memebership problem

[MIKE]

Cadet becomes a senior... Crisis averted.

[c/LTCOLorbust]

See I think thats wrong, Its more wrong if those two people don't show it in anyway when in uniform or at CAP events.

[BillB]

And if the cadet is a C/SMSgt, you want him/her to turn senior without earning the Mitchell, becoming a senior with NO rank? To forego scholarships available only to cadets?  No wonder membership is dropping, the inflexibility of CAP to understand the real world is carried to the extreme.  As long as there is no PDA in uniform, or it effects the operating of the Squadron, what the relationship is between consenting adults is none of CAP's business.

[shorning]

Well...it's all a matter of priorities now isn't it?  You can't have everything in the world.

[NIN]

Friend of mine was a Capt, former Spaatz cadet.  His girfriend was a 19 or 20-year old C/Capt. They'd been dating for some time as I recall, but he was still a senior when they met.

We're at my old group CO's house for his birthday party and he hands her CAPF 12s and a pen, looks at her boyfriend and says (I'm not making this up) "The signature goes on before [insert a euphemism that I won't repeat in front of the cadets]"

We all busted up laughing, but she did carry around that filled-out CAPF 12 with the commander's signature on it until she turned 21.  (Actually, she might have gone Flight Officer right after that. I honestly don't remember. This was like 1990.. I lost a number of those brain cells at Fort Hood the next year..)

[Psicorp]

*grin*

Too funny, sir.

On the flip side of all of this, I can't imagine how depressing it would be for a cadet to turn senior in order to make a relationship be in accordance with S.O.P. and then have a break up.  If the cadet was over 18 he/she gets is stuck with being a S.M..   Priorities, priorities.

[Heather]

glad that is settled but I'm still not sure on my situation

[MIKE]

Well... CAPR 52-16 just passed, so unless they changed some wording since it was up for comment...

[Heather]

do you have a link for it? That would be helpful!

[ncc1912]

Question, My girl friend who is 18 is thinking about joining but she would have to join as a Senior member, are there any Regs against a senior member and cadet dating as a long as no one can tell at a CAP activity or in uniform? I am 19 but want to stay in the cadet program till 21... can this happen or would I have to become a Senior member or her not join?

Back to the issue at hand:

Colonel, no reasonable senior member is going to have a problem with what you are doing regardless of rank or membership category as long as you keep it professional.

That being said, don't misunderstand what fraternization is.  Take it from a active duty Air Force guy, in the military and among CAP senior members it is OK for a major to date a first lieutenant as long as the major is not in the lieutenant's chain-of-command.  If they're both staff officers (not line), such as communications and personnel, how cares?  It is OK (but extremely rare) for a chief master sergeant to date a airman first class.  As long as the chief is not in a position to directly supervise the airman no conflict of interest is implied.

Among CAP cadets the same holds true, however, in my opinion, it's OK for a second lieutenant to date a technical sergeant as long as one is not placed in a position over the other.  Our squadrons, for the most part, are far too small and cadets advance way too fast to try to eliminate/prevent enlisted/officer relationships among cadets.  Senior cadets and senior members should be quick to squash issues relating to the known relationships among cadets such as cadets trying to pull rank over their girl/boyfriends.  Squadron commanders and cadet commanders should be observant enough and keep couples separate in the organization of the squadron.

CAP has went one step further, though; senior member/cadet.  It is highly unlikely that any two cadets dating each other are going to be born on precisely the same day.  Therefore, if they are still dating when one becomes a senior member, then that new senior member has (technically) started off his/her new career in violation of the regulations.

When we are referring to a relationship that spans less than 18-24 months in age difference, then I think it should be CAP's policy to turn the other cheek when it is a pre-existing relationship when there are no obvious signs of fraternization when in uniform and/or at meetings or activities.  On the other hand, anything more than 24 months should be taken with additional concern (more than just the regulations), especially when we are talking about 15-20 year olds.

Married couples who wish to work together within the unit:  Easy... for example, make one the personnel officer and one the administration officer.  Neither one supervises the other and their positions are supervised directly by the commander or a deputy.

Not to invoke an sigh of expected boredom, but when I was a cadet, at the age of 15, I was dating a girl 13 months older than me whom later joined CAP.  On her 21st birthday, she became a senior member and, of course, I was still one month short of 20.  Needless to say, no one was going to question our aged relationship or ask us to discontinue it as long as we kept it out of CAP, at least for the next 13 months.   For the seven years I was a cadet no one could ever tell that we were dating unless they asked.  My squadron commander's attitude was that 'as long as the only CAP members who know about our relationship were in our squadron and we don't bring it to the meetings and activities, we were golden.'  ...an opinion I wish every squadron commander shared.

Your best option would be to discuss it with your SQ CC and see what he/she says.  His/Her support is ultimately what you are going to have to have.  It is not a good idea to come to your commander with a problem unless you have a solution in hand, so if I were in your position I would suggest to your commander, that your girlfriend (as a senior) not be placed in a position to supervise you.  If she can join as a cadet, you/your cadet commander should not put yourself/you in a position to supervise her.  This would probably be better for your relationship, as well.

Good Luck and Simper Vigilans!

[Heather]

"It is OK (but extremely rare) for a chief master sergeant to date a airman first class.  As long as the chief is not in a position to directly supervise the airman no conflict of interest is implied." - quote from ncc1912


ok...I think this answers my question...thanks!