Black Boots in ABUs?

[Stonewall]

From this week's Air Force Times:

Editorial: Say yes to black, general   

When Gen. Norton Schwartz takes over as Air Force chief of staff, a proposed uniform change will be sitting on his new desk: allowing airmen who work on the flight line or perform other dirty jobs to wear the old black leather boots with their new airman battlefield uniforms.

The new green suede boots might be fine for the pristine confines of the office, but they don't belong where grease and grime come with the job.

it's hard to believe anyone involved in the decision to switch boots thought green suede on the flight line was a good idea.

What was a good idea, however, was the decision to solicit airmen's suggestions for uniform improvements online. Hundreds of airmen took that opportunity to ask that they be allowed to wear black boots with their new ABUs.

Many told Air Force Times they avoid wearing the new boots on their everyday jobs, where they'll quickly be ruined, by shucking their ABUs and wearing the old battle dress uniform, with which black boots are OK. but that's a short-term solution — the BDU will be permanently retired in 2011.

To its credit, the Air Force Uniform Board responded to the airmen's input and approved a plan to let those who do dirty jobs return to leather footwear. Virtually all the other players — the Air Force personnel responsible for improving service uniforms, Defense Department and private-sector suppliers and the Army and Air Force Exchange Service — think it's a good move.

And it is. By signing off on the uniform board proposal, Schwartz has an opportunity to show, early in his tenure, that he will put common sense and the needs of rank-and-file airmen high on his priority list. He should jump on it.

[RiverAux]

Gee, actually soliciting opinions on something from the people out on the ground directly rather than expecting them to try to push something up 30 levels of the chain of command....maybe its something CAP might like to think about?

[CASH172]

^Then what's Captalk. 

[mikeylikey]

hmmm........perhaps ditch the green boots altogether.  Silly to have half in green, half in black.  Uniformity=uniform sameness. 

[Hawk200]

The Navy just came out with a no shine black boot for their new utilities. Maybe the Air Force should consider it.

[Cecil DP]

The Navy just came out with a no shine black boot for their new utilities. Maybe the Air Force should consider it.

You know it's been 61 years since the Department of Defense was created and the 5 services still can't get together on a common utitlty/field uniform. Instead they have to have a diferent color and material for each service. With all the cost involved there should only be 1 field uniform.

[Smithsonia]

May I introduce a definition. Uniform is both an adjective AND a noun. Conformity is an adjective only.
Please review the following and consider that many people on this board mix-up and misunderstand all three definitions. Regarding footwear: Calvary boots, tennis shoes, jump boots, corofam and leather low top dress shoes are all uniform footwear as are stadium pumps, provided you're female. Conformity, is a different word because it means a different thing. Uniforms, the noun, is indentified dress to a specific group, not conformity and not uniformity. Nothing more. If the tarmac-tigers in black boots will be accidentally shot as intruders to the flight line by Air Police because they're in black boots... then I can see your consternation. I know I've just pulled the alert-alarm for the Cap-talk uniform police. Let us pray they are never in charge of flight-line security too.
With regards; ED O'BRIEN

UNIFORM:
ADJECTIVE:
   1. Always the same, as in character or degree; unvarying.
   2. Conforming to one principle, standard, or rule; consistent.
   3. Being the same as or consonant with another or others.
   4. Unvaried in texture, color, or design.
NOUN:
   1. A distinctive outfit intended to identify those who wear it as members of a specific group.
   2. One set of such an outfit.

[Smithsonia]

To finish my point about footwear and uniformity/conformity: Let us consider the most uniform and conforming in all of the military... The Sentinel Wall Walkers at the Tomb of the Unknowns at Arlington. BUT even they have an exception to footwear for purpose. WITH REGARDS; ED O'BRIEN

Please read and consider the following.

The shoes are standard issue military dress shoes. They are built up so the sole and heel are equal in height. This allows the Sentinel to stand so that his back is straight and perpendicular to the ground. A side effect of this is that the Sentinel can "roll" on the outside of the build up as he walks down the mat. This allows him to move in a fluid fashion. If he does this correctly, his hat and bayonet will appear to not "bob" up and down with each step. It gives him a more formal and smooth look to his walk, rather than a "marching" appearance.

The soles have a steel tip on the toe and a "horseshoe" steel plate on the heel. This prevents wear on the sole and allows the Sentinel to move smoothly during his movements when he turns to face the Tomb and then back down the mat.

