CAP Medals

[Walkman]

I like ceremonies and it is a shame we do not recognize the Senior Membership like we do the Cadets...

Totally agree.

[Майор Хаткевич]

I like ceremonies and it is a shame we do not recognize the Senior Membership like we do the Cadets...

Totally agree.

Other units don't award SMs on "Promotion Night"? Sure its much rarer than cadets, but why wouldnt you tag SM awards/promotions with the cadet awards at the all hands?

[MacGruff]

In our squadron all promotions are handled during promotion night. Cadet or Senior - makes no difference.

In the year I've been around though, I have not see any medals being presented to anyone. Is that supposed to be done in a ceremony also? Maybe the same ceremony as many of the cadet achievements confer grade as well as a ribbon/medal. No?

[VNY]

Nobody has mentioned money.  It cost me well over a hundred dollars to make up a full size rack, and that was only six common military awards.  A full size rack for someone who has been in CAP awhile would probably cost a fortune - and weigh several pounds.

[Panache]

Question: Why are most CAP Senior Awards presented only in mini-medal form?

Answer: Because we are the "mini-me" of the Air Force.   

Sooooo....Ma Blue is Dr. Evil, and CAP is Mini-Me?

"Mini-Me, no! We don't gnaw on our kitty.  Leave Mini-Mr. Bigglesworth alone.  Just love him, stroke him."

[Private Investigator]

In our squadron all promotions are handled during promotion night. Cadet or Senior - makes no difference.

In the year I've been around though, I have not see any medals being presented to anyone. Is that supposed to be done in a ceremony also? Maybe the same ceremony as many of the cadet achievements confer grade as well as a ribbon/medal. No?

Some Squadrons do and some do not. Same with Group HQ and at Wing HQ I do not recall anyone getting promoted.

The only medals we have is SMV, BMV and the DSA, which is usually presented at the Wing Conference. The Cadets can also get the AFA award which consists of a medal to present along with the certificate. That is one the Cadets like.

[Fubar]

In our squadron all promotions are handled during promotion night. Cadet or Senior - makes no difference.

Our seniors have always been privately asked if they want to be called up front. I can think of one time where a senior said yes (he had his parents come in to put his captain epaulets on). The prevailing opinion seems to be "it's a cadet thing" when it comes to rank. That's not to say people aren't progressing, our PDO has everyone on a spreadsheet and is on top of what everyone should be doing to advance. I guess most want the info part of the meeting to conclude as quickly as possible so that everyone can get to work on whatever project they have that night 

[Shuman 14]

I might add that the AF doesn't have any uniforms on which full-size gongs are worn.  (Well, except for those godawfully-ugly things worn by the incoming and outgoing CSAF and the CMSAF at the last change of command.  Ugh.)

Many SMs (myself included) would willingly purchase full-size medals of the CAP decorations and higher training awards (Garber and Wilson, at least) for shadowbox display.  Perhaps Vanguard should consider it ...

Jack

Sorry been off=line and couldn't get on to post.

I'd like to point out that while there are uniforms in the Army that fullsize medals could be worn on (IE Dress Greens, Dress Blues, Dress Whites) they were rarely (if ever) worn on them outside of the Old Guard or other ceremonial local unit.

The only time most of us wear one is when it is pinned on at the awards ceremony... after that, ribbons only.

So other than a shadow box, they're not much use to us either.

I do like the concept of them being offered to those who would wish to buy them.

I also find it disheartening that there is so little ceremony placed in awarding Senior Members their due rewards and promotions, to me even that little form of recognition is a big retention tool and possibly a recruitment tool.

The concept of what is "hard" varies by the abilities of the person.

For example, I assume most of the posters here would think completing CAP's Level 1 is easy, but for a new SM who never served in the military, was never a CAP cadet and just an average guy/gal looking to volunteer their time to something, Level 1 might be hard and completion a big deal to them.

So to have a small ceremony at a meeting where he/she is called forward and the Membership Award Medal is pinned on them in front of everyone would be a big deal to him/her and if a potential member is in audience, seeing that simple ceremony might be the "push" they need to join.

The same for any other award, recognition in front of your peers and friends helps to reinforce why a person volunteered in the first place.

Much better than telling that SM, "you can go to this website and print out your online certificate and go to Vanguard's website to order your ribbon and mini-medal".

[MacGruff]

I also find it disheartening that there is so little ceremony placed in awarding Senior Members their due rewards and promotions, to me even that little form of recognition is a big retention tool and possibly a recruitment tool.

The concept of what is "hard" varies by the abilities of the person.

For example, I assume most of the posters here would think completing CAP's Level 1 is easy, but for a new SM who never served in the military, was never a CAP cadet and just an average guy/gal looking to volunteer their time to something, Level 1 might be hard and completion a big deal to them.

