New to cadet staff, any helpful advice?

[pilot97]

I have recently been promoted to assistant flight sergeant and I was wondering if those experienced in being in a cadet staff position have any helpful advice to give? 

Thanks! 

C/TSgt.

[Extremepredjudice]

First thing is you should ask someone in your squadron.

[HGjunkie]

Check out CAPP 52-14 for a rough guide.

Ask your staff for any and all advice, that's what they're there for.

[pilot97]

First thing is you should ask someone in your squadron.

No offence Extreme Prejudice, but you don't have a staff position.

[pilot97]

First thing is you should ask someone in your squadron.

No offence Extreme Prejudice, but you don't have a staff position.

But thankyou  for the advice anyways.

C/TSgt.

[a2capt]

First thing is you should ask someone in your squadron.

Maybe.. just maybe .. It's a growing unit, there's never been position X before, maybe the question was posed to get some/multiple *additional* and varied viewpoints ..

[GTCommando]

Assistant Flight Sergeant. I'm assuming you're training to take charge of a flight in the near future. Here's some basic tips for new staff members:

1.  Know your core subjects. As the first person the cadets will ask for advice and instruction, you have to strive for excellence in drill, PT, wear of the Uniform, customs and courtesies, etc.

2.  Get to know your Chain of Command. You'll be interacting with these folks plenty in the next few months (or however long you're on staff), so it won't hurt to develop good working relationships with them.

3.  Watch and Listen. A smart man learns from his mistakes. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Are you going to make mistakes? Guaranteed, but the CAP Core Value of Excellence mandates you to constantly seek ways to improve yourself and your squadron.

4.  Be willing to work with people. Here's something I see lacking all too often in new staff members, especially as they start to advance. Conflict always falls into one of two categories: Matters of principle, and matters of style. The faster you learn how to tell the difference, the better. If you're willing to compromise and work with people on the little things, you boost your credibility and they'll be more willing to work with you on the big things later on.

That's all I've got tonight. If you have any questions or need some advice, feel free to PM me. I've trained squadron cadet staff from element leaders all the way up to cadet executive staff for the past two years. Odds are if there's an issue or question, I can answer it or I know someone who can.


Respectfully,

[Extremepredjudice]

First thing is you should ask someone in your squadron.

Maybe.. just maybe .. It's a growing unit, there's never been position X before, maybe the question was posed to get some/multiple *additional* and varied viewpoints ..

I'm in the same squadron as the OP.


Pilot pay close attention to 1 and 4.

[a2capt]

Pilot pay close attention to 1 and 4.

Posts 1 and 4 don't tell me much of anything other than he says you are not on staff. He could know this ... because you could be in units near each other, could have had PM's, could have met at some activity, could have ... LOTS OF THINGS.

* a2capt thinks some cadets are getting a bit bold in their actions and reactions.

If that's how you do it at your unit, well then..

[Extremepredjudice]

Pilot pay close attention to 1 and 4.

Posts 1 and 4 don't tell me much of anything other than he says you are not on staff. He could know this ... because you could be in units near each other, could have had PM's, could have met at some activity, could have ... LOTS OF THINGS.

* a2capt thinks some cadets are getting a bit bold in their actions and reactions.

If that's how you do it at your unit, well then..

I meant for pilot, the OP, to pay attention to GTCommando's post. Number 1 and number 4

[pilot97]

First thing is you should ask someone in your squadron.

Maybe.. just maybe .. It's a growing unit, there's never been position X before, maybe the question was posed to get some/multiple *additional* and varied viewpoints ..

You are partially right. It is definately a growing squadron. That is what I meant. Thankyou.

[pilot97]

Assistant Flight Sergeant. I'm assuming you're training to take charge of a flight in the near future. Here's some basic tips for new staff members:

1.  Know your core subjects. As the first person the cadets will ask for advice and instruction, you have to strive for excellence in drill, PT, wear of the Uniform, customs and courtesies, etc.

2.  Get to know your Chain of Command. You'll be interacting with these folks plenty in the next few months (or however long you're on staff), so it won't hurt to develop good working relationships with them.

3.  Watch and Listen. A smart man learns from his mistakes. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Are you going to make mistakes? Guaranteed, but the CAP Core Value of Excellence mandates you to constantly seek ways to improve yourself and your squadron.

4.  Be willing to work with people. Here's something I see lacking all too often in new staff members, especially as they start to advance. Conflict always falls into one of two categories: Matters of principle, and matters of style. The faster you learn how to tell the difference, the better. If you're willing to compromise and work with people on the little things, you boost your credibility and they'll be more willing to work with you on the big things later on.

