Potential Homeland Security Taskings

[SARMedTech]

As many people have pointed out, CAP is becoming obsolete in many ways, due to technology, etc. What are some possible taskings that we could be given if we were "adopted" by the Department of Homeland Security. We are prohibited from LE other than point and get out of the way, but could that change, and if so how? Also, how if we were to get involved in HLS or Border Patrol, would self defense of CAP members become an issue?  Look forward to hearing what you all think.

[jb512]

We need to push to keep up with technology.  There is only so much that can be done with a C172 and a camera.  Continue to upgrade systems and aircraft as we have been like the G1000, ARCHER, and the like.  Start researching any and all possible avenues to use the planes we have and to progress into the new.  If we don't keep up, we'll be left behind.

Border patrol is a perfect use for us that we can currently handle with what we have.  Start a roster rotating aircraft and crews to different locations on the border, shorelines, wherever, and pump a little money into it.  The old days of spotting marijuana fields for CD are all but gone so we have to again, keep up with the times.

I'm sure there's a lot more things out there that we can do.  Planes are sitting on the ground not being used.

As far as self-defense, I'm not sure I see an issue with allowing people who can legally carry concealed weapons to do so.  It doesn't really matter what kind of clothes you're wearing if you have to use deadly force to defend yourself from a threat.  Make sure that the officers volunteering for HD duty are aware that they may possibly run into dangerous situations, train them for it ahead of time, and let them do their job. 

It's better to have it and not need it than..... you all know how the saying goes.

[SARMedTech]

We need to push to keep up with technology.  There is only so much that can be done with a C172 and a camera.  Continue to upgrade systems and aircraft as we have been like the G1000, ARCHER, and the like.  Start researching any and all possible avenues to use the planes we have and to progress into the new.  If we don't keep up, we'll be left behind.

Border patrol is a perfect use for us that we can currently handle with what we have.  Start a roster rotating aircraft and crews to different locations on the border, shorelines, wherever, and pump a little money into it.  The old days of spotting marijuana fields for CD are all but gone so we have to again, keep up with the times.

I'm sure there's a lot more things out there that we can do.  Planes are sitting on the ground not being used.

As far as self-defense, I'm not sure I see an issue with allowing people who can legally carry concealed weapons to do so.  It doesn't really matter what kind of clothes you're wearing if you have to use deadly force to defend yourself from a threat.  Make sure that the officers volunteering for HD duty are aware that they may possibly run into dangerous situations, train them for it ahead of time, and let them do their job. 

It's better to have it and not need it than..... you all know how the saying goes.

The marijuana spotting days of CD may be dwindling, but I can tell you from experience that you can spot the signs of a meth lab from the air just as easily. Just look for chemical cannisters and jugs, etc. This is an example of where CAP has to keep up with the times. Unfortunately, the new generations of things like counter narcotics, new technologies, etc have passed  us by and we are, as you say, still left snapping photos with the trusty Canon. With the aforementioned meth labs, you can fly over high risk areas, like trailer parks (not to be insensitive, thats just where most of my meth lab gone wrong calls have been) with a FLIR attached to the plane and a meth lab will light up like the 4th of July.

I know I raised the question of self-defense during HLS missions, but you cant really suggest that CAP members carry firearms simply because they are licensed to do so, since regs forbid the carrying of weapons of every sort including firearms, and I believe things like pepper spray, etc. Perhaps if it happened that we adopted more HLS taskings we could adopt less lethals like the Arwin gun, pepper ball launchers, etc, but there would have to be some fundamental re-writes done of our charter, etc. I think we would have to do some fancy work with 10 USC to allow us to get into the law enforcement business. I recently saw a USCG commander on TV talking about the myriad missions carried out by the CG. He said that if they had remained purely "Title 10" they wouldnt be able to do but a small percentage of what they do now.

The fact of the matter is, that with new membership, new ways of thinking and new types of education of members (ie those who got alot of the "skills" they use in CAP in the military vs people like me working on our masters in HLS related fields) we are opening broad new horizons. Unfortunately at the same time, we have members who not only think they hear the death knell of CAP, but are the ones ringing the darn bell in the first place. If the membership at large could put as much into developing new work for us to do, or simply recognizing what is out there already for us to do if we simply develop new training and education for our members as they do into saying we are going the way of the dodo, we would have little to worry about in terms of extinction.

