My Report on the ABUs

[DNall]

Leaving for school beginning of next FY. They're issuing to outbound officers & WOCs before we go. Just because they can basically. The unit is in refit after coming back from Iraq, so taking advantage of the supply chain to get stuff while it's avail. Don't know if they want us wearing it before we start IERW or if it'll ever even come in, but that's what we were told.

[Hawk200]

Leaving for school beginning of next FY. They're issuing to outbound officers & WOCs before we go. Just because they can basically. The unit is in refit after coming back from Iraq, so taking advantage of the supply chain to get stuff while it's avail. Don't know if they want us wearing it before we start IERW or if it'll ever even come in, but that's what we were told.

Good deal. What are you slotted to fly?

[DNall]

AH-64A!!! We're supposed to get longbows in a few years, but it may end up being ARH-72s, not sure yet, lots of rumors.

We're insanely short of pilots right now though. We were only 70% strength when they alerted for Iraq, had to pick up from other units. Lost those guys coming back, and some folks got out. Then everyone we sent to trng from the rear det got snagged by our sister Bn to go this year in blackhawks, so we're down around 50% pilot strength now & have to be ready to go again in Jan 2010. So it's kind a critical. We're sending people as fast as funded slots can be found & begging for more. Nice time for me to land in the unit.

[CAP006]

Personaly I don't like the fact of not being able to roll up the sleaves with the ABU's. With extream hot weather I like to roll the sleaves.

Although, I also like the fact that the ABU's are a little bit heavyer than the normal BDU's which will come in handy in cold weather.

There are deffenetly some Pro's and Con's with the ABU's but you cant always please everyone.

[Stonewall]

Personaly I don't like the fact of not being able to roll up the sleaves with the ABU's. With extream hot weather I like to roll the sleaves.

There are many arguments about sleeve rolling.  Such as having more circulation in your arms when the sleeves are down.  Lots of folks with IBS (Imaginary Bicep Syndrome) like to roll their sleeves ultra tight which is not good in hot weather.  Additionally, sleeves down offers more sun protection than any sunscreen can.

See, the whole mentality with all branches of the military these days is being "combat ready".  Generally speaking, you don't roll your sleeves in the field (or combat), thus the non-rolling capability of the ACU and ABU. 

[CAP006]

Personaly I don't like the fact of not being able to roll up the sleaves with the ABU's. With extream hot weather I like to roll the sleaves.

There are many arguments about sleeve rolling.  Such as having more circulation in your arms when the sleeves are down.  Lots of folks with IBS (Imaginary Bicep Syndrome) like to roll their sleeves ultra tight which is not good in hot weather.  Additionally, sleeves down offers more sun protection than any sunscreen can.

See, the whole mentality with all branches of the military these days is being "combat ready".  Generally speaking, you don't roll your sleeves in the field (or combat), thus the non-rolling capability of the ACU and ABU. 

I fully understand that. See I don't have really big bicepts so I don't have that problem. 

I understand the fact of having the sleaves down to have more circulation but with the sleaves down in hot weather, won't it make you a little more dehidrated and sweat more?

[Stonewall]

Picture yourself shaded by a tree with air flow as opposed to standing in direct sunlight with airflow.  Which is cooler?  The one in the shade, right?

Sleeves on the field uniforms are loose and provide protection (shade) from the sun, thus it's like your arms are in the shade.  Plus, sunburn will dehydrate you long after the sun has gone down.  Not to mention damaged skin, pain, itching, etc.  Additionally, in field conditions, where I see a lot of CAP folks with their sleeves up (mostly for looks), sleeves down will provide additional protection from things like bugs, scrapes from branches and poisonous plants.

In addition to my many years a ground team member in CAP, I spent 10 years as an infantryman where my "office" was the field.  I can tell you, from desert to jungle to your typical North American woodlands, the furthest I'll go as far as sleeve rolling is maybe rolling the cuffs up once or twice to get them out of the way of my weapon.  And I always keep the cuffs buttoned on the biggest setting to allow for airflow; in the field, not in garrison.

[NIN]

Personaly I don't like the fact of not being able to roll up the sleaves with the ABU's. With extream hot weather I like to roll the sleaves.

My first extended time in ACUs was spent in July at Fort Bragg.  85-90 degrees plus 80+% humidity.  I thought sleeves down was going to be a problem. It was not.

[mikeylikey]

Just look at Arab tribes.  They wear 12 freaking layers of clothes.  It actually keeps the body cool.  They have been doing that for well before our civilizations existed.  I think they know what they are doing. 

There is no practical need to roll BDU sleeves.

[Stonewall]

There is no practical need to roll BDU sleeves.

Especially when you already got 2/3 of the sleeve cut off and put the cuff  up at your bicep area.  Yep, my fluff and puff 1Sgt did that along with his patent leather boots.  Every once in the while the Air Force (guard) does something that blows my mind.  Once, the wing commander was coming to talk to us so he had to run to his office and put on a long sleeve BDU top so he could look like the rest of us. 

Honestly, I think the last time I rolled my sleeves was back in basic trainin in 1991 when we were in the barracks area doing clean-up.  Other than that, it has mostly been policy to keep'em down.

[Hawk200]

There is no practical need to roll BDU sleeves.

Especially when you already got 2/3 of the sleeve cut off and put the cuff  up at your bicep area.  Yep, my fluff and puff 1Sgt did that along with his patent leather boots.  Every once in the while the Air Force (guard) does something that blows my mind.  Once, the wing commander was coming to talk to us so he had to run to his office and put on a long sleeve BDU top so he could look like the rest of us. 

