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CAP Talk  |  Cadet Programs  |  Encampments & NCSAs  |  Topic: Phones at NESA?
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Author Topic: Phones at NESA?  (Read 963 times)
diegoochoaaa
Recruit

Posts: 28

« on: April 09, 2017, 01:14:18 PM »

I'm attending NESA this year and I'm wondering if we can bring and use our phones at NESA.

Thanks!
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ProdigalJim
Seasoned Member

Posts: 499
Unit: MER-VA-082

Aviation Week
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2017, 04:27:11 PM »

From pages 8 and 9 of the NESA policies and procedures document, which is on the NESA website:

"F. Telephones
     Regular telephone times will be established for participants to call home at their own expense. Though we have a mission number assigned for the duration of the activity, the budget does not include communications expenses to pay for students to call home on this mission or out of activity fees. Participants are encouraged to call home and let parents, guardians, or spouses know how they are doing. Telephone usage at other than established times by cadets will be with the permission of the Academy Director or Commandant only.
     A phone number to reach our NESA Command Post will be given to participants on arrival and will be posted on our web site after the school begins at http://nesa.cap.gov/. This contact number is unavailable until we are on site because we are not guaranteed specific buildings for use until the advance party arrives to sign for them. In the event of an emergency, the activity director may be reached at (317) 289-6087.
     Cell phones will be required to be off or silent except during designated free time to avoid disturbing students attending NESA classes."

Link to the document is below:

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/52f294c6e4b0bede38b4d35c/t/584f54f7cd0f688bd1b2add5/1481594104016/2017+NESA+Policies+and+Procedures+Guide.pdf
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Jim Mathews, Maj., CAP
Commander, VAWG Group 3
My Mitchell Has Four Digits...
husker
Forum Regular

Posts: 150
Unit: NHQ-007

« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2017, 09:17:00 AM »

Thank you Jim for passing this along to the cadet.  I should probably revise/update/expand on that policy a bit for next year.

I would prefer that no cadet actually bring a phone, but that is not realistic.  I do have strict "no cell phone in the classroom or in the field" rule - I want participants to be paying attention to the academics, field work, and their situational awareness, not SnapTwitInstaBook or whatever they are into. 

We have become so psychologically attached to these devices, its a "tough sell."   I make it clear during the GSAR inbriefing that cell phones are not allowed during those times - if someone needs to call home and check in while in the field, we make it clear we will provide a way for them to do so.  It is extremely rare that a cadet will take us up on that offer.  We certainly do make arrangements for senior members, most have work and family responsibilities that require them to remain in contact.  I have one of those 24x7x365 jobs - my work calls me regularly during the two weeks of NESA.

My biggest problem is cell phone use after "lights out."

I would be interested if their are any other NCSA staff members (or even encampment directors) here - what is your policy on cell phones?
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Michael Long, Lt Col CAP
Deputy Director, National Emergency Services Academy
nesa.cap.gov
mlong (at) nesa.cap.gov
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award
***
Posts: 28,063

« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2017, 09:40:13 AM »

I would be interested if their are any other NCSA staff members (or even encampment directors) here - what is your policy on cell phones?

Encampment here - With the exception of the top 3 exec staff, who need them operationally (and have a reasonable lane to stay within),
cell phones are turned off and put into contraband envelopes, returned during outprocess.  Cadets who need to contact home do so with a Senior's phone.

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"The man who does more than he is paid for will soon be paid for more than he does." - Napoleon Hill.
The contents of this post are Copyright 2017 by eclipse. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

Brad
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 778
Unit: MER-SC-020

« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2017, 09:51:03 AM »

I would be interested if their are any other NCSA staff members (or even encampment directors) here - what is your policy on cell phones?

Communications didn't have any issues with it that I observed last year, mainly because if we weren't doing practical work or classroom work or supporting your guys, Colonel, it was a lot of "hurry up and wait."

See you in July, sir!
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Brad Lee
Maj, CAP
Assistant Director of Communications
SCWG
K4RMN
Luis R. Ramos
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,530

« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2017, 10:40:44 AM »

What did people do before cell phones?

 :-\
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Squadron Administrative Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer
kcebnaes
Member

Posts: 99
Unit: GLR-OH-064

« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2017, 10:48:00 AM »

What did people do before cell phones?

 :-\

Smoke signals! Telegraphs! Yelling really loud!
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Maj Sean Beck
Ohio Wing
Group VI Commander
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award
***
Posts: 28,063

« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2017, 10:50:11 AM »

To be fair, it's not the phones it's the !@#$% advertising platforms that are addicting
"information slot machines" (to paraphrase 60 Minutes). 

It's got kids, especially, on a constant endorphin drip  while also feeding narcissism and
the "Fear of Missing Out".  Kids are so worried about "other" and "next" they miss "now.

I've had a cell phone in my pocket since the late 90's, and very little has changed in regards
to how I use it - work and staying in touch but no drip, because the people I need to help or hang with
are generally in front of me, and I could not give less of a rip about what some guy I went to high school
with, and haven't talked to in 30 years, had for lunch.
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"The man who does more than he is paid for will soon be paid for more than he does." - Napoleon Hill.
The contents of this post are Copyright 2017 by eclipse. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

Luis R. Ramos
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,530

« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2017, 11:02:23 AM »

But they never did that while a meeting/encampment/other activity is going on! What changed?

