New NCSA?

[afgeo4]

I was thinking of an Boot Camp, NCO - Drill master type of camp.

How about a week spent at BMT at Lackland? They could do what real flights do and get an MTI who's between flights to push them through. Might also be good for new MTIs to train.

[afgeo4]

I wish USAF would identify high demand - low density career fields and offer summer activities in those careers to our cadets at no cost. It may end up yielding a good number of enlisted men and women who are interested specifically in those fields.

[DC]

Ok, first responders course....

60 hours of classroom, No clinical or Ride time.

I talked to an instructor of the FR class and he indicated that it was just as rough as the EMT - Basic without worrying about transport.

He also indicated that 2 weeks for the course was pushing the limits of learning, but was possible.

Also you would have to go back to your home state to take the practicals, then the national exam.

We coule set this up is several ways.  We would have to limit class size and identify prereq's for the course.

Then.....we know there will be attrition, what do we do with those that "fail" the course through exam failures?

Send them home? In a normal class you could tutor them, but there would not be time during an NCSA. If they cannot keep up with the course then why keep them around, you are not doing them any favors... Maybe give them a second chance at the final test, if they fail it twice they fail the course..

[CadetProgramGuy]

Ok, first responders course....

60 hours of classroom, No clinical or Ride time.

I talked to an instructor of the FR class and he indicated that it was just as rough as the EMT - Basic without worrying about transport.

He also indicated that 2 weeks for the course was pushing the limits of learning, but was possible.

Also you would have to go back to your home state to take the practicals, then the national exam.

We coule set this up is several ways.  We would have to limit class size and identify prereq's for the course.

Then.....we know there will be attrition, what do we do with those that "fail" the course through exam failures?

Send them home? In a normal class you could tutor them, but there would not be time during an NCSA. If they cannot keep up with the course then why keep them around, you are not doing them any favors... Maybe give them a second chance at the final test, if they fail it twice they fail the course..

In my current Basic course you can fail each of the test's only once, get a re-take, if you fail that you are out.

Also there are a maximum of 4 retakes out of 8 tests.

[afgeo4]

Why are you guys so hardcore about First Responder's courses? CAP, by nature and mission isn't a first response agency. It just isn't what we do. There are agencies that are first responders. Volunteer ambulance corps and volunteer fire brigades come to mind. I think if you want to be first responders, you should join them and make a difference! We have our missions and we need more training for that. We want to make a difference doing air and ground searches.

Now I know you guys will tell me that in the wilderness our ground teams could be the first ones to get to the victims, but tell me... how many missions like that are there a year? What percentage is it of the total missions we go out on? How critical was it for our members to be qualified as first responders on those missions?

I'm sure that when you look at the real statistics you'll realize that it's a skill that 99.99% of members would never get to use in the field. Now don't y'all think it'd be a better use of time and money to teach them something they would use?

[DC]

Why are you guys so hardcore about First Responder's courses? CAP, by nature and mission isn't a first response agency. It just isn't what we do. There are agencies that are first responders. Volunteer ambulance corps and volunteer fire brigades come to mind. I think if you want to be first responders, you should join them and make a difference! We have our missions and we need more training for that. We want to make a difference doing air and ground searches.

Now I know you guys will tell me that in the wilderness our ground teams could be the first ones to get to the victims, but tell me... how many missions like that are there a year? What percentage is it of the total missions we go out on? How critical was it for our members to be qualified as first responders on those missions?

I'm sure that when you look at the real statistics you'll realize that it's a skill that 99.99% of members would never get to use in the field. Now don't y'all think it'd be a better use of time and money to teach them something they would use?

The point of NCSAs isn't always to directly benefit CAP by training members. It is a cool thing that a cadet that is interested in medicine but can't be an EMT yet can pursue. Around here cadets can't go on REDCAPs anyway, so there is little point in cadets attaining GTM certification, attending NESA or any of it. The purpose of NCSAs is to provide the experience to cadets, not be a more efficient way of achieving ES training. Its about the cadets, plain and simple.

[DC]

Ok, first responders course....

60 hours of classroom, No clinical or Ride time.

I talked to an instructor of the FR class and he indicated that it was just as rough as the EMT - Basic without worrying about transport.

He also indicated that 2 weeks for the course was pushing the limits of learning, but was possible.

Also you would have to go back to your home state to take the practicals, then the national exam.

We coule set this up is several ways.  We would have to limit class size and identify prereq's for the course.

Then.....we know there will be attrition, what do we do with those that "fail" the course through exam failures?