That's all I've got tonight. If you have any questions or need some advice, feel free to PM me. I've trained squadron cadet staff from element leaders all the way up to cadet executive staff for the past two years. Odds are if there's an issue or question, I can answer it or I know someone who can.


Respectfully,

Thankyou very much. Your input is extremely helpful. 

[Extremepredjudice]

First thing is you should ask someone in your squadron.

Maybe.. just maybe .. It's a growing unit, there's never been position X before, maybe the question was posed to get some/multiple *additional* and varied viewpoints ..

You are partially right. It is definately a growing squadron. That is what I meant. Thankyou.

It is a growing squadron, but we've had at least one flight sergeant for at least a year and a half. (probably longer)

[GTRanger]

What I am about to say, is something that will help you out for the rest of your life, no matter what position you have. NEVER ASSUME THE CHAIN OF COMMAND WILL WORK ON ITS OWN. Or even work most of the time, for that matter. Never be afraid to double check and triple check something before doing it, because they guy above you, probably didn't check with his superviser.

[davidsinn]

What I am about to say, is something that will help you out for the rest of your life, no matter what position you have. NEVER ASSUME THE CHAIN OF COMMAND WILL WORK ON ITS OWN. Or even work most of the time, for that matter. Never be afraid to double check and triple check something before doing it, because they guy above you, probably didn't check with his superviser.

That's actually poor advice. If my cadet commander went to the commander every time I gave her instructions, I would replace her PDQ. If her flight Sgt came to me every time she gave him instructions, I'd let her rip him a new orifice.

[a2capt]

Absolutely. Agreed.
Yup. PDQ.

[GTRanger]

What I am about to say, is something that will help you out for the rest of your life, no matter what position you have. NEVER ASSUME THE CHAIN OF COMMAND WILL WORK ON ITS OWN. Or even work most of the time, for that matter. Never be afraid to double check and triple check something before doing it, because they guy above you, probably didn't check with his superviser.

That's actually poor advice. If my cadet commander went to the commander every time I gave her instructions, I would replace her PDQ. If her flight Sgt came to me every time she gave him instructions, I'd let her rip him a new orifice.

I meant for major things, you arent going to double check with your superviser over everything of course.  A lot of times there is a break down in the chain, and it is the responsibility of leaders to fix these break downs.

[davidsinn]

What I am about to say, is something that will help you out for the rest of your life, no matter what position you have. NEVER ASSUME THE CHAIN OF COMMAND WILL WORK ON ITS OWN. Or even work most of the time, for that matter. Never be afraid to double check and triple check something before doing it, because they guy above you, probably didn't check with his superviser.

That's actually poor advice. If my cadet commander went to the commander every time I gave her instructions, I would replace her PDQ. If her flight Sgt came to me every time she gave him instructions, I'd let her rip him a new orifice.

I meant for major things, you arent going to double check with your superviser over everything of course.  A lot of times there is a break down in the chain, and it is the responsibility of leaders to fix these break downs.

I feel sorry for you if your unit is that screwed up. The simple fact is: a subordinate is not supposed to go around the leader unless it is a) dangerous or b) violates regs.

[GTRanger]

What I am about to say, is something that will help you out for the rest of your life, no matter what position you have. NEVER ASSUME THE CHAIN OF COMMAND WILL WORK ON ITS OWN. Or even work most of the time, for that matter. Never be afraid to double check and triple check something before doing it, because they guy above you, probably didn't check with his superviser.

That's actually poor advice. If my cadet commander went to the commander every time I gave her instructions, I would replace her PDQ. If her flight Sgt came to me every time she gave him instructions, I'd let her rip him a new orifice.

I meant for major things, you arent going to double check with your superviser over everything of course.  A lot of times there is a break down in the chain, and it is the responsibility of leaders to fix these break downs.

I feel sorry for you if your unit is that screwed up. The simple fact is: a subordinate is not supposed to go around the leader unless it is a) dangerous or b) violates regs.

The experiences i alluded to happened to me many moons ago, if you will, but in a different squadron than the one I am at now. You are 100% right. A subbordinate should not have two double check anything with a superior, if he is authorized to do something. This would be a perfect chain of command, which sadly doesn't always exist. Depending on the situation though, one should never assume anything. I am simply trying to share the advice that i've been taught by experience to the cadet who started this thread, and asked for advice.

