CAP Talk

So, I live in a decent neighborhood.  We've got a doctors, airline pilots, teachers, few navy folks, retired navy folks, a postal worker and some others I don't know.

Here's the deal.  My neighbor, a retired Navy E-5 doesn't keep his home and yard up to the "standard" I think appropriate for the neighborhood.  Lawn is rarely kept, trash cans are put out too early or left out for days, fence is practically coming down, old junk like a washer sitting on side of the house along with the trash cans when they're "put away" instead of out of site.  Finally, I think the oldest son and daughter (or someone) has moved back in.  There are rarely fewer than 4 cars in the driveway or parked on the street, usually directly infront of my house.

The owner, a nice enough guy, never seems to be around.  He's got 2 young daughters, like pre-teen and a couple kids that are grown adults.  Did I mention the dog they allow to roam freely on the street named "Freedom".  They guy has let me borrow his ladder and seems to be of the good natured generous, perhaps religous, type.  The adult kids on the other hand, although I haven't met them, seem to be of the "trouble maker" type.  I could be wrong, it's happened before.  But loud music, jeans hanging down their butt, and friends that look like they may have seen the inside of a jail cell before.

I'm a fan of the saying "good fences make great neighbors".  My problem is that I expect everyone to follow the rules of common sense, common courtesy and decency.  I know, I'm a fool.  But as I've learned before, it doesn't make for a comfortable way of life to be "at war" with your neighbor (or roommate).

Our home owners association leaves a lot to be desired.  My neighbor painted his house Peach, not allowed by current guidelines.  Nothing has been done.  In fact, lots of violations occur and nothing is done.  I guess that's the difference between paying $50 a year compared to $1200 a year in Northern Virginia.

My BEEF is with the cars parked in front of my house, which isn't illegal.  The car is nasty, broken down and has a tarp in the righ passenger window because it's broken.  The other car, a white newer model, has the hood up partially charging or something.

So, am I just too anal retentive or is this a legitimate issue?

The owner's house is off to the left...
(http://captalk.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3469.0;attach=1259)

What I see when I walk out my front door...
(http://captalk.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3469.0;attach=1260)

Some towns have a local ordinance about junk cars being parked on the street.  If it doesn't run, they have to get it off the street.  Might be some help from the cops on that issue.

Quote from: Short Field on November 06, 2007, 11:21:32 PM
Some towns have a local ordinance about junk cars being parked on the street.  If it doesn't run, they have to get it off the street.  Might be some help from the cops on that issue.

It runs, unfortunately.  It's gone off and on, along with the white car.  The worst was when the mail lady had to knock on my door last week to give me my mail because the junker was blocking the mailbox.  Grrrr....

Ouch......

Legally  would say city code enforcement would be your best bet unless the tags are expired.  In Ca they have to be expired over 6 months for them to be towed away.  I feel for you.  It may be that talking to the guy might be your only solution.

Hey, I don't believe you can legally block a mailbox with a car...at least, that's what my parents always told me when I parked in front of theirs.

I've dealt with a neighbor from hell.  The cops finally told me that they could keep ticketing him, or I could to go my HOA.  They told me that at least in my state, HOA's have way more power than they do.  Frightening, but sometimes comes in useful.  I say look through all the rules, find out which ones he's breaking, and start writing letters. 

Or just make a phone call saying you think there's drug activity going on (judging by the way the cars look, it's a possibility).  Or slash their tires.  I see quite a few options here. :-)

Confront politely.  The best way to approach ANY conflict is to talk it over.  Party A gives their views, party B gives their views, debate, resolve.  If there are still hard feelings afterwards, or if the opposite party refuses, that is the time to go to the authorities.

Quote from: star1151 on November 07, 2007, 03:46:33 AM
Hey, I don't believe you can legally block a mailbox with a car...at least, that's what my parents always told me when I parked in front of theirs.

FL statutes state that you can't block a rural mailbox positioned on a state road by 30 feet.  Yeah, I pulled out my code book to see if I can get anything.  Only if it were abandoned or not driveable could I do something legally.  Believe it or not, it works.

A couple of ideas:

1.  IF you live in a city, there may be an ordinance prohibiting parking for longer than 18 hours.

2.  Otherwise, code enforcement is your best bet for the junker.

One option you didn't list above may be a little too creative, but...

Have professionally printed signs posted marking the house as the "Redneck Land" and sell tickets like its a theme park.  Be sure to establish a route that runs the tourists through the gift shop where they can purchase authentic "Low-rider" baggy jeans, CD's of their favorite rap artists, and toy trucks with the wheels broken off.

And don't forget the crazy "Mullet" wigs!

Stop by the shore and pick up a nice dead 'n bloated fishy for that open window.

Interested to know who voted "just blow it off, ain't nuthin wrong with it".  Obviously you don't have to answer as it's an anonymous poll, but it blows my mind that someone would be totally cool with this hunk of junk outside their house every day.  Although I don't actually care for it to even be seen on my street, I'd be totally cool if it were actually parked in the owner's driveway or at a minimum, in front of his house.  We have two-car garages and driveways big enough to park 4 cars in.  If you must park on the street in front of my house, they could at least park the Acura or Honda there.

I'm guessing the 4 folks that voted "slash tires" were possibly joking.  I'd like to hear that rationale as well, if you're willing to speak up.  I kind of threw two extra options in there.  I think, like most have answered, the right and mature thing to do is approach my neighbor in a friendly, non-confrontational manner and see if he could make some parking adjustments.

Didn't know you lived so close to another CAP Talk member, eh Kirt? :D

Actually, there is another CAP Talk member with my same zip code.  Touche.

Well, I had something quasi-similar in my neighborhood. I live in a college town in an apartment complex, and there was this crappy stationwagon parked right in the front of the complex. Tags expired, rear tire flat, didn't move for like 8 months.

First thing I did was be patient, and hoped it would go away. Didn't happen.

Talked to the owner. She told me, in harsher words, to go fly a kite.

So, talked to management (since we dont have an HOA), as did everyone else in my particular building. Came out one morning to go to work, and the vehicle had a big orange sticker on the driver window saying "You have 48 hours to move it, or it's towed off property".

It's not there anymore.

My recommendation: start civil, and increase the tactics as the situation progresses.

Honestly, in FL, I figured they had laws about eyesores like that car. Doesn't even look like it would pass inspection. Get your neighbors to complain that the car sitting in the neighborhood, along with the rest of the problems you listed, may negatively affect the resale value of your home, etc. Get "the man" on your side, and you should be able to do a lot.

I believe you said the vehicles tags are expired. Local LE should be able to tell you what they can do about that. I would think that a vehicle w/ expired tags on a public street can be considered abandoned and towed.

You can always get one of those plastic fire hydrants, put it next to the car, and call the local LE. They'll move it REAL fast  ;D

All else fails, call Colgan. He's got a Springfield XD he's been itching to use, and tires are great targets.  >:D

Quote from: tedda on November 07, 2007, 05:36:20 AM
Stop by the shore and pick up a nice dead 'n bloated fishy for that open window.

Tedda, your random interjections of resounding satirism never cease to entertain.  :)

Quote from: ♠SARKID♠ on November 07, 2007, 07:50:22 AM

Quote from: tedda on November 07, 2007, 05:36:20 AM
Stop by the shore and pick up a nice dead 'n bloated fishy for that open window.

Tedda, your random interjections of resounding satirism never cease to entertain.  :)

IMHO, that was neither satire, nor sarcasm. Instead, it was usable (if not entirely sound) advice, guaranteed to get a reaction. Frankly, I think he got the idea from Grumpy Old Men.

