How many CAC reps have there been?

[Eagle400]

Was a CAC Rep (California Wing; Central Coast GRP IV Advisor) back in 2002. 

How many of us were there, from the inception of CAC to 2002?  I've tried research, but don't know for sure. 


Regards,

Michael A.T.S. Smith

Earhart 11826
Mitchell  47210
COS 2003 (Flight 4 - Phantoms)

[jimmydeanno]

1998-2000 with final term as wing chairman. 

Is the research for anything in particular?

[Eagle400]

1998-2000 with final term as wing chairman.

Bravo Zulu, sir!  I joined CAP in 1998!   

Is the research for anything in particular?

Yes.  A friend asked me, and I wish I could give her accurate info. 

[Ned]

FWIW, I was the CAWG CAC Chair in 1975.

Of course, back then it was a high speed organization, mind you.  We worked hard, but played hard as well . . . Heck, I remember the time that (excuse me for a moment)

HEY!, You darn kids get off my lawn!  I'll call your foks.  I will!

Oh, I'm sorry.  Where were we?

[AlphaSigOU]

CAC Chairman, Florida Wing Group 15, 1981-82

Senior Advisor, Texas Wing CAC, 2006-07

[Eagle400]

Thank You all for Your Service to CAC and our people!



But back to the original question...

How many of us have there been, from [when CAC first began] up to 2002?

I'm not really sure; need help here.


Now I figure if CAC began in 1964 (a guess), and there've been 55,000 members from then to 2002, then about .5% were Wing-Level CAC reps.  (Out of a combined total of 2,090,000 members).  Not sure what that number is... Terrible at advanced math... 

But like I said, I don't know the figure (ballpark).


Does the above sound plausible?

[JC004]

...
Does the above sound plausible?

No.

[Eclipse]

+1

[Eagle400]

Well hey, what can I say: I suck at math. 



Would it be okay to move on from here?  I could call National, but they may have no more info on this than I do...

[JayT]

Well hey, what can I say: I suck at math. 



Would it be okay to move on from here?  I could call National, but they may have no more info on this than I do...

What is all of this research for?

[Eagle400]

What is all of this research for?

Helping myself and others pin down how many of us there are, (or were) from the inception of CAC until 2002. 

[Майор Хаткевич]

Why stop at 2002?

[ßτε]

What is all of this research for?

Helping myself and others pin down how many of us there are, (or were) from the inception of CAC until 2002.

If you get your answer, what are you going to do with the information?

[JC004]

Well hey, what can I say: I suck at math. 



Would it be okay to move on from here?  I could call National, but they may have no more info on this than I do...

You do not have a sample here.  To create statistics, you need to either: 1. have a representative sample or 2. make them up.

NHQ is not going to have this information.  They do not track it.  Commanders appoint CAC representatives and it stays there.

So your options are probably either to make them up or go do something different - perhaps something useful, like cleaning up that oil spill or some such thing.

[heliodoc]

CAC Cadet Vice Chair MN Wing 1979

Do something useful?  CAC was fun while it lasted.  Met some good friends ....got to do some fun survival courses etc etc etc etc

But I soon realized it was a paper tiger like a lot of things in CAP

Speaking of which....why isn't CAP out doing public service like washing flying wildlife off with Dawn detergent like some past oil spills?

Excellent experience for those Senior Members that like to mouth off about how useless CAC was

Especially SM's that were not cadets and think CAC was no more than prima donnas or is that PRIMO donnas

[IceNine]

Excellent experience for those Senior Members that like to mouth off about how useless CAC was

Especially SM's that were not cadets and think CAC was no more than prima donnas or is that PRIMO donnas

^ Concur.

[Pylon]

There's no way to tell.  As mentioned, it's a local personnel action that even then is documented inconsistently.  So even if you had access to every CAP personnel file ever made, assuming none were ever destroyed, you still wouldn't be able to account for the total number of CAC reps.

Frankly, it's not a useful statistic to the organization.  Numbers and information that could be valuable to the organization would be those that account for what we've accomplished or quantify our value to society  -- like identifying cadets who have gone on to become CEOs or General Officers?  How many saves CAP has to its credit over history?  How many flying hours CAP logs in a year conducting one form of public service or another?  The value of the volunteer hours and services contributed by SMs?   Great information to start researching. 

The number of cadets who participated in CAC/went on a bivouac/wore shoe taps/earned a commander's commendation/sung dirty jodies during an arbitrary range of years is not particularly useful information, and I doubt anybody other than perhaps a trained statistician could give you an idea where to start.

[heliodoc]

Like many things in CAP that need to statistics to prove much of anything...

Its primary lack of historical records or record keeping of any sort especially when CAP members are throw away happy on anything.

