wearing uniforms to school for recruiting

[lycan1138]

i heard a cadet say this and it sounds interesting

[lordmonar]

Get your squadron commander's permission first.
Then talk with your school adminstation to make sure they don't mind recruiting at school....then go for it.

[Hawk200]

I would add a caution to make certain that those cadets aren't doing it to just show off. A lot of them do. If their intentions are above board, go for it. (After the considerations that monar put forth are met, of course.)

[JBC]

I would go against it for the cadets sake. A giant ego commonly stems from cap. Letting cadets where uniforms to school certainly wouldn't be helpful in this respect. I had this problem my first year in cap, and found myself rejected by the normal social loop as a result of my flamboyancy. I've gotten much better, suppressing my cockiness even from hawk mountain. But that's just me. I'm sure there are some schools out there where CAP's  more popular.

[DakRadz]

I would go against it for the cadets sake. A giant ego commonly stems from cap. Letting cadets where uniforms to school certainly wouldn't be helpful in this respect. I had this problem my first year in cap, and found myself rejected by the normal social loop as a result of my flamboyancy. I've gotten much better, suppressing my cockiness even from hawk mountain. But that's just me. I'm sure there are some schools out there where CAP's  more popular.

Sounds like you learned from the way you acted. School of Hard-Knocks is not necessarily a bad one.

Just because you didn't succeed doesn't mean there aren't trustworthy cadets out there. I often wore my blues to school as we had a JROTC presence as well, and people did indeed notice that I had a LOT fewer ribbons on (when in CAP blues, xD)- it made people ask questions about my uniform since it was just different enough to intrigue.

However, the squadron was 30 miles away, so I did end up being the only CAP cadet in a 10-12 HS of 1500... But had one been closer, it would have worked.

[Major Lord]

When I was a Deputy Commander for Cadets, I gave my Cadets permission to wear their Uniforms to school on any occasion, as long as they had recruiting info and collected names of potential Cadets so we could do a follow-up if they never showed at a meeting. It was a great recruiting tool, and we drew lots of Cadets that way. I also cautioned them that if the School objected, they would need to go back to politically correct kiddie clothing  for public schools. ( You know, Che Guevara T-Shirts and sandals and the like) Since at that time we had a disproportionately number of home-school kids, it was never a problem. I never wanted them to be ashamed of having the privilege of wearing our Country's Uniform.

Major Lord

[Spaceman3750]

...sandals and the like...

Slightly off topic, but you seem to have this thing with sandals - I find that they keep my feet comfy and cool! :angel:

[lycan1138]

I'm a senior member and also deputy commander of cadets and  I'm also a senior at the school so I can make sure the act properly

[Майор Хаткевич]

I'm a senior member and also deputy commander of cadets and  I'm also a senior at the school so I can make sure the act properly

18 year old Deputy Commander?

[DakRadz]

I'm a senior member and also deputy commander of cadets and  I'm also a senior at the school so I can make sure the act properly

18 year old Deputy Commander?

That's definitely a recipe for success.....

[Hawk200]

I'm a senior member and also deputy commander of cadets and  I'm also a senior at the school so I can make sure the act properly

18 year old Deputy Commander?

Could be 19 by now, I was 19 when I graduated high school. 18 as a new senior, but 19 when graduated.

Doesn't sound wise, and I know of a wing or three that required a former cadet to leave a cadet squadron for a minimum of two years before returning to hold a staff position in a unit with cadets. Never saw any studies on it, so I don't know the efficacy of the policy. At first hearing it, it sounds like a way to ensure the maturity of the individual, but I didn't know anyone affected by it, so I can't make any judgements on whether or not it works.

[lordmonar]

I'm a senior member and also deputy commander of cadets and  I'm also a senior at the school so I can make sure the act properly

18 year old Deputy Commander?

That's definitely a recipe for success.....

Better then letting the position go vacant, which may have been the only alternative?

[Tim Medeiros]

I'm a senior member and also deputy commander of cadets and  I'm also a senior at the school so I can make sure the act properly

18 year old Deputy Commander?

That's definitely a recipe for success.....