I'll bet that POS is leaking oil, gas, transmission fluid etc., it'd be shame if it caught fire... >:D

Hey I bet the boys at McDill, Pensacola, or Tydell would love to do an air strike on it.
You know people, who know people, get in touch with DEA or INS, you get the idea.

I would just get some of the other neighbors on your side calling the local PD. Make sure the neighbors are not too buddy, buddy with them.

HEY! That's my car!  Kirt, if you had a beef with where I park my car, why didn't you let me know? 

Seriously though, although it may not be illegal for them to park their car there, I do think it is very inconsiderate.  It sounds as though your issue isn't that they have this car in the neighborhood, but that it is parked in front of your house.

You mention that you'd rather have one of the nicer cars there because it isn't as much of an eyesore, but I don' think you'd really want either.

I've always gone by the unwritten rule that the curb space in front of someone's house is theirs, so I don't park there.

I'm sure that a polite conversation with the guy would work for you - people don't know there is a problem until you let them know and getting the police involved this early may just lead to neighborhood fueds rather than a "Oh, sorry, if I had known earlier..." situation.

I guess that's one reason I won't live somewhere that has a home owners association.  I pay enough in property taxes that I'm not going to pay more just so someone can tell me what color I have to paint my house.

What you call a "junker" might be some kid's first car and that's all he could afford. 

If it's really bugging you then I'd suggest printing off the list of your Association's "guidelines" and annonymously mail them to your neighbor, or have the association do it.  If that doesn't work then maybe a conversation is in order.

I'm curious to know if your association's guidelines are rules or just guidelines.

I would decide which issues directly affect me and limit my gripes to only those. What he does with his land that he paid for is not really an issue unless he is breaking a law or a homeowner's covenant that he agreed to when he bought the land. I would have similar gripes if someone tried telling me what antennas I could put up, that my kids could not work on their cars in my backyard (which I did surround with a privacy fence), or that I could not keep the squadron's practice SAR target at my house since the airport won't let us park a Cessna 150 trailer there.

Once the issue starts to affect you (loud music, car parked in front of your house, wierd smells making you either gag or get stoned) then you have every right to inform him of the problem that is causing you. My guess is that he probably has no idea he's causing you these problems and will be more than happy to try to accomodate you as long as you're polite and respectful to him, which I have no doubt you will be.

As for the car, I've had cars like that when I was younger and had no money. Remember, not every parent buys their kid a new Lexus for graduation. On the bright side (for you anyway, for the kid that owns it, it might mean walking to work), it doesn't look like it will last much longer.

Quote from: ♠SARKID♠ on November 07, 2007, 07:50:22 AM

Quote from: tedda on November 07, 2007, 05:36:20 AM
Stop by the shore and pick up a nice dead 'n bloated fishy for that open window.

Tedda, your random interjections of resounding satirism never cease to entertain.  :)

Satirism?

I put that into my book of "Creative Solutions!"

The car:  When I moved in last year, the home owner, "Hawk" as we'll call him, asked me if the car sitting in front of his house bothered me because some other neighbors complained.  I admitted that it was sort of an eye-sore but as long as it isn't abandoned, is legal, and not causing a hinderence, then whether I like it or not, it can stay.  He said it's some old model with low mileage.  I'm like, whatever.  Not my cup of tea but maybe it's a hobby of his.

The son:  The son, young twenties, is using the car.  As Hawk told me, his son got into some trouble with the law and would be moving back.  I thought he got rid of the car because I hadn't seen it in at least 6 months.

Hawk is approachable, but never around.  I last saw him 3 weeks ago when I mentioned to him that his dog was messing around in my bushes and when I opened the blinds my dog saw his dog and charged the window, breaking it.  Cost me almost $400 to fix.  Yes, my 80 lb lab is fine. 

I plan on talking to him, but the one time I did go to their house no one answered the door.  I generally see him hanging out in the driveway on the weekends but not this past weekend and not since the junker car showed up.  Right now, there are 4 cars in the driveway and 2 in front of my house.

HOAs:  I like living in a neighborhood with rules.  In Northern Virginia (outside of DC), I paid more than $1,200 a year in HOA fees and didn't mind one bit.  You couldn't park commerical vans in the neighborhood; there were limited colors you could paint your house, and if someone didn't cut their lawn, they got a notice.  I personally like that.  I can truly appreciate people having opposite feelings than me and that's cool.  Just differences of opinion, no reason to bash or start a war.   When you've got 15 houses on a street and everyone has a clean yard, well kept exterior of their house, cars in the garage or driveway, fences that aren't falling down and everyone's house is painted with an earth-toned color; it kind of ticks me off when one person is the complete opposite.  Trash in their yard, grass is 10" tall, 6 cars in front and 1 is a junker, fence is falling down, dog is roaming freely, loud music and so on.

Kind of makes all the work everyone else does go to waste. 

I would try reasoning with him. Having a neigbor feud going on is not the hill you want to die on! You pay a homeowners association to represent your interests in this area, and I believe that they should be your second line of recourse. Police ( and you know how those guys are  >:D) never make neignbor disputes better, they just arrest the guy with no shirt and a beer can in hand, ( and since he is a squid, it will probably be him, since swabbies are prone to alcoholism and crabs) If your homeowners association won't enforce your written bylaws, consider suing them in small claims court for your dues. Lawyer letters, air strikes, arson, false police reports, etc have a way of ending in tragedy. I am sure you have seen as many or more family "415's " (California-talk for disturbance calls) stemming from neigbors at war over trees, fences, barking dogs, and parking spaces. A good many of these turn seriously violent. Since you a dealing with a member of the Canoe-Club, you know he must be an intrinsically defective person anyway!

Major Lord

Quote from: Psicorp on November 07, 2007, 03:37:58 PM
I guess that's one reason I won't live somewhere that has a home owners association.  I pay enough in property taxes that I'm not going to pay more just so someone can tell me what color I have to paint my house.

What you call a "junker" might be some kid's first car and that's all he could afford. 

Just wait until you can't sell your house because no one ELSE wants to deal with the eyesore.  I personally don't care if it's some kid's first car, he can park it somewhere else or take care of it.  In my state, that car with no window wouldn't pass inspection and I'd be calling code enforcement on him.  His right to be sloppy ends when it affects my finances.  At least, that's how it should be.

And to everyone else...reasoning doesn't work with people like this.  My neighbor thought nothing of habitually drinking and driving and bumping into the back of my car on the street (the one day I was stupid enough to PARK on the street).  Unfortunately, people are by nature selfish and don't care that what they do affects others.

Quote from: Major Lord on November 07, 2007, 05:49:42 PM
.. snip ..( and since he is a squid, it will probably be him, since swabbies are prone to alcoholism and crabs) ..snip ..  Since you a dealing with a member of the Canoe-Club, you know he must be an intrinsically defective person anyway!
Major Lord

What a great response and generalization slamming the many fine folks who serve in the US Navy.

Quote from: star1151 on November 07, 2007, 06:40:21 PM
Just wait until you can't sell your house because no one ELSE wants to deal with the eyesore.  I personally don't care if it's some kid's first car, he can park it somewhere else or take care of it.  In my state, that car with no window wouldn't pass inspection and I'd be calling code enforcement on him.  His right to be sloppy ends when it affects my finances.  At least, that's how it should be.

I guess I've just never had enough free time to worry about such things.  If it's a safety issue, sure, but the visual asthetics of my neighbor's property would only be a concern if my house was on the market, otherwise it's not affecting my fianances one little bit.

Michigan doesn't have vehicle inspections.  If it rolls, has lights, doesn't burn more oil than gas, you're good to go.  