Honestly, I think the last time I rolled my sleeves was back in basic trainin in 1991 when we were in the barracks area doing clean-up.  Other than that, it has mostly been policy to keep'em down.

I think the last time I regularly wore sleeves up was back in '94. I was out at Edwards, and after getting sunburned a few times, I just left them down. After a few years, I didn't bother rolling because it was annoying to do it. Now it just doesn't really do anything for me anyway. The most I do is open the cuffs. 

[Slim]

IIRC, the first year we could wear BDUs was 1991 (I could be wrong, BTW... I don't seem to have any photos from the 1991 encampment, only 1992, where we're definitely all in BDUs. My faulty remembery says that we were in BDUs in 1991, too, but I don't trust that..<GRIN>).  I'm not sure how many years that was after the "official wearout date" of the pickle suit in AF service.  But what I do remember about the transition was that every service was in BDUs, and pickle suits had disappeared from the shelves at AAFES.

I seem to remember us being in BDUs in '91, with the transition from fatigues in progress.  I seem to remember both being authorized at that point, but you could have thrown a rock into a formation and not hit someone in a pickle suit.

I know for sure we were completely in BDUs in 1992, and I got photo proof.

[SarDragon]

Sundown on the pickles was 1 Jan 96. We were in BDUs at my overseas unit in 89. In fact, I was the only one in pickles when I left in Aug '89, because I wasn't sure of my future in CAP when Ileft the Navy, and didn't want to spend the bucks on something I might not ever wear after I got out, and became a fuzzy.

[PHall]

Personaly I don't like the fact of not being able to roll up the sleaves with the ABU's. With extream hot weather I like to roll the sleaves.

Although, I also like the fact that the ABU's are a little bit heavyer than the normal BDU's which will come in handy in cold weather.

There are deffenetly some Pro's and Con's with the ABU's but you cant always please everyone.

Where did you get that "info"?

According to the latest ABU Wear Policy message (072013Z SEP 07) you are authorized to roll the sleeves.
The rules that apply to the BDU/DCU also apply to the ABU according to the above referenced message which is on the Air Force Uniform Board page of the Air Force Portal.

[Slim]

Sundown on the pickles was 1 Jan 96. We were in BDUs at my overseas unit in 89. In fact, I was the only one in pickles when I left in Aug '89, because I wasn't sure of my future in CAP when Ileft the Navy, and didn't want to spend the bucks on something I might not ever wear after I got out, and became a fuzzy.

Not doubting you Dave, but I didn't think BDUs were authorized prior to 1990.  For some reason, 1 Jan 91 stands out as the sunrise date for BDUs.  Maybe the overseas units had special authorization to transition early due to the lack of supply for pickles/lack of DRMO access, and the ready availablity of BDUs?  Not sure on that one, but seems logical.

I've got pictures from our 1990 encampment, where we were all wearing pickle suits.  I don't have any pictures from 1991, but those I do remember seeing showed us in BDUs (that was when the only authorized undershirt color was white, and looked silly).  Darin, somewhere I have a picture of K-Deuce sitting at his desk in BDUs/white t-shirt.  The pics I have from the 1992 encampment show everyone in BDUs.

I remember the sunset very well, I dusted off and updated my old jungles and wore them to our last meeting in 1995, as the OG-107's last hurrah.

[mikeylikey]

According to the latest ABU Wear Policy message (072013Z SEP 07) you are authorized to roll the sleeves.
The rules that apply to the BDU/DCU also apply to the ABU according to the above referenced message which is on the Air Force Uniform Board page of the Air Force Portal.

Both Stonewall and I posted the ABU messages from the AF Portal here in another ABU specific thread.  I do believe I remember reading that.  Now why in hell would you roll your sleeves in the sandbox?  They should have eliminated that clause.  Once again I would like to point out, CAP is not the AF....and at every CAP activity I have run, I demanded a "sleeves down" approach.  The only reason to roll your sleeves is to look cool.  Well I could care less if little Cadet Snuffy looks cool.  Am I a cold-hearted MF'er.....you bet!

[Gunner C]

According to the latest ABU Wear Policy message (072013Z SEP 07) you are authorized to roll the sleeves.
The rules that apply to the BDU/DCU also apply to the ABU according to the above referenced message which is on the Air Force Uniform Board page of the Air Force Portal.

Both Stonewall and I posted the ABU messages from the AF Portal here in another ABU specific thread.  I do believe I remember reading that.  Now why in hell would you roll your sleeves in the sandbox?  They should have eliminated that clause.  Once again I would like to point out, CAP is not the AF....and at every CAP activity I have run, I demanded a "sleeves down" approach.  The only reason to roll your sleeves is to look cool.  Well I could care less if little Cadet Snuffy looks cool.  Am I a cold-hearted MF'er.....you bet!

Many years ago I was on a team with a guy who was really proud of his biceps.  He'd go to the field w/sleeves up but arms cammied.  What a . . . People caught on pretty quick.  Luckily, we got a team sergeant who had biceps bigger than his - that stopped it. 

There's a time for looking cool and a time for work.

GC

[mikeylikey]

^ Can't agree with you more!

[lordmonar]

IIRC the USAF allowed certain units to wear BDU's as early as '86 starting with SP, combat comm units and TACP's.  By 92 everyone was in BDU's.

See this AU graphic.

http://afehri.au.af.mil/Documents/History%20of%20USAF%20Uniforms.pdf

Fixed URL -TA