Since encampment season is coming up, how about posting your tips for first-time attendees (aka basics) to encampment?
first tip... take only what the packing sheet says, and don't try bringing any junk food (aka contraband), unless you just want to give it to the staff. :)
If it's on your uniform, know how to wear it correctly.
Don't try anything too mischievious, because the staff and senior members probably invented the prank or spirit mission that you are going to try. Thus, you lose to experience.
Shut up and listen
Quote from: Cmdbuddy on February 24, 2005, 11:43:16 PM
Shut up and listen
Amen, I need to get my cadets in my flight right now to understand this.
Quote from: Cmdbuddy on February 24, 2005, 11:43:16 PM
Shut up and listen
Also along those lines- don't try to prove to the staff how much you know.
If you want to live... While at encampment never ever say: "But we don't do it this way at my squadron."
Conversely, while at your squadron never ever say: "But, we learned to it this way encampment."
Try not to be annoying. You never know where a certain C/UB will pop up, or who's orders he'll be acting on... ;)
Quote from: Yoda on February 25, 2005, 03:54:54 AM
Try not to be annoying. You never know where a certain C/UB will pop up, or who's orders he'll be acting on... ;)
This is off topic but, Fenner what the heck is a C/UB and why are you not representing yourself with your real grade?
I know it is meant to be funny, but I'm not finding it so.
*psst* private messaging. ;)
Quote from: whatevah on February 25, 2005, 04:43:47 AM
*psst* private messaging. ;)
Yeah... Sorry... He mentioned it in his post so I just hit reply figuring it was somewhat relevant.
Don't piss me off. ;D
Seriously, just take everything day by day and just realize the staff is there to do a job. Pay attention and learn all that you can.
Don't take everything that is said personally.
I have had basics freak out on me because I was giving instruction with my command voice and well thats not what they expected.
Quote from: JaL5597 on March 14, 2005, 05:14:52 PM
Don't take everything that is said personally.
I have had basics freak out on me because I was giving instruction with my command voice and well thats not what they expected.
Tip for staff: your "command voice" is rarely necessary, and even less so, effective. A little whispering goes a long way!
Back to the first timers: The purpose of Encampment is to learn. Go there with an open mind. And most importantly, have fun. I truly believe that Encampment is the number one retention item in CAP, because it is catered for the new cadets. Yea, IACE will keep me in CAP, but if I've been in for 5 years already, it's not likely that I will quit.
Staff, you need to realize that your purpose at Encampment is not to practice being a drill sergeant. Your job is to create an atmosphere conducive to learning in a teamwork atmosphere. People say that Encampment is made to break cadets down to be lower than dirt, and then build them up to be a better cadet. This is not the atmosphere that should occur at Encampment- rather, you should skip the whole "breaking down" process.
Comments?
Quote from: Cmdbuddy on March 14, 2005, 11:00:10 PM
Quote from: JaL5597 on March 14, 2005, 05:14:52 PM
Don't take everything that is said personally.
I have had basics freak out on me because I was giving instruction with my command voice and well thats not what they expected.
Tip for staff: your "command voice" is rarely necessary, and even less so, effective. A little whispering goes a long way!
Back to the first timers: The purpose of Encampment is to learn. Go there with an open mind. And most importantly, have fun. I truly believe that Encampment is the number one retention item in CAP, because it is catered for the new cadets. Yea, IACE will keep me in CAP, but if I've been in for 5 years already, it's not likely that I will quit.
Staff, you need to realize that your purpose at Encampment is not to practice being a drill sergeant. Your job is to create an atmosphere conducive to learning in a teamwork atmosphere. People say that Encampment is made to break cadets down to be lower than dirt, and then build them up to be a better cadet. This is not the atmosphere that should occur at Encampment- rather, you should skip the whole "breaking down" process.
Comments?
Obviously your command voice is not the most effective. I was trying to simply get instructions to cadets during the reception process. And well a loud vocal senior member was not what they expected and cadets started to go loopy at that point.
