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Safety Vests

Started by isuhawkeye, October 19, 2007, 07:02:28 PM

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isuhawkeye

After several uniform discussions several members have expressed concern over the safety of our ground teams.  the images to follow have been taken from a presentation I use to train fire and EMS crews on road side safety.  Enjoy. 


















I hope this has been usefull

Dragoon

Good brief.  Based on this, it seems the different levels are primarily used to make yourself visible to cars.  Since CAP adopted vests not to provide roadside visibility, but rather to provide field visibility, seems like Class Is would be fine.

O-Rex

Class II if you are marshalling aircraft.

Vanguard actually sells a CAP logo vest specifically for flightline personnel: don't know if it meets these specs.

Avery

I just took delivery of two Vanguard CAP safety vests, they look to be Class II. We use them on the flight line, so I think we're OK.
Avery Loucks Maj, CAP
In transistion to Washington, DC area

SDF_Specialist

This would be a good ES/Safety briefing. Awesome presentation.
SDF_Specialist

MIKE

ORANGE reflective is a key word as far as vests for CAP use.
Mike Johnston

Steve Silverwood

#6
Quote from: isuhawkeye on October 19, 2007, 07:02:28 PM
After several uniform discussions several members have expressed concern over the safety of our ground teams.  the images to follow have been taken from a presentation I use to train fire and EMS crews on road side safety.  Enjoy. 

Excellent presentation!  :clap:

Quote from: MIKE on October 19, 2007, 08:24:46 PM
ORANGE reflective is a key word as far as vests for CAP use.

If that's mandated by the regs, then they might want to reconsider.  That new neon-lime-green-whatever color they're using in school zones these days is strikingly visible.  Grabs my attention a lot quicker than the orange color ever did.

Funny story, only very vaguely related: when I got my orders back to Alaska in 1977, I got a new car before going.  (Alaskan winters can be rough on a car, and I wanted something very reliable.)  My grandmother was so worried that I'd be lost forever in a blizzard or something, so she was absolutely serious about wanting me to get a car painted international distress orange!!  ;D
-- //Steve//

Steve Silverwood
kb6ojs@arrl.net

pixelwonk

Quote from: MIKE on October 19, 2007, 08:24:46 PM
ORANGE reflective is a key word as far as vests for CAP use.
that's two words.

* tedda ducks
:P

MIKE

Mike Johnston

Dragoon

Quote from: O-Rex on October 19, 2007, 07:57:30 PM
Class II if you are marshalling aircraft.

Vanguard actually sells a CAP logo vest specifically for flightline personnel: don't know if it meets these specs.

Is class II a CAP requirement for flight line, or a recommendation?

O-Rex

Quote from: Dragoon on October 19, 2007, 08:39:52 PM
Quote from: O-Rex on October 19, 2007, 07:57:30 PM
Class II if you are marshalling aircraft.

Vanguard actually sells a CAP logo vest specifically for flightline personnel: don't know if it meets these specs.

Is class II a CAP requirement for flight line, or a recommendation?

Dunno: I just got schooled on the topic reading this, like all of you...

I saw two reflective vests on Vanguard, the standard orange one that they sold for years, and a new green one, for flightline marshalling.

Mike, thanks for the orange font, I now get an after-image when I stare at a blank wall: will probably have to change my eyeglass prescription :o

Anyway, at $30, the vests are not cheap (at Vanguard, what is?) but they do have the nifty CAP graphics, and I've seen them up-close: they are pretty heavy-duty.

PHall

We had some new road guard vests at Encampment this year.
They were yellow with white reflective strips and flashing red lights (light emitting diodes).
They had Civil Air Patrol printed on them and I am told they came from Vanguard at about $40 each.

If they can't see you when you're wearing this vest, they have no business driving!

Eclipse

I agree 100% that retro-reflective, whatever the color, is the way to go.

The "CAP" stenciled vest is very nice, but unfortunately made of a very stiff material, and although it is fairly adjustable I could never get it to sit right.

