In which our squadron presents the colors...

[Holding Pattern]

I thought the picture was pretty awesome. Figured I'd share.

[Pylon]

Nice photo and nice color guard!  :clap:

[NIN]

Wow that's really cool

[Cadet12354]

Amazing picture.  Although I can see a few things wrong with the color guard, it overall makes a great impression, since any problems are nothing the audience would notice.  The military bearing looks great, the spacing is good, and it looks like the crowd is focused on the color guard (as they should be).  Overall, that color guard is a credit to CAP.

How many people were in attendance?

[Mitchell 1969]

Amazing picture.  Although I can see a few things wrong with the color guard, it overall makes a great impression, since any problems are nothing the audience would notice.  The military bearing looks great, the spacing is good, and it looks like the crowd is focused on the color guard (as they should be).  Overall, that color guard is a credit to CAP.

How many people were in attendance?

Aha, I knew patience would pay off. Sure enough, here is the eagerly anticipated "...a few things wrong..." post.

Please feel free to list them.

[NIN]

Although I can see a few things wrong with the color guard

<Jedi mind trick>
No, you don't
<Jedi mind trick>

There isn't anything wrong. They're presenting the colors at a major sporting event. Let them enjoy it. Let the crowd enjoy it. Let -us- enjoy it.

[Luis R. Ramos]

If there really are things wrong, they are too far away for us to notice. Let them enjoy the moment. Were you there to see their technique? No? Then please cool it...

[Cadet12354]

If there really are things wrong, they are too far away for us to notice. Let them enjoy the moment. Were you there to see their technique? No? Then please cool it...

Cool it?  What is that supposed to mean?  In addition to saying that I saw a few mistakes, I also said

Amazing picture.  Although I can see a few things wrong with the color guard, it overall makes a great impression, since any problems are nothing the audience would notice.  The military bearing looks great, the spacing is good, and it looks like the crowd is focused on the color guard (as they should be).  Overall, that color guard is a credit to CAP.

I was saying how good they looked.  I can't say something is 100% wonderful and perfect if it isn't, but if it looks amazing and is a credit to CAP, I will say it.  And I did.
And about their technique?  I did not see a video, but I can see what is in the picture.  And, I know what I am talking about, because I use the USAF Drill manual as a reference.  I never said that they did a bad job.  I said they did a great job.  I don't believe I have ever seen a perfect color guard, but this one is excellent.

If there really are things wrong, they are too far away for us to notice.

I specially noted that the audience cannot see any mistakes.  However, the people seeing the picture can see something wrong--the rifles are both in right shoulder, even though the USAF (and thus, CAP) has one rifle in right shoulder and one in left shoulder.  One person mentioned to me that it looks like they might be at Port.  That, too, would not be correct.  But, as long as they have good military bearing and make no huge mistakes (like dropping the American flag, which hopefully they did not), they are a credit to CAP.

There isn't anything wrong. They're presenting the colors at a major sporting event. Let them enjoy it. Let the crowd enjoy it. Let -us- enjoy it.

I showered praise upon them.  I said that they are a credit to CAP.  And, as for "There isn't anything wrong," I have actually reached a conclusion about that: after doing a lot of color guards, some of which had many thousands of people watching, I have concluded that any color guard that went perfectly, without a single hitch, is made up.  This conclusion is supported by a USAF Honor Guardsman with over 20 years of experience.  He said that every time, there will be something... all we can do is practice so that something isn't big.
I wish people weren't so quick to assume that others are trying to stir up controversy.  As I previously stated, I have done a lot of color guards.  Some of them were in front of many thousands of people.  If everyone had just said how wonderful we were, I would think that we were actually pretty bad and that people just didn't want to say.  But, if people had pointed out some small problems, it would bring me comfort that the things which were wrong were not major.
But truly, if doing right shoulder on both sides is the color guard's biggest problem, they are an amazing color guard.  I would like to reiterate that I love that picture and I think it is a great representation of CAP.
On another note, would there be any problem if I used that picture for recruiting materials?

[THRAWN]

It was a series of backhanded compliments. "They looked good but..." is not a compliment. As to your assertions about the handling of rifles and the Color Guard Manual of Arms, cite your source. Anecdotal evidence won't count.

[lordmonar]

Cadet12354.....sorry.  But you did not shower praise on them.

You Lead with

Amazing picture.  Although I can see a few things wrong with the color guard

You should have stopped after the first period.

[LSThiker]

However, the people seeing the picture can see something wrong--the rifles are both in right shoulder, even though the USAF (and thus, CAP) has one rifle in right shoulder and one in left shoulder.  One person mentioned to me that it looks like they might be at Port.  That, too, would not be correct.