Thats why I said don't take things personally. I know the sort of horror stories that cadets are told and I guess that I just hit the right buttons with a few of those cadets.
Using Gunny Hartman as your encampment rolemodel is not a good idea and pretty much guarntees your gonna be going home very quickly.
Be ready for long days and PT, remember silent and listen are spelt with the same letters, prevent blisters but bring plenty of moleskin, learn lots and definently have fun.
Have Fun. ;)
Learn what you can, be safe, and enjoy the experience.
-CC
Quote from: MIKE on February 25, 2005, 04:33:16 AM
Quote from: Yoda on February 25, 2005, 03:54:54 AM
Try not to be annoying. You never know where a certain C/UB will pop up, or who's orders he'll be acting on... ;)
This is off topic but, Fenner what the heck is a C/UB and why are you not representing yourself with your real grade?
I know it is meant to be funny, but I'm not finding it so.
C/UB is Cadet Undercover Basic. It stems from an inside joke in an IM a while back. Because I had complained about people using fake grades in conjunction with CAP a while back, I dropped the ", CAP" from the end of the grade title.
Not everybody will find it funny or amusing. It entertains me though, which is enough reason for me to keep it.
Quote from: Greg on February 24, 2005, 11:56:22 PM
Quote from: Cmdbuddy on February 24, 2005, 11:43:16 PM
Shut up and listen
Also along those lines- don't try to prove to the staff how much you know.
hehe
Speaking from experience on both counts. I just went to the GLR Southern encampment in Greenville Kentucky. I am a MSgt and my flight SGT was just a SSgt. And the fact that I am the C/CC at my squadron back home, well lets just say it didnt help me much.
My CMSgt from my squadron was also attending basic encampment with me. He caught alot of flak. We didnt go against what our Flight Sgt. was saying...much. but we both felt we knew more than him. not because of rank but simply from experience.
My CMSgt had issues with shutting up and listening...and i had a problem with not showing how much i knew to the Cadres. oh well im through it now and next year i can go back and be a Cadre. ::)
i definitly suggest going to the first encampment that becomes avalible to you because you will get more, LOTS MORE out of the basic encampment experience if you are brand new. out of my squadron i had three airmen go. and actually two of those three have been in for close to two years now. but the third one, he has learned so much. anyways my point is that "green cadets" (newbies) get way more out of it, so go as early as you can.
P.S. DO NOT try to prove to your Cadres that your uniform is correct even with the revised version of 39-1 because i did...and it didnt go over too well. :-\
Quote from: SAR junkie on August 08, 2005, 09:27:12 PM
Quote from: Greg on February 24, 2005, 11:56:22 PM
Quote from: Cmdbuddy on February 24, 2005, 11:43:16 PM
Shut up and listen
Also along those lines- don't try to prove to the staff how much you know.
hehe
Speaking from experience on both counts. I just went to the GLR Southern encampment in Greenville Kentucky. I am a MSgt and my flight SGT was just a SSgt. And the fact that I am the C/CC at my squadron back home, well lets just say it didnt help me much.
My CMSgt from my squadron was also attending basic encampment with me. He caught alot of flak. We didnt go against what our Flight Sgt. was saying...much. but we both felt we knew more than him. not because of rank but simply from experience.
My CMSgt had issues with shutting up and listening...and i had a problem with not showing how much i knew to the Cadres. oh well im through it now and next year i can go back and be a Cadre. ::)
i definitly suggest going to the first encampment that becomes avalible to you because you will get more, LOTS MORE out of the basic encampment experience if you are brand new. out of my squadron i had three airmen go. and actually two of those three have been in for close to two years now. but the third one, he has learned so much. anyways my point is that "green cadets" (newbies) get way more out of it, so go as early as you can.