When I was looking into joining the USCGAUX, I had the privilege to speak to a rather high ranking CG Commander who told me that the reason that the USCG and by extention its Auxiliary are flourishing is because its membership is constantly working on and experimenting with new ways to be of use and then running them up the chain and actually getting them approved. What if we started to work with organizations like the EPA and did photographing flyovers of coast lines and water ways to conduct pollution studies. What if our ground pounders got out there like the CGAUX and took water readings to measure contamination. Perhaps more creative joint taskings with the CGAUX could jolt us out of this slump.

So we arent throwing depth charges at subs anymore. We have the assets and the imagination. If we can get rid of the GOB mindset and hold meetings that are essentially think tanks and say to the young imaginative officer and cadets: "What do you think we could be doing using our current resources that we are not doing? What uses could their be for our planes? Could we expand that model rocketry program to include sending up rockets in conjunction with organizations like NOAA to take weather readings?" Its all there and ripe for the pickings. We just need to follow through with one of our credos and truly go "Where imagination takes flight." Lets start issuing citations, commendations and ribbons for officers who are doing graduate level work who write papers that show how CAP could be used. Let us move into the era of research instead of trying to retrofit our WWII era missions into something of value today. Thats where we are running into the trouble. What if  each Wing and/or Squadron appointed a USCGAUX Liaison Officer to constantly be working with them to develop new ideas. I have to say that right now, some of them dont think a whole lot of us or really know what we do, but its because we spend our time worrying about uniforms and medals and this shirt vs that shirt instead how we can be of use in a technologically evolving country. One where the war isnt about bombs but about technology, etc. Instead of training members in Morse code as in days gone by, lets put them together with AD USAF for training in cryptology, follow the USCGAUXs lead and develop and Translator Corp, develop a medical asset.

I know there will be any outcry when this post publishes about "where do we get the money?" Really quite simple. We start setting up at community events and holding community events of our own. Auctions of old CAP memorabilia, etc to collectors, auctions at community events where the winners could win an o-ride in a plane or balloon. And breath new life into some of the old programs and operations. I am a newbie so I havent been around long enough to know what they all are, but they are ripe for the picking. CAP wont die if the membership follows our motto of Semper Vigilans! Not just vigilance against the German and Japanese enemies of WWII, but internal vigilance and a restoration of pride in our organization and its heritage. We have been around since 1 week before Pearl Harbor. Lets get out there and let the public know that "we are from the government and we are here to help." Lets get started with environmental actions....Why should the USCGAUX have all the fun. Lets let the public see us in CAP jump suits and BDUs out there picking up trash and cans (and making money for doing so.) What if a squadron had a weekend where members in BDUs collected cans and bottles, took them to the local recycling center and collected the money to go into the Squadrons coffers to acquire new and innovative equipment and computer softwear, the best comms equipment on the market, better battle rattle for our members.

Yes, CAP is a little sick at the moment. But we are far from terminal as some members' recent posts would have us believe. As that amazing USCG Commander at Station Calumet Harbor told me...we need new blood, fresh imaginations, etc. If we are to truly expect our USAF parents to support us and give us new and better resources, we have to show them that we are using what we have and not just sitting around waiting to turn off ELTs. Theres no reason why our SAR capabilities cannot be put into searching for lost children when an Amber Alert is issued. No reason why CAP couldnt train or utilize members who scuba dive for environmental clean up and studies along with searching water ways for lost persons. What if our ground teams uptrained to take an even more active role in supporting wild fire suppression efforts working side by side with smoke jumpers, etc. Lets get meetings with those non-profit agencies that might need things transported across the country and say "how could our fleet of a/c be of use to you." Lets put our PAOs to even better use than the wonderful work they already do by giving them staff to liaise with community leaders. Imagine a couple of well squared away officers in service dress, a rack of ribbons on their chests and badges shining going to meet with Mayors and governors with prepared spiral bound handouts entitled "CAP: A New Era of Service." I also happen to think that the addition of the U.S to our name, when done properly instead of snuck in the back door will give further brand recognition when meeting with public officials. Lets get meetings with pro-CAP Senators and Congressmen and find out what they would like us to help them with in their districts around the country. Lets ramp up our transport of medical supplies into a regular function instead of just when asked. What if CAP aircrews participated in regular "Life Flights" to transfer much need blood, plasma and other medical supplies to underserved areas.