They are not at port arms as you can see both left arms on the guards.

Cadet12354, please see CAPM 52-4 Figure 12-6.  What do you notice on the picture?

Edit:  Yes I know they remove the old NCC guide, but it is still an excellent guide for CAP color guards. 

[Luis R. Ramos]

Cadet,

Once you have participated in Color Guards you will be on a position to criticize.

Once you have trained Color Guards you will be in a position to criticize.

In my almost 14 years of CAP service I have trained a Color Guard. I have seen countless presentations of Color Guards.

You say they are at "Port Arms which is wrong."

It shows you do not know the Drill Manual you purport to live by. The position they are is Right Shoulder Arms. Like I said, you do not know the entire procedure they go thru since this is not a video but a photo!

Did you even stop to think they are in that little pause before they switch to Present Arms? A few seconds after, both rifles come to the front and other Flags are dipped... That is why...

OMG! The rifles are still at Right Shoulders and the CAP flag is still up!

When you laud, you do not criticize! That is what I meant by "Cool it!"

Color Guard of the Federal Protective Service. The rifles are both on the right side. Are they wrong?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_guard#/media/File:FPS_color_guard.jpg

[THRAWN]

Cadet,

Once you have participated in Color Guards you will be on a position to criticize.

Once you have trained Color Guards you will be in a position to criticize.

In my almost 14 years of CAP service I have trained a Color Guard. I have seen countless presentations of Color Guards.

You say they are at "Port Arms which is wrong."

It shows you do not know the Drill Manual you purport to live by. The position they are is Right Shoulder Arms. Like I said, you do not know the entire procedure they go thru since this is not a video but a photo!

Did you even stop to think they are in that little pause before they switch to Present Arms? A few seconds after, both rifles come to the front and other Flags are dipped... That is why... OMG! The rifles are still at Right Shoulders and the CAP flag is still up!

When you laud, you do not criticize! That is what I meant by "Cool it!"

Color Guard of the Federal Protective Service. The rifles are both on the right side. Are they wrong?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_guard#/media/File:FPS_color_guard.jpg

Forget the FPS, he used the example of the USAF HG. Use the Google and take a look at those images. Port arms, right shoulder...oh the horror....

Like you, I've been on them, trained them, evaluated them, etc, and he should cool it. Hopefully with the last few posts, he got the message.

To the OP, awesome. Not only a great pic, but a great experience. That seems to be getting overlooked here.

[Cadet12354]

It was a series of backhanded compliments. "They looked good but..." is not a compliment. As to your assertions about the handling of rifles and the Color Guard Manual of Arms, cite your source. Anecdotal evidence won't count.

http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/afman3622031_7A853B1DF6091.pdf
That is the USAF Drill and Ceremonies manual.  Look at Figure 7.10, Position of Flags at the Carry.

And what do you mean by, "a series of backhanded compliments"?  I did not say "They look good, but."  I said that it is a credit to CAP.  I don't give many CAP-related complements higher than that one.  I said that their military bearing looks great.  I said that their spacing is good (and anyone who had done a lot of color guard will know that spacing is hard to get right; saying the spacing looks good is actually a big complement).  I said that it looks like the crowd is focused on the color guard, which is pretty good, since the crowd (and lighting crew) will often ignore color guards.
Yes, I did say that there were a few things wrong.  But, I also said that it makes a good impression.  That is not backhanded.  As I attempted to explain, if people were telling me what a great color guard I was in, and no one mentioned anything wrong, I would think they were trying pretend that they liked it.
If I ever tell a lot of good points but just one or two bad points, like I did, that does not mean that I'm trying to be nit-picky.  It means that I'm impressed, and I think the color guard is very good; good enough to handle it.  If I had not liked it, I would have said nothing about it.
Just for the record, I think that color guard did an excellent job, at least from what I can see in the picture.  I would greatly appreciate it if people would please stop assuming that I am being overly critical.  I really, truly do not see how anyone could have gotten that from what I posted.  Before I posted, I read it over and over to try to prevent that.  However, I suppose that I still wrote it in a way that can be misinterpreted, so I apologize for that.  I meant only to say that it is every bit as good and any other CAP color guard that I have seen, and much better than some.  I was trying to say that the pros way outweigh any cons.  I was trying to say that I like that color guard; from what I can see of the picture.  I also was saying that I liked the photo; the lighting is amazing.  So, to clear the record, that is one of the best CAP color guard pictures I have ever seen.  Any problems are incidental; practically meaningless.  That picture shows a CAP color guard performing well; better than most others that I have seen.  I would seriously appreciate it if people would not try to say that I was being negative; I was not trying to.  I explained it, but I guess not well enough.  I apologize for writing anything that might have confused people.

