Why shouldn't there be designated outergarments for CAP distinctive uniforms?

[RiverAux]

Can anyone give me a decent reason why there are not specific outgarments for CAP distintive uniforms?  Just because you're in a Blue BDU or flightsuit doesn't meant that CAP couldn't have picked something to be the official jacket or overcoat.  Just because it isn't AF-style doesn't mean that we have to totally abandon the concept of uniformity does it?

The only "uniform" that we shouldn't have a designated outgarment for probably should be the blazer, since that is so civilian it doesn't even count. 

[MIKE]

Because people will just ignore it and wear whatever they want anyway.

[CASH172]

I don't know about anyone else here, but I find the golf shirt to be pretty much the most civilian uniform there is.  More than the blazer. 

[Eclipse]

Because one of the points of the corporate uniforms are to allow for service by people of limited means wearing mostly apparel they already own.

[JayT]

Can anyone give me a decent reason why there are not specific outgarments for CAP distintive uniforms?  Just because you're in a Blue BDU or flightsuit doesn't meant that CAP couldn't have picked something to be the official jacket or overcoat.  Just because it isn't AF-style doesn't mean that we have to totally abandon the concept of uniformity does it?

The only "uniform" that we shouldn't have a designated outgarment for probably should be the blazer, since that is so civilian it doesn't even count. 

Besides the blue MA1 and M65, and that ugly blue jacket Vanguard sells?

[star1151]

Because one of the points of the corporate uniforms are to allow for service by people of limited means wearing mostly apparel they already own.

Yes, but what about those of us who simply don't have appropriate outerwear for the CAP uniforms?  Some guidance would be nice.

[RiverAux]

I'm not aware of anything saying that the reason we have corporate uniforms are to save money for members.  I'm sure we can come up with all sorts of examples where CAP members could get free or inexpensive AF-style uniforms for less than the cost of CAP corporate uniforms.

Besides the blue MA1 and M65, and that ugly blue jacket Vanguard sells?

yes, they are sold, but nothing requires that they be worn with those uniforms.  I could put a hot pink ski jacket over BBDUs or a flightsuit if I wanted. 

[Eclipse]

I'm not aware of anything saying that the reason we have corporate uniforms are to save money for members.  I'm sure we can come up with all sorts of examples where CAP members could get free or inexpensive AF-style uniforms for less than the cost of CAP corporate uniforms.

Less than a $17 golf shirt w/ pants / shoes / jacket you already own?

Insignia alone on one "free" BDU blouse will cost as much.

[SARMedTech]

Because one of the points of the corporate uniforms are to allow for service by people of limited means wearing mostly apparel they already own.

Yes, but what about those of us who simply don't have appropriate outerwear for the CAP uniforms?  Some guidance would be nice.

I hate to open this can of worms, but it seems to me that, at least in the case of the BBDU's, the M-65 field coat would just be common sense. I've asked and it can have the same things affixed to it as the camo version (or at least there is no prohibition that I know of or was told about...this came from our sdrn's commander). We have people wearing the blue M-65, as well as navy blue windbreakers for slightly warmer weather but in conditions where a jacket is desirable. It seems to me that since there is no guidance, that one's internal compass would lead to outgarments that match or co-ordinate with the corporates. And heck, for the corporate blue's equivalent, I bet you could find dark blue Members Only jackets on Ebay. 

[afgeo4]

Because one of the points of the corporate uniforms are to allow for service by people of limited means wearing mostly apparel they already own.

Yes, but what about those of us who simply don't have appropriate outerwear for the CAP uniforms?  Some guidance would be nice.

I hate to open this can of worms, but it seems to me that, at least in the case of the BBDU's, the M-65 field coat would just be common sense. I've asked and it can have the same things affixed to it as the camo version (or at least there is no prohibition that I know of or was told about...this came from our sdrn's commander). We have people wearing the blue M-65, as well as navy blue windbreakers for slightly warmer weather but in conditions where a jacket is desirable. It seems to me that since there is no guidance, that one's internal compass would lead to outgarments that match or co-ordinate with the corporates. And heck, for the corporate blue's equivalent, I bet you could find dark blue Members Only jackets on Ebay. 

The corporate blue equivalent has the black (Army) outerwear authorized. Both, the lightweight jacket and the all-weather coat are in the regs. Don't now about the topcoat.

[Eagle400]

Because people will just ignore it and wear whatever they want anyway.

Which seems to be the attitude many members have regarding outerwear for the AF uniforms.   

[♠SARKID♠]

I could put a hot pink ski jacket over BBDUs or a flightsuit if I wanted.

Please don't.

[Hawk200]

I could put a hot pink ski jacket over BBDUs or a flightsuit if I wanted.

Please don't.

Why not? ? Let him. It would be an easy target. 

[SAR-EMT1]

I could put a hot pink ski jacket over BBDUs or a flightsuit if I wanted.