 >:D
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Squadron Administrative Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award
***
Posts: 28,063

« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2017, 11:16:45 AM »

But they never did that while a meeting/encampment/other activity is going on! What changed?

The world - dial back 10-15 years and it was just as likely a cadet's entire circle >was< CAP,
or at least a significant portion of it.

This current generation of cadets doesn't know a disconnected world - back that same time frame,
the tech was out of the reach of all but he parents.  with cheap phone service, all bu ubiquitous Wifi,
and lots of used tech in the secondary market, every kid has a phone, and a lot of parent's are clueless
as to what their kids are doing, or the risks involved in addictive tech use by adolescents.

Like alcohol and cannabis (among other things), use by fully-baked (heh) adults is a different equation from
a developing mind. Pathways are formed which cannot be undone easily.
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"The man who does more than he is paid for will soon be paid for more than he does." - Napoleon Hill.
The contents of this post are Copyright 2017 by eclipse. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

jeders
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,010

« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2017, 11:28:14 AM »

I would be interested if their are any other NCSA staff members (or even encampment directors) here - what is your policy on cell phones?

NBB - One last call home before in-processing and then they go in the contraband bag, that goes for all cadets including staff. They get them back for a few hours on flight night out and a couple of hours Sunday evening half way through the event.

TXWG Encampment - They go in the contraband bag during in-processing and don't come back out until out-processing, again, that goes for all cadets including staff.
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If you are confident in you abilities and experience, whether someone else is impressed is irrelevant. - Eclipse
Blanding
Recruit

Posts: 21
Unit: MER-VA-102

« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2017, 08:57:23 AM »

...or the risks involved in addictive tech use by adolescents.

Like alcohol and cannabis (among other things), use by fully-baked (heh) adults is a different equation from
a developing mind. Pathways are formed which cannot be undone easily.

That's a pretty big assertion; do you have some peer reviewed evidence handy to support your hypothesis?

For the record, the same general fears were levied on the printing press and radio...
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Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award
***
Posts: 28,063

« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2017, 10:09:09 AM »

...or the risks involved in addictive tech use by adolescents.

Like alcohol and cannabis (among other things), use by fully-baked (heh) adults is a different equation from
a developing mind. Pathways are formed which cannot be undone easily.

That's a pretty big assertion; do you have some peer reviewed evidence handy to support your hypothesis?

Which one?

Cell phones?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5076301/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4291831/

http://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/5/1/e006748

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0747563214007626

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23981147 (Summary of the below)
http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/abs/10.1089/cyber.2012.0260

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4668509/

http://www.e-chnr.org/journal/view.php?number=1173


Or Cannabis and Alcohol?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3930618/

https://teens.drugabuse.gov/drug-facts/marijuana

http://www.apa.org/monitor/2015/11/marijuana-brain.aspx

https://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/arh283/125-132.htm

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3149806/

For the record, the same general fears were levied on the printing press and radio...

Not a fair comparison, both may be conversationally similar in regards to their societal
effects on information sharing and gathering, not to mention the way they may have disrupted
society, but neither provided the chemical hits that a cell phone and similar technology provides on the
scale they do, nor were they being exploited at the micro scale with the mountains of personal data
stored and exploited on everyone on the planet, making the hits harder and faster.

There were and are practical physical barriers to distribution and use of those technologies which do not
exist for mobile tech and PCs.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/brain-wise/201209/why-were-all-addicted-texts-twitter-and-google

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2012/07/exploiting-the-neuroscience-of-internet-addiction/259820/
« Last Edit: April 12, 2017, 10:15:39 AM by Eclipse » Logged

"The man who does more than he is paid for will soon be paid for more than he does." - Napoleon Hill.
The contents of this post are Copyright 2017 by eclipse. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

Blanding
Recruit

Posts: 21
Unit: MER-VA-102

« Reply #13 on: April 13, 2017, 10:57:25 AM »

...or the risks involved in addictive tech use by adolescents.

Like alcohol and cannabis (among other things), use by fully-baked (heh) adults is a different equation from
a developing mind. Pathways are formed which cannot be undone easily.

That's a pretty big assertion; do you have some peer reviewed evidence handy to support your hypothesis?

Which one?

Cell phones?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5076301/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4291831/

http://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/5/1/e006748

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0747563214007626

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23981147 (Summary of the below)
http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/abs/10.1089/cyber.2012.0260

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4668509/

http://www.e-chnr.org/journal/view.php?number=1173


Or Cannabis and Alcohol?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3930618/

https://teens.drugabuse.gov/drug-facts/marijuana

http://www.apa.org/monitor/2015/11/marijuana-brain.aspx

https://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/arh283/125-132.htm

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3149806/

I'm mainly interested in the cell phone argument; I'll leave cannabis and alcohol alone, since I doubt anyone is advocating we allow those things to be part of our program.