And, another thing that I might have confused people with: I never said that anyone was at Port.  I said that someone else said what it looked like.  I said

the rifles are both in right shoulder, even though the USAF (and thus, CAP) has one rifle in right shoulder and one in left shoulder. One person mentioned to me that it looks like they might be at Port.

I could tell what it looked like; but I was trying to cover all of the bases just in case.  I guess I didn't do it well enough.
Please, please stop misunderstanding me.  I think the color guard looks great, but I do not think it is true praise to just say that, because of experience I have had with color guards.  I truly do not understand how anyone could have gotten anything else from it.  I guess I just worded things wrong.  If this is the case, please understand that I did not mean to leave a negative impression.  I liked the picture, and the color guard represented CAP and the USA with dignity and pride.

[THRAWN]

Pretty sure that CAP is not the Air Force...take a look in the CAP regs and manuals that govern color guards.

[THRAWN]

I liked the picture, and the color guard represented CAP and the USA with dignity and pride.

If you said that and left it there, none of this would be happening.

[C/Cool]

Cadet12345, please take the INSTRUCTIVE criticism and leave it at that. You defending your point is really making yourself and this thread look bad.

Everybody else, this thread is supposed to be about this color guard. Why can't we congratulate them and stop carrying on the arguments? If you have something negative to say to someone please say it in a PM. Negative post degrade the whole point of the original post. I do realize we are only trying to help someone out here but, could we do it more discreetly?

Thanks, and that is my two cents worth

[Cadet12354]

Pretty sure that CAP is not the Air Force...take a look in the CAP regs and manuals that govern color guards.

We use the USAF drill manual for everything else.  Why would we yank out the section on color guard and use the rest?  And yes, the Learn to Lead curriculum references the USAF drill manual, and CAPR 52-16 does as well.

I liked the picture, and the color guard represented CAP and the USA with dignity and pride.

If you said that and left it there, none of this would be happening.

I explained twice now that if I only say positive things, when there are negative things (and there always are negatives in color guards), it means that I do not think that the other people can handle it.  If I only get positive remarks, and nothing at all negative, I would be sorely offended, as would many other cadets I know.  However, if people mention the problems that really happened, and the problems are not bad ones; it is then that I know that I did a good job.  I had assumed that other people had the same thoughts on that.  I guess it was a bad assumption.
Please, I was just trying to give a complement in the way that I (and many other people I know) would enjoy it best.  There have now been six different people who said that I should not have done it.  Hasn't enough been said?

[abdsp51]

Pretty sure that CAP is not the Air Force...take a look in the CAP regs and manuals that govern color guards.

We use the USAF drill manual for everything else.  Why would we yank out the section on color guard and use the rest?  And yes, the Learn to Lead curriculum references the USAF drill manual, and CAPR 52-16 does as well.

I liked the picture, and the color guard represented CAP and the USA with dignity and pride.

If you said that and left it there, none of this would be happening.

I explained twice now that if I only say positive things, when there are negative things (and there always are negatives in color guards), it means that I do not think that the other people can handle it.  If I only get positive remarks, and nothing at all negative, I would be sorely offended, as would many other cadets I know.  However, if people mention the problems that really happened, and the problems are not bad ones; it is then that I know that I did a good job.  I had assumed that other people had the same thoughts on that.  I guess it was a bad assumption.
Please, I was just trying to give a complement in the way that I (and many other people I know) would enjoy it best.  There have now been six different people who said that I should not have done it.  Hasn't enough been said?

Until you have more experience equal to what many have here you are far from an expert.  I would love to attend one your meetings especially when you are doing D&C.  I'm sure I would and a few other SMs here would be able to pick that apart piece by piece but we'll cap it off with looks good.  Until you're stuff is spot on and squared away don't comment.

[SarDragon]

The AF D&C Manual has no mention of procedures for arms, other than this:

Units or organizations required to drill under arms will use the procedures in US Army Field Manual 22-5, Drill and Ceremonies, SECNAV 5060.22, Marine Corps Drill and Ceremonies Manual, or Air Force Academy Cadet Wing Manual 50-5.

From FM 22-5:

c. The Color guard is formed and marched in one rank at close interval, the bearers in the center. They do not execute rear march or about face. The Color guard marches at right shoulder arms and executes facing movements by wheeling to the right or left.