[RickFranz]

The Navy just came out with a no shine black boot for their new utilities. Maybe the Air Force should consider it.

You know it's been 61 years since the Department of Defense was created and the 5 services still can't get together on a common utitlty/field uniform. Instead they have to have a diferent color and material for each service. With all the cost involved there should only be 1 field uniform.

I think the closest they have come to one service uniform was the BDU's.  I have seen Soldiers, Sailors and Airman in that uniform.  Now we have to move away from that, change the color but don't reinvent the wheel.  Rant over!    I do think that working around oily things like aircraft makes sense to keep something on your feet that won't show it.

[LittleIronPilot]

The Navy just came out with a no shine black boot for their new utilities. Maybe the Air Force should consider it.

You know it's been 61 years since the Department of Defense was created and the 5 services still can't get together on a common utitlty/field uniform. Instead they have to have a diferent color and material for each service. With all the cost involved there should only be 1 field uniform.

I am SOOOO with you on that. One freaking uniform across all branch's.

[DC]

The Navy just came out with a no shine black boot for their new utilities. Maybe the Air Force should consider it.

You know it's been 61 years since the Department of Defense was created and the 5 services still can't get together on a common utitlty/field uniform. Instead they have to have a diferent color and material for each service. With all the cost involved there should only be 1 field uniform.

I am SOOOO with you on that. One freaking uniform across all branch's.

I don't have a problem with distinctive dress uniforms, each service has a unique heritage that goes into their uniform, but there is no reason to have a different field/combat uniform for each service. With BDUs at least everyone looked alike, they had different insignia, and that is fine, but the base uniform was the same. Now we have 4 different uniforms, only one of which seems to be any kind of viable camouflage - MARPAT. The entire military should convert to either MARPAT or Multicam. The MARPAT style seems to be functional enough, and the pattern works. Multicam is an excellent universal pattern that works fairly well in multiple environments.

But, alas, wishful thinking.

[Hawk200]

Multicam is an excellent universal pattern that works fairly well in multiple environments.

But, alas, wishful thinking.

Maybe not. The Army is considering Multicam for the next utility uniform. Most likely they'll digitize it and find a way to get out of any licensing fees.

[DC]

Multicam is an excellent universal pattern that works fairly well in multiple environments.

But, alas, wishful thinking.

Maybe not. The Army is considering Multicam for the next utility uniform. Most likely they'll digitize it and find a way to get out of any licensing fees.

I knew the Army was looking at Multicam, I was referring to the entire Armed Forces adopting the same combat uniform, and being more concerned about having an effective uniform, rather than something 'distinctive'.

It would seem to me that a single uniform would also aid in battlefield IFF.. But what do I know...

[SarDragon]

Lemme ask a Q here - why does the Navy need a green working uniform? Previous iterations have been blue my whole life, and probably quite a few years before that. Granted, there are certain small segments that wear camo uniforms of some sort, but they are already well taken care of with the MarPat and whatever the SEALS are wearing these days.

Help me out here.

[Hawk200]

Lemme ask a Q here - why does the Navy need a green working uniform? Previous iterations have been blue my whole life, and probably quite a few years before that. Granted, there are certain small segments that wear camo uniforms of some sort, but they are already well taken care of with the MarPat and whatever the SEALS are wearing these days.

Help me out here.

They're not green. It's a digital camo utility (designed to hide dirt and grime, not the wearer) similar to the old BDU. A link to the Navy Task Force Uniform page with the working uniform:

http://www.npc.navy.mil/CommandSupport/USNavyUniforms/uniform_photos.htm

Don't think there's any green whatsoever. As long as you don't think of it as meant to conceal the wearer, it's OK looking.

[DC]

It is made up of varying shades of blue and grey on a MARPAT like pattern, with regular black boots or black suede boots.

[Smithsonia]

To match the Blue Marpat -- If we go to blue suede boots Carl Perkins and Elvis will come back to the building. Sorry, I know this is a serious topic and I tried to control myself... but I failed.
With regards;
ED OBRIEN

[RiverAux]

When the Carrier mini-series was on recently I was surprised to see how many Navy personnel were regularly wearing BDU pants.   Obviously the camo was worthless, but the pants themselves are pretty handy for a lot of dirty jobs. 

[SarDragon]

Lemme ask a Q here - why does the Navy need a green working uniform? Previous iterations have been blue my whole life, and probably quite a few years before that. Granted, there are certain small segments that wear camo uniforms of some sort, but they are already well taken care of with the MarPat and whatever the SEALS are wearing these days.