I had a neighbor once who would always keep his grass golf course putting green short and hated seeing anyone else's grass longer than his.   I'm not the kind of person who cuts grass more than once a weekend, might even skip a week here or there.  He decided that I was bringing down the value of his property so one Saturday morning I hear a lawnmower in my yard.  I look out the window and here he is on a riding lawn mower, beer in one hand and an infant on his lap.   I'm sure some of you LEOs can add that citation up...not to mention calculate insurance premium adjustments had that child fallen.

Quote from: a2capt on November 07, 2007, 08:31:45 PM

Quote from: Major Lord on November 07, 2007, 05:49:42 PM
.. snip ..( and since he is a squid, it will probably be him, since swabbies are prone to alcoholism and crabs) ..snip ..  Since you a dealing with a member of the Canoe-Club, you know he must be an intrinsically defective person anyway!
Major Lord

What a great response and generalization slamming the many fine folks who serve in the US Navy.

The navy has fine folks??  >:D Those are called Marines  ;D

Quote from: a2capt on November 07, 2007, 08:31:45 PM

Quote from: Major Lord on November 07, 2007, 05:49:42 PM
.. snip ..( and since he is a squid, it will probably be him, since swabbies are prone to alcoholism and crabs) ..snip ..  Since you a dealing with a member of the Canoe-Club, you know he must be an intrinsically defective person anyway!
Major Lord

What a great response and generalization slamming the many fine folks who serve in the US Navy.

He's kidding.

Lighten up, Francis!

All joking aside Kirt, I hope you can come to a solution to this issue.

I have enjoyed this topic as it is a break from our CAP issues.

Quote from: stillamarine on November 07, 2007, 08:57:51 PM

Quote from: a2capt on November 07, 2007, 08:31:45 PM

Quote from: Major Lord on November 07, 2007, 05:49:42 PM
.. snip ..( and since he is a squid, it will probably be him, since swabbies are prone to alcoholism and crabs) ..snip ..  Since you a dealing with a member of the Canoe-Club, you know he must be an intrinsically defective person anyway!
Major Lord

What a great response and generalization slamming the many fine folks who serve in the US Navy.

The navy has fine folks??  >:D Those are called Marines  ;D

No, no, no, you've got it bass-ackwards - (http://members.cox.net/dragnd/usmc_hm.gif)

I agree on the "Lighten up, Francis". Allen's commentary was tongue-in-cheek, and I took it as such. Otherwise, I would have been forced to hunt him down and drive a stake into his heart.

You and me both... Revenge of the Tweets

On a side note, a Navy HM earned the Silver Star for actions in Iraq when he saved many Marines and killed many bad guys.

Quote from: RobG on November 07, 2007, 09:31:39 PM
All joking aside Kirt, I hope you can come to a solution to this issue.

I have enjoyed this topic as it is a break from our CAP issues.

Thanks, Rob.  I want it to go well as too.  Look, I know I'm anal retentive and some would say I'm taking this too far and it's not a big deal.  But I'm a big fan of not imposing on people because the way I live.  Like smoking, I don't smoke, but if I did, I'd make sure to smoke away from non-smokers.  That's just how I am.

I think a reasonable and prudent person would assess this car as an "eye sore".  I think most people wouldn't mind if a their neighbor had it out there for a few days while a family member was visiting, or he was just keeping it there before he could get it fixed.  But that's not the case.  It is a blatent disregard for common courtesy and ungentelmanly like conduct.  I don't think the owner thinks of it this way, but I do.

Will let everyone know how it goes once I get a chance to see Hawk again.  They're like vampires, I've been home all day and haven't seen movement from that house.  Not sure if they watch to see when I'm not looking before they leave, but dern sure seems that way  ::)

Quote from: Stonewall on November 07, 2007, 10:18:48 PM
On a side note, a Navy HM earned the Silver Star for actions in Iraq when he saved many Marines and killed many bad guys.

Marines don't consider "Their" Corpsman as Navy, they are just slightly confused Brother Marines  ;D

Quote from: Stonewall on November 07, 2007, 10:22:47 PM
Thanks, Rob.  I want it to go well as too.  Look, I know I'm anal retentive and some would say I'm taking this too far and it's not a big deal.

You're not (at least not because of this) and it is.  My neighbor from hell is gone, and him leaving was a bigger stress relief than taking a month long vacation from work.  All joking aside, I hope you find a way to deal with it.

It's not easy dealing with neighbors, especially if you don't know them. The neighbors I have are the most inconsiderate people I've ever had the displeasure to share a house with (we live in a duplex). My suggestion is to confront the neighborhood watch commander as a community and bring the problems to him/her. The confront the neighbors politely. If that doesn't work, then the law comes into play. Since it doesn't seem that there is criminal play involved, it'll be a civil issue to be taken up with your city's building department, and possible the law department. Politeness is the key in this situation. Grin and bear it.

Quote from: stillamarine on November 07, 2007, 10:45:48 PM

Quote from: Stonewall on November 07, 2007, 10:18:48 PM
On a side note, a Navy HM earned the Silver Star for actions in Iraq when he saved many Marines and killed many bad guys.

Marines don't consider "Their" Corpsman as Navy, they are just slightly confused Brother Marines  ;D

Do you wonder why we are confused when we can only wear our rank on one sleeve?  In J-ville (NC) the hawkers on my starboard side kept asking what I did to get busted to private after seeing no stripes but Vietnam awards.

Send a note to the HOA demanding they enforce the CCR's. If they do not, seek legal guidance reguarding lack of enforcement and seek damages related to loss of property value. Inform them that is the process you will initiate. Make them be the bad guy.

Little update.

Situation:  Resolved

Method:  Had a cop buddy drive up and run the tags that were expired.  Knocked on my neighbor's door to inquire about the old beater with expired tags.  When they couldn't come up with a legitimate excuse, he said "I'll tell you what, your neighbor (me) is a good friend of mine so if you go ahead and put the car in your driveway, off the city street, you can keep it as long as you'd like without renewing the tags.  This way, you don't have to go through the hassle of paying a towing fee on top of getting it registered".

My neighbor came over and thanked me.

Even though it's not out of view, it is off the street and more importantly, no longer in front of my house.

Hey great news, glad it all worked out.

 :clap:

A new turn with my neighbors...

So, I got the car issued sort of squared away.  At least they moved the clunker into their driveway and covered it up.  Only after I had a buddy come over in his cop car and run the tags and the owner came home.  But still, as I type this, there are two more cars parked in front of my house, but at least they aren't broken down and too nasty looking.

NOW, there is a new dog issue.  While their dog "Freedom" still roams around the street pooping in peoples' lawns and barking throughout the night, they brought it 2 new dogs, probably their sons'.  A big male pitbull and a puppy.  The male, nuts hanging and all, is solid muscle and very mean looking.  Enough to scare the poop out of someone when it pops up in my backyard Friday night as my wife holds the baby and lets out our friendly black lab.  She quickly shut the door and called me. 

Not knowing who it belonged to and never have seen it before, I light it up with my TLR-1 light attached to my glock.  Not wanting to kill a dog as I'm an animal lover, I call animal control but by the time they got here I looked the fool because it was no where to be found.

This morning, as we had guests over for sunday breakfast, all of the sudden the dog popped up.  My dog freaks out and chases it through a hole in the fence we didn't know we had.  This is when I learn it's my neighbor's dog.  And of course, they aren't home.

I go to nail a piece of wood over the hole and the pitbull starts tearing at the other wood panels aggressively trying to get at me. In about 30 minutes there will be another hole in my fence and dog with either a 5.56 or 9mm in it's head.  Haven't decided.  M4 is probably better because I can shoot from the safety of my porch as it makes entry and it'll be more accurate.

15 houses on my block, and only one family causes this much of a ruckass.  I think it's going to get nasty here.

Apropos of nothing whatsoever at all, dogs love chocolate, which is extremely toxic to them.....and quieter than a .223 round....

