NCO Duty Positions and Responsibilities

[kwe1009]

A lot of this points to my personal idea (that is, it is not a goal or task for the NCO committee) about changing the way people join CAP.

If I were god for a day.....

A person off the street with no military expiernce, no advanced degree, no advanced skills, would join up an Airman Basic.
Level I and six months in.....they get promoted to Amn.
10 months TIG and an Apprentice  rating (new name for tech rating) in a specialty tract they can be promoted to A1C.
20 months TIG and 36 months time in service they can be promoted to SrA.

A person coming into CAP with advanced degrees, skills, etc that would normally be associated with officer ranks would follow the same promotion scheme except they would wear Flight Officer Stripes. 

Join as a Basic Flight Officer
Six Months and Level I....Flight Officer
10 months TOG and an Apprentice rating.....Flight Officer First Class
20 months TIG and 36 Time in service they would be Senior Flight Officer.

At the the three year mark.  SrA and SFOs with a degree (say an Associates or 60 hours of college credit) could opt to go to the Officer Basic Course (sort of like an RSC type course) and then at the four year mark they can be promoted to 2d Lt.

The SrA with out degrees can go to the NCO basic course (a week long RSC type course) and at the four year mark they can be promoted to SSgt.

Both officer and NCO promotions from that point of will be driven by PD progression and performance of duties at appropriate levels of responsibilities.    That is no one get promoted beyond capt with having performed staff or command duties outside of the squadron.  Same story with the NCOs.

Those people who were SFOs but do not have degrees (say a pilot who does not have a degree) they can promote up the chain as well as Chief Flight Officers (CFO-1, CFO-2, CFO-3)

That's my idea of how things should be.   

Once again....this is not the official policy/goal/stance of CAP or the NCO committee.....just my own little pipe dream.

Definitely a pipe dream but it is a great dream!  I think this would be a great approach and honestly could be implemented pretty easily.  It would recognize those with military experience while not putting those with no experience above them as the current system does.

[lordmonar]

Your personal idea actually makes more sense than some of the aspects of the official NCO program.

That's the problem with leadership by committee vs leadership by decree.

The NCO committee can only do things that affect NCOs.   We can't make direct changes to the officer system.  We can't make changes to the PD system that affects officers.

We can develop and NCO corps that positions CAP to be able to make those changes to the other programs.....if we can get them to see the wisdom of them.

Which is the frustration I have here on CAPTALK where you all complain about how slow we are getting this thing rolling and how come it seems to be only going half way.

There are a lot of people in CAP and they all have good ideas about how things are supposed to be.   And the are all good ideas.   It is no harm no foul.   It is just slow.

First we got to come up with the vision and direction.   Then the actual ideas, work out the bugs, then convince 75.32 other CAP members (who either don't have any idea what we are talking about, or see it as a cut into their territory, or just don't like change) that what we want to do is a good idea.   We got to do all this with out torking off the USAF, or alienating the officer corps (when we start talking about those Lt Cols who never did anything outside of their squadron.) or riling the rank and file with a "you pulled the rug out from under our feet" (a.k.a. the changes to officer promotions Level V for Lt Col).

And if you even suggest that you are even thinking about making degrees required for promotion.......make sure you got your fire proof britches on!

[Storm Chaser]

Your personal idea actually makes more sense than some of the aspects of the official NCO program.

That's the problem with leadership by committee vs leadership by decree.

The NCO committee can only do things that affect NCOs.   We can't make direct changes to the officer system.  We can't make changes to the PD system that affects officers.

We can develop and NCO corps that positions CAP to be able to make those changes to the other programs.....if we can get them to see the wisdom of them.

Which is the frustration I have here on CAPTALK where you all complain about how slow we are getting this thing rolling and how come it seems to be only going half way.

There are a lot of people in CAP and they all have good ideas about how things are supposed to be.   And the are all good ideas.   It is no harm no foul.   It is just slow.

First we got to come up with the vision and direction.   Then the actual ideas, work out the bugs, then convince 75.32 other CAP members (who either don't have any idea what we are talking about, or see it as a cut into their territory, or just don't like change) that what we want to do is a good idea.   We got to do all this with out torking off the USAF, or alienating the officer corps (when we start talking about those Lt Cols who never did anything outside of their squadron.) or riling the rank and file with a "you pulled the rug out from under our feet" (a.k.a. the changes to officer promotions Level V for Lt Col).

And if you even suggest that you are even thinking about making degrees required for promotion.......make sure you got your fire proof britches on!

The thing is unless there is a clear direction from the National Commander and all those involved in making decisions, there's not much the NCO Committee, or any committee for that matter, can do. Maybe Maj Gen Carr shared this vision, but after two years in the works, I'm not convinced the current National leadership does.

[FW]

The thing is unless there is a clear direction from the National Commander and all those involved in making decisions, there's not much the NCO Committee, or any committee for that matter, can do. Maybe Maj Gen Carr shared this vision, but after two years in the works, I'm not convinced the current National leadership does.

I think you are correct on this.  I don't remember seeing this in the current strategic plan nor have I heard of anything recent (other than here on CT) about progress on the program.  Like so many other initiatives, (anyone remember OE2), the NCO program evolution may have ended up in no man's land.

[PHall]

The thing is unless there is a clear direction from the National Commander and all those involved in making decisions, there's not much the NCO Committee, or any committee for that matter, can do. Maybe Maj Gen Carr shared this vision, but after two years in the works, I'm not convinced the current National leadership does.

I think you are correct on this.  I don't remember seeing this in the current strategic plan nor have I heard of anything recent (other than here on CT) about progress on the program.  Like so many other initiatives, (anyone remember OE2), the NCO program evolution may have ended up in no man's land.

I do believe I did say in the past, on this board, that the formal NCO program will go away in about 2 years due to lack of interest from above.
This was very much the previous National Commander's baby. The current National Commander has other concerns.

[JeffDG]

The thing is unless there is a clear direction from the National Commander and all those involved in making decisions, there's not much the NCO Committee, or any committee for that matter, can do. Maybe Maj Gen Carr shared this vision, but after two years in the works, I'm not convinced the current National leadership does.

I think you are correct on this.  I don't remember seeing this in the current strategic plan nor have I heard of anything recent (other than here on CT) about progress on the program.  Like so many other initiatives, (anyone remember OE2), the NCO program evolution may have ended up in no man's land.

I do believe I did say in the past, on this board, that the formal NCO program will go away in about 2 years due to lack of interest from above.
This was very much the previous National Commander's baby. The current National Commander has other concerns.

I believe I have chimed in with a similar opinion as well.  My thoughts are drawn to the fact that it was released half-baked, with required duty positions and no actual duties for those positions, as a midnight reg-drop just before the change of command.  It was done half-way because the outgoing CC didn't thing the incoming CC would do it at all, and that's all they had ready for him to sign off on.

That's 100% speculation on my part, but it fits the available evidence.