In a previous vest thread, I noted (IMHO), that the orange SAR-MED type vest, readily available on eBay and other sources, are your best best for most CAP functions: http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=1071.0

The above thread has similar photographs from the ground and air which show why high-vis is important.

As noted there, my Tactical vest has lights!  http://group22.net/files/other/vest/vest.wmv
BTW - the tapes now say "U.S. CIVIL AIR PATROL".  ;)

"That Others May Zoom"

0

As a safety guy, my feeling is wear what makes you most visible. 

1st Lt Ricky Walsh, CAP
Boston Cadet Squadron
NER-MA002 SE, AEO & ESO

alamrcn

I am a little glad that 39-1 doesn't mandate the reflective vests. The only reason  being that they are not as easy to obtain as your typical "hunter" blaze orange style. Althought I don't have one because they are not allowed, I would prefer to wear the bright yellow with silver relective stripes. Some members do wear these, and as far as I know they go unchallanged. Pick your battles I guess, who wants to tell someone they are too safe?!

My real reason for posting is do any of these materials hold up better than another with BURS? You know, those little balls you collect like Pokemon after an intensive line search through the woods.

The first vests that the Bookstore sold were molded plastic mesh. Although they folded up like hell in your pack, they were pretty resistant against nature's little hitch hikers. I guess most safety vests aren't really made with our use in mind.

- Ace



Ace Browning, Maj, CAP
History Hoarder
71st Wing, Minnesota

Eclipse

I have them with me in both colors, as you said pick the battles and go with safety, though my "main" vests are orange.

The current version is a thickly-molded plastic which stands up well to just about anything, versus the cheaper cloth vented vests which tend to get torn apart with regular wooded use.

"That Others May Zoom"

floridacyclist

I'm not sure where reflectieve is not mandated, I've always seen the word reflective used with safety vet, maybe that's just in the gear list in the GT/UDF curriculum.

Either way, reg or not, it's common sense. Orange is nowhere nearly as visible as white at night, so people thinking they're being safe are lulled into a false sense of security as in the dark, their orange vest isn't much more visible than their BDUs.

We get our vests from a local industrial safety supply store. They're orange with lime-green reflective stripes and highlights, lightweight and soft enough to be comfortable plus fits into a grenade pocket on one of my ammo pouches. They run about $14.00...I would think yo could get them from places like Gall's as well.
Gene Floyd, Capt CAP
Wearer of many hats, master of none (but senior-rated in two)
www.tallahasseecap.org
www.rideforfatherhood.org

MIKE

The GT and UDF task book sez Orange Reflective.
Mike Johnston

floridacyclist

#18
And I see in 39-1 where it refers to "A safety vest must be worn when participating in Ground Team activities"  and then later on under "Wear instruction/materials" it states that "Orange plastic, mesh, or cloth. Will be worn when participating in ground team activities."

Another one of those discussions from the ES thread over what takes precedence...the reg or the training guide....or common sense

To me, the most common sense approach would be to replace "orange" with flourescent or even ANSI/OSHA-approved (not sure which one would govern that, but you get the idea) and require reflectiveness across the board in order to avoid confusion.

"flourescent, contrasting with predominant local foliage colors, plastic, mesh, or cloth with reflective trim. Will be worn when participating in ground team activities."

Maybe we should suggest that as a reg change...they do happen even from the bottom up, last year we got black t-shirts authorized for wear with BBDUs since white looked so goofy.
Gene Floyd, Capt CAP
Wearer of many hats, master of none (but senior-rated in two)
www.tallahasseecap.org
www.rideforfatherhood.org

0

Quote from: MIKE on October 25, 2007, 10:01:36 PM
The GT and UDF task book sez Orange Reflective.

Mike as has already been stated Orange Reflective doesn't always show up.  The newer stuff is much safer, remember those reqs were written before the new stuff came out.  Also remember that SAFETY is our top priority and if we were something that is to keep us safe in some way shape or form that is ok.

1st Lt Ricky Walsh, CAP
Boston Cadet Squadron
NER-MA002 SE, AEO & ESO