No worse off than a brand new member taking the position due to manning issues.  At least most 18yr old SMs have some CAP experience as a cadet (at least the ones I've met)

[Майор Хаткевич]

I'm a senior member and also deputy commander of cadets and  I'm also a senior at the school so I can make sure the act properly

18 year old Deputy Commander?

That's definitely a recipe for success.....

No worse off than a brand new member taking the position due to manning issues.  At least most 18yr old SMs have some CAP experience as a cadet (at least the ones I've met)

When it comes to CAP SM, both are just as bad I suppose. As a new SM, I know I don't know....much.

[lycan1138]

well my commander chose me because of my maturity not only am i in this program I'm a volunteer firefighter been in military style programs for a long time and a very fair officer.  and we are very short handed... 

[cust0s]

I would add a caution to make certain that those cadets aren't doing it to just show off. A lot of them do. If their intentions are above board, go for it. (After the considerations that monar put forth are met, of course.)

What's wrong with showing off?  As long as they have permission and act appropriately by properly representing CAP in uniform, then where is the harm in them having pride in wearing this uniform?  Especially, considering that they would get to show ribbons, people might ask questions, and they can explain what each award means, etc...  I'm sure this is no different then the other organizations (JROTC, ROTC, etc...) who have programs on campus and require the occasional wear of the uniform.  I would be hesitant to allow BDUs, but the dress uniform in most service organizations was meant to be worn in public.  Don't get me wrong, we still need to abide by the CAP uniform wear policy, but in general, especially when recruitment is concerned, there is no harm in wearing the dress uniform in general.  It just depends but cadets need to understand that if you put the uniform on, people will approach you, and you must act properly while in and even out of uniform.  Just my $0.02.

[Hawk200]

I would add a caution to make certain that those cadets aren't doing it to just show off. A lot of them do. If their intentions are above board, go for it. (After the considerations that monar put forth are met, of course.)

What's wrong with showing off?  As long as they have permission and act appropriately by properly representing CAP in uniform, then where is the harm in them having pride in wearing this uniform?  Especially, considering that they would get to show ribbons, people might ask questions, and they can explain what each award means, etc...  I'm sure this is no different then the other organizations (JROTC, ROTC, etc...) who have programs on campus and require the occasional wear of the uniform.  I would be hesitant to allow BDUs, but the dress uniform in most service organizations was meant to be worn in public.  Don't get me wrong, we still need to abide by the CAP uniform wear policy, but in general, especially when recruitment is concerned, there is no harm in wearing the dress uniform in general.  It just depends but cadets need to understand that if you put the uniform on, people will approach you, and you must act properly while in and even out of uniform.  Just my $0.02.

There's a major difference between pride and showing off.

[cust0s]

There's a major difference between pride and showing off.

Okay, and that would be?  Please enlighten me.  Thanks.

[Hawk200]

There's a major difference between pride and showing off.

Okay, and that would be?  Please enlighten me.  Thanks.

Start with Merriam-Webster. The definitions are more plain than I tend to give.

[DakRadz]

There's a major difference between pride and showing off.

Okay, and that would be?  Please enlighten me.  Thanks.

Start with Merriam-Webster. The definitions are more plain than I tend to give.

Agreed with Hawk. I've seen cadets in JROTC and CAP take pride in their achievements, rank, uniform, and program. And I've seen cadets show off (myself included).

Guess which action portrays our programs in a bad light and warranted a "discussion" with the SNCO? I'm talking retired SNCO, not cadet type.

[cust0s]

There's a major difference between pride and showing off.

Okay, and that would be?  Please enlighten me.  Thanks.

Start with Merriam-Webster. The definitions are more plain than I tend to give.

Agreed with Hawk. I've seen cadets in JROTC and CAP take pride in their achievements, rank, uniform, and program. And I've seen cadets show off (myself included).

Guess which action portrays our programs in a bad light and warranted a "discussion" with the SNCO? I'm talking retired SNCO, not cadet type.

I'm not disagreeing but the problem is people make these statements about there being some sort of difference and no one has yet to provide a concrete example.  In fact I did go to Meriam Webster and here's what it says when you search for "showing off":

showing off

The word you've entered isn't in the dictionary. Click on a spelling suggestion below or try again using the search bar above.