Its out there folks, we just have to seize the opportunity.  I look forward to your responses and once again, thanks for letting this SMWOG have the soap box for a while.  Semper Vigilans and Long Live the Civil Air Patrol!

[capchiro]

This is just off the cuff and hasn't been given much thought yet, but how about some radio controlled work by some squadrons for border observation?  I know the military is getting into that big time, but their aircraft are also very expensive.  Could we develop, design, and have squadrons build and operate radio controlled aircraft with video cameras for surveillance?  We have the commo equipment to stay in touch with the LEO's to make reports.  Just a thought.  I could see some comp and cadet squadrons and maybe even some senior squadrons working on building RC aircraft togther and learning and training how to fly and work with them.  sounds like a retro project, but perhaps that is what we are all about, doing the little things, much cheaper than the Air Force can.  What thinks ye??

[SARMedTech]

This is just off the cuff and hasn't been given much thought yet, but how about some radio controlled work by some squadrons for border observation?  I know the military is getting into that big time, but their aircraft are also very expensive.  Could we develop, design, and have squadrons build and operate radio controlled aircraft with video cameras for surveillance?  We have the commo equipment to stay in touch with the LEO's to make reports.  Just a thought.  I could see some comp and cadet squadrons and maybe even some senior squadrons working on building RC aircraft togther and learning and training how to fly and work with them.  sounds like a retro project, but perhaps that is what we are all about, doing the little things, much cheaper than the Air Force can.  What thinks ye??

Sounds like a better concept than us rolling over and playing dead because we are afraid to try to keep up with Mama Blue.

[Major Lord]

This is just off the cuff and hasn't been given much thought yet, but how about some radio controlled work by some squadrons for border observation?  I know the military is getting into that big time, but their aircraft are also very expensive.  Could we develop, design, and have squadrons build and operate radio controlled aircraft with video cameras for surveillance?  We have the commo equipment to stay in touch with the LEO's to make reports.  Just a thought.  I could see some comp and cadet squadrons and maybe even some senior squadrons working on building RC aircraft togther and learning and training how to fly and work with them.  sounds like a retro project, but perhaps that is what we are all about, doing the little things, much cheaper than the Air Force can.  What thinks ye??

I love the idea of CAP ROVs! I would love to take a helicopter and put a basic direction finder with downlink telemetry. A ground team could fly it up a couple of thousand feet and increase their ELT detection range by miles! The COMM guys will of course tell us that we must use CAP frequencies and NTIA approved transmitters, which would kill the deal. There are no allocations for video transmitters on our frequencies (did I just violate an OPSEC rule?), license free stuff won't do what we need, and ham stuff ( which would be perfect) is off limits to us, and SARmedtech, I am pretty sure that arming the ROV's would be unacceptable to the Air Force 

Capt. Lord

[SARMedTech]

This is just off the cuff and hasn't been given much thought yet, but how about some radio controlled work by some squadrons for border observation?  I know the military is getting into that big time, but their aircraft are also very expensive.  Could we develop, design, and have squadrons build and operate radio controlled aircraft with video cameras for surveillance?  We have the commo equipment to stay in touch with the LEO's to make reports.  Just a thought.  I could see some comp and cadet squadrons and maybe even some senior squadrons working on building RC aircraft togther and learning and training how to fly and work with them.  sounds like a retro project, but perhaps that is what we are all about, doing the little things, much cheaper than the Air Force can.  What thinks ye??

I love the idea of CAP ROVs! I would love to take a helicopter and put a basic direction finder with downlink telemetry. A ground team could fly it up a couple of thousand feet and increase their ELT detection range by miles! The COMM guys will of course tell us that we must use CAP frequencies and NTIA approved transmitters, which would kill the deal. There are no allocations for video transmitters on our frequencies (did I just violate an OPSEC rule?), license free stuff won't do what we need, and ham stuff ( which would be perfect) is off limits to us, and SARmedtech, I am pretty sure that arming the ROV's would be unacceptable to the Air Force 

Capt. Lord

Yeah, youre right...they can be such a kill-joy  . All I want is boonies and the new H and K 4.46 issued to each graded officer. Is that so much to ask? Sheesh.