So to have a small ceremony at a meeting where he/she is called forward and the Membership Award Medal is pinned on them in front of everyone would be a big deal to him/her and if a potential member is in audience, seeing that simple ceremony might be the "push" they need to join.

The same for any other award, recognition in front of your peers and friends helps to reinforce why a person volunteered in the first place.

Much better than telling that SM, "you can go to this website and print out your online certificate and go to Vanguard's website to order your ribbon and mini-medal".

Exactly!!

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

[UH60guy]

I agree that we should put more into stuff for Senior Members- it makes things mean a little more when they're presented right, and it is always nice to get the pat on the back in front of your peers.

That said, I also feel kinda strongly in the opposite direction in that CAP has too many ribbons. Not that I've been in long enough to get many, but the ones that get me are the ones tied to rank or other achievements. For example, why did I get both a ribbon AND a technician badge when I made my first tech rating? Why does the Crossfield award exist, when you already have a master version of the aerospace badge? I don't advocate taking away cadet bling, but why does every promotion also have a ribbon, when they're already wearing the rank? The Army gives out service awards like candy too, but at least it's one ribbon/badge/rank per achievement. The one that boggles my mind there is the "Army Service Ribbon." Isn't wearing the uniform enough indication that I'm in the Army?

All that said, I guess what I'm getting at is yes- I'd love optional full size medals for a shadow box and recognition of senior members- but I also think we need to cut down on what's out there to make what you earn mean that much more.

Finally, I would point out that you can make a decent shadow box with mini medals yourself. I did that with my Army mini-medals- found an 8x10 frame with a 5x7 matte and a little depth behind the glass. Glued some black felt to the back of the matte, and just pinned the medal rack to it. Added a few other pins on the top right/left (you could add specialty track badges) and closed it up. The back bulges out a bit from the metal backings, but it looks fine on the wall.

[Shuman 14]

The one that boggles my mind there is the "Army Service Ribbon." Isn't wearing the uniform enough indication that I'm in the Army?

Yes... and no.

The ASR itself has little meaning, but purpose behind it is sound. Back before the ASR was created, during the Cold War, draftee soldiers were getting sent to Germany and were being awarded German awards like the GAFET and the Schutzenschnur but could not wear them because regulations stated Foreign decorations could only be worn in conjunction with at least one (1) US decoration.

Since this was also before the Army Achievement Medal was created, most soldiers didn't see their first decoration until their Good Conduct medal was awarded at 3 years, which most draftees never saw, getting out at 2 years.

So the Army created the ASR, the most minor of decorations, so that those German (and other Foreign awards) could actually be worn when they were presented.

[FlyTiger77]

The one that boggles my mind there is the "Army Service Ribbon." Isn't wearing the uniform enough indication that I'm in the Army?

The ASR itself has little meaning...

There is the understatement of the evening.

[Private Investigator]

The one that boggles my mind there is the "Army Service Ribbon." Isn't wearing the uniform enough indication that I'm in the Army?

Yes... and no.

The ASR itself has little meaning, but purpose behind it is sound. Back before the ASR was created, during the Cold War, draftee soldiers were getting sent to Germany and were being awarded German awards like the GAFET and the Schutzenschnur but could not wear them because regulations stated Foreign decorations could only be worn in conjunction with at least one (1) US decoration.

Since this was also before the Army Achievement Medal was created, most soldiers didn't see their first decoration until their Good Conduct medal was awarded at 3 years, which most draftees never saw, getting out at 2 years.

So the Army created the ASR, the most minor of decorations, so that those German (and other Foreign awards) could actually be worn when they were presented.

I was Army Guard 1982-1985 and that is not now I remember it. BTW, the last drafted soldier reported for duty in June 1973. The Army Achievement Medal was a good ideal, badly deployed. A friend of mine, his son got an AAM for doing well in Boot Camp.

[Mitchell 1969]

The one that boggles my mind there is the "Army Service Ribbon." Isn't wearing the uniform enough indication that I'm in the Army?

Yes... and no.

The ASR itself has little meaning, but purpose behind it is sound. Back before the ASR was created, during the Cold War, draftee soldiers were getting sent to Germany and were being awarded German awards like the GAFET and the Schutzenschnur but could not wear them because regulations stated Foreign decorations could only be worn in conjunction with at least one (1) US decoration.

Since this was also before the Army Achievement Medal was created, most soldiers didn't see their first decoration until their Good Conduct medal was awarded at 3 years, which most draftees never saw, getting out at 2 years.

So the Army created the ASR, the most minor of decorations, so that those German (and other Foreign awards) could actually be worn when they were presented.

I'm not buying that. Not a'tall.