However, "pride" is reported as "the quality or state of being proud."

So, instead of just making these statements, give us some examples.  If you experienced a "showing off" moment, then we need to know, especially those of us in leadership positions who have yet to see something like this.  What should we be looking for?

Thanks,

[lordmonar]

Pride and showing off is the same difference between Self Confidance and Arrogance.

No one can draw that line....but you know it when you see it.

Either way.

Get permission from your commander and get permission from your school....don't make an FPOC of yourself and you are golden.

[DakRadz]

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/show-off_1

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/pride_1?q=pride

Free of charge.

Note which definition contains the word "annoying" and which contains the word "good"

[Mavvrikk]

well my commander chose me because of my maturity not only am i in this program I'm a volunteer firefighter been in military style programs for a long time and a very fair officer.  and we are very short handed... 

Are any of you reading this? I kinda lol'd when I saw that, because he thinks people will believe him...

[Mavvrikk]

I am a Cadet, and would love to wear my uniform to school, because I am proud of it, but at the same time worried people will think of me as cocky, or a show off.

[jimmydeanno]

Is there any particular reason that people have decided to jump all over this CDC because of his age? 

[DakRadz]

I am a Cadet, and would love to wear my uniform to school, because I am proud of it, but at the same time worried people will think of me as cocky, or a show off.

I would probably consider you to be both considering your response above.

The OP gave his reasons and qualifications. Before that, yeah, I said some stuff.  But after? Right now one of my fellow cadets is a volly FF, been in CAP for years, and if he was asked to switch to SM to be our DCC, I would gladly call him sir and follow his lead- and he would gladly take the position if necessary based on past conversations. (My squadron isn't that short-staffed, luckily- we have good experienced leaders).

But hey, everyone has to learn sometime. The OP did, at least, step up to the plate.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Is there any particular reason that people have decided to jump all over this CDC because of his age?

I was personally surprised, because his OP gave me the impression that he is a younger cadet.

I guess it went downhill from there.

Mavvrikk, I'm not sure how old you are, but you do admit to being a cadet. Did the new leadership texts get rid of respect for officers?

[Eclipse]

I'm lost...

[DakRadz]

OP- SM with former NJROTC experience. Paid his dues, given DCC job.

Doubtful posts regarding who/what/why the OP was.

Argument over... pride and prejudice? Something like that.

Cadet steps in and says the OP is some sort of lying troll.

Eclipse is confused- O.O/thread!

[Майор Хаткевич]

OP- SM with former NJROTC experience. Paid his dues, given DCC job.

Doubtful posts regarding who/what/why the OP was.

Argument over... pride and prejudice? Something like that.

Cadet steps in and says the OP is some sort of lying troll.

Eclipse is confused- O.O/thread!

Actually,

OP asks a non-punctuated one liner;
Reveals to be a HS Senior and the DCC;
That leads to a side discussion on the situation;
Topic moves on and does a slow drift;
Topic gets once again carried away with Mavverikk's comments;
Here we are now.

[Skydude61]

Get your squadron commander's permission first.
Then talk with your school adminstation to make sure they don't mind recruiting at school....then go for it.

Also make sure that these are documented and signed... don't want people saying "why are you doing this" and then all you have is verbal confirmation. better to have it on paper.

Why are we talking about ages of cadets from JROTC, and how much they have done, or what they have paid, or doubted...
BACK ON TRACK!

[Mavvrikk]

If he is actually an officer, I apologize, but due to the fact of how he types and his stories seem pretty unrealistic, I don't really believe him, but, if he's telling the truth, I give him all respect.

[cust0s]

If he is actually an officer, I apologize, but due to the fact of how he types and his stories seem pretty unrealistic, I don't really believe him, but, if he's telling the truth, I give him all respect.

Isn't that the same as saying "With all due respect..." before insulting somebody?  Haven't you seen Talladega Nights?

[Майор Хаткевич]

If he is actually an officer, I apologize, but due to the fact of how he types and his stories seem pretty unrealistic, I don't really believe him, but, if he's telling the truth, I give him all respect.

What are the CAP Core Values again?