P.S. DO NOT try to prove to your Cadres that your uniform is correct even with the revised version of 39-1 because i did...and it didnt go over too well. :-\
Actually, I think you'll find that whether you're correct or not, it's your approach that matters. If you throw a hissy-fit right there and then about your uniform being correct, I wouldn't care how right you were, you're behaving very poorly as a follower and disrespectfully in general. If, on the other hand, you were to approach your flight sergeant or commander in a more private oppurtunity and say "Sir/Ma'am/Sergeant, I had been going by my interpretation of the manual. Right here it says that we should have our grade 1 inch from the collar. What did I do wrong so I don't make that mistake again?", you are much more likely to get a favorable response. Your tone, body language, and general attitude will all make a difference in how you are recieved.
It's all right to be a very knowledgeable cadet going to your basic encampment. Just exercise care in how you use your knowledge. When I was in my basic encampment year, I was loaded with delusions of power. It wasn't my flight staff that ended up getting the point across to me, it was my peers in flight. They didn't much like my attitude as an element leader, and the good thing that came of it was that I changed.
I attended my first encampment as a Chief last summer. Since it was my first that means I was a...you guessed it...basic. Exciting, neh? As stated above, I truly reccommend that cadets try to attend ASAP after joining. I had a huge amount of fun at encampment, but the probability of pulling that off decreases, I think, the higher up in grade you go. Encampment really is meant for the cadets without much grade.
On a different note, I kept a journal for each day that I was at encampment. If anyone would like to read that, please e-mail me and I will send it to you.
C/2d Lt Laura Reichardt, CAP
Quote from: lreichardt on October 16, 2005, 06:30:49 AM
I attended my first encampment as a Chief last summer. Since it was my first that means I was a...you guessed it...basic. Exciting, neh? As stated above, I truly reccommend that cadets try to attend ASAP after joining. I had a huge amount of fun at encampment, but the probability of pulling that off decreases, I think, the higher up in grade you go. Encampment really is meant for the cadets without much grade.
On a different note, I kept a journal for each day that I was at encampment. If anyone would like to read that, please e-mail me and I will send it to you.
C/2d Lt Laura Reichardt, CAP
You make an excellent point here, and for a couple of reasons. First, cadets are much more likely to stick with the program if they attend encampment. Second, the training that encampment provides is very unique and all but impossible to duplicate at the home squadron. To have cadets locked into an challenging enviroment for a week or more on end truly provides a one-of-a-kind training enviroment.
I almost think encampment should be a requirement for C/MSgt or even the Wright Brothers Award, but the frequency with which it is offered doesn't make this a terribly feasible idea.
You make an excellent point here, and for a couple of reasons. First, cadets are much more likely to stick with the program if they attend encampment. Second, the training that encampment provides is very unique and all but impossible to duplicate at the home squadron. To have cadets locked into an challenging enviroment for a week or more on end truly provides a one-of-a-kind training enviroment.
I almost think encampment should be a requirement for C/MSgt or even the Wright Brothers Award, but the frequency with which it is offered doesn't make this a terribly feasible idea.
[/quote]
I found that encampment motivated the newest Airman (he'd pinned on his stripes just a month before he came) to the couple of Chiefs that were in my Flight, including myself. However, the Airman really learned more. Plus, my Flight Sergeant was the exact same grade as me...not to say I wasn't respectful or anything, but it did change the dynamic a bit. :-\
I think California Wing, and some other Wings, have the right idea by offering Airmen and NCO training schools on weekends. These aren't weeks, but they do offer a little bit of that week long mentality, and a break to normal routine of two hours a week. I'm implementing a Cadet Basic Training School at my squadron right now...it'd be so much easier if I could just get them away for a whole weekend, instead of offering it over the course of eight weeks! >:(
Encampment had been offered about a month before I joined...so I couldn't go, obviously. At the end of my first year (I think I was a TSgt) I had some other activities/issues come up, so at the last minute I couldn't go. Your idea is a good one...but it might delay promotion unjustly for a whole year. :( I think that would end up losing us more cadets then it gained, to be honest. :-X
C/2d Lt Laura Reichardt, CAP
first timers, do what your told the first time, and try to keep in mind the fun stuff you'll be doing ie UH-60 rides, M-16/SAW shoot, repealing (all done in my first encapment (GAWG 04)
2nd timers non-staff....why are you not on staff?, i did it becuase i couldnt get a staff slot. but anyway take a basic under your wing, show them how to polish boots, make a bed, D&C and the stuff ur flight staff cant go over everyday, you never know you may end up having to fill in for one of them, i did when my FS twisted his ankle
staff, remember how you felt about ur flight staff at ur basic encampment, dont make the same mistakes
Quote from: lreichardt on October 17, 2005, 06:02:30 PM
You make an excellent point here, and for a couple of reasons. First, cadets are much more likely to stick with the program if they attend encampment. Second, the training that encampment provides is very unique and all but impossible to duplicate at the home squadron. To have cadets locked into an challenging enviroment for a week or more on end truly provides a one-of-a-kind training enviroment.