Major Lord

Sigh...I feel sorry for the dogs.  Your neighbors are idiots.

^ Agreed!  Perhaps Kirt.....time to move to a "higher class hood".

Quote from: mikeylikey on December 02, 2007, 06:50:50 PM
^ Agreed!  Perhaps Kirt.....time to move to a "higher class hood".

Dude, my hood is fine.  It's totally middle to upper-middle class.  Got a doctor living across the street, airline pilot, and some retired folks.  Only one bad apple, my neighbor.

Pehaps he has unusually high electric and water bills for a small indoor gardening hobby....

My hood (http://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&hl=en&ll=30.328141,-81.463076&spn=0.001336,0.002151&t=h&z=19&om=1)

^ Not bad.......if your neighbors house "mysteriously" burned down......$$??   >:D :angel:

Quote from: RiverAux on December 02, 2007, 07:11:55 PM
Pehaps he has unusually high electric and water bills for a small indoor gardening hobby....

I wouldn't rule that out. I grew up in a decent neighborhood that's yet to succumb to local trends; the house behind my folks' place was busted a few months ago for exactly the same thing. While the parents went back to India for an extended visit, their Ivy League grad son decided to convert their house into an indoor greenhouse for cannabis. The only reason it was discovered was that the fire alarm in the house went off from an overheated grow light.

I don't mean to offend anyone by asking this, but....is he a renter?  If so, maybe a call to his landlord is in order.

No, he owns the house.  The owner is a good guy, but I think he lacks the ability to understand that others around him may not be happy with certain things that he thinks are the norm.  Plus, as I said before, most issues weren't issues until the two kids (son and daughter, both adults) came back to live with him.  Number of cars increased from 3 or 4 to 6 or 7, plus increased activity (i.e. friends always over, lots of cars parked, music, other noise), and more trash in the lawn.

Talk to surrounding neighbors, get thier opinions of the situation, if it's bothering you, it's obviously bothering them. There is power in numbers. Determine if they are in vilolation of any city codes. and contact the respective departments; Animal Control, Parking Enforcement, Health Dept, etc.

Start having all your neighbors who are bothered by this guy make calls as well. The city/county will get so tired of the calls they'll  be all over this family to get their respective 'stuff' together.

It's hard not to want to put a 'hole' in different things of your neighbors, but that's your fastest way to have your backside in the back of a cop car instead of your neighbors.

Quote from: Lancer on December 02, 2007, 08:15:24 PMIt's hard not to want to put a 'hole' in different things of your neighbors, but that's your fastest way to have your backside in the back of a cop car instead of your neighbors.

Well, being a cop (in a different jurisdiciton), I still know all the cops in the zone that I live in and are buds with them.  They're all like "you know how to articulate shooting the [darn] dog, just do it...but you didn't hear it from me :-)".

My biggest issue is this is my neighbor; I have to live with them next door and the last thing I want/need is hostilities.  Unfortunately, my dream of having understanding neighbors who respect their properterty, the HOA rules and the law as much as I do just isn't the case today.  I'm one for a fight and conflict when it's worth the cause.  Keeps me on my toes.  But as they say good fences make great neighbors

Maybe just approach the kids, and be like "listen, your not a homeowner here, we would appreciate you knocking off the stuff we don't like".  "I have young kids, we don't have any problem with you living here, but your cars, music, friends over at all hours are starting to be a disruption".

Honestly, I don't know how to say stuff to people without coming off as a COMPLETE  A-Hole, so good luck there.

If all else fails, get a beater truck from the junkyard and park it in one of their spots, blast some AC/DC at 330AM, paint your house pink, cut the grass in nothing but boxers, burn whatever you can in your backyard (beer cases, pizza boxes), start a raunchy smelling compost pile, and start driving your neighbors out of their minds. 

It is a two way street (civility, that is)

Quote from: mikeylikey on December 02, 2007, 11:23:46 PMHonestly, I don't know how to say stuff to people without coming off as a COMPLETE  A-Hole, so good luck there.

My biggest fault as well.  I've practiced not being a complete a-hole by throwing a smile on my face, but it doesn't work.

^ Then you are just an A-hole that is asking to be punched in the face.

After the guy punches me....."I punched you not because I hate you, but because you had that stupid grin on your face while you said what you said". 

Been there as well. 

Quote from: Stonewall on December 02, 2007, 11:52:46 PM

Quote from: mikeylikey on December 02, 2007, 11:23:46 PMHonestly, I don't know how to say stuff to people without coming off as a COMPLETE  A-Hole, so good luck there.

My biggest fault as well.  I've practiced not being a complete a-hole by throwing a smile on my face, but it doesn't work.

Just think of it this way Colonel, that dog is a hundred pounds of learn, aggressively muscle. If it tried to get at you, it'll try to get at someone else.

Quote from: Stonewall on December 02, 2007, 04:58:06 PM
A new turn with my neighbors...

So, I got the car issued sort of squared away.  At least they moved the clunker into their driveway and covered it up.  Only after I had a buddy come over in his cop car and run the tags and the owner came home.  But still, as I type this, there are two more cars parked in front of my house, but at least they aren't broken down and too nasty looking.

NOW, there is a new dog issue.  While their dog "Freedom" still roams around the street pooping in peoples' lawns and barking throughout the night, they brought it 2 new dogs, probably their sons'.  A big male pitbull and a puppy.  The male, nuts hanging and all, is solid muscle and very mean looking.  Enough to scare the poop out of someone when it pops up in my backyard Friday night as my wife holds the baby and lets out our friendly black lab.  She quickly shut the door and called me. 

Not knowing who it belonged to and never have seen it before, I light it up with my TLR-1 light attached to my glock.  Not wanting to kill a dog as I'm an animal lover, I call animal control but by the time they got here I looked the fool because it was no where to be found.

This morning, as we had guests over for sunday breakfast, all of the sudden the dog popped up.  My dog freaks out and chases it through a hole in the fence we didn't know we had.  This is when I learn it's my neighbor's dog.  And of course, they aren't home.

I go to nail a piece of wood over the hole and the pitbull starts tearing at the other wood panels aggressively trying to get at me. In about 30 minutes there will be another hole in my fence and dog with either a 5.56 or 9mm in it's head.  Haven't decided.  M4 is probably better because I can shoot from the safety of my porch as it makes entry and it'll be more accurate.

15 houses on my block, and only one family causes this much of a ruckass.  I think it's going to get nasty here.

Don't bother shooting a pit bull with a 9mm.  It has no effect.  The 9mm is a glorified and very expensive bb gun.  The 5.56 should have the desired effect on target.

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on December 03, 2007, 12:35:33 AM
Don't bother shooting a pit bull with a 9mm.  It has no effect.  The 9mm is a glorified and very expensive bb gun.  The 5.56 should have the desired effect on target.

I'm no ballistics expert, but several guys on my department have killed more than a handful of dogs, fox, and even a deer hit by a car flopping around in the street with a 9mm.  Only once did someone have to shoot a second shot because [she] grazed the dog's ear.

If a 9mm can kill a 225 lb man with one shot, it can kill a dog.  Remember, I'd shoot until the threat is no longer a threat.  Regardless, if it comes to it, 5.56 or 00 buck is standing by.

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 01:20:03 AM
Remember, I'd shoot until the threat is no longer a threat.  Regardless, if it comes to it, 5.56 or 00 buck is standing by.

Yeah.......explaining to the cops showing up after I kill the neighbors dog that the reason I reloaded three times........."Making sure it wasn't a threat anylonger".  That works.  At least I will get some of that rage out of my system that night!

