ES Qaulification Badge Proposal

[arajca]

I am in the final stages of preparing my ES Qualification Badge proposal for submittal. It has changed significantly from the original version I posted a couple years ago. I plan to submit it by 30 Apr 2016. Looking for CONSTRUCTIVE comments and suggestions.

[Eclipse]

Adoption should be instead of the SARDOG, not an option.

The insignia are the wrong shape, and too squishy, but that's a flavor thing.  I don't like the IC badge, either.

Only one "occupational" and one aviation should be worn.

[Gunsotsu]

As CERT "leaders" are chosen and tasked by the IC, the proposal to recognize individuals as such is problematic. As many CERT programs offer advanced training to trained members that chose to actively volunteer with their community department of emergency services/management, a better approach would be recognize those with additional training beyond the basic CERT course with a leader/senior badge, and those certified as active train-the-trainer personnel the chief/master badge.

[RogueLeader]

I like the concept. 
Question:
As PSC requires ABOD or GBD, and both of those qualifications have specialty badges/ratings for the basic qualifications (Mission Scanner or GTM) does that NEED another badge?  I can see it as it shows further progression, but at the same time, the current badges are adequate for what we have.

As to the other basic qualifications, I totally agree that there should be badges to recognize personnel for their achievements.

I don't see specifically that they are designated as "Specialty Badge" for proper placement according to CAPR 35-6

[Storm Chaser]

Do we really need more badges?

[Garibaldi]

Do we really need more badges?

Yes. So much yes.

[arajca]

I like the concept. 
Question:
As PSC requires ABOD or GBD, and both of those qualifications have specialty badges/ratings for the basic qualifications (Mission Scanner or GTM) does that NEED another badge?  I can see it as it shows further progression, but at the same time, the current badges are adequate for what we have.

As to the other basic qualifications, I totally agree that there should be badges to recognize personnel for their achievements.

I don't see specifically that they are designated as "Specialty Badge" for proper placement according to CAPR 35-6

Currently, there is no insignia to denote an AOBD vs a MP/MO/MS. If you read the details regarding the master GT badge, I propose removing it from GBD's and making it more of an overall field team leader with GT and DR quals.

[arajca]

As CERT "leaders" are chosen and tasked by the IC, the proposal to recognize individuals as such is problematic. As many CERT programs offer advanced training to trained members that chose to actively volunteer with their community department of emergency services/management, a better approach would be recognize those with additional training beyond the basic CERT course with a leader/senior badge, and those certified as active train-the-trainer personnel the chief/master badge.

What advanced training would be appropriate for a higher badge and what would not? What happens when a Trainer stops being an active trainer?

[Spam]

Do we really need more badges?

I don't think we do, but apparently I'm alone on this, in the festival of Cosplay that CAP (and CAPTALK) occasionally become.

Todays stats on posts in Captalk:
"Uniforms and Awards" group: 95,772 posts

... where this isn't even a core Mission, but of those three, we have:
"ES and Operations" group: 37,408 posts (only 39% as much interest as badges)
"Cadet Programs" group: 24,980 posts (only 26% as much interest as uniforms)
"Aerospace Education" group: a paltry 4,348 posts (not even 5% as much interest in aerospace as in dress up).


What an organization this could be, were we to redirect this enthusiasm towards planning, organizing, and conducting meaningful training, on providing interesting and educational AE content, and having exciting and useful mentoring and development of cadets. (and yeah, once again, I've done my share of cosplay at 'Cons, in my day, so I get the impulse to play dress up and yeah, I get that the ribbons are they only pay for some).


Arajca, I apologize if this isn't the constructive commentary that you were looking for, but in honesty you seem to be a highly motivated, intelligent, well organized officer, who has so much to offer, beyond mere uniform proposals. I would LOVE to see AE, ES, or CP modules from you, instead - I'd bet they'd be outstanding.


V/R
Spam

[Storm Chaser]

I like the concept. 
Question:
As PSC requires ABOD or GBD, and both of those qualifications have specialty badges/ratings for the basic qualifications (Mission Scanner or GTM) does that NEED another badge?  I can see it as it shows further progression, but at the same time, the current badges are adequate for what we have.

As to the other basic qualifications, I totally agree that there should be badges to recognize personnