CAP receipient of the Air Force Organizational Excellence Award.

[lordmonar]

The AFOEA was awarded to the organization not CAP-USAF...watch the ceremony.

Imagine that, CAP members get their first very real Air Force ribbon.

I earned two AFOEAs during my AF Career. It goes to un-numbered organizations that are recognized by the Air Force. It is NOT something just given away and NEVER take this recognition lightly!

Face it, there would have been a nomination package submitted through channels and approved at various levels of command authority for this very important award. It would be interesting to see the package. It will also be interesting to see the orders when they are published.

I suspect NHQ will forward the orders along with appropriate guidance when the time comes.

By the way, uniformed Air Force members get both the ribbon and the lapel pin...at least I did. That fact was reinforced when I requested replacements of medals from the National Personnel Records Center.

Stop quibbling about the details and give yourself a very well deserved pat on the back.

From my own perspective, it pretty strongly shows a shift in the Air Force's perception of the CAP that has been occurring so dramatically in the last two to three years.

Actually, AFOEA's and AFOUA's are not that hard to get. Mostly depends on the quality of the word smithing when putting together the package.
My Airlift Squadron got 5 AFOUA's over a 12 year period. And we weren't doing anything much different then any other squadron flying C-141's.
But we did have a kickass Squadron Exec who was an English Major and in her day job she was an English Teacher.

except for all those other units that did not get one.    Sure....the word smithing is important.  But with out documented actions to support the words.....you get butkus.   

[lordmonar]

Is there still that discrepancy between the CAP uniform and award regs where one says that you can wear US awards authorized by a competent authority and the other one says that they must have been earned while in service?

Easy to fix.

You and I have different definitions of the word easy.

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

[Eclipse]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

[lordmonar]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

[abdsp51]

And yes, if a cadet goes on to serve in the Air Force, does he or she take this award with them, the answer is yes. They would be entitled to continue wearing it, but I suspect that recognition will not formally transfer until they get to their first permanent base. It is, after all, the decision of an Air Force unit commander or the awards and decorations people at military personnel, and not the hair-splitting of CAP members on this website.

Have a cite for this?  Because I actually talked to a personnelist about this yesterday and the answer I received was no.  So no if a cadet enlists this will not transfer over.  In order for decorations to transfer they have to be prior service or awarded during current service. 

[Eclipse]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

Set the calendar - this would open doors left purposely closed for 20 some years.

[lordmonar]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

Set the calendar - this would open doors left purposely closed for 20 some years.

I don't know how it would "open a door".  It would be a one time, one line, change to the reg to apply to just one time period.    It may open to the door for more USAF awards....but that is it.

[flyboy53]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

Set the calendar - this would open doors left purposely closed for 20 some years.

I don't know how it would "open a door".  It would be a one time, one line, change to the reg to apply to just one time period.    It may open to the door for more USAF awards....but that is it.

I think that subject was run through the ringer once before. I don't think you'd ever see an AFOUA because of the nature of that unit award. I'd like to see a device on the Air Force Training Ribbon to reflect accession training from CAP for that former milestone cadet that enters basic, ROTC or the Academy.

Do you think someone will ever post the attachment and orders on this website?

I've now been retired from CAP for two years -- following 44 years of service -- and have little contact with the organization other than what I'm able to glean on-line.

[raivo]

And yes, if a cadet goes on to serve in the Air Force, does he or she take this award with them, the answer is yes.

I am politely skeptical.

[Flying Pig]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

Set the calendar - this would open doors left purposely closed for 20 some years.

I don't know how it would "open a door".  It would be a one time, one line, change to the reg to apply to just one time period.    It may open to the door for more USAF awards....but that is it.

I think that subject was run through the ringer once before. I don't think you'd ever see an AFOUA because of the nature of that unit award. I'd like to see a device on the Air Force Training Ribbon to reflect accession training from CAP for that former milestone cadet that enters basic, ROTC or the Academy.

Do you think someone will ever post the attachment and orders on this website?

I've now been retired from CAP for two years -- following 44 years of service -- and have little contact with the organization other than what I'm able to glean on-line.

Do we really need the USAF to recognize a youth organization with a device on a military ribbon?  Once enlisted, if a cadet made it their Mitchell, their service in CAP is reflected by their extra stripes on their sleeve.  What is it with people in CAP and wanting recognition for everything and constant reassurance from the USAF?  I would be absolutely embarrassed to wear a blanket award from the USAF the same way I was embarrassed to wear the black beret in the Army when Gen Shinseki thought giving everyone a hat would make them feel elite. 

[Holding Pattern]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

Set the calendar - this would open doors left purposely closed for 20 some years.

I don't know how it would "open a door".  It would be a one time, one line, change to the reg to apply to just one time period.    It may open to the door for more USAF awards....but that is it.

I think that subject was run through the ringer once before. I don't think you'd ever see an AFOUA because of the nature of that unit award. I'd like to see a device on the Air Force Training Ribbon to reflect accession training from CAP for that former milestone cadet that enters basic, ROTC or the Academy.

Do you think someone will ever post the attachment and orders on this website?

I've now been retired from CAP for two years -- following 44 years of service -- and have little contact with the organization other than what I'm able to glean on-line.

Do we really need the USAF to recognize a youth organization with a device on a military ribbon?

Last I checked CAP is more than a youth organization. I've even heard rumblings that it is an auxiliary of a major organization, with real missions and stuff!

[lordmonar]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

Set the calendar - this would open doors left purposely closed for 20 some years.

I don't know how it would "open a door".  It would be a one time, one line, change to the reg to apply to just one time period.    It may open to the door for more USAF awards....but that is it.

I think that subject was run through the ringer once before. I don't think you'd ever see an AFOUA because of the nature of that unit award. I'd like to see a device on the Air Force Training Ribbon to reflect accession training from CAP for that former milestone cadet that enters basic, ROTC or the Academy.

Do you think someone will ever post the attachment and orders on this website?

I've now been retired from CAP for two years -- following 44 years of service -- and have little contact with the organization other than what I'm able to glean on-line.

Do we really need the USAF to recognize a youth organization with a device on a military ribbon?  Once enlisted, if a cadet made it their Mitchell, their service in CAP is reflected by their extra stripes on their sleeve.  What is it with people in CAP and wanting recognition for everything and constant reassurance from the USAF?  I would be absolutely embarrassed to wear a blanket award from the USAF the same way I was embarrassed to wear the black beret in the Army when Gen Shinseki thought giving everyone a hat would make them feel elite.

Did you have a problem with wearing the unit awards that your unit won in WWII or WWI?   Coming from an ex-army member.....too much bling.....is a little of the pot calling out the kettle.

[MHC5096]

 :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

[PHall]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

Set the calendar - this would open doors left purposely closed for 20 some years.

I don't know how it would "open a door".  It would be a one time, one line, change to the reg to apply to just one time period.    It may open to the door for more USAF awards....but that is it.

I think that subject was run through the ringer once before. I don't think you'd ever see an AFOUA because of the nature of that unit award. I'd like to see a device on the Air Force Training Ribbon to reflect accession training from CAP for that former milestone cadet that enters basic, ROTC or the Academy.

Do you think someone will ever post the attachment and orders on this website?

I've now been retired from CAP for two years -- following 44 years of service -- and have little contact with the organization other than what I'm able to glean on-line.

Do we really need the USAF to recognize a youth organization with a device on a military ribbon?  Once enlisted, if a cadet made it their Mitchell, their service in CAP is reflected by their extra stripes on their sleeve.  What is it with people in CAP and wanting recognition for everything and constant reassurance from the USAF?  I would be absolutely embarrassed to wear a blanket award from the USAF the same way I was embarrassed to wear the black beret in the Army when Gen Shinseki thought giving everyone a hat would make them feel elite.

Did you have a problem with wearing the unit awards that your unit won in WWII or WWI?   Coming from an ex-army member.....too much bling.....is a little of the pot calling out the kettle.

Pat, he wasn't in the Army. He was a Marine. Just a small, slight difference there.

[DakRadz]

   I would be absolutely embarrassed to wear a blanket award from the USAF the same way I was embarrassed to wear the black beret in the Army when Gen Shinseki thought giving everyone a hat would make them feel elite.

Did you have a problem with wearing the unit awards that your unit won in WWII or WWI?   Coming from an ex-army member.....too much bling.....is a little of the pot calling out the kettle.

Pat, he wasn't in the Army. He was a Marine. Just a small, slight difference there.

He referenced wearing a black beret due to Shinseki. Pretty distinctly Army.

(I know Flying Pig was in the USMC, but didn't he lateral one way or the other to/from the Army? That would make sense.)

1st Lt Raduenz

[lordmonar]

"All members (Active, retired, patron, sponsor and cadet...et al) who were members in good standing for at least one day from Oct. 1, 2012 thru Aug. 31, 2016 are allowed to wear the AFOEA.  This can be worn on both USAF style and Corporate uniforms.   The placement will be in accordance with CAPM 39-1 and AFI 36-2903."   

That took me all of two minutes.

That's because the above sentences are contradictory under the current regulations.

It's easy to just write something on the whiteboard as you walk out the door if you don't actually care about the regs.

When making an exception to the current regulations......it will be contradictory to the current regulations and once the above lines are inserted into the regulations then it will be part of the regulation and not contradictory at all.

Set the calendar - this would open doors left purposely closed for 20 some years.