I almost think encampment should be a requirement for C/MSgt or even the Wright Brothers Award, but the frequency with which it is offered doesn't make this a terribly feasible idea.
I found that encampment motivated the newest Airman (he'd pinned on his stripes just a month before he came) to the couple of Chiefs that were in my Flight, including myself. However, the Airman really learned more. Plus, my Flight Sergeant was the exact same grade as me...not to say I wasn't respectful or anything, but it did change the dynamic a bit. :-\
I think California Wing, and some other Wings, have the right idea by offering Airmen and NCO training schools on weekends. These aren't weeks, but they do offer a little bit of that week long mentality, and a break to normal routine of two hours a week. I'm implementing a Cadet Basic Training School at my squadron right now...it'd be so much easier if I could just get them away for a whole weekend, instead of offering it over the course of eight weeks! >:(
Encampment had been offered about a month before I joined...so I couldn't go, obviously. At the end of my first year (I think I was a TSgt) I had some other activities/issues come up, so at the last minute I couldn't go. Your idea is a good one...but it might delay promotion unjustly for a whole year. :( I think that would end up losing us more cadets then it gained, to be honest. :-X
C/2d Lt Laura Reichardt, CAP
[/quote]
I really agree with your idea that encampment should be a requirement for something lower then mitchell, i.e. the crossover from C/NCO to C/SNCO. I bet, if one were to work with their state director, and get the curriculum right, you could design those airman and NCO leadership schools so that completion of both would satisfy the regulatory requirements of an encampment.
Hmm....
Don't try to do everything for everyone. let the cadets learn for themselves.
As Senior Staff, before you come to encampment, find out which of your cadets are ready for promotion. Let them have it at encampment IF the paperwork is completed prior to arriving.
I have seen several cadets get promoted this way.
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 07, 2008, 04:11:08 AM
Don't try to do everything for everyone. let the cadets learn for themselves.
Huh? Some cadets will learn stuff on their own easily, but others have to be shown everything multiple times, and have their hand held all week. If you just abandon your cadets on the assumption that they will get it, you're wrong. You have to be flexible, and adapt to and with your cadets if you want to do a good job.
Quote from: DC on July 07, 2008, 10:58:34 AM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 07, 2008, 04:11:08 AM
Don't try to do everything for everyone. let the cadets learn for themselves.
Huh? Some cadets will learn stuff on their own easily, but others have to be shown everything multiple times, and have their hand held all week. If you just abandon your cadets on the assumption that they will get it, you're wrong. You have to be flexible, and adapt to and with your cadets if you want to do a good job.
What I meant is, we had a cadet who knew how to do hospital corners. While I was working on my corner she ran over ripped the corner out and did it her way. She worked at a hospital so she was good. My point is it took me longer to learn how to that then it should have!
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 07, 2008, 10:54:35 PM
Quote from: DC on July 07, 2008, 10:58:34 AM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 07, 2008, 04:11:08 AM
Don't try to do everything for everyone. let the cadets learn for themselves.
