New Decals for CAP Aircraft

Started by bosshawk, January 31, 2007, 06:41:50 PM

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bosshawk

Does everyone know that National is shipping sets of decals to Wings?  CIVIL AIR PATROL  to replace USAF AUX on the tails and larger, newly designed decals to cover the current round decal on the door.

Hang on, folks, the change is right around the corner.
Paul M. Reed
Col, USA(ret)
Former CAP Lt Col
Wilson #2777

Pylon

Quote from: bosshawk on January 31, 2007, 06:41:50 PM
Does everyone know that National is shipping sets of decals to Wings?  CIVIL AIR PATROL  to replace USAF AUX on the tails and larger, newly designed decals to cover the current round decal on the door.

Hang on, folks, the change is right around the corner.

They've already shipped the new "Civil Air Patrol" shield for the vans.  Our unit has them, but we're not putting it on and I'd advise not to do anything to the aircraft either.  I haven't seen any policy letter, change to appropriate regulations, or directive that would otherwise allow us to change the aircraft and vehicles from what they're, by regulation, supposed to have on them.
Michael F. Kieloch, Maj, CAP

afgeo4

So we literally... "didn't get the memo"
GEORGE LURYE

Pylon

Quote from: afgeo4 on January 31, 2007, 08:35:24 PM
So we literally... "didn't get the memo"

Nope.  Go ask Lumburgh, maybe he got it.  And don't forget the new cover sheet on your TPS reports.
Michael F. Kieloch, Maj, CAP

carnold1836

Chris Arnold, 1st Lt, CAP
Pegasus Composite Squadron

bosshawk

Can't speak for any of the other wings, but our Wing Aircraft Manager sent out an email, announcing that the kits were being sent by National.  Will advise us later as to when and how to make the changes.

Like lots of other changes in CAP, don't hold your breath.
Paul M. Reed
Col, USA(ret)
Former CAP Lt Col
Wilson #2777

Robert Hartigan

And I said, I don't care if they lay me off either, because I told, I told Bill that if they move my decals one more time, then, then I'm, I'm quitting, I'm going to quit. And, and I told Don too, because they've moved my decals four times already this year, and I used to be over by the window, and I could see the squirrels, and they were married, but then, they switched from the Swingline to the Boston stapler, but I kept my Swingline stapler because it didn't bind up as much, and I kept the staples for the Swingline stapler and it's not okay because if they take my stapler then I'll set the building on fire...
<><><>#996
GRW   #2717

Eclipse

Memos should / did go to Wing LG's, Tranports Officers, and aircraft managers.

You might want to hold off installing however as scuttle has it this will be recinded or delayed.

It can cost as much as $400 per ground vehicle to have them properly installed, and that assumes
you don't ruin the paint removing the old one. 

Airplanes, of course, are another kettle of fish - you don't go around just slapping things on them.

I have it on good authority that several wings have simply said "no", or "no, until NHQ pays for it"

"That Others May Zoom"

SAR-EMT1

Would that include our own Capt. Williams?
C. A. Edgar
AUX USCG Flotilla 8-8
Former CC / GLR-IL-328
Firefighter, Paramedic, Grad Student

bosshawk

When I started this thread, I didn't say that I liked the idea, just that it was happening.  Some of our erstwhile posters very much like to jump on these sorts of things like ducks on a bug and I wanted to whet their appetites.

It was strictly an informational post, so lets just let it drop and get on to better and more important topics.  I won't go there, because I don't want to insult anyone.
Paul M. Reed
Col, USA(ret)
Former CAP Lt Col
Wilson #2777

DNall

Didn't say a word. Ahh crap, now I did.  :D  If the decision is made then you have to just salute & execute. It's before it's made you try to play conscience of the org.

JohnKachenmeister

Another former CAP officer

bosshawk

Kach: only you, I and a couple of other gray heads can say that with any authority.
Paul M. Reed
Col, USA(ret)
Former CAP Lt Col
Wilson #2777

BillB

You didn't get the memo ? ? ?  Effective soon the decals will be maroon to match the old epaulets
Gil Robb Wilson # 19
Gil Robb Wilson # 104

Pylon

Quote from: Eclipse on February 01, 2007, 02:59:37 PM
It can cost as much as $400 per ground vehicle to have them properly installed, and that assumes
you don't ruin the paint removing the old one. 

That's why this whole decal thing has appeared to be a complete hack from the start. 