Send them home? In a normal class you could tutor them, but there would not be time during an NCSA. If they cannot keep up with the course then why keep them around, you are not doing them any favors... Maybe give them a second chance at the final test, if they fail it twice they fail the course..

In my current Basic course you can fail each of the test's only once, get a re-take, if you fail that you are out.

Also there are a maximum of 4 retakes out of 8 tests.

Yeah, but that's EMT-B. FR is not quite a complicated. It's pretty much the same deal, BLS, EMTs just add a few additional skills, and get a lot more practice at it. When I did my FR it was divided up into sections (Airway, CPR, Soft-Tissue Injures, etc) and there was a short quiz at the end of each section, but it was more of a class deal. Then at the end of the course we had a 100 question written test, with a minimum 80% passing grade. We also got homework, the books we worked out of (Brady's First Responder, 9th Edition I think) came with a workbook. After each class we would go home and do the section of the workbook that corresponded with the days course work. Nobody in my class of about 10 had any problem with the test, the lowest grade was like an 85 or something...

[sarmed1]

FR is a nice qualification.  For anyone, especially those (and I think its bigger than 0.01%) that may need it because they are active in land SAR or Disaster relief.  NCSA's should be about learning about oppurtunites for cadets.  Leave schools that qualifiy you for something or enhance you existing abilites to be their own animal ( ie HMRS, NESA, COS etc etc)

A medical carreer NCSA would be nice; even a military one.  Learn a little about the some of the high speed medical stuff out there do some shadowing and ride alongs....aeromedical evac fixed and rotor wing, critical care transport hazmat/rescue medicine, military medicine and what you need to do if thats the path you want to go down in your carreer civilian or military.  Honestly San Antonio would be a great place to develop such an activity.  You have Lackland AFB, Fort SAM Houston, Brooks City Base and Camp Bullis right there.  Wilford Hall/Brooke Army Meidcal center both are level 1 trauma facilities, Lackland has an active reserve fixed wing aerovac program as well as the school for the AF at Brooks City Base, Critical care air transport school is at Brooks as well as most of the Air Force's AD teams including pediatrics are out of Wilford hall.  BAMC has one of the premier Burn units as well as a Burn Transport team, FtSam/Camp Bullis runs all of the Armys medic programs plus tri service DMRTI (defense medical rediness institute) there is a very active civilian rotor wing program in the city plus a NG helo unit.  (and PJ indoc is there too....could play that tie in as well)

that would be cool.....
mk

[Duke Dillio]

Here's my idea:

Start by going out with an Army field artillery battery and shoot their guns.
Then go to an Army Tow Missile Company and fire their stuff live.
Then hop on an AC-130 for a fun filled joy ride live fire.
Then jump on a Navy boat with some 5 inch guns for more live fire.
Maybe join some forward observers on a hill to watch the stuff come down.
And finally, have a BBQ.

Indirect Fire Familiarization Course.

I know I'd love it.

[mikeylikey]

Here's my idea:

Start by going out with an Army field artillery battery and shoot their guns.
Then go to an Army Tow Missile Company and fire their stuff live.
Then hop on an AC-130 for a fun filled joy ride live fire.
Then jump on a Navy boat with some 5 inch guns for more live fire.
Maybe join some forward observers on a hill to watch the stuff come down.
And finally, have a BBQ.

Indirect Fire Familiarization Course.

I know I'd love it.

Minus the stuff I striked, I did that with a group of Cadets about 3 years ago!  It was Awesome. 

[sarmed1]

When I was at DM the base Liason coordinated for our cadets to sit in on a live fire (might have been GBS though cant remmeber for sure)CSAR type mission demo....mission/situation briefing...then bus ride to Gila Bend AS hike up a really big hill watch the A-10 CAS and the rescue pick off...we missed something in there so via radio he got the A-10 to come in low and fast on a simulated straffing run on the way out...it was pretty cool....

mak

[RiverAux]

Now I know you guys will tell me that in the wilderness our ground teams could be the first ones to get to the victims, but tell me... how many missions like that are there a year? What percentage is it of the total missions we go out on? How critical was it for our members to be qualified as first responders on those missions?

Doesn't matter -- under the new national standards we're going to need to have someone on our ground teams to do that sort of stuff. 

[CadetProgramGuy]

Why are you guys so hardcore about First Responder's courses? CAP, by nature and mission isn't a first response agency. It just isn't what we do. There are agencies that are first responders. Volunteer ambulance corps and volunteer fire brigades come to mind. I think if you want to be first responders, you should join them and make a difference! We have our missions and we need more training for that. We want to make a difference doing air and ground searches.