Huh? Some cadets will learn stuff on their own easily, but others have to be shown everything multiple times, and have their hand held all week. If you just abandon your cadets on the assumption that they will get it, you're wrong. You have to be flexible, and adapt to and with your cadets if you want to do a good job.
What I meant is, we had a cadet who knew how to do hospital corners. While I was working on my corner she ran over ripped the corner out and did it her way. She worked at a hospital so she was good. My point is it took me longer to learn how to that then it should have!
Okay, I understand what you are trying to say.
Quote from: DC on July 08, 2008, 05:36:51 AM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 07, 2008, 10:54:35 PM
Quote from: DC on July 07, 2008, 10:58:34 AM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 07, 2008, 04:11:08 AM
Don't try to do everything for everyone. let the cadets learn for themselves.
Huh? Some cadets will learn stuff on their own easily, but others have to be shown everything multiple times, and have their hand held all week. If you just abandon your cadets on the assumption that they will get it, you're wrong. You have to be flexible, and adapt to and with your cadets if you want to do a good job.
What I meant is, we had a cadet who knew how to do hospital corners. While I was working on my corner she ran over ripped the corner out and did it her way. She worked at a hospital so she was good. My point is it took me longer to learn how to that then it should have!
Okay, I understand what you are trying to say.
I kinda warded it wrong from the beginning....
Move with a purpose.
Make a buddy and help each other out, with uniforms, bunks, motivation, and everything else.
When you and your buddy are inspection ready help others, remember at most encampments inspection results are tallied both individually and as a flight so if one cadet gets a 0 and you get a 100 your flight only gets 50... Moral, don't take too much time searching for perfection. Spend more time trying for a great score as a team.
Listen, think, speak. Always in that order.
CLEAN UP AFTER YOURSELF, Put your name on EVERYTHING, Keep track of your stuff.
Again, no one expects perfection. When I am looking at cadets for honors I am looking for well rounded cadets. Usually the ones that obsess over their bunks don't learn the OI, and those that memorize the OI, can't march, and so on.
Quote from: IceNine on July 08, 2008, 11:39:11 PM
Move with a purpose.
Make a buddy and help each other out, with uniforms, bunks, motivation, and everything else.
When you and your buddy are inspection ready help others, remember at most encampments inspection results are tallied both individually and as a flight so if one cadet gets a 0 and you get a 100 your flight only gets 50... Moral, don't take too much time searching for perfection. Spend more time trying for a great score as a team.
Listen, think, speak. Always in that order.
CLEAN UP AFTER YOURSELF, Put your name on EVERYTHING, Keep track of your stuff.
Again, no one expects perfection. When I am looking at cadets for honors I am looking for well rounded cadets. Usually the ones that obsess over their bunks don't learn the OI, and those that memorize the OI, can't march, and so on.
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
Learn to wake up early! Really, all you need to do, is to pay attention, listen, and do what you are told, and you will do great.
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
That would have been a reason for that cadet to receive a 2b. I can't stand stealing, and I can't stand people that allow it to happen.
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 09, 2008, 10:04:00 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
That would have been a reason for that cadet to receive a 2b. I can't stand stealing, and I can't stand people that allow it to happen.
2b? I know exactly how you feel!
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
So this cadet was basically like "I know you needed this, but I needed one too, so I took it"??
Quote from: JC004 on July 09, 2008, 10:19:02 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
So this cadet was basically like "I know you needed this, but I needed one too, so I took it"??
Pretty much!
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 10:22:17 PM
Quote from: JC004 on July 09, 2008, 10:19:02 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
So this cadet was basically like "I know you needed this, but I needed one too, so I took it"??
Pretty much!
If that is how the game is played, then I would have taken a pair of scissors and turned his blues into little pieces of blues. And added "I needed a rag, thanks".
Move fast
Stay focused
and if you can make a staff member laugh, you're good...
