Red Service Ribbon

[taylor914]

I have been in CAP for 2.5 years now and I know at 2 years you're qualified to wear the Red Service Ribbon.  My Yeager and Membership awards show up in my member search report.  Should the service award show up as well before I am authorized to wear the ribbon?  Do I have to fill out paperwork or something to be authorized?  Or do I just wear it since I'm past the 2 year mark and am in good standing?

[Eclipse]

Red Service does not appear in eServices.

Ask your CC if he wants to do the Form.  Some insist on a form for everything, some, like myself, see the
self-actualizing decorations as being just that.  To me the RSR is awarded based on the calendar, not the whim
of a CC.  It's not like he could deny it.

With that said, your CC may want to actually recognize it, so again, best to ask him.

[taylor914]

Thanks for the advice Eclipse.  I get so confused with all of the regs and forms and uniform requirements.

[Panache]

My CC requests that nobody wears it until he has a chance to formally "award" it during the monthly promotion-and-award night, but that's only because he likes giving out awards and promotions.  If you choose to wear it as soon as your eligible, that's fine with him too.

[Storm Chaser]

If you want the ribbon, I strongly recommend you complete the CAPF 2A and have it approved by the appropriate commander. The reason being is that, while eServices shows the date you joined CAP, it doesn't show any lapse in membership. As time passes and if you move units later on, you may need to go out of your way to document an award that you can easily get approve now.

[Private Investigator]

When I was CC I like passing out SWAG. Some Squadrons have created their own Cerificate for the Red Service Ribbon too.

Congratulations and thank you for your service.   

[Mitchell 1969]

On a related note - isn't it about time that we just started calling it the "Service Ribbon" instead of "Red Service Ribbon?" It's not as if we still had the Blue Service Ribbon and White Service Ribbon anymore. What's it been - 40 + years since they went away?

[vento]

On a related note - isn't it about time that we just started calling it the "Service Ribbon" instead of "Red Service Ribbon?" It's not as if we still had the Blue Service Ribbon and White Service Ribbon anymore. What's it been - 40 + years since they went away?

Isn't the Blue Service Ribbon called Command Service Ribbon nowadays? Or are they totally different animals?

[SarDragon]

Totally different.

[Mitchell 1969]

On a related note - isn't it about time that we just started calling it the "Service Ribbon" instead of "Red Service Ribbon?" It's not as if we still had the Blue Service Ribbon and White Service Ribbon anymore. What's it been - 40 + years since they went away?

Isn't the Blue Service Ribbon called Command Service Ribbon nowadays? Or are they totally different animals?

Totally different. The service ribbons used to be Red, White, Blue. Cadets were not eligible to earn them. I forget the service requirements, but they were awarded in that order. Only one was worn at a time - earn White, drop Red. Earn Blue, drop White.

Blue and White were eliminated in favor of the clasp/numbers arrangement on the Red and cadets were made eligible to earn it. I won't swear to it, but 1971 sticks in my mind as when it all changed.

[vento]

^^^ Thanks for the history.    :clap:

[SarDragon]

My sources confirm the 1971 date, which leads me to question whether or not I wore a Red Service ribbon as a cadet. I thought I did. I don't have a period 39-3 to confirm the current rules.

[pierson777]

Eservices does not track activity and service ribbons.  Awarding the Red Service Ribbon requires a CAPF 2a.  The wing commander is the approving authority for all activity and service ribbons, however the wing commander may delegate this authority to subordinate unit commanders. 

Submit the CAPF 2a to your unit commander or designee such as Deputy Commander, Personnel Officer, Administration Officer, etc. depending upon your local procedures.  It should eventually be be approved by the wing commander or whichever echelon commander has been delegated with the authority to award the Red Service Ribbon within your wing.

Some things appear in eServices, but aren't technically true documentation of the award or decoration, and therefore still require a  CAPF 2a. i.e. IACE, Command Service, Encampment Ribbon, etc.

I truly hope this process is replaced soon with electronic submission and approval, and tracked on eServices.  The CAPF 2a is no longer the preferred method for retirements, transfers, and duty assignments (except for any locally created duties not reflected in CAPR 20-1).  I personally would much rather spend my time training in ES than submitting and tracking CAPF 2a's.

[SarDragon]

Some things appear in eServices, but aren't technically true documentation of the award or decoration, and therefore still require a  CAPF 2a. i.e. IACE, Command Service, Encampment Ribbon, etc.

Command Service is tracked, and well as Encampments.