On another note, I am not saying "go around" anyone. I think you missunderstood me. The internet seems to do that sometimes, a person says one thing and it is taken differently by someone else.  I have found it useful in the past to just check with the guy who gave me the order or OKed me to do something, and see if he went the next step up. This way, you dont end up responsible for anything that wasnt sent through the chain. No going around anyone, no stepping on toes, just checking with the guy above you, to see if he went the next step up, before you go forward with something. Its called dotting your i's and crossing your t's.

-editted for clarity

[davidsinn]

I have found it useful in the past to just check with the guy who gave me the order or OKed me to do something,

This is good. Always clarify and instruction to make sure you do it right.

and see if he went the next step up.

Not your problem. If you follow a lawful order you are not responsible if the guy giving it to you shouldn't have. That's on him, not you.

[GTRanger]

I have found it useful in the past to just check with the guy who gave me the order or OKed me to do something,

This is good. Always clarify and instruction to make sure you do it right.

and see if he went the next step up.

Not your problem. If you follow a lawful order you are not responsible if the guy giving it to you shouldn't have. That's on him, not you.

It should be on him, but we dont live in a perfect world, and at times, the peons, if you will, get blamed. Just how some things turn out. Thats why we need great cadet leaders to step up to the plate and be responsible for their actions. I learn from all my experiences, even the bad ones. And look at the outcomes of some instances, and use them as guides for future reference. I agree with you 100% percent though.  The sad fact is, things sometimes dont go they way they should, and you have to adapt your leadership/followership styles to suit the situation.

[a2capt]

That is why you keep accurate records, and paper trails. (email trails... )

Have your plan, your goals, and assignments written down, and annotated by when/whom/where even, that direction was given.

When someone comes and says "*you* didn't do this right/whatever" you can reply with "I did it according to what I was instructed to do" .. and here's the details.

That's the proper way to dot your i's and cross those t's, and back up your actions with a solid foundation.

[GTRanger]

That is why you keep accurate records, and paper trails. (email trails... )

Have your plan, your goals, and assignments written down, and annotated by when/whom/where even, that direction was given.

When someone comes and says "*you* didn't do this right/whatever" you can reply with "I did it according to what I was instructed to do" .. and here's the details.

That's the proper way to dot your i's and cross those t's, and back up your actions with a solid foundation.

You Sir, are a genius, and think like me. I have a huge paper trail ( for example emails) for anything I do, just so I am ready to whip a document out on someone when they come and ask me about anything. My original point was that, in order to avoid all of this, you should double check with the guy who gave you the order to see if he went the next step up. That way, all controversy is avoided, and no blame will be created in the first place. Why go through all the drama and controversy if it can be avoided in the first place?

[CT074CC]

This thought of asking the person who gave you the order if "he went the next step up" is absurd.  If that person, your superior gives you an order, you simply follow it.  Whether he went the next step or not is really not your issue and quite frankly, one wouldn't be held responsible for such as they were following orders.  If something like that happened in my squadron, I would be dealing with the one giving the order, not the one carrying it out.

There's a chain of command for a reason.  It's too bad you've had a bad experience, but that doesn't nullify it's existence and it need to be followed without question.  This comment that it will be better to check your facts, controversy is avoided, etc. (I'm paraphrasing) is again, not your job.  That's why there are different levels of leadership and command.

[FlyTiger77]

My original point was that, in order to avoid all of this, you should double check with the guy who gave you the order to see if he went the next step up.

I strongly disagree. If a subordinate asked me that question, we would have a very direct one-way conversation. It is none of your business who your boss may or may not have checked with. Unless the order is illegal, immoral or unethical, it is your duty to follow it.

Of course, I also disagree with the CYA technique you espouse. I believe that integrity precludes the requirement for that. If I do something, I will tell you--good, bad or indifferent--and I expect the same thing from my subordinate leaders.

To the OP: Seek responsibility and take responsibility for your actions.

[shlebz]

Don't be afraid to get 'down and dirty' with your cadets. For example, sit with them at lunch during a sqd activity instead of at the staff table or go play catch with them instead of only talking to the other cadet staff memebrs there, i have found you create a better atmosphere and they resent you less and see you as more of a leader figure instad of a dictator figure. You also find out alot of information on what activities they like and whatthey don't like, what they are struggling with, what they wish your sqqd would do more of, etc. etc. In the end though, you have to make sure you do keep that line between you and your cadets. You do need them to know that you are in charge.