt is in charge of an SNCO.... the SNCO, who has been in CAP forever, and could easily be a Lt. Col, is not allowed to have authority, just because they want to display their service in a unique way...

On an unrelated note, could an SNCO theoretically become a Wing CC?

A (former) SNCO is our Nat/cc.

[PHall]

A (former) SNCO is our Nat/cc.

He's not a former SNCO, he's a Retired SNCO. There is a difference.

[RogueLeader]

A (former) SNCO is our Nat/cc.

He's not a former SNCO, he's a Retired SNCO. There is a difference.

Whoops. My bad. That's what I meant., just not what I said.

[Eclipse]

Yes, but they would become a colonel.

Cite please.

That was my point.  It has, to my knowledge, never been tested.  Maj Gen Carr had long-before decided to
pursue the standard CAP grade system.

I don't know of any regulation that requires a wing CC to be a Colonel, officer, or anything other than a SM in good standing.
It's been tradition that the appointments are accepted, but where's the requirement?

[Extremepredjudice]

They would become a col. at the beginning of their term. See: CAPR 35-2, 3-2, item B.

[Eclipse]

Nowhere does it say it is a requirement. The word used is "may". The specific section you cited simply indicates the timing.

[ßτε]

Nowhere does it say it is a requirement. The word used is "may". The specific section you cited simply indicates the timing.

Actually, the word "may" is not in section B.

b. Wing Commander. Promotion to the temporary grade of colonel is concurrent with appointment as wing commander. The permanent grade of colonel is contingent upon the recommendation of the region commander upon the wing commander's satisfactory completion of assignment as wing commander.

I really don't see any option here.

[FW]

Nowhere does it say it is a requirement. The word used is "may". The specific section you cited simply indicates the timing.

Actually, the word "may" is not in section B.

b. Wing Commander. Promotion to the temporary grade of colonel is concurrent with appointment as wing commander. The permanent grade of colonel is contingent upon the recommendation of the region commander upon the wing commander's satisfactory completion of assignment as wing commander.

I really don't see any option here.

Correct.  All "Corporate Officers" are given the grade of "Colonel" upon appointment to the office they are assigned.  Elected officers are given the grade of, either Brig Gen or Maj Gen; depending on the office they were elected.  That may all change in August however, for now, that is the rule. 

[AlphaSigOU]

Way back in the day WIWAC I remember new wing commanders were first appointed to the grade of lieutenant colonel (if they weren't already at that grade) and served in that grade at least six months 'on probation' before getting their 'chickens'. Even then, the chickens weren't considered permanent until successful completion of their term of office.

[ol'fido]

I think it's pretty cool that you became an SNCO, I mean, honestly, this is just an observation, but anyone can put in the time and effort and become a Lt. Col, while an SNCO is so much different.


It's silly though, how only "officers" can be in charge of things and how some 2nd or 1st Lt is in charge of an SNCO.... the SNCO, who has been in CAP forever, and could easily be a Lt. Col, is not allowed to have authority, just because they want to display their service in a unique way...

On an unrelated note, could an SNCO theoretically become a Wing CC?

You will find very few SNCOs who feel that a 2nd or 1st Lt is in charge of them. They may be in "command" of them but seldom are they in charge of them.

"2nd Lt goes into the 1SG's office and says, "1SG your gonna do this, this, and this, and your this is how your gonna do it."

1SG says, "With all due respect, Lieutenant, get the [expletive] out of my office and stay the [expletive] outta my office."

2nd Lt runs to the CO's office and tells him what the 1SG said. CO looks at him, shakes his head, and says, "Well then, Lt, stay the [expletive] out of the 1SG's office." 2nd LT goes into a corner and pouts.

[Eclipse]

All well and good in the military, not likely to mean anything different in CAP.

Changing bars into stripes won't change who has the real experience, who is really in command, nor the fact that the vast majority
of members don't even understand the theoretical paradigm, let alone have a clue what it's supposed to mean in CAP, which is zero.

And further to this, in CAP, the butterbars aren't likely to be 21 and afraid of their shadows, they are just as likely to be as, or more, experienced
than the those members wearing stripes who chose not to accept an officer appointment.  And since both the officers and the NCOs both have
to empty the trash cans, the whole argument doesn't mean much.

[Майор Хаткевич]

And further to this, in CAP, the butterbars aren't likely to be 21 and afraid of their shadows

[PHall]

All well and good in the military, not likely to mean anything different in CAP.

Changing bars into stripes won't change who has the real experience, who is really in command, nor the fact that the vast majority
of members don't even understand the theoretical paradigm, let alone have a clue what it's supposed to mean in CAP, which is zero.

And further to this, in CAP, the butterbars aren't likely to be 21 and afraid of their shadows, they are just as likely to be as, or more, experienced
than the those members wearing stripes who chose not to accept an officer appointment.  And since both the officers and the NCOs both have
to empty the trash cans, the whole argument doesn't mean much.

In my last Air Force Reserve unit the officers (pilots) emptied the trash cans in their office with no complaints.
Someone had to do it and since it was their office...

[Eclipse]

Kinda missed the point...

[PHall]

Kinda missed the point...

And your point was?