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 09, 2008, 11:26:09 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 10:22:17 PM
Quote from: JC004 on July 09, 2008, 10:19:02 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
So this cadet was basically like "I know you needed this, but I needed one too, so I took it"??
Pretty much!
If that is how the game is played, then I would have taken a pair of scissors and turned his blues into little pieces of blues. And added "I needed a rag, thanks".
Then attempt to sew it back together, and be like heres your blues!
^ LMAO. Right on dude.
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 10, 2008, 03:24:06 AM
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 09, 2008, 11:26:09 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 10:22:17 PM
Quote from: JC004 on July 09, 2008, 10:19:02 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
So this cadet was basically like "I know you needed this, but I needed one too, so I took it"??
Pretty much!
If that is how the game is played, then I would have taken a pair of scissors and turned his blues into little pieces of blues. And added "I needed a rag, thanks".
Then attempt to sew it back together, and be like heres your blues!
Sew it back together? Nuuu, too easy. Duct tape it back together.... and blacken their belt buckle....
Oh wait, wouldn't that be hazing....
So yeah, um don't do any of that stuff....
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was so frustrated!
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 09, 2008, 11:26:09 PM
If that is how the game is played, then I would have taken a pair of scissors and turned his blues into little pieces of blues. And added "I needed a rag, thanks".
I trust you notified your TAC officer right? And it's not a game; this was a serious offense. And yes Team Surge - I was there! Too bad we're only finding about this now; we could've taken some corrective action had we known at the time.
Quote from: Sqn72DO on July 10, 2008, 05:18:17 AM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 10, 2008, 03:24:06 AM
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 09, 2008, 11:26:09 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 10:22:17 PM
Quote from: JC004 on July 09, 2008, 10:19:02 PM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was soo frustrated!
So this cadet was basically like "I know you needed this, but I needed one too, so I took it"??
Pretty much!
If that is how the game is played, then I would have taken a pair of scissors and turned his blues into little pieces of blues. And added "I needed a rag, thanks".
Then attempt to sew it back together, and be like heres your blues!
Sew it back together? Nuuu, too easy. Duct tape it back together.... and blacken their belt buckle....
Oh wait, wouldn't that be hazing....
So yeah, um don't do any of that stuff....
I am too nice to do that! >:D
Quote from: Camas on July 10, 2008, 05:28:38 AM
Quote from: TEAM SURGE on July 09, 2008, 09:58:37 PM
PUT YOUR NAME ON EVERYTHING!!!! AWWWW!
I wish I would have taken that seriously.
One of the cadets in our flight took my blues cover and wore it during the pass and review! I freaked out because I didn't have my cover. He came to me right after pass in review and says heres your cover. I was so frustrated!
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 09, 2008, 11:26:09 PM
If that is how the game is played, then I would have taken a pair of scissors and turned his blues into little pieces of blues. And added "I needed a rag, thanks".
I trust you notified your TAC officer right? And it's not a game; this was a serious offense. And yes Team Surge - I was there! Too bad we're only finding about this now; we could've taken some corrective action had we known at the time.
Not a big deal! I will just be smart and put my name on my stuff next time I go to something like encampment or an activity.
You went to Eagle Talon 3?
If you are a first time TAC Officer, remember that you are not in the cadets' chain of command. You are there for safety and guidance when necessary, but don't jump in and start giving orders to the basics or even to the flight staff.
Our encampments here in TXWG keep going back and forth on that. Last summer we had a really good staff of TACs who kept out of the cadets' business. This summer, for some reason, we had a bit of trouble. I saw several times where TACs were directing or "TIing" cadets when there was no reason for a TAC to have been involved.
As long as the cadets are safe, don't interfere. If the flight turns left when the next class is to the right, just follow along. Encampments are not only there to teach basics how to learn, it's there to teach the flight staff how to lead. When they get their a$$ chewed for being late, they'll learn to turn the right direction next time.
Quote from: jaybird512 on July 10, 2008, 08:21:24 AM
If you are a first time TAC Officer, remember that you are not in the cadets' chain of command. You are there for safety and guidance when necessary, but don't jump in and start giving orders to the basics or even to the flight staff.