Help me out here.

They're not green. It's a digital camo utility (designed to hide dirt and grime, not the wearer) similar to the old BDU. A link to the Navy Task Force Uniform page with the working uniform:

http://www.npc.navy.mil/CommandSupport/USNavyUniforms/uniform_photos.htm

Don't think there's any green whatsoever. As long as you don't think of it as meant to conceal the wearer, it's OK looking.

Ouch. Those service uniforms look BAD! Glad I won't have to wear them.

As for the green question, I was referring to commentary that seemed to suggest a single uniform color for all services.

[DC]

Lemme ask a Q here - why does the Navy need a green working uniform? Previous iterations have been blue my whole life, and probably quite a few years before that. Granted, there are certain small segments that wear camo uniforms of some sort, but they are already well taken care of with the MarPat and whatever the SEALS are wearing these days.

Help me out here.

They're not green. It's a digital camo utility (designed to hide dirt and grime, not the wearer) similar to the old BDU. A link to the Navy Task Force Uniform page with the working uniform:

http://www.npc.navy.mil/CommandSupport/USNavyUniforms/uniform_photos.htm

Don't think there's any green whatsoever. As long as you don't think of it as meant to conceal the wearer, it's OK looking.

Ouch. Those service uniforms look BAD! Glad I won't have to wear them.

As for the green question, I was referring to commentary that seemed to suggest a single uniform color for all services.

The Navy doesn't need a green/camo uniform, but they are the odd man out, the rest of the services do. I think it would be simpler and much easier on the $$$ if the whole military, with the possible exception of the Coast Guard, because of their law enforcement role, went to a single combat uniform. Money is not wasted on developing a uniforms for each service and having to produce said uniforms. You could instead devote the resources required to produce all those separate uniforms to making a single one. Much more efficient, and likely cheaper all around.

And by one uniform I am not suggesting one uniform for all climates. *cough*ACU *Cough* But like a modern BDU, a style of uniform with different patterns for different environments, but that standard style would be universal across the military.

[mikeylikey]

^ ACU??  There are various uniform combos of that uniform for various climates.  Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying..........

[DC]

^ ACU??  There are various uniform combos of that uniform for various climates.  Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying..........

It is my understanding that the Universal Pattern camouflage that appears on the ACU is intended to camouflage the wearer in a multitude of environments, eliminating the need for separate patterns for different environments.

I was referring to the camouflage pattern on the ACU, not the style of uniform directly.

[mikeylikey]

^ Understood.  My mistake!

[Hawk200]

It is my understanding that the Universal Pattern camouflage that appears on the ACU is intended to camouflage the wearer in a multitude of environments, eliminating the need for separate patterns for different environments.

Intent is far different than application. I've only been one place that the ACU "Universal" camo would have been effective. The Denver International Airport terminal. The colors would have been perfect.

The Army is already considering ditching it.

But back to the original post: Black boots may be OK, as long as you don't have to actually shine them to keep them from getting ruined by oil and grease. The old ones did need a little bit of wax for that reason. It made a difference.

[Stonewall]

New Airman Battle Uniform Boots
Week of February 15, 2010

The results are in, and the final decision has been made concerning a prototype Airman Battle Uniform stain-resistant boot for wear in industrial environments. The wear test choice is a sage green, full-grain leather boot, which incorporates a rubber toe and heel cap that resists staining and increases durability. As an interim solution until a stain-resistant boot is produced, a policy has been issued allowing commanders to authorize wear of black boots in specific industrial work areas.

Once a stain-resistant boot is approved for production, the black boot wear policy will be phased out and replaced by the new sage green stain-resistant boot for industrial use only. More information will be available on the approval and production of a new stain-resistant boot by early summer 2010.

LINKY

[raivo]

Intent is far different than application. I've only been one place that the ACU "Universal" camo would have been effective. The Denver International Airport terminal. The colors would have been perfect.

Late to the party, but...

[RiverAux]

Beetle Bailey could probably use that uniform to hide from Sarge...

[Hawk200]

Intent is far different than application. I've only been one place that the ACU "Universal" camo would have been effective. The Denver International Airport terminal. The colors would have been perfect.

Late to the party, but...
...

Way late, that pic's been out since a few months after ACUs were first fielded. It's been a running joke in the Army for years.

It's old, even though it is hilarious.