[JohnKachenmeister]

HLS missions that can be flown by light fixed-wing aircraft:

1.  Radiological monitoring over ports of entry, major highways, etc.

2.  Patrol of key infrastructure assets upon increased threat level, observe and direct in ground-based Law Enforcement or other assets.

3.  Route recon. of evacuation routes from cities, before and during the evacuation.

4.  Route recon of military convoy routes in CONUS.

5.  Border patrol.

6.  Coastal patrol (Atlantic coast of FL and entire Gulf coast, for persons trying to boat in from various Carribbean nations).

7.  Rapid movement of FEMA, DHS, and other officials.

8.  Rapid resupply of small arms ammunition for NG and other troops involved in HS missions. 

9.  Rapid movement of spare parts for repair of military or other government equipment vital to recovery efforts.

Ground missions for CAP:

1.  Operation of Air Base Support, converting civilian airports into temporary airbases in an emergency. 

2.  Traffic control in support of military or FEMA relief convoys.

Give me some time, I'm sure I can come up with others.

[RiverAux]

There are two reasons that CG Aux has been able to rapidly expand the scope of missions its members can participate in:
1.  There is no "chain of command".  All the Aux leadership is elected by the members and is much more responsive than CAP leadership.  There is no "Wing King" that can really keep an idea bottled up for very long.  Plus, there is much more turnover in leadership at all levels such that someone with a good idea can probably get themselves in a position to implement it. 
2.  The real decision maker is the CG and they are involved with the Aux at all levels and have developed a level of trust such that they aren't really afraid to approve new taskings for the CG Aux.  CAP and USAF have no such relationship really.  While the AF State Director has a lot of authority over money, they have no real operational control or input into these sorts of things. 

On the flipside, almost all of CAP's potential missions involve working with outside agencies since (except for AF unit augmentation) we're doing about all we can for the AF itself.  In the CG Aux, all of their new missions are within the CG family and are therefore much easier to implement and don't require a lot of MOUs, discussions about payment, etc. 

[Tubacap]

Kach,
I'm fairly certain we do almost all of those already.

Will

[Flying Pig]

You do have to be careful and tread lightly when you talk about taking over certain homeland security roles, especially in areas where there is law enforcement aviation. 

Some of the things John listed in his post, are some of the things we do with our fixed wing and helicopters.  You dont want to start taking food off peoples plates if you know what I mean.....

Otherwise youll find CAP becoming very unpopular in certain locations.  Sorry, thats just the honest truth.

[RiverAux]

Frankly, you're looking at it backward -- DHS is standing up a lot of fixed wing assets to do the sort of stuff that CAP has been doing for a while....they're the ones cutting into our "business".   I'm not saying we could do it all, but DHS right now is a much bigger threat to CAP than the other way around....After all, once they've got hundreds of aircraft assigned to their "Homeland Security Air Wings", they're going to be looking for more stuff to do in order to justify their existence.

[Flying Pig]

Im not talking about DHS.  What I mean is a lot of local law enforcement fly DHS missions.

Im in an interesting situation, considering I am involved in both aspects of the scenario.

[SARMedTech]

There are two reasons that CG Aux has been able to rapidly expand the scope of missions its members can participate in:
1.  There is no "chain of command".  All the Aux leadership is elected by the members and is much more responsive than CAP leadership.  There is no "Wing King" that can really keep an idea bottled up for very long.  Plus, there is much more turnover in leadership at all levels such that someone with a good idea can probably get themselves in a position to implement it. 
2.  The real decision maker is the CG and they are involved with the Aux at all levels and have developed a level of trust such that they aren't really afraid to approve new taskings for the CG Aux.  CAP and USAF have no such relationship really.  While the AF State Director has a lot of authority over money, they have no real operational control or input into these sorts of things. 

On the flipside, almost all of CAP's potential missions involve working with outside agencies since (except for AF unit augmentation) we're doing about all we can for the AF itself.  In the CG Aux, all of their new missions are within the CG family and are therefore much easier to implement and don't require a lot of MOUs, discussions about payment, etc. 