Our encampments here in TXWG keep going back and forth on that. Last summer we had a really good staff of TACs who kept out of the cadets' business. This summer, for some reason, we had a bit of trouble. I saw several times where TACs were directing or "TIing" cadets when there was no reason for a TAC to have been involved.
As long as the cadets are safe, don't interfere. If the flight turns left when the next class is to the right, just follow along. Encampments are not only there to teach basics how to learn, it's there to teach the flight staff how to lead. When they get their a$$ chewed for being late, they'll learn to turn the right direction next time.
Disagree with you, but just a little. TAC's are there for safety, yes. They are there to be glorified babysitters, yes. They are also there to correct mistakes, counsel, mentor and make the day go better.
More likely than not, it is a Cadet who has a problem with their TAC Officer. I understand the Cadets want to play military, and be "hardcore", but that is not what Encampment is about. The TAC can be a very useful tool for the Cadet Staff, and should be used to the point of exhaustion.
Every Wing is different on how they run the Encampment. Some Wings, you can't find a Senior Member, other Wings, the Senior Members direct every aspect of the Encampment.
Finally, I would hate to be the TAC that let his SQD burn to death because he was not permitted to run an extra fire drill the first night, but was sent to his room by a 16 year old Cadet Staff member.
Just remember to show respect, and you should have no problems with a TAC.
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 10, 2008, 01:36:50 PM
Quote from: jaybird512 on July 10, 2008, 08:21:24 AM
If you are a first time TAC Officer, remember that you are not in the cadets' chain of command. You are there for safety and guidance when necessary, but don't jump in and start giving orders to the basics or even to the flight staff.
Our encampments here in TXWG keep going back and forth on that. Last summer we had a really good staff of TACs who kept out of the cadets' business. This summer, for some reason, we had a bit of trouble. I saw several times where TACs were directing or "TIing" cadets when there was no reason for a TAC to have been involved.
As long as the cadets are safe, don't interfere. If the flight turns left when the next class is to the right, just follow along. Encampments are not only there to teach basics how to learn, it's there to teach the flight staff how to lead. When they get their a$$ chewed for being late, they'll learn to turn the right direction next time.
Disagree with you, but just a little. TAC's are there for safety, yes. They are there to be glorified babysitters, yes. They are also there to correct mistakes, counsel, mentor and make the day go better.
More likely than not, it is a Cadet who has a problem with their TAC Officer. I understand the Cadets want to play military, and be "hardcore", but that is not what Encampment is about. The TAC can be a very useful tool for the Cadet Staff, and should be used to the point of exhaustion.
Every Wing is different on how they run the Encampment. Some Wings, you can't find a Senior Member, other Wings, the Senior Members direct every aspect of the Encampment.
Finally, I would hate to be the TAC that let his SQD burn to death because he was not permitted to run an extra fire drill the first night, but was sent to his room by a 16 year old Cadet Staff member.
Just remember to show respect, and you should have no problems with a TAC.
All my tac officers were awesome people! They kinda just converse with you, and check your feet!
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 10, 2008, 01:36:50 PM
Quote from: jaybird512 on July 10, 2008, 08:21:24 AM
If you are a first time TAC Officer, remember that you are not in the cadets' chain of command. You are there for safety and guidance when necessary, but don't jump in and start giving orders to the basics or even to the flight staff.
Our encampments here in TXWG keep going back and forth on that. Last summer we had a really good staff of TACs who kept out of the cadets' business. This summer, for some reason, we had a bit of trouble. I saw several times where TACs were directing or "TIing" cadets when there was no reason for a TAC to have been involved.
As long as the cadets are safe, don't interfere. If the flight turns left when the next class is to the right, just follow along. Encampments are not only there to teach basics how to learn, it's there to teach the flight staff how to lead. When they get their a$$ chewed for being late, they'll learn to turn the right direction next time.