[TACP]

If we were able to change something about the ABUs boots would be the least of my worries. The uniform is terrible in general, from the material to the setup. Boots generally come in the same variety as the tan/black, and it doesn't really matter because they all get dirty and brown. Lets try to make a uniform that is light weight, long lasting, and has pockets that are actually functional.

They had 'Battlefield Airman' careerfields test wearing this uniform for 2-3 years before mass production, with each person giving huge amounts of input on how STUPID it is. The only change? Slight variation to the color.

[Hawk200]

Lets try to make a uniform that is light weight, long lasting, and has pockets that are actually functional.

Unfortunately, the two concepts are somewhat mutually exclusive. What's possible is a heavier weight, but breathable.

The problem is that the military doesn't want to spend the money to develop it. They also don't want to pay someone else who's already done the developing. There's the additional issue of each branch is just inherently incapable of accepting the results of other branches, and at times outright contradicting previous research.

They had 'Battlefield Airman' careerfields test wearing this uniform for 2-3 years before mass production, with each person giving huge amounts of input on how STUPID it is. The only change? Slight variation to the color.

Yeah, didn't help credibility at all when a Chief, wearing what is not lovingly known as "blueberry camo", made the statement that "I was standing next to a blue spruce and the camo worked great!".

I'm thinking that each branch needs to quit doing their own research, and simply identify their needs to a central DOD development section, and let that one central point develop everything. One uniform camo, let that central office develop any variants that are needed in the way of flyers, convoy operators, spec ops, etc. Get rid of the elitist and really unnecessary utilities that only exist for branch ego and create higher senseless costs.

Hmmm, that felt kind of good...

[PHall]

I'm thinking that each branch needs to quit doing their own research, and simply identify their needs to a central DOD development section, and let that one central point develop everything. One uniform camo, let that central office develop any variants that are needed in the way of flyers, convoy operators, spec ops, etc. Get rid of the elitist and really unnecessary utilities that only exist for branch ego and create higher senseless costs.

Oh, so you want DARPA to mess with it. That could be interesting...

[TACP]

Lets try to make a uniform that is light weight, long lasting, and has pockets that are actually functional.

Unfortunately, the two concepts are somewhat mutually exclusive. What's possible is a heavier weight, but breathable.

I would disagree... I find the summer weight BDUs to be a comfortable material/weight, and still wear an acceptable set of mine from 4 years. Of course a little faded, but that's expected. It's the little things that are irritating about ABUs, like putting the pen pocket on the inside of the sleeves so they jab you in the bicep any time you're working. Or my favorite, not putting pockets on the sleeves because we want to keep the 'heritage' of the stripes. Are we serious here? Make our WORK uniform functional, worry about history with the blues.

And you mentioned saving money as well, which the Air Force really hasn't done. Instead of creating a uniform we could wear at all times they spent some unspeakable amount producing ABS-Gs, which actually have EVERYTHING that you could possibly want on a work uniform, but can only be worn outside the wire.

[Hawk200]

I would disagree... I find the summer weight BDUs to be a comfortable material/weight, and still wear an acceptable set of mine from 4 years.

That's actually the same basic material that ABU's use, but I've never really considered that ripstop "long lasting". Yeah, it is possible to wear them for four years, I've done the same thing, but you've got to admit it takes some care to do it. Washing them properly, not starching them, and certainly not using an ironing system that burns holes above the buttons.

There are materials that would make a summerweight uniform only slightly thicker, but even more breathable than ripstop. The problem is expense. No military branch wants to do it, and they don't want to pay anyone that's done the research for their product. It's a "Not Invented Here" syndrome.

The Air Force put out that it was impossible to replace the flightsuit with a camo printed version because there was no way to make the print on Nomex. Funny, in that the Army had been doing it for years with the ABDU, and now the A2CU. It was basically a case of "It can't be done" ahead a whisper of "We don't want that". It's an example of one service contradicting another because the research doesn't meet one's desires.

Or my favorite, not putting pockets on the sleeves because we want to keep the 'heritage' of the stripes.

I hear that. If memory serves, the Air Force was the only branch to have stripes on the sleeves of BDUs. All the other branches wore collar insignia.

[Hawk200]

Are we serious here? Make our WORK uniform functional, worry about history with the blues.

Agreed. The service uniforms should be service identity, when it comes to the field, use what works not what's pretty.