Just as a point of clarification, there are alot of MOUs flying around between the USCG and its AUX. If I wanted to be an EMT for example for a giving CG tasking (and this is based on actual experience) I would have to contact the CG OIC for that tasking and get an MOU stating that I was allowed to provide health and emergency medical services to my flotilla and AD Coasties from that command and that command only, and only during the duration of the tasking. And the reason that the AF doesnt always trust CAP and thus offer us more taskings is that there is not the uniformity of training and experience that exists in the CGAUX. If we could nail that down, they might feel much more comfortable in calling us up and saying hey, could you do so and so.

[RiverAux]

Uh, there aren't really MOUs between the CG and the CG Aux.  There are CG regulations which set out what the CG authorizes the CG Aux to do. 

[SARMedTech]

Uh, there aren't really MOUs between the CG and the CG Aux.  There are CG regulations which set out what the CG authorizes the CG Aux to do. 

Uh, actually, when it comes to the medical operatons/EMT service as I stated, a MOU is required. I already spoke with with a CG CPO in Chicago about this, yesterday actually to find out how their first aide practices differ from ours.

[ZigZag911]

Having HLS as a CAP "Customer" (utilizing us through Northcom /1st AF) is fine.

I would not want to see CAP, as some have suggested on other threads, placed under Dept of HLS....in many respects they are still getting their act together....we'd probably be folded into FEMA, which would introduce its own problems.....I just don't see it.

As for CAP as a "threat" to law enforcement aviation: I've heard this argument a great deal. No one wants to cut into anyone's livelihood; however, realistically virtually no LE agency has unlimited personnel, resources, and budget.

CAP should be augmenting LE aviation assets (and military, and other federal agency) where needed, feasible, and legal. Sometimes the "first responders" are stretched too thin....that's where CAP is supposed to serve as one of the 'force multipliers'.

Put another way....some missions are higher priority than others.....yet even low priority infrastructure oversight, for instance, should not be neglected due to limited paid resources when volunteers are ready, willing, and available to pitch in and take up the slack.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Kach,
I'm fairly certain we do almost all of those already.

Will

I'm not sure.  We certainly have the capability, but in the case of Rad monitoring, we would need some additional equipment.

We cannot direct traffic at this point, which makes convoy coordination more difficult, unless we were to put a CAP officer with a radio as an integral asset of NG Military Police units to coordinate ground support.

We used to fly spare parts for the AF back in the 80's, but I have not heard of us doing so lately.

[RiverAux]

Uh, there aren't really MOUs between the CG and the CG Aux.  There are CG regulations which set out what the CG authorizes the CG Aux to do. 

Uh, actually, when it comes to the medical operatons/EMT service as I stated, a MOU is required. I already spoke with with a CG CPO in Chicago about this, yesterday actually to find out how their first aide practices differ from ours.

This would be more appropriate to discuss at the CG Aux board at military.com, but this just doesn't sound right to me and would be totally different than how the CG runs every other CG Aux program.  Now, if you're talking about as a CAP member trying to do EMT work for the CG Aux, yes an MOU would be required (and unlikely).  But, if you're trying to do it as a CG Aux member, something is messed up and you should go right to the head of the CG Aux medical program (whatever they call it). 

[SARMedTech]

Uh, there aren't really MOUs between the CG and the CG Aux.  There are CG regulations which set out what the CG authorizes the CG Aux to do. 

Uh, actually, when it comes to the medical operatons/EMT service as I stated, a MOU is required. I already spoke with with a CG CPO in Chicago about this, yesterday actually to find out how their first aide practices differ from ours.

This would be more appropriate to discuss at the CG Aux board at military.com, but this just doesn't sound right to me and would be totally different than how the CG runs every other CG Aux program.  Now, if you're talking about as a CAP member trying to do EMT work for the CG Aux, yes an MOU would be required (and unlikely).  But, if you're trying to do it as a CG Aux member, something is messed up and you should go right to the head of the CG Aux medical program (whatever they call it). 

THe USCGAUX has no medical program except for the fact that if a person happens to be an EMT and renders care during an operation and something goes wrong, the cover the liability. Since the USCGAUX has no formal medical program, that is why the MOU is necessary with the CG Commander is necessary is a Flotilla wishes to use a member as an EMT during a CG "Augmentation" or tasking. and that MOU is only valid for that operation or until revoked by the USCG Commander, whichever comes first.

[RiverAux]

Actually there is a growing program whereby CG Aux members work at CG health clinics as doctors, nurses, etc. 