I don't know how it would "open a door".  It would be a one time, one line, change to the reg to apply to just one time period.    It may open to the door for more USAF awards....but that is it.

I think that subject was run through the ringer once before. I don't think you'd ever see an AFOUA because of the nature of that unit award. I'd like to see a device on the Air Force Training Ribbon to reflect accession training from CAP for that former milestone cadet that enters basic, ROTC or the Academy.

Do you think someone will ever post the attachment and orders on this website?

I've now been retired from CAP for two years -- following 44 years of service -- and have little contact with the organization other than what I'm able to glean on-line.

Do we really need the USAF to recognize a youth organization with a device on a military ribbon?  Once enlisted, if a cadet made it their Mitchell, their service in CAP is reflected by their extra stripes on their sleeve.  What is it with people in CAP and wanting recognition for everything and constant reassurance from the USAF?  I would be absolutely embarrassed to wear a blanket award from the USAF the same way I was embarrassed to wear the black beret in the Army when Gen Shinseki thought giving everyone a hat would make them feel elite.

Did you have a problem with wearing the unit awards that your unit won in WWII or WWI?   Coming from an ex-army member.....too much bling.....is a little of the pot calling out the kettle.

Pat, he wasn't in the Army. He was a Marine. Just a small, slight difference there.

Then why would he be embarrassed "the same way I was embarrassed to wear the black beret in the army....."

[jeders]

   I would be absolutely embarrassed to wear a blanket award from the USAF the same way I was embarrassed to wear the black beret in the Army when Gen Shinseki thought giving everyone a hat would make them feel elite.

Did you have a problem with wearing the unit awards that your unit won in WWII or WWI?   Coming from an ex-army member.....too much bling.....is a little of the pot calling out the kettle.

Pat, he wasn't in the Army. He was a Marine. Just a small, slight difference there.

He referenced wearing a black beret due to Shinseki. Pretty distinctly Army.

(I know Flying Pig was in the USMC, but didn't he lateral one way or the other to/from the Army? That would make sense.)

1st Lt Raduenz

As I recall, he went Army Reserve (maybe guard) after his service in the Marines was over.

[NIN]

BTW, in case anybody is wondering....

The Air Force has not made a formal decision yet on whether CAP members will be able to wear the Air Force Organizational Excellence Award on the Air Force style uniforms.  Please ask your members to be patient until we receive the final decision from the Air Force.  Hopefully we will have the answer to that and other related questions within a few weeks.

[THRAWN]

BTW, in case anybody is wondering....

The Air Force has not made a formal decision yet on whether CAP members will be able to wear the Air Force Organizational Excellence Award on the Air Force style uniforms.  Please ask your members to be patient until we receive the final decision from the Air Force.  Hopefully we will have the answer to that and other related questions within a few weeks.

Thanks. Source?

[Eclipse]

BTW, in case anybody is wondering....

The Air Force has not made a formal decision yet on whether CAP members will be able to wear the Air Force Organizational Excellence Award on the Air Force style uniforms.  Please ask your members to be patient until we receive the final decision from the Air Force.  Hopefully we will have the answer to that and other related questions within a few weeks.

That looks like a KB response.

I have to go sit down the room is spinning.

Why aren't these questions asked and answered beforehand?

This is the kind of thing that wastes the most time, effort, initiative and worst, esprit-de-corps -
specifically rushing things out the door, when there is no actual rush whatsoever, many times
ignoring the advice, sometimes solicited advice, of the membership at large.

• 10 years to update 39-1, member input ignored, rushed out the door broken, remains broken 2 years later.
  
  Encampment curriculum in draft form for 3 years, tested for two more, published seriously broken, remains broken 2 years later.
  
  ABU ICL published broken / incomplete, update broken / incomplete, remain broken.

But NHQ can issue emergency instructions overnight on what email signature to use,
(which was also largely unusable by many email systems).

The above are just three high-visibility examples of what can be found all across the regs and policies,
and that doesn't even account for all the places Wing and below make up more rules or replicate these problems.

Now add up all the times questions are raised about things that should be fixed when found, x's member hours,
and you have one of the top ten reasons mission-centric things aren't getting done.

In this case...

"Hey boss, cool on giving CAP that award, but you know their regs don't allow for the members to be awarded
military decorations, right?"

"Wow, really?  Hadn't considered that..."

"Yeah, and even if we waive the first part, other regs preclude about 1/2 the adult membership from
wearing military awards at all, and giving it to cadets may cause real issues, plus, there's the issue
of whether AD and Reservists could wear it on their uniforms..."

"Plus there's the thorny issue of whether or not their patrons, sponsor and legislative members should receive it,
and what about all those members we just heard about that never show up...ever?"

"Hmmm...OK, write the dec up as an "honorarium recognizing contribution but not to include individual decorations."

"Done, thanks...this will look real nice on their flag and make a good press release..."