Now I know you guys will tell me that in the wilderness our ground teams could be the first ones to get to the victims, but tell me... how many missions like that are there a year? What percentage is it of the total missions we go out on? How critical was it for our members to be qualified as first responders on those missions?

I'm sure that when you look at the real statistics you'll realize that it's a skill that 99.99% of members would never get to use in the field. Now don't y'all think it'd be a better use of time and money to teach them something they would use?

The point of NCSAs isn't always to directly benefit CAP by training members. It is a cool thing that a cadet that is interested in medicine but can't be an EMT yet can pursue. Around here cadets can't go on REDCAPs anyway, so there is little point in cadets attaining GTM certification, attending NESA or any of it. The purpose of NCSAs is to provide the experience to cadets, not be a more efficient way of achieving ES training. Its about the cadets, plain and simple.

Why is it that you do not believe that CAP is a first response agency?  We are sometimes the first on scene of some pretty horrific stuff.

While I agree with you in principle, I have to admit that giving cadets and Officers the tools that are needed to complete and compete on the National SAR level.  NIMS will give CAP fits unless CAP finds a way to get the training done.

While CAP will still be able to 'do' Search and rescue, you will find that even with high levels of training, unless you have medical staff on your team, you are a type III or IV team at best.  I will look up the specifics and post them later. 

Bottom line is that our members need this training.

[afgeo4]

Why are you guys so hardcore about First Responder's courses? CAP, by nature and mission isn't a first response agency. It just isn't what we do. There are agencies that are first responders. Volunteer ambulance corps and volunteer fire brigades come to mind. I think if you want to be first responders, you should join them and make a difference! We have our missions and we need more training for that. We want to make a difference doing air and ground searches.

Now I know you guys will tell me that in the wilderness our ground teams could be the first ones to get to the victims, but tell me... how many missions like that are there a year? What percentage is it of the total missions we go out on? How critical was it for our members to be qualified as first responders on those missions?

I'm sure that when you look at the real statistics you'll realize that it's a skill that 99.99% of members would never get to use in the field. Now don't y'all think it'd be a better use of time and money to teach them something they would use?

The point of NCSAs isn't always to directly benefit CAP by training members. It is a cool thing that a cadet that is interested in medicine but can't be an EMT yet can pursue. Around here cadets can't go on REDCAPs anyway, so there is little point in cadets attaining GTM certification, attending NESA or any of it. The purpose of NCSAs is to provide the experience to cadets, not be a more efficient way of achieving ES training. Its about the cadets, plain and simple.

I'm cool with a medical careers cadet activity. Either civilian or military will do. A week spent with an Aeromedical Evacuation Squadron or at a base hospital would be very useful.  I just don't think getting First Responder is a good summer activity. It's too narrow in appeal and application for cadets.

[maverik]

One I would create would be an advanced honor guard encampment. It would last a week and a half and we would train with the Marine Corp silent drill team and the old guard that guarded the tomb of the unknowns. Oh and I would start up the old Airborne school in Indiana and PA.

[DC]

One I would create would be an advanced honor guard encampment. It would last a week and a half and we would train with the Marine Corp silent drill team and the old guard that guarded the tomb of the unknowns. Oh and I would start up the old Airborne school in Indiana and PA.

There is already the Honor Guard Academy, which I believe does train with an Air Force Honor Guard. Usually military NCSAs are Air Force related, Air Force Auxilary and all.

I can see mucho insurance issues with any thing that involves jumping from aircraft...

[maverik]

Hey we did it once we can do it again and I was looking at a joint srvice Honor Guard school that way everyone knows we're out there.

[DC]

Hey we did it once we can do it again and I was looking at a joint srvice Honor Guard school that way everyone knows we're out there.

When though? The '50s, '60s? CAP is a different organization these days, and back then people understood what 'at your own risk' meant, now all people understand is the word 'lawsuit'.

[maverik]

Well just look at the PJOC forms and read the fine fine fine print like I had to use a magnifying class.

[SAR-EMT1]

I'm not sure if someone already mentioned this but I wouldnt offer another cadet encampment. I would however design a miniature OCS for Officers. Figure a week or two for those SMs comprised of Leadership, Communication, PT, military history, etc.
NO, this wouldnt be SLS or CLC revised.

Class to be taught by RM Officers, NCO's and business execs.