There's an additional OPSEC advantage to it. When you see a service specific field uniform, it doesn't take much to figure out what they're up to. In your own case, a bunch of airman around means that some aerial firepower is probably not too far behind. Not so bad if you get to wear the ACU when you're hanging with us grunts, but why should you need special issue to do that? With all branches in the same field utilities, you won't need it, you're all already wearing the same thing.

Standardizing rank placement and size wouldn't hurt, either. And when it comes to accessories, the Marines adopted a very practical concept that I read about fifteen years ago, coyote brown. Instead of two different colors of web gear (green and tan), you had one that worked with either uniform and in multiple environments. A Multicam print for all services with coyote brown accessories would handle most environments that any branch would work in.

And you mentioned saving money as well, which the Air Force really hasn't done. Instead of creating a uniform we could wear at all times they spent some unspeakable amount producing ABS-Gs, which actually have EVERYTHING that you could possibly want on a work uniform, but can only be worn outside the wire.

I picked up that issue of the Times while in theatre, it looked like it did have just about everything you'd need. But it could probably still use some fine tuning. However, that's where a central development would pay for itself. What's good for the Airman medic is just as good for the Navy Corpsman, or the Ranger medic.

A joint development with all branches present but under a DOD office would probably be the ticket on getting everyone something that works well with less cost to the taxpayers footing the bill. Sure, you might have a standard duty uniform, a convoy uniform (with flash resistant properties), a flyer/fuelers fire resistant outfit, a medics ensemble, etc; but even the more specialized uniforms would be cheaper because they're standardized.

Keeping in mind the original topic, black boots with ABUs comes back to the original outlook of the Air Force in that you have to be neat and pressed all the time, stains on your boots just aren't acceptable. I don't think anyone should show up to work looking like they got an oil bath, but stains during the day and on working boots are a given, and should be accepted.

[raivo]

Related: http://www.armytimes.com/news/2010/02/army_multicam_030110w/

Interesting pattern, it looks like a cross between the DCU and the BDU.

[TACP]

It's an amazing pattern, one that is actually effective in more places than a rock quarry. Best of all the Air Force is already looking at outfitting their combat airman with the same for outside the wire ops.

[Stonewall]

From Aug 2009...

The 2010 House Defense Authorization Bill Requirements for Standard Ground Combat Uniform This section would require the Secretary of Defense, in consultation with the Defense Logistics Agency, to require that future ground combat uniforms be standardized in order to ensure increased interoperability of ground combat forces and reduce tactical risks encountered when military personnel wear a different uniform from their counterparts in the other military services in a combat area.

Full article: Congress Proposes Common Ground Combat Uniform

Best of all the Air Force is already looking at outfitting their combat airman with the same for outside the wire ops.

AFSOC Security Forces out of Hurlburt Field, FL in January 2008.


A members of a Deployed Aircraft Ground Response Element from the 1st Special Operations
Security Forces Squadron catalog and bag evidence gathered from a simulated high value
target elimination scene during the Emerald Warrior Exercise, Feb. 3. The forensic evidence
collected from the scene could result in the identification of other high value targets. 
(Photo by Senior Airman Julianne Showalter : 1st Special Operations Wing Public Affairs)


A member of a Deployed Aircraft Ground Response Element from the 1st Special Operations
Security Forces Squadron surveys the area for threats during a tactical evidence collection
simulation during the Emerald Warrior Exercise, Feb. 3. Collecting forensic evidence from the
scene verifies the elimination targets and provides further intelligence for other high value
targets.  (Photo by Senior Airman Julianne Showalter : 1st Special Operations Wing Public Affairs)

[fquinonez]

I must say that there have been some very interesting comments and it seems that a lot of you truly believe that there should only be one uniform.  We have tried that with the original Camouflage Utility Uniform, aka BDU's or cammies.  The issue was that there was no standard wear.  The Navy and Marine Corps rolled/folded our sleeves one way and bloused trousers over our boots.  The Army and Air Force rolled a different way and tucked their trousers in their boots.  Then came all of the insignia and attavchment goodies.  When I was on active duty, Marines did not wear anything on the Cammies other than an Eagle, Globe, and Anchor ironed on to our left breast pocket, along with rank insignia on our collars.  The only time we had names showing on our uniforms was when you were on a MEU at sea.  When we were forced to apply name tapes in 1991, there was a huge backlash, but we did as the Commandant ordered.