The last "Cold War" draftee to go to Germany without at least one US award was probably in 1960, maybe 1961, when the NDSM started to be awarded again following a break since the mid 1950's. But the ASR didn't come along until 1981. Are you really trying to convince anyone that they came up with a ribbon then to solve a problem that hadn't been around for 20 years?

And...point of order. ASR isn't a "decoration."

[Mitchell 1969]

In our squadron all promotions are handled during promotion night. Cadet or Senior - makes no difference.

In the year I've been around though, I have not see any medals being presented to anyone. Is that supposed to be done in a ceremony also? Maybe the same ceremony as many of the cadet achievements confer grade as well as a ribbon/medal. No?

Some Squadrons do and some do not. Same with Group HQ and at Wing HQ I do not recall anyone getting promoted.

The only medals we have is SMV, BMV and the DSA, which is usually presented at the Wing Conference. The Cadets can also get the AFA award which consists of a medal to present along with the certificate. That is one the Cadets like.

A CAP career can last over 70 years. But somehow, the idea that people might like to leave behind medals as a legacy, or hang them on a wall, has escaped notice. Meanwhile, JROTC has full-sized medals, some of which are presented within days of turning in uniforms after their 3 or 4 (max) years.  Seems...odd.

I'd probably buy a set. Maybe units would even spring for a few, even if only as loaners for photo ops. ("Congratulations, Chester, proud to know you. Turn that way, smile...that was great. See Milton after the meeting, he'll give you a free ribbon, on the squadron, and an order form if you want your own medal. He'll also take that one back, don't spill anything on it...")

[UH60guy]

I'd like to see something like that for the "retiring" guys from CAP. It's very common in the military, but how often do the other senior members chip in a few bucks to put together a nice display case for someone moving on? In this case it's more of a cultural change that could be easily implemented- it only takes one person to make the suggestion for the pooling of cash for an order from Vanguard and a trip to the frame store based on a departing member's easily looked-up eServices record.

It would be nice to have the full size medals, but a nice display could still be made with the mini medals, skill badges, and possibly an accompanying ribbon rack (Ultra Thin makes a great product easily usable for display) to catch the awards that don't have a mini-medal.

[ColonelJack]

Here's my (already-well-known) take on the topic, with an additional plea to our official supplier.  (Full disclosure - I posted this in the "Tribal Logo" thread in the Lobby.)

Attention Vanguard:

Do you want more of my money?  Of course you do.

Here's an idea ... offer something that I would buy.

For example (and this isn't the only example) ... why not offer full-size versions of the miniature medals?  I would most definitely buy those ... and so would many of the Senior Members of CAP. 

I know we don't wear them.  Members who earn the Distinguished Service Award or the Silver or Bronze Medals of Valor don't wear them after they're presented either.  But they'd look great in a shadowbox.  And at a suggested cost of $20 - $25 a pop, you'd get a good chunk of change just from me - look at the rack in my signature block and you'll see.  You're looking at $360 - $450 at the bare minimum.  And I'm not the only one who'd pay for them.

Don't offer me crap like this "tribal" logo or any other stuff you keep putting in your "New Items" part of the website.  Offer me something I want.

It's Marketing 101, folks, not rocket science.

Jack

[ColonelJack]

It would be nice to have the full size medals, but a nice display could still be made with the mini medals, skill badges, and possibly an accompanying ribbon rack (Ultra Thin makes a great product easily usable for display) to catch the awards that don't have a mini-medal.

The mini-medal idea isn't bad, but I (and a lot of other folks) would prefer to have full-size in such a display.  Just aesthetics, I suppose.

Jack

[ColonelJack]

A CAP career can last over 70 years. But somehow, the idea that people might like to leave behind medals as a legacy, or hang them on a wall, has escaped notice. Meanwhile, JROTC has full-sized medals, some of which are presented within days of turning in uniforms after their 3 or 4 (max) years.  Seems...odd.

^^ This.  Right here.  A bloody fantastic reason for offering the full-size gongs.  Occasions to wear the full-size medals in the Real Military­® are few and far between ... but you get the medals.  Why don't we do that?  I have the full-size versions of the medals I won in JROTC back in the early 70s...

I'd probably buy a set. Maybe units would even spring for a few, even if only as loaners for photo ops. ("Congratulations, Chester, proud to know you. Turn that way, smile...that was great. See Milton after the meeting, he'll give you a free ribbon, on the squadron, and an order form if you want your own medal. He'll also take that one back, don't spill anything on it...")

Excellent way to use them for members!  National HQ, I know you read this forum ... you're hearing what some of your members want!

Jack

[Shuman 14]

The one that boggles my mind there is the "Army Service Ribbon." Isn't wearing the uniform enough indication that I'm in the Army?

The ASR itself has little meaning...

There is the understatement of the evening.

No more understated than the Air Force Training Ribbon.