(Mikey does not shoot dogs, cats, birds (the tasty kinds I do), or any other form of wild and or domesticated animals.  He does however hunt dolphins with those 6-pack plastic ring on the can holder things.  Mikey will not ever shoot the neighbors dog, no matter how loud it barks.....nor will I shoot any other dog except for the Kujo kind (you know, rabies and trying to eat my kid type).  IMPORTANT NOTE:This statement expires Jan 1 2008.

I have a laser on my M4 and tonight, I saw the dog, somehow, again in my backyard and "lit him up" with the laser.  He freaked out.  I boarded up the hole he came through earlier today so I have no clue how he got in.  I have a good sized backyard.  Not sure the exact measurements, but I used my pace count and it's about 50 meters deep and 75 meters in length.

Tomorrow, animal control, who only works Mon - Fri, 0800 to 1700 will be coming out.  I think I'll actually trap it in my backyard so I don't look the fool again.

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on December 03, 2007, 12:35:33 AM
Don't bother shooting a pit bull with a 9mm.  It has no effect.  The 9mm is a glorified and very expensive bb gun.  The 5.56 should have the desired effect on target.

??? I'll take a shot from the BB gun any day over a 115 to 147 grain peice of lead coming at me at 950 to 1100 feet per second. There are a lot of choices in ammunition for a 9mm firearm and I don't want to be on the receiving end of any of them.

Just sprayed the poop out of him with my OC spray.  Didn't phase him one bit.

Snapped a few pics.

This morning there was only one fence panel missing.  Then I nailed the wood there, but now there are 3 panels missing and the dog chewed through the wood.  Love thy neighbor!

(http://captalk.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3469.0;attach=1321)

It's Cujo dude...

If they bring the dog in the house... get a few Chili-Cheese dip bowls and spread the wealth..

not as bad as chocolate .. but .. the results are quite amusing. ;)

Ok, that's one scary looking dog...but it's not his fault!  Don't shoot it.

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 01:20:03 AM

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on December 03, 2007, 12:35:33 AM
Don't bother shooting a pit bull with a 9mm.  It has no effect.  The 9mm is a glorified and very expensive bb gun.  The 5.56 should have the desired effect on target.

I'm no ballistics expert, but several guys on my department have killed more than a handful of dogs, fox, and even a deer hit by a car flopping around in the street with a 9mm.  Only once did someone have to shoot a second shot because [she] grazed the dog's ear.

If a 9mm can kill a 225 lb man with one shot, it can kill a dog.  Remember, I'd shoot until the threat is no longer a threat.  Regardless, if it comes to it, 5.56 or 00 buck is standing by.

Once, back in 1992 or 1993, I was covering the rear of a house while the SWAT guys went in the front to serve a search warrant (the occupant of this particular piece of paradise was a burglar).  The people inside tried to goout the back, but saw me and another unit in the rear.  Then they opened the door again, and turned loose a very p.o.'ed German shepherd.  The dog went for the other officer first.  She shot it once.

The dog yelped, then went after me, now even MORE p.o.'ed than it was when it came out the door.  I shot at it three times, and later learned that 2 rounds of mine hit.

The dog then ran back into the house, but by now the SWAT team had broken down the front door.  It ran past them, and tried to bite the sergeant outside.  The sergeant ran to a police car to escape the dog.  Then the dog went after the SWAT guys back in the house.  One of the SWAT guys killed it with a 12-guage.

I can describe at least three incidents where suspects were shot with the 9mm and still fired at police.  One suspect was shot through the heart, and still fired 4 .38 rounds into a female officer.  (She survived, but was off work for over a year.)

Sorry, but based on what I have seen, I have no confidence in the 9mm.  The department I used to work for finally scrapped them in favor of the .40 caliber.

Have any blanks?  That might even worry the owners.  Especially with the mention of"next time" they might not be blanks. . . .  ;)

Quote from: star1151 on December 03, 2007, 04:50:45 AM
Ok, that's one scary looking dog...but it's not his fault!  Don't shoot it.

Let me describe to you what happened today.

My wife opened the back sliding door to let our dog out, a lovable, friendly, black lab with a $3,000 back left leg.  Yes, we paid that much money to fix it's leg.  Like always, my 16 month old son is eager to go into the back and play with our dog.  To my wife's surprise, the very mean looking pitbull is growling at my dog and scares the crap out of my wife.

The dog has come at me twice.  I sprayed OC at it once, knowing that it probably wouldn't work and it didn't.  I nailed the wood where hole was and it ate through the wood.

I realize that it's the owner's fault, but no animal is worth my family living in fear, let alone getting hurt by said animal.  I am an animal lover.  I do not want to kill this dog.  What I want, is my neighbors to become civilized and realize that keeping their 2 pitbulls in the backyard with zero supervision 24/7 is not how we treat pets in this country.  Dogs do not equal the value of human life, but we have laws that forbid people from animal cruelty.  Yes, dogs can and are "outside dogs", but I am 100% confident that these dogs are neglected.

This issue only started Friday night when we first saw it in our front yard, then our back.  I hadn't seen it again until this morning (Sunday).  Called the police since I learned animal control doesn't work weekends in this city and an officer came out and started paperwork.  Later, I saw a different officer show up at the neighbor's house.  Not sure what went on, but obviously nothing changed.

I HATE that my neighbor has made me have to do this, but I have no other options.  His one mini-mutt dog that roams freely in the street already cost me a $350 window when my lab charged at it through my front window back in October.  Luckily my dog wasn't hurt, but my wallet was.  Even back then, I couldn't get them to come outside when I knocked on their door.  5, 6, 7 cars our front and no one answers the door.  Same with today.  I will not live in fear and I will do what I have to do.  If it becomes awkward for my family to have to see their trashy, nasty, dumba$$ family, so be it, their loss.  They are the one and only family on our street that has any issues.  Pisses me off!

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on December 03, 2007, 04:59:03 AM
Once, back in 1992 or 1993, I was covering the rear of a house while the SWAT guys went in the front to serve a search warrant (the occupant of this particular piece of paradise was a burglar).  The people inside tried to goout the back, but saw me and another unit in the rear.  Then they opened the door again, and turned loose a very p.o.'ed German shepherd.  The dog went for the other officer first.  She shot it once.

The dog yelped, then went after me, now even MORE p.o.'ed than it was when it came out the door.  I shot at it three times, and later learned that 2 rounds of mine hit.

The dog then ran back into the house, but by now the SWAT team had broken down the front door.  It ran past them, and tried to bite the sergeant outside.  The sergeant ran to a police car to escape the dog.  Then the dog went after the SWAT guys back in the house.  One of the SWAT guys killed it with a 12-guage.

I can describe at least three incidents where suspects were shot with the 9mm and still fired at police.  One suspect was shot through the heart, and still fired 4 .38 rounds into a female officer.  (She survived, but was off work for over a year.)

Sorry, but based on what I have seen, I have no confidence in the 9mm.  The department I used to work for finally scrapped them in favor of the .40 caliber.

Point taken and appreciated.  Like humans, they can withstand many direct hits from 9mm, .40 cal, and even .45.  Heck, numerous hits by 5.56 are survivable.  I don't have a .40 here, I just pack my 147 grain +P+ JHPs in my G19.  I'll keep my Remington 870 and/or M4 close by so as not to draw attention from the neighbors.  But when I went out to nail the wood to the fence, I just had my G19 with me.  At a minimum, 15 rounds would have done something, hopefully killed the mutt, but at least stop him so I can retreat to the house.  I'm no scaredy cat, but I'm not stupid either.  At age 12, I was bit in the face by a dog whose owner couldn't control it, even on a leash.  It jumped up biting my face.  The bottom part of it's mouth actually went into my mouth (I know, very weird) and clamped down on the roof of my mouth while his upper jaw/snout big down on my face.  I was very lucky.  Only a few stitches and a fer faint scar today.  I still love all animals, but I don't trust anyones' but my own.