One of the reasons that the Marine Corps has trade marked the new digtal pattern for a few different reasons, one of them is because as Marines, we expect a higher standard and thus do not allow anyone to wear the uniform that is not a Marine.  I have friends who left active duty in te Marine Corps and are serving forward with the Marine Corps, and they are not allowed to wear the new pattern.  They wear the older desert camo patterns. 

Pride and tradition in the Marine Corps and Naval Services around the world are incredibly important and those traditions must be protected.  Even from those that meant no harm.

(off soap box)

[fquinonez]

One more comment on this.  Even though the Army and Air Force encourage their personnel to wear the utility uniforms off base, the Marine Corps specifically does not allow this practice.  A while back the Marine Corps relaxed the rules to allow for short stops out in town for gas, picking up kids, etc.  However, when the current Commandant took command, he issued a Marine Corps Order banning all use of utility uniforms off base, unless you are in your vehicle driving to or from work.  No stops are allowed.

Many think this is not right, but if this is supposed to be a work uniform, it will get dirty.  If you are dirty, you should not wear it around civilians, becuse you are an ambassador of not only your branch of service, but the United States Armed Forces as a whole.

[Spike]

^ fquinonez,

Wow.  That was a lot to take in.  If you bear with me I will try to tackle your posts in some logical manner.

First, you are repeating the "we are best, because we are Marines" propaganda that is primarily used as a recruitment tool.  The Marine Corps in fact did not patent the digital pattern.  It was in fact vetted at the Army Labs at Aberdeen Proving Grounds, and has a copyright by the Department of Defense.  The pattern is available to any Armed Service should they choose to use it.  I believe it was a DOD directive in the late 1950's that stated "the Services are required to share innovations and designs between each other".  Thus the "one uniform" idea was born.  Green Fatigues were the first uniform worn by each Armed Service, and each was allowed to add to the basic design service distinctive emblems and traditions.  The Marines chose to wear green fatigues a certain way, just as the Air Force chose to place blue name and branch tapes on the shirt.

Later the BDU's were adopted with the same agreement, that each service gets the BDU's and can add to the design, but not take anything away.

One of the reasons that the Marine Corps has trade marked the new digital pattern for a few different reasons, one of them is because as Marines, we expect a higher standard and thus do not allow anyone to wear the uniform that is not a Marine.  I have friends who left active duty in the Marine Corps and are serving forward with the Marine Corps, and they are not allowed to wear the new pattern.  They wear the older desert camo patterns. 

Pride and tradition in the Marine Corps and Naval Services around the world are incredibly important and those traditions must be protected. Even from those that meant no harm.

(off soap box)

About what I quoted above, did you know that the Army, Navy and Marine Corps all wore the same uniform until the year 1817.  Of course each created different ways to wear it to make it distinctive but they all wore the same base uniform.

I also do not believe that a Marine who leaves active duty and is recalled to duty would be forced to wear the old Marine Corps uniform.  In fact, I personally know that is not true.  They are issued uniforms that conform to current directives at time of recall.  In fact part of serving in the Reserves or IRR is the rule to keep your uniform set current, unless retired (then you would be forced to buy the new set upon recall).

My Wife just so happens to be a former Marine, now an Army Lawyer.  She was recalled to service and had to purchase brand new Marine uniforms at personal expense for her deployment.

For your "higher standard" about Marines, sure I will give that to you.  We each believe our Service is better than the others, but that propaganda and doctrine that is used as a motivator.  I happen to be a former Army Officer.  In 2005 I was recalled to Active Duty because they needed Armor Officers.  I served my time, went back to the Army Reserve and am now going to my first UTA as an Air Force Reserve Lawyer.  No one service is better than another.  They all do almost the same thing......Kill the enemy.  If you want to break it down, the Army is the premier occupier of land.  They take and keep enemy realestate.  The Marines are good at the "get in get out" method and the Air Force supports the Army and Marines by killing the enemy from the air, while bringing in cargo.  The Navy....kills anything in or around the water and transports marines and soldiers to the battle. 

We are all one team.  If you ask anyone here who served in 2 separate services, they would probably agree that each service is unique, but dependant on each other.  We are a team!  Shouting off recruiting propaganda that "you are not worthy unless you are a Marine" is silly at least, and disrespectful at most. 

To sum it up;  I was a combat Officer, was an IRR punk, and now will assist military members with legal issues.  I have gone from combat to nothing to support role in a few years time.  I have transferred services, worked with each service and am married to a former Marine.  I have a kid on the way, bought a new house and have a successful career in the "civilian world".

By the way......welcome to CAPTALK