Please don't.

Why not? ? Let him. It would be an easy target. 

But hten NHQ would require it for visibility issues.

[afgeo4]

I could put a hot pink ski jacket over BBDUs or a flightsuit if I wanted.

Please don't.

Why not? ? Let him. It would be an easy target. 

But hten NHQ would require it for visibility issues.

And I would require it for Youtube

[star1151]

It seems to me that since there is no guidance, that one's internal compass would lead to outgarments that match or co-ordinate with the corporates. And heck, for the corporate blue's equivalent, I bet you could find dark blue Members Only jackets on Ebay. 

I don't even know what that those are. :-)

[billford1]

It's interesting how they keep authorizing additional outerwear like overcoats and black windbreakers for the blue aviator shirt corporate uniform. It seems they have decided not to go any further with anything additional for the gray slacks crowd. Do you suppose us gray slacks folks are supposed to get a message from this?

[Major Carrales]

It's interesting how they keep authorizing additional outerwear like overcoats and black windbreakers for the blue aviator shirt corporate uniform. It seems they have decided not to go any further with anything additional for the gray slacks crowd. Do you suppose us gray slacks folks are supposed to get a message from this?

No, I think the "Grey Slacks crowd" uniform and the "corportate uniform" will one day merge to the middle ground.

[billford1]

I've thought that for a while because it makes sense. It just makes me laugh at the time spent by those in the uniform control crowd who keep things from being uniform like they should be.

[O-Rex]

Did I miss something?

I thought that the Blue M65 was okay for BBDU's and that the Black A-2 jacket was the outer garment of choice for the blue utility and/or blue flightsuit (?)

[SARMedTech]

Did I miss something?

I thought that the Blue M65 was okay for BBDU's and that the Black A-2 jacket was the outer garment of choice for the blue utility and/or blue flightsuit (?)

This is the practice across the board in my squadron, among the members of the so-called "fat and fuzzy" brigade.

[Eclipse]

Did I miss something?

I thought that the Blue M65 was okay for BBDU's and that the Black A-2 jacket was the outer garment of choice for the blue utility and/or blue flightsuit (?)

Yes, they are - but there's a difference between "ok" and prescribed.

The USAF-Style uniforms all have a strict prescription regarding what can be worn over them, most of the corporates have a civilian "whatever" choice.

[Dragoon]

In the interest of low cost (and the fact that we'll never get everyone to dress exactly alike anyway), I'd love to see us standardize on a color for outer garments, even if no specific garment was chosen.

Blue would have been nice, but since we've already got specified black outerwear for the TPU, plus a black leather jacket that you can wear with almost everything else, I vote for black as the outer color.

Why not just specify for the golf shirt, BBDU, utility, flight and white and greys that "Commercial outergarments may be worn, but must be black with with no additional markings or colors visible."  (or if you wanna be fancy, you could mandate the Command patch be worn.)

Keeps the cost low, but adds a measure of uniformity.  You can pick up a cheap black windbreaker for under $20.  And black M-65s and nylon flight jackets are available just about everywhere.

[RiverAux]

I could go for that especially since with black it will avoid a lot of the issues we see with different shadings of supposedly the same color (gray pants)

[SARMedTech]

Where did this whole black thing come from?  Why not blue, as in a color that actually co-ordinates with the rest of the corporate uniforms?

[Hawk200]

Where did this whole black thing come from?  Why not blue, as in a color that actually co-ordinates with the rest of the corporate uniforms?

You'd have to ask those that prescribed the black Army outergarments for the CSU variations.

Since those items are already black, standardizing on black would be easier.

Additionally, there are far more shades of blue out there. Black is a fairly standard color. It would also avoid any problems of some items that look close to Air Force items, but not close enough that there would be issues.

[RiverAux]

Blue would be better, but unless we actually picked a specific outgarment and a particular shade (which I wouldn't mind), we would end up with just as many shades of blue as we have shades of gray pants now.  The simplest, cheapest solution would be to at least have a standard color but allow variation in style. 

[Dragoon]

Methinks they went with black so as to be able to claim "see, it's not a USAF uniform."

So somehow, wearing Army outergarments is OK, but USAF ones aren't.  Sheesh.

Anyhow, what's done is done.  Add to that the Black A-2 (which seems to be pretty popular) and the fact that black pretty much comes in one shade (while blue comes in MANY) and I think I can live with black outergarments.

But yeah, I would have liked blue better.

[O-Rex]

Methinks they went with black so as to be able to claim "see, it's not a USAF uniform."

It's all about semantics: the statement above was what spawned the white/blue corporates in the first place.

[billford1]

What's funny is I get to wear an AF blue gaberdine sweater with my gray and white shirt uniform. Some people at wing thought that looked screwed up and I had to confirm for them that it was legal. I have a blue M-65 that I can wear with my BBDU which is just fine.