I love dogs and would take in strays to save them if I didn't live in a small apartment. I do whatever I can to protect dogs when I see them (including finding cats for them to eat  ;D).

If I were in your place, I wouldn't hesitate to shoot that dog as many times as necessary if I thought that it was endangering my family. And in my experience, no the cops won't do a thing if you shoot a neighbors dog that threatens you. In Lubbock last year a couple of cops shot a dog on the street that they thought had rabies, it didn't.

Quote from: Stonewall on November 07, 2007, 10:18:48 PM
On a side note, a Navy HM earned the Silver Star for actions in Iraq when he saved many Marines and killed many bad guys.

Is a Navy HM ALLOWED to kill MANY bad guys?

It was my understanding that medical personnel STILL went unarmed and were captured then indentured to care for wounded POWs with the assistance of supplies brought through the lines by the Red Cross/ Cresent. (According to the Geneva Conventions; had there been a change?)
...
Then again, considering the current oppositions failure to abide by the rules of civilized warfare, I can understand the reason you would arm a medic with an M4 carbine or M9 pistol.  :-\

Kirt,

A while back a friend's dog was attacked by the neighbor's pit who came through the back fence.  Here's some forwarded advice on how others have dealt with similar situations (aggressive neighbor dog) (most of them live in the country, not suburbia).

Document everything.  Try to get pictures of their side of the fence/their back yard in addition to the pictures of your side.  Talk to a lawyer to find out local codes, actions you can take.  If you feel you can't keep your composure if you talk face to face about the situation with your neighbor, send a letter (certified, if necessary).

Install a remote motion-activated detector in your yard that sounds an alarm in the house if there are any unwanted "visitors".

Install cement blocks, the kind you use for retaining walls that interlock along sections of the fence.

double fence the part of your yard that adjoins this neighbors and put some type of deterent between the fences - my inclination is towards razor wire! Maybe just a severly thorny shrub between their fence and the new fence you put up.

Put chicken wire or combination stock panels on the ground under the fence to prevent digging!
/Or cattle panel. Bought the 16' lengths and cut them down to about 1' tall by 16' long. Then I dug a narrow trench about 12" deep just inside my fenceline and sunk the panel pieces in.
/We just put them on the ground and tacked them in with landscaping nails. The grass grows through it and you can mow over it./ We use stock panels that are full height because our fence is away from the property line and we want more protection, but you can also use pig panels which are shorter./the panels don't have to be on top of the ground. You can rake up an inch or two of soil, lay the panels down, and cover them./ Pig Panels and have them bent to a 90 degree. Tack one side of the 90 to the fence and then tack the other 90 to the ground. A little sand and grass seed... good to go!

Just a few ideas to keep that dog out of your yard while you work toward resolution.

Praying for the safety of your family & pet,

Judy

Also, some vet clinics and pet stores have a spray that will deter animals like this pitbull.  You apply it to the OUTSIDE of your fence. The oder can be sensed by animals with smell better then ours. I think if you spray the INSIDE of the fence it might keep the pitbull from leaving (if he gets back in) and might keep your lab from going outside.
Or you could always electrify your fence. - two wires, four inches off the ground offset by one inch horizontally.   ::)

Quote from: SAR-EMT1 on December 03, 2007, 06:34:51 AM

Quote from: Stonewall on November 07, 2007, 10:18:48 PM
On a side note, a Navy HM earned the Silver Star for actions in Iraq when he saved many Marines and killed many bad guys.

Is a Navy HM ALLOWED to kill MANY bad guys?

It was my understanding that medical personnel STILL went unarmed and were captured then indentured to care for wounded POWs with the assistance of supplies brought through the lines by the Red Cross/ Cresent. (According to the Geneva Conventions; had there been a change?)
...
Then again, considering the current oppositions failure to abide by the rules of civilized warfare, I can understand the reason you would arm a medic with an M4 carbine or M9 pistol.  :-\

Totally posted in the wrong thread...

Quote from: SAR-EMT1 on December 03, 2007, 06:34:51 AM

Quote from: Stonewall on November 07, 2007, 10:18:48 PM
On a side note, a Navy HM earned the Silver Star for actions in Iraq when he saved many Marines and killed many bad guys.

Is a Navy HM ALLOWED to kill MANY bad guys?

It was my understanding that medical personnel STILL went unarmed and were captured then indentured to care for wounded POWs with the assistance of supplies brought through the lines by the Red Cross/ Cresent. (According to the Geneva Conventions; had there been a change?)
...
Then again, considering the current oppositions failure to abide by the rules of civilized warfare, I can understand the reason you would arm a medic with an M4 carbine or M9 pistol.  :-\

Off topic, I know, but a historical teaching point nonetheless.

Navy hospital corpsmen have not been issued nor have they worn the Red Cross brassard since Guadalcanal.  At Guadalcanal, it was apparent that the Japanese (NOT signatories to the Geneva Accords) were targeting medical personnel.  In Vietnam, I was issued a .45, but the training guidance we got at Field Medical Service School was to keep the .45 concealed, carry an M-16, and keep your medical gear in a grenade bag rather than your Unit-1.  In other words, look as much like a Marine infantryman as you can.  Snipers in Vietnam were known to target medics, officers, and radio operators.  Everyone important is carrying a .45, usually.

I was not assigned to an infantry unit, so I never had to use that advice.  But the Geneva rules still allow for medical personnel to be armed to defend themselves and their patients against an unlawful attack.

Hey Kirt, here's how you take care of the problem.  Get a dog bowl and fill it with antifreeze.  Then place said dog bowl near the open hole.  Observe said problem dog drinking antifreeze.  Problem solved.

Quote from: sargrunt on December 03, 2007, 03:58:05 PM
Hey Kirt, here's how you take care of the problem.  Get a dog bowl and fill it with antifreeze.  Then place said dog bowl near the open hole.  Observe said problem dog drinking antifreeze.  Problem solved.

And then be like "your dog should not have been in my yard".  Could this work on the neighbors as well?  Perhaps.

Having you considered getting a humane animal trap and capturing the mutt. Than when the Animal Control comes around you'll have ready him for delivery to the pound. I'm sure that Jax or Duval County will then be able to fine them an apropriate amount. Don't forget that they are also liable for the fence. Get an estimate and have it sent to them, along with a reminder that they'll pay this everytime their dog comes calling.  

Go outside this morning with son in hand only to find pitbull sitting there looking at me in my driveway.  Run back inside, drop off Junior and draw my gun.  Dog ain't there!  It's 0800 and animal control is awake.  I call them then take my son to daycare.

I come back and the animal control officer was in our backyard trying to catch the pitbull.  I identified myself as the home owner, a police officer and that I was armed.  The dog was aggressively charging the officer and he told me to shoot him if he escapes.  The dog tears down a couple more panels of the fence but the officer finally got the "catcher's pole" thing around the dog's neck.  Biting, clawing and charging, the dog wouldn't give up.  The officer had to drag the dog about 100 yards from our backyard to his truck.

The neighbor's son comes out along with the home owner's wife.  This, after the officer knocked on the door several times this morning.  Not to mention the 2 police officers yesterday as well as myself.  The whole time no fewer than 5 cars were parked in front of the house or in the driveway.

When questioned by the officer, the son explained that it wasn't his dog but he let it stay back there with his smaller pitbull puppy that he just happened to get the same time the large adult pitbull showed up.  The guy asked the officer if he could take the smaller dog too, but they don't come get dogs just because you don't want them anymore.  However, the officer explained how he would be charged with animal cruelty because the smaller dog is chained up in the backyard without shelter, water and has since got himself tangled up and there's obviously no supervision.

