Radio Use Question

[isuhawkeye]

Just yesterday I was working a multi agency, multi operational period missing persons search.  I was handed a "non approved" hand held radio by an experienced Search manager form another SAR entity.   This SAR coordinator told me "If you need me give me a shout".

So, how do I respond. 

I cant give him a CAP radio to talk on, and I dont have staff to have a radio operator follow him around. 

I'm not supose to use the FRS radio in use.

What do you sugest. 

[SJFedor]

Was it an organizational radio, like FDs or PDs carry with their own special frequencies, or was it just an FRS radio?

Best thing to do is say something to the extent of "You have a cell phone number? Those tend to work better for me, I always break these things." 

[isuhawkeye]

It was an FRS,

And my cell phone doesnt work in many of the places we search

[floridacyclist]

I know I saw a policy letter a while back that FRS was allowed when needed to communicate with others. I believe it was referring primarily to communicating with rescuees, but I doubt it would take much to extend that concept to communicating with other rescuers. I just found it and the relevant portion says that

We still can not use FRS to talk CAP-to-CAP on Emergency Services (ES) missions. Intra Squad Radios (ISR) and VHF-FM radios are designed for those functions. However, this new policy does allow us to use FRS to talk to victims. Also, FRS continues to be allowable for non-ES activities.

I started looking through the comm pages at https://ntc.cap.af.mil ... Even though I was behind the firewall when I found this, I really don't think it's FOUO...if so, somebody slap me...but here's some quotes from the FAQs

The FAQ regarding FRS says

Because the NTIA and the Air Force have changed their rules, FRS radios are now authorized for some, but not all, CAP activities. Basically, you may NOT use FRS radios for any ES Missions or training, or anything pertaining to emergency or medical communications, command and control communications, or disaster response. Some suitable activities would be: Encampments and FTXs, conventions, model rocketry and cadet competitions. They would also make excellent tools for radio operator training!

Interesting..so we can use FRS for radio operator training as long as we're not training on MRO/CUL tasks or conducting radio operator training during an approved ES training mission.

The best I can find about talking to others on other services is a blurb in the comm FAQ that states that

MURS is an FCC Part 95 service, and CAP, as a Federal Entity, is not authorized on FCC frequencies except for liaison purposes

Holy cow...we're even allowed to use CB for liaison..at least according to the comm FAQ.

Why can't we use Citizen's Band radios for our communications?
 
CB radios are another radio service that Federal Agencies cannot use for their own communications needs. While it is permissible to get authorization use them for liaison with other SAR groups, we cannot use them for our own internal needs. "

Now, what I don't understand is what the big deal is about liason with other agencies, even on ham radio? If we need to talk to another SAR group (I know our K9 SAR team uses Rhino FRS radios), or are assigned as communicators to Red Cross or the County EOC using their radios, should it matter whether they are using CB, FRS, MURS, or ham?

[RogueLeader]

I'd say take it and use it while obtaining instructions from above.  if word comes down that it is OK, great; if say no, say "OK how should we communicate with them as cell's are more miss than hit?"

[sdcapmx]

Sometimes what it comes down to is that if we do not use the "assigned radios" then why is the Air Force buying us radios.  This comes from a fairly high up source from NHQ.  I posed the question about safety.  I stated that if our CAP radios don't work but a cooperative agencies radios do work then in the interest of safety I would use whatever radio I needed to so that I could have comm capabilites.  The response was "don't get caught doing it".  We are doing quite a bit of work with local and state authorities that don't use the same type of radios CAP does so we are finding ourselves using non CAP radios so that we can complete our requested missions with the requesting custormer.

[arajca]

The term is "Liasion Radio". The standards that CAP applies to CAP radios do not apply to liasion radios because they are not CAP's and they are only used for communicating with another agency, usually the one that provided the radio.

[floridacyclist]

OK, so now that we've established that we can use these other services with permission, who do we get permission from? I know that there is a written process for using CAP radios on other frequencies (like Marine or Fire/rescue) but nothing seems to spell out the process for using say CB if that's what it takes to interoperate with other organizations. My fear is that the process will cover so much red tape that by the time permission is obtained, the need for liaison will be long-gone.

[BillB]

CB radios usually have a longer range since they operate on 5 watts where FRS radios are lower power. CAP had a frequency of 26.xx megs that was used for training. I can't find if it's still an active frequency or must meet NTIA narrow band requirements. It was so easy to switch channel 10 CB crystals to use on the CAP frequency., which allowed pther CB frequencies to use for inter-agency communications. Many law enforcement agencies still maintain monitoring of CB Channel 9, and even radio hams still use (but rarely) CB frequencies.