[SARMedTech]

Actually there is a growing program whereby CG Aux members work at CG health clinics as doctors, nurses, etc. 

Yes, there is, but its not like a health care professional just wanders onto a CG Station and works in their clinic. There are higher security clearances required, etc. That being said, the USAF could take a page from the CG/AUX playbook.

[wingnut]

all members of the US Coast Guard Aux. must have a Homeland Security clearence, I think it is fairly close to a secret. Thus when it was implimented the USCGAUX lost between 30% and 40% of their members. Furthermore, Auxiliary members are 'Augmenting" regular coast guardsmen, USCGAUX members cannot and do not carry firearms and they are under the direct supervision of a regular Coast Guard member in most instances. read their regulations, although the USCGAUX has an aviation component it is teeny and a far far cry from the independent Autonomy of CAP.  By the way there is an MOU between the USCG and CAP for our aircraft to be used in Coast Guard SAR and other missions.

[SARMedTech]

all members of the US Coast Guard Aux. must have a Homeland Security clearence, I think it is fairly close to a secret. Thus when it was implimented the USCGAUX lost between 30% and 40% of their members. Furthermore, Auxiliary members are 'Augmenting" regular coast guardsmen, USCGAUX members cannot and do not carry firearms and they are under the direct supervision of a regular Coast Guard member in most instances. read their regulations, although the USCGAUX has an aviation component it is teeny and a far far cry from the independent Autonomy of CAP.  By the way there is an MOU between the USCG and CAP for our aircraft to be used in Coast Guard SAR and other missions.

The security check to join the CGAUX is basically just a routine criminal history check, complete with fingerprinting. If you are to work as a force augmenter on a station or facility, the you must apply for clearance with the 16-page long form. From there you receive a positive or negative determination, which is still not a clearance. Once you have the determination then you can be eligible to work on stations and facilities as needed and the clearance alloted to you is situational and based on the positive or negative determination, you may or may not receive the high level clearance. Regardless, no member going through the initial background check received secret clearance

[RiverAux]

SARMed is right except that even those CG Auxies who receive a favorable determination on the detailed background check would only receive an actual security clearance if someone in the CG requests it for the specific position they are working in.  For the vast majority of Auxies it goes no farther than getting the favorable determination, even those augmenting CG units.

And I think a 30-40% loss of members from the CG Aux is way too high an estimate for the effects of the security check.  But, it is hard to teas out since they, like CAP, were also on the downward trend due to people who signed up after 9/11 leaving.  I believe they were at about 36,000 before the check and by the end (after a multi-year implementation) the lowpoint was about 27,000.  There are major discussions over on military.com about this issue and I believe some actual figures are given there. 

And, CG Auxies augmenting CG units are not always under direct CG supervision.  I believe Aux radio watchstanders are often on their own and I know several folks who have qualified as Officer of the Day on CG cutters who end up being the only one on the cutter during their shift. 

[SARMedTech]

SARMed is right except that even those CG Auxies who receive a favorable determination on the detailed background check would only receive an actual security clearance if someone in the CG requests it for the specific position they are working in.  For the vast majority of Auxies it goes no farther than getting the favorable determination, even those augmenting CG units.

And I think a 30-40% loss of members from the CG Aux is way too high an estimate for the effects of the security check.  But, it is hard to teas out since they, like CAP, were also on the downward trend due to people who signed up after 9/11 leaving.  I believe they were at about 36,000 before the check and by the end (after a multi-year implementation) the lowpoint was about 27,000.  There are major discussions over on military.com about this issue and I believe some actual figures are given there. 

And, CG Auxies augmenting CG units are not always under direct CG supervision.  I believe Aux radio watchstanders are often on their own and I know several folks who have qualified as Officer of the Day on CG cutters who end up being the only one on the cutter during their shift. 

I think you have your numbers down cold and have a better handle on the facts than I do, since I have never been an Auxie. The only number that I differ with is that I think the CG says it currently has 39,000 total AD and Reserves and the same number of Auxies, though this may well not be true and I do know from my time in researching the CGAUX when I was thinking of joining that they have lost alot of  folks because of regulations changes, less autonomy on the part of flotilla commanders, etc. But yeah, your figures and facts are better than mine in this case.