I'm guessing that cadet special activities are, also, including IACE. If you went a long time ago, you'll need to submit proof, and they will update it. I did that for two encampments.

[Eclipse]

Command Service is tracked, and well as Encampments.

I'm guessing that cadet special activities are, also, including IACE. If you went a long time ago, you'll need to submit proof, and they will update it. I did that for two encampments.

Command service is supposed to be tracked, however if it predates eServices, or wasn't properly recorded, it won't be in there.

I had to have my Command Service corrected before I could get my Jumpstart approved, and a number of my encampments
were not in there. NHQ corrected the encampments with just an email, and the Command issues with a message from the Wing CC.

[LSThiker]

It's not like he could deny it.

Well that depends on how one interprets the "in good standing" clause.  Does this mean, if not under investigation?  Does it mean, if he attends frequently?  Does it mean, if you see him 1 time ever 3 months?

This would the reason why members are not automatically awarded the ribbon after 2 / 5 years. 

Command Service is tracked, and well as Encampments.

I'm guessing that cadet special activities are, also, including IACE. If you went a long time ago, you'll need to submit proof, and they will update it. I did that for two encampments.

IACE and NCSAs are tracked as the same with encampments (assuming NHQ does not accidentally screw up and forget to add your name).

Really, I wish eServices would track all ribbons and awards.  Hopefully, we will get there at some point.

[Eclipse]

It's not like he could deny it.

Well that depends on how one interprets the "in good standing" clause.  Does this mean, if not under investigation?

This is a stretch, but I understand the point.  In CAP parlance "good standing" is essentially "check did no bounce"
(investigations aside).

Does it mean, if he attends frequently?  Does it mean, if you see him 1 time ever 3 months?

Neither of these is a factor in the award criteria, nor would they be grounds for disapproval.
Denying a service ribbon on either of these would be a great way to receive a sustained complaint.

[LSThiker]

It's not like he could deny it.

Well that depends on how one interprets the "in good standing" clause.  Does this mean, if not under investigation?

This is a stretch, but I understand the point.  In CAP parlance "good standing" is essentially "check did no bounce"
(investigations aside).

Does it mean, if he attends frequently?  Does it mean, if you see him 1 time ever 3 months?

Neither of these is a factor in the award criteria, nor would they be grounds for disapproval.
Denying a service ribbon on either of these would be a great way to receive a sustained complaint.

My point is, there is a nebulous "in good standing" clause that has never really been defined.  It is left up to the commander to decide.  I think most commanders would agree that it means "the check/credit card did not bounce".  Even in the business world outside of CAP, that clause has many different standards depending on the business you are.  In the broadest sense, it simply means "in favor or on good terms with someone."

A question,I have is, would you (in general you) award the red service ribbon to a member that has spent the last 10 years in a ghost squadron?  (I have seen this happen and reasons or circumstances aside, it has happened.  Or even a person that spent 8 years active and 2 years inactive.  Or any combination or scenario).  therefore, if the criteria is simply "the check did not bounce", then all of those members that have been in a ghost squadron for 2, 5, 10, etc years should be mailed a CAPF 2a. 

[Eclipse]

A question,I have is, would you (in general you) award the red service ribbon to a member that has spent the last 10 years in a ghost squadron?  (I have seen this happen and reasons or circumstances aside, it has happened.  Or even a person that spent 8 years active and 2 years inactive.  Or any combination or scenario).  therefore, if the criteria is simply "the check did not bounce", then all of those members that have been in a ghost squadron for 2, 5, 10, etc years should be mailed a CAPF 2a.

Technically an unanswerable question - the 000 units don't have commanders, so there is no one to approve the 2a, though I
suppose the Wing CC could do it.

The real answer is "yes", assuming they were not patrons.  NHQ chooses to count these empty shirts as "active members",
and while many (most) wings have been pushed to Patron-ize all the members in 000, I don't think this is universal.

So if NHQ sees fit to count these empty shirts as "active", then they should qualify for the RSR.

[pierson777]

Some things appear in eServices, but aren't technically true documentation of the award or decoration, and therefore still require a  CAPF 2a. i.e. IACE, Command Service, Encampment Ribbon, etc.

Point of clarification.  I did not say that those items (encampment, NCSA, command service, etc.) are not tracked in eServices, rather I said the exact opposite.  I said that they are tracked in eServices.  But appearing in eServices does not alone warrant the wear of the associated ribbon.  No CAP directive allows the eServices record of participation to substitute for the CAPF 2a for activity and service ribbons.  They are awarded in accordance with CAPR 39-3.  Thus, we still use CAPF 2a.