With its "famous " 69 year history....remembering subchasers and all.  Whether CAPtalkers want to admit it or not...some good things in CAP came from spinoffs fom CAC and many other activities AFTER WWII.  No disrespect, folks.  Just what CAP needs to face......THE FACTS!!

What's going to be left of the history AFTER the subchasers?  Anything after this period CAPTalkers think there probably NO reason to hang on to any history of many CAP "milestones"........well 'cuz they are in the trash at the local dump.

But there is plenty of arbitrary facts and statistics that hold CAP together!!

[Pylon]

Like many things in CAP that need to statistics to prove much of anything...

Its primary lack of historical records or record keeping of any sort especially when CAP members are throw away happy on anything.

With its "famous " 69 year history....remembering subchasers and all.  Whether CAPtalkers want to admit it or not...some good things in CAP came from spinoffs fom CAC and many other activities AFTER WWII.  No disrespect, folks.  Just what CAP needs to face......THE FACTS!!

What's going to be left of the history AFTER the subchasers?  Anything after this period CAPTalkers think there probably NO reason to hang on to any history of many CAP "milestones"........well 'cuz they are in the trash at the local dump.

But there is plenty of arbitrary facts and statistics that hold CAP together!!

Did that post have a purpose?

(This must be the "how many trolls can we fit in one thread" contest.  I guess I missed the memo on that.)

Uhm, I'm not sure where that came from but nobody here suggested scrapping the CAP historian track, throwing out years of CAP newspapers and documents already archived, nor ignoring the benefits the organization has produced since our WWII roots.   I know some people love to harp on what CAP accomplished in WWII, but I like to think that we've accomplished a whole lot more since, and have touched the lives of many through both ES and our cadet program in the intervening years.

As for your concern for people throwing our history out the window:  again, we have a whole specialty track dedicated to preserving our organization's history, but to be blunt -- we don't have the resources of the national archives.  We can't meticiulously catalogue every newspaper article, every clipping, every personnel file, every memorandum, and piece of mail from every squadron across the U.S.  Just a single-year of the paper generated would fill a small warehouse.

Even the government and the military services still "re-discover" gems from their pasts, and they've received immense resources to preserve, archive, catalogue, and research their histories.  CAP does extremely well for the resources we've been given. 

So unless you have specific evidence of ongoing trends or want to identify specific policies that are causing us to lose important documentation for the future, I'd say your claims are baseless fear-mongering and ranting-and-raving.

[Eagle400]

If you get your answer, what are you going to do with the information?

Make it meaningful, useful, and purposeful for others and myself. 

(Not sure how else to answer).

[Майор Хаткевич]

If you get your answer, what are you going to do with the information?

Make it meaningful, useful, and purposeful for others and myself. 

(Not sure how else to answer).

HOW will you make it meaningful, useful, and purposeful for others and yourself?

[mynetdude]

If you get your answer, what are you going to do with the information?

Make it meaningful, useful, and purposeful for others and myself. 

(Not sure how else to answer).

HOW will you make it meaningful, useful, and purposeful for others and yourself?

I understand the CAC itself might be useful in some wings but CAC statistics doesn't seem useful as far as I can tell.

I have never been a CAC nor a cadet so I can't comment much on CAC because I do not want to be some SM making baseless comments about CAC as someone mentioned here have said some SMs do.

[SarDragon]

Backtracking a bit, i don't recall that CAC was in place in 1964. I'd say more like '66 - '68. I had my own car by the time I was rep, and don't recall driving to the meetings (an hour away) in the snow, so my tenure wasn't until '67 at the earliest. My "CAC-ness" is not documented in my olde cadet record, so the dates are only a SWAG.

[Eagle400]

HOW will you make it meaningful, useful, and purposeful for others and yourself?

Gather data, apply due diligent research, and ask lots of questions. 

Perhaps I should have gone straight to National? 

[JC004]

HOW will you make it meaningful, useful, and purposeful for others and yourself?

Gather data, apply due diligent research, and ask lots of questions. 

Perhaps I should have gone straight to National?

No.  National does not have this.  We said this already.  They could MAYBE tell you about NCAC.  If you are lucky.

[BillB]

dave
The first CAC Regulation was written in 1957. But the CAC was discontinued in 1960. The regulation was rewritten in 1963 and the CAC has been in existance since then in one form or another. The '63 Reg called for the CAC to be elected by cadets, not appointed as in the current 52-16. It provided a cadet chain of command to higher headquarters, something useful when there are unsolved problems at Squadron of Group level. The CAC was very effective in getting bad Commanders replaced after higher headquarters learnt of the problems and investigated.
Since the CAC has been in existance over 45 years, I doubt a complete listing could be made. Most CAC records are tossed out after five years.