In reviewing your literature against my null hypothesis: "There is no link between cell phone usage and increased risk of developmental disorder in adolescents" I've made some general observations about each.

As a summary, I've found most of the papers you linked were some type of ethnological research that classify / categorize device users into types (light, heavy, addicted, etc.) and ask what types of physiological / psychological issues they might be experiencing (loss of sleep, headaches, etc.) however, with this type of data it is exceedingly difficult to find powerful enough data to reject the null hypothesis above.

I can show that people who use cell phones are younger than the average American, but surely the fact that they use a cell phone didn't *cause* their "youngness" right?

The same principle therefore applies to headaches. Unless I examine a sample population for the effect of cell phone screen use on the prevalence of headaches, I cannot state the cell phone was the cause of a headache.

The primary focus of my skepticism centers on the absence of cell phone addiction in the current DSM-V. I'm under no illusion that new disorders are impossible, but until a diagnosable condition exists all I hear (to be a bit facetious) are people who don't like change complaining about the cell-phone carrying youths.

Thoughts on your articles:

1: Lit review with no hypothesis or research conducted; they imply cell phone usage is problematic without testing to the contrary (which is of course, not the purpose of a lit review). Describes usage of cell phones as "abuse" and states there is "consensus about the existence of cell-phone addiction" - yet (again) cell phone addiction is not described in the DSM-V. In this way, cell phones are about as psychologically addicting as cars are to commuters who drive to work.

2: This paper describes a survey of college students asking how much they use a phone. The conclusion is that college students use their phones a lot. This hardly disproves my hypothesis.

3: I have a slight objection to the methodology of this study; it's a decent ethnographic study looking at behaviors in adolescents, but it has limitations. Specifically (from their discussion section)
-They can't draw inferences about directionality (so some might use electronics to help fall asleep)
-Their question phrasing promotes overlap in the data (daytime vs. nighttime usage)
-They couldn't rule out school-related work as the reason for electronic device usage
-Sleep measurements based on self-reports, subject to bias (especially sleep onset latency, their main measure)
-They specifically say emotional and behavioral problems were not assessed.


4: "We did not find an influence of emotional intelligence on habitual or addictive smartphone behavior, and a failure of self-regulation seems to cause a higher risk of addictive smartphone behavior." This effort (another survey) asked people how much they use smartphones. I can't find any evidence to support rejecting my original hypothesis here.

5: So the researchers catalogued (since it's a British study) usage habits among teenagers and then drew a line down a chart to describe some of those users as "problematic" according to a scale of measurement. This sole purpose of this study appears to be to confirm that British teenagers are similar to Spanish teenagers, and not to make any specific assertions about health.

6: This paper is frustrating. In their intro they cite other literature as "Evidence...regarding the negative physical and psychological consequences of its excessive use" and "equivalent to substance dependence" yet the papers cited to show this evidence use language like:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15738692
"Drawing potential predictors from the addiction literature, this study sought to predict usage and, specifically, problematic mobile phone use..." with the conclusion of the paper: a set of identified "groups that should be targeted [for] intervention" - based on what evidence?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24876797
One citation is a proposal for including "nomophobia" (proposed name for fear of being out of cell phone contact) in DSM-V. Full text isn't available, but this paper is probably the most interesting and likely to support your assertion. In their abstract they say:

"Even though nomophobia has not been included in the DSM-V, much more attention is paid to the psychopathological effects of the new media, and the interest in this topic will increase in the near future, together with the attention and caution not to hypercodify as pathological normal behaviors." - I agree, but until we have that evidence and the condition is well understood, it'll be difficult to codify the real impact of high usage.


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19228576
Other cited works by this paper are called things like "Adverse effects of excessive mobile phone use" where the research design is:
-Collect data about usage
-Collect data about physiological conditions
-Draw inferences from those two pieces of data
-Conclude: "...its impact on psychology and health should be discussed among the students to prevent the harmful effects of mobile phone use" What harmful effects? The paper did not show correlation between usage and harmful effects.

7: This survey data shows what segment of a sampled population is "addicted" to cell phones, but draws no inferences to physiological / psychological impact. In their conclusion, they describe the purpose of the paper to help drive "cell phone addiction prevention" program focus areas.

For the record, the same general fears were levied on the printing press and radio...

Not a fair comparison, both may be conversationally similar in regards to their societal
effects on information sharing and gathering, not to mention the way they may have disrupted
society, but neither provided the chemical hits that a cell phone and similar technology provides on the
scale they do, nor were they being exploited at the micro scale with the mountains of personal data
stored and exploited on everyone on the planet, making the hits harder and faster.

Hey so I agree that we as humans like dopamine hits; I mean.. I'm kind of ok with that, since it keeps us alive!
I also am unsatisfied with the level of exploitation that takes place with companies / groups who target adolescent users of internet devices.

I think on those topics we're in agreement. What I disagree with is the assertion that cell phone use is physically / emotionally damaging our cadets. I do apologize for not really being clear in my last post; I appreciate the time you took to find those articles. I like the conversation!
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