[DakRadz]

If he is actually an officer, I apologize, but due to the fact of how he types and his stories seem pretty unrealistic, I don't really believe him, but, if he's telling the truth, I give him all respect.

He's a SM. He never claimed to be a CAP cadet.

Also, proof-read your signature.

[Mavvrikk]

If he is actually an officer, I apologize, but due to the fact of how he types and his stories seem pretty unrealistic, I don't really believe him, but, if he's telling the truth, I give him all respect.

He's a SM. He never claimed to be a CAP cadet.

Also, proof-read your signature.

My signature? And I'm done with the conversation, you guys are right, I apologize.

[lycan1138]

Sorry about my grammar it's not that great because i was on a iphone and the screen was broken so i couldn't use all the buttons. And yes i am telling the truth, i do not lye about this stuff, also we have 3 senior member we are really short handed and the SM part of the squadron is horrible because of it but we are trying to fix the problems luckily we have help from some experienced officer.

[mjbernier]

Regardless of the nature of the OP's rank or position, the question that started this thread had to do with whether or not it was a good idea for Cadets to wear their uniforms to school for recruiting purposes. I think that this question was pretty well answered along the way. The side discussions sort of took things on tangents that really didn't have much application to the original question. I hope the same will not happen to me...

I have a similar question regarding the wear of uniforms at school, but it's from a different angle. I am the recently-appointed PAO for our squadron, and I am helping our CC put together materials that could be used in presentations to our local schools and civic groups. I will likely be the one to speak to our local school board since all three of my children have been in that system over the past 10 years. When I do get on the agenda to present at a school board meeting, or later when I'm making presentations in the schools themselves, is it appropriate (or is there a best practice) to go to these presentations in full dress uniform (Class A/B/Aviator shirt) or to dress more casually (such as the golf shirt uniform)? Would the same policy or practice apply if I am speaking to a civic group, like a Rotary club?

Thanks in advance! 

Mike

[Briski]

I've heard the "with your squadron commander's approval" response pretty much ever since I joined CAP. However, I recently tried looking it up, and I couldn't find any regulatory precedent for it.

Does anyone have a reg cite to verify that authorizing members to wear their CAP uniforms to school is within the squadron commander's authority?

Thanks,

[Майор Хаткевич]

I've heard the "with your squadron commander's approval" response pretty much ever since I joined CAP. However, I recently tried looking it up, and I couldn't find any regulatory precedent for it.

Does anyone have a reg cite to verify that authorizing members to wear their CAP uniforms to school is within the squadron commander's authority?

Thanks,

I think it's more of a "heads up" than anything specific regarding wear outside of CAP activities.

[Fubar]

I think it might be a gray area (surprising, I know). You can wear a CAP uniform to "CAP activities" and if your CC declares wearing a uniform to school a CAP activity, I suspect you're good to go. Since there is no official definition to what a CAP activity is, it becomes the CC's responsibility to make those calls.

When in doubt, what the boss says goes. 

[Eclipse]

Does anyone have a reg cite to verify that authorizing members to wear their CAP uniforms to school is within the squadron commander's authority?

You squadron or echelon commander is directly responsible for everything you do in CAP, and is the person who authorizes all of your participation in everything, either overtly, or through omission.

Absent a higher authority, he is the person who defines what a CAP activity "is" for his members, and whether and who can participate.

[Briski]

So, to summarize the general consensus:

• There is no regulatory precedent specifically giving commanders the authority to authorize members of their units to wear CAP uniforms to school or other similar activities;
  
• However, commanders can basically say, "Hey, you three cadets attend the same school, right? Why don't you wear your uniforms to school on Thursday as part of a recruiting drive?";
  
• A recruiting drive would be an official CAP activity, and this is certainly within the authority of a commander.
  

This makes complete sense to me, even if the specific term "recruiting drive" isn't used.

Am I missing anything in this summary explanation?

Thanks,

[Extremepredjudice]

I think he could definitly allow his cadets to wear their uniforms. You need to be careful that they don't disrepect the uniform, or act inappropriately.

The op could get the greenlight from the principles, Then make it a reward to be allowed to wear your uniforms... Stuff like passing milestones, getting perfect on inspection... Stuff like that.

Or people you know that would act appropriately you allow to wear their uniforns...