Now, I have a 3+ foot hole in my fence and a new appreciation for how to handle neighbors and their dogs.  Instincts were right in the is case, and we should never assume that a dog is friendly, especially if we've never seen it before, it has no collar, is a pitbull and keeps coming back after you scare it off.  Also, as the animal control officer explained, dogs don't have teer ducts so OC spray doesn't affect them unless you can get it into their mouth, then it's like feeding them the hottest of hot peppers.

Lesson learned?  I think so.  Shoot first!  But of course, I didn't want to be the neighbor that shot and killed the other neighbor's dog.  Although I would have been justified, I wanted to do as much as I could to not begin a futile war between my neighbors since we're the ones that have to live with them.  On a personal note, I don't see the situation getting better.

Enjoy the pictures....

(http://captalk.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3469.0;attach=1325)

(http://captalk.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3469.0;attach=1326)

(http://captalk.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3469.0;attach=1327)

Just out of curiosity...what made the dog bleed - the pole thingy or did someone open a can when it charged?

Glad to hear that you don't have to worry about that dog anymore, good luck with the neighbors though.

Quote from: jimmydeanno on December 03, 2007, 05:01:38 PM
Just out of curiosity...what made the dog bleed - the pole thingy or did someone open a can when it charged?

Dog kept fighting, biting the fence/wood, the pole and anything else it could.  I have video but I wouldn't know how to upload it, nor do I have the time to figure it out right now.

I still think the antifreeze would have worked out better.....

On the lighter side, I have to say that that is the ugliest dog that I have ever seen.  Hope it likes its' new home, behind bars.  Good going Kirt.  Now just got the pesky neighbors to take care of.  I recommend something in .308.

And who's paying for the fence???

Yours truly.  Afterall, "it wasn't their dog". 

A couple of weeks after Hurricane Katrina, I was protecting some FEMA folks and we were set upon by a small dog pack gone feral. It included Pitbulls and at least one shepard. The pack sent one dog to get right in my face and bark ( a clever distraction) while other dogs tried to flank me. They almost got away with it. Like many dog lovers, I was reluctant to shoot dogs. Several of these dogs had collars, but after a matter of only days they turned into a bunch of wild killer dogs, and learned to pack-hunt. It is amazing what things are built into our little fluffy pets' instincts. My tender heartedness almost got me killed. If I had waited for just a few more nanoseconds before opening fire, I would have been killed and probably eaten. ( I had my clients go slowly to the vehicle when I saw the dogs approaching, and cut off the dog's approach) The good news is that the pack scattered when I opened fire. Lessons learned? engage, engage, engage. Start shooting bad doggies before they close the range on you. Also, don't leave your CAR in the car!

I got sheist from the powers that be. They wanted top know why I did not start with a verbal challenge, pepper spray, ASP baton, etc. (show me your paws! show me your paws!) Its amazing how the Monday morning QB's can have such "helpful" suggestions when its your life on the line.

Stonewall, I think you showed commendable restraint in not killing that hell-hound the first time he showed up within a hundred meters of your kids! I am glad it all worked out without loss of life.

Major Lord

Quote from: Major Lord on December 03, 2007, 06:34:23 PMStonewall, I think you showed commendable restraint in not killing that hell-hound the first time he showed up within a hundred meters of your kids! I am glad it all worked out without loss of life.

Trust me, I'm re-hashing it through my mind and wish I had killed it when I first saw it.  While it was aggressive, it never got closer than 15M +/- to any of us and would run if you stomped your foot at it.  My wife didn't help matters any because she pleaded with me several times when I did in fact go outside and took aim.  I thought I got it taken care of when I nailed the wood to the fence, keeping it in my neighbor's backyard.  But of course, I was wrong. 

Fortunately, everyone is okay, no one even touched the dog or came close enough for it to touch us.  I know how things will end up with my neighbors and it's only a matter of time before SWAT kicks down their doors, I'm sure of it.  But until that happens, I don't want to be the neighbor that's known as the guy that will shoot your dog if I see it.  Kids in my neighborhood, and there are a lot of them, don't need to hear gunshots if I can help it.

I was actually a little disappointed in the police department's response.  If I were on duty and responded, I wouldn't have left until I knew the situation was under control.  The officer left without making contact or removing the dog from the property on Sunday.  Had to wait until Animal Control could show up on Monday.

My son is 16 months, it's not like he goes out and plays in the front yard unless we're out there with him.  Only thing that could have happened was my dog getting into it with the pitbull.  But I know, I'm pretty mad at myself for holding out.  I just expect too much from my neighbors since I live in a decent neighborhood.  All it takes is one bad neighbor to ruin a neighborhood.

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 06:44:33 PM
My son is 16 months, it's not like he goes out and plays in the front yard unless we're out there with him.  Only thing that could have happened was my dog getting into it with the pitbull.  But I know, I'm pretty mad at myself for holding out.  I just expect too much from my neighbors since I live in a decent neighborhood.  All it takes is one bad neighbor to ruin a neighborhood.

Nothing is more important than your Kids.  It doesn't matter if your son goes outside or not, things happen.  For example, you go to let your dog in, and that other dog runs in the house behind it and bites someone.  Relationships with your neighbors is a two-way street.  It seems like they have been rather disrespectful to you and your family.  I would seriously think about small claims for the fence.

Perhaps a letter from the family attorney threatening suit for mental anguish over the whole dog incident will be enough to line them out straight.

Anyway.....glad you got the dog out of there.     

Quote from: Cecil DP on December 03, 2007, 05:36:55 PM
And who's paying for the fence???

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 05:52:12 PM
Yours truly.  Afterall, "it wasn't their dog". 

I don't know about your location, but in a lot of places, if you put up or repair a fence between properties, both parties are liable for half the cost.  A party that doesn't want to pay it's fair share can even be sued for the amount.

Not sure about the fence issue, but the fence has needed to be replaced for a while now and neighbors on both sides showed an interest in replacement months ago.  We just haven't taken action.  Of course, this was well before issues started to arise.

Mikey.  I know things happen, but I can't just go shooting things because what may happen.  I've got youngsters behind me and both sides; ages ranging from 3 to 9.  I see dogs loose in my neighborhood on a weekly basis, most of which have collars and probably just squeeze through the fence or got out the doggy door.  I'd be hard pressed to explain shooting dogs just because they're out on the street and can potentially hurt someone.   Granted this situation was different and new to me.  I never pushed the dog or provoked it.  If we saw it, we simply shut the door or scared it off, from the safety of our back door.  I agree, anything can happen, but the only thing I would have changed would be pushing the responding officer on Sunday to go look for the dog and confront it.  Naturally, when we needed it, we couldn't find the dog.  Kept running away.  Also, learned from the officer that another family called in from a different street, so it was making it's rounds in the 'hood.

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 07:21:35 PM
Not sure about the fence issue, but the fence has needed to be replaced for a while now and neighbors on both sides showed an interest in replacement months ago.  We just haven't taken action.  Of course, this was well before issues started to arise.

Sounds like an opportunity here.  If the evil neighbor doesn't want to take responsiblity for the dog's damage, he might be receptive to the "it's time to replace our common fence" pitch.  (Normally, adjoining landowners are equally responsible for the cost of the fence.)

If he really is a good guy, this might be a face-saving way that will get the fence repaired without having to admit that he is responsible for the dog damage.

Just thinkin . . .

Quote from: Ned on December 03, 2007, 07:47:19 PMJust thinkin . . .

Always something good comes from you thinkin...