When we got the decals it came with a print-out from an e-mail the commander received with "NHQ's Preferred Method of Removal" for the old decal.  They told us to use a (get this!) hair dryer to remove the CAP seal decals.   ::)

Sorry.  Until I see something official those decals will grow brittle in a file drawer.  And for good reason, judging by the speed things change and then change again in this "new CAP".   :P
Michael F. Kieloch, Maj, CAP

lordmonar

Quote from: Pylon on February 02, 2007, 06:11:42 AM
Quote from: Eclipse on February 01, 2007, 02:59:37 PM
It can cost as much as $400 per ground vehicle to have them properly installed, and that assumes
you don't ruin the paint removing the old one. 

That's why this whole decal thing has appeared to be a complete hack from the start. 

When we got the decals it came with a print-out from an e-mail the commander received with "NHQ's Preferred Method of Removal" for the old decal.  They told us to use a (get this!) hair dryer to remove the CAP seal decals.   ::)

Sorry.  Until I see something official those decals will grow brittle in a file drawer.  And for good reason, judging by the speed things change and then change again in this "new CAP".   :P

I'm a little perplexed?  National sends out decals with instructions on how to remove the old ones and where to stick the new ones......and you are waiting for something official?

Now I may only be a barracks lawyer....but....does the word insubordination mean anything to you?
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

Pylon

Quote from: lordmonar on February 02, 2007, 06:40:45 AM
Quote from: Pylon on February 02, 2007, 06:11:42 AM
Quote from: Eclipse on February 01, 2007, 02:59:37 PM
It can cost as much as $400 per ground vehicle to have them properly installed, and that assumes
you don't ruin the paint removing the old one. 

That's why this whole decal thing has appeared to be a complete hack from the start. 

When we got the decals it came with a print-out from an e-mail the commander received with "NHQ's Preferred Method of Removal" for the old decal.  They told us to use a (get this!) hair dryer to remove the CAP seal decals.   ::)

Sorry.  Until I see something official those decals will grow brittle in a file drawer.  And for good reason, judging by the speed things change and then change again in this "new CAP".   :P

I'm a little perplexed?  National sends out decals with instructions on how to remove the old ones and where to stick the new ones......and you are waiting for something official?

Now I may only be a barracks lawyer....but....does the word insubordination mean anything to you?

An email from somebody (we're not even sure who) with some provided decals doesn't override the CAPR 77-1 or any regulation which requires that the vehicles have CAP seals on the doors.  The email clipping that was cut from a full sheet of paper and scotch taped to the decals had about a paragraph entitled "NHQ's preferred method of removal" or something similar.

No policy letter to override the regulations, no vote of the NB that I can find that approves the change for corporate vehicles.  Just some decals passed down with some verbal instructions.

Granted, yep - the intent seems to be "put these decals on and we'll worry about the paperwork afterwards!"   That can be a great sentiment, but seeing as how there's usually a phase-in period for these changes anyways, I'm waiting until I get something more firm before making cost-inducing and potentially damaging changes to the corporate vehicle we are entrusted with caring for.

If a policy letter appears online or is sent out, or some other form of official notice that CAPR 77-1's requirements for the CAP seals on the doors has been officially changed -- you bet, I'll go out there and change them on the van even though I don't like the new decals.

In the meantime, I'd like to wait and see what pans out.  Maybe the NB will vote next meeting against the decals.  Who knows?  Without anything official, I can't divine the intent of the echelons above reality.

Doesn't seem unreasonable to me to wait to do it properly, especially since we're talking about changing one small decal for another that doesn't really change anything for a van used primarily to truck cadets around and occassionally some UDF training.  Nothing life or death here.
Michael F. Kieloch, Maj, CAP

SarDragon

FWIW, hair dryers actually work pretty well for removing decals of that type. BTDT.

YMMV.

That is all. You now return to your regularly scheduled bickering.
Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
50 Year Member
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret

Eclipse

Quote from: SAR-EMT1 on February 01, 2007, 05:58:43 PM
Would that include our own Capt. Williams?

Thankfully, no - I wear a lot of hats, but this isn't one of them.

Just my 2nd-hand info.

As mentioned above, the lasat year or so has seen so many regs, policy letters, etc., which were then receinded, changed, etc., that my attitude now is to wait until sunset dates, BOG approval or new regulations for anything which incurs cost or effort, especially if the cost has to be borne personally or through unit funds.

ESPECIALLY when its anything approved for "corporate" but not "USAF" that smacks of being denied.

"That Others May Zoom"

mikeylikey

If anyone has to pay to remove and stick these new things on, it should be the Wing HQ.  Afterall, they are always so good at saying "all the vehicles are wing assets and can be moved around the wing aimlessly".  Usually vans are rewards to good boys and girls that support the Wing Commander.  While units are still driving around vans from 1982, the Wing Commanders get new suburbans or expeditions.  How fair is that.  Guess it is a perk of being a Colonel.
What's up monkeys?