Disagree with you, but just a little. TAC's are there for safety, yes. They are there to be glorified babysitters, yes. They are also there to correct mistakes, counsel, mentor and make the day go better.
I just don't see that as part of a TAC's duty. The way that we ran this last encampment was to make every part of that, except for counseling, the cadet flight and squadron staff's job. Our TACs were not to correct mistakes (other than safety or health related) because not only do you end up undermining the flight staff, they're not learning anything. If a TAC is always there to bail you out of trouble, then why concentrate on doing things the right way?
Our cadets were fully empowered and responsible and we saw a lot of them step up to the plate and take charge once we got the TACs out of the way...
Quote from: jaybird512 on July 10, 2008, 08:02:53 PM
way?
Our cadets were fully empowered and responsible and we saw a lot of them step up to the plate and take charge once we got the TACs out of the way...
Thats what I figured. You had to "get your TACs out of your way". Don't forget the TAC is responsible for every cadet to include you as a staff cadet. Why wouldn't a TAC correct a mistake??!?! Should they just let you go on teaching something the wrong way? That is a reason we have 1,000 different ways of doing one thing in CAP. The whole "That's how we did it at Encampment" saying is a direct result of Cadet Staff doing the WRONG THINGS.
Work with your TAC, not against them. Because in the end the TAC always wins, and any tension will be relieved by sending you the Cadet home, not the TAC.
To get back on subject "Tips for First Timers"
Follow the advice of AA.
Take it one day at a time, or as Scarlett O'Hara said "Tomorrow is another day"
Quote from: mikeylikey on July 10, 2008, 09:04:54 PM
Quote from: jaybird512 on July 10, 2008, 08:02:53 PM
way?
Our cadets were fully empowered and responsible and we saw a lot of them step up to the plate and take charge once we got the TACs out of the way...
Thats what I figured. You had to "get your TACs out of your way". Don't forget the TAC is responsible for every cadet to include you as a staff cadet. Why wouldn't a TAC correct a mistake??!?! Should they just let you go on teaching something the wrong way? That is a reason we have 1,000 different ways of doing one thing in CAP. The whole "That's how we did it at Encampment" saying is a direct result of Cadet Staff doing the WRONG THINGS.
Work with your TAC, not against them. Because in the end the TAC always wins, and any tension will be relieved by sending you the Cadet home, not the TAC.
No one is working against the TACs; I think you missed the point and yes, some TACs are in the way and create more problems than they solve. It is the exception, not the rule and don't take this to mean that I'm bashing all of them, just a few who get too involved in the cadets' business when they shouldn't be.
TACs are responsible for the health and safety of the cadets, but not their instruction. Why should they not correct a mistake?... Because that's not their job. If it is a mistake that will cause potential injury to a cadet, yes, step in by all means. If a flight sergeant is teaching a cadet to pivot incorrectly in drill, then no. It is the job of the flight commander, first sergeant, squadron commander, etc., to observe that mistake and make the correction. If the flight commander fails to notice that his/her flight sergeant is instructing incorrectly then the TAC can mention that to the flight commander in private so he/she can address it as they choose, but not correct the flight sergeant in front of the flight or begin to give instruction to the flight.
From what we've seen here, the majority of TACs are there because they have children in the program and they are volunteering their time to assist which is a great thing. Without TACs, we wouldn't be able to run the program. The bad part is that most of the TACs here have very little experience with CAP and most have no experience around the military. Some have the mindset of a den mother rather than knowing when and how to step in using the chain of command. While a TAC usually has more in the way of life experience and maturity (most of them), they lack in the leadership skills and knowledge that the cadet flight sergeants, flight commanders, squadron commanders, etc., have been taught.
Where TACs become a hindrance is when they begin to take on the role of the flight staff and that is not their place. If a TAC sees a minor mistake, they should talk to the flight staff in private, away from the flight.
For the lock-happy people, while this is not entirely on the original topic, it is related to first-time TACs.