Oh yeah, the home owner himself is a good guy.  Retired Navy, works on computers, just doesn't have the same understanding that I do as far as how neighbors should act.  I think he's just in a bad position with him wanting to be the good dad and make sure his kids are taken care of and have a place to go when things get rough.  Unfortunately, I'm sure his kids abuse that open hand and open heart; or they simply just don't appreciate it.

Quote from: Ned on December 03, 2007, 07:47:19 PM
...(Normally, adjoining landowners are equally responsible for the cost of the fence.)...

Not around here...if you want to put up a fence you need the town's approval (after submitting a design sample (paper) and the pretty side needs to face your neighbor's property.  You are responsible for it soley.There aren't any "joint fences" because they need to be at least 10 feet from the property line which puts it on your property or theirs. 

Quote from: Stonewall on December 02, 2007, 07:25:25 PM
My hood (http://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&hl=en&ll=30.328141,-81.463076&spn=0.001336,0.002151&t=h&z=19&om=1)

Suburbia NOOOOOOO!!!!

In all seriousness this might help the barking problem:

http://www.smarthome.com/61392-stop-dog-barking.html (http://www.smarthome.com/61392-stop-dog-barking.html)
http://www.tesco-shopping.com/DogOff.htm (http://www.tesco-shopping.com/DogOff.htm)
http://koolatrononline.stores.yahoo.net/super-bark-free.html (http://koolatrononline.stores.yahoo.net/super-bark-free.html)

http://www.welistit.com/tv.html?Tp=2&Vl=33&Pos=10 (http://www.welistit.com/tv.html?Tp=2&Vl=33&Pos=10)
http://www.stopdogs.com/?gclid=CMH8hqP6jJACFSDyYAodtiK6tQ (http://www.stopdogs.com/?gclid=CMH8hqP6jJACFSDyYAodtiK6tQ)
http://www.izola.co.uk/bark-buster/body.htm (http://www.izola.co.uk/bark-buster/body.htm)



It's not right you might have to buy stuff to stop the dog from barking and using your house for a restroom but it beats having to crank off a few rounds and risk the vagaries of the court system.

Quote from: SAR-EMT1 on December 03, 2007, 06:34:51 AM

Quote from: Stonewall on November 07, 2007, 10:18:48 PM
On a side note, a Navy HM earned the Silver Star for actions in Iraq when he saved many Marines and killed many bad guys.

Is a Navy HM ALLOWED to kill MANY bad guys?

It was my understanding that medical personnel STILL went unarmed and were captured then indentured to care for wounded POWs with the assistance of supplies brought through the lines by the Red Cross/ Cresent. (According to the Geneva Conventions; had there been a change?)
...
Then again, considering the current oppositions failure to abide by the rules of civilized warfare, I can understand the reason you would arm a medic with an M4 carbine or M9 pistol.  :-\

Medic!: The Story of a Conscientious Objector in the Vietnam War (http://www.amazon.com/Medic-Story-Conscientious-Objector-Vietnam/dp/0891418482/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1196714696&sr=8-4)

I think maybe I was misunderstood or misrepresented my question. I know medics go armed for self defense.
Let me put it another way: As a medic, I thought you had a "bag limit"

Quote from: SAR-EMT1 on December 03, 2007, 10:19:41 PM
I think maybe I was misunderstood or misrepresented my question. I know medics go armed for self defense.
Let me put it another way: As a medic, I thought you had a "bag limit"

Dude, why are you in my "Neighbor Thread" with this medic stuff?  I think you're posting in the wrong forum.

We admitted it was off topic.  We'll stop now.

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on December 03, 2007, 10:43:38 PM
We admitted it was off topic.  We'll stop now.

No, I'm not mad, just saying, I thought this was the topic or a discussion in another thread on CAP Talk and maybe somehow got mixed into the "Neighbor" thread.  Just sayin'.

EDIT:  My bad, I looked back and somehow we topic drifted on like page 2 or something.  Continue, nothing to see here...I'd do push-ups but I'm still on profile.   8)

Kirt,

Are you truly done with this now?  Any chance Cheech (or is he Chong?) can go to the pound and bail it out?  It would suck to go through all this, only to have the mutt show up again in a couple of days and start causing trouble again.

I'm guessing since the critter was aggressive to the ACO, that they will most likely quarantine and euthanize it as a menace.  But it is something to think about.

Might also want to talk with your bros at the PD and see if they'll extend a fellow officer the courtesy of some extra patrols through your 'hood.  Those types of dogs are usually kept for a specific purpose, and you don't want Cheech's crew showing up torqued off because their stash protection got pinched.

I'm sure you know all this stuff, but check-six anyway, will ya?

Sp would it be safe to assume that if the neighbor could get the dog back, that his name would become "Old Yeller" if he shows back up in your backyard? Not saying to make the dog into swiss cheese, but enough is enough. Gotta protect what is yours.

Since the guy said it wasn't his dog, I'm sure it ain't coming back.  After the fight the ACO had to go through, and the words "that dog ain't making it through the night", I think it's a done deal.

Of course, will cover my 6.

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 10:56:20 PM
...I'd do push-ups but I'm still on profile.   8)

Beat your boots.  :D

It's a shame animal control wouldn't come out. Animal control in my jurisdiction works Mon - Fri 8-5 as well, but they always have someone on call for "aggressive animals".  But if it ain't aggressive, they ain't comin'!

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 06:44:33 PM
But until that happens, I don't want to be the neighbor that's known as the guy that will shoot your dog if I see it.  Kids in my neighborhood, and there are a lot of them, don't need to hear gunshots if I can help it.

Maybe it's time to file for an FFL, and obtain a suppressor or three. No worries about gunshots scaring the neighborhood. Plus, it allows reaquiring target much faster. I imagine that with your background, it wouldn't really be a problem.

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 06:44:33 PM
I was actually a little disappointed in the police department's response.  If I were on duty and responded, I wouldn't have left until I knew the situation was under control.  The officer left without making contact or removing the dog from the property on Sunday.  Had to wait until Animal Control could show up on Monday.

Maybe a good time to put the mightier pen to use. Situations like that need to be submitted as complaints. It's a case that could have turned very nasty, even deadly, and the issue needs to be dealt with. The Animal Control Officer that came out could have at least tried your cellphone.

Quote from: Stonewall on December 03, 2007, 06:44:33 PM
I just expect too much from my neighbors since I live in a decent neighborhood.  All it takes is one bad neighbor to ruin a neighborhood.

Does your HOA have any regular meetings? There are probably a few issues that need to be addressed. Too many cars is one thing that is considered a problem in many neighborhoods. Others have restrictions on  types of dogs. Cleanliness of yards is something that many cover too.

Your neighbor may be trying to be a good guy, but it sounds like he's a doormat. I don't know him, but it sounds like his good intentions are being taken advantage of by his kids.

An effective silencer can be made with a large potato.  Hollow out the inside, and put it on the end of your muzzle.

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on December 04, 2007, 09:26:22 PM
An effective silencer can be made with a large potato.  Hollow out the inside, and put it on the end of your muzzle.

You bring your silencer, I will bring a potato gun.  Man....... what fun we could have. 

I'll bring Hummus.  We can have a hummuside.

Remember, before hollowing out your potato you must have a Class II manufacturers License, filled out a BATF form 1, and paid your $200.00 tax stamp. Where are you going to put the serial number on the potato? By the way, it is Suppressor, not a silencer... or possibly its just a hollow potato....

Major Lord

Why spoil the beauty of it with legalities?

Quote from: Stonewall on December 04, 2007, 11:07:17 PM
I'll bring Hummus.  We can have a hummuside.

hahah  :o

Good one.  Made me laugh tonight!

.22 CB Caps with a 2 liter soda bottle over the end of the barrel works just wonderfully (or so I am told by those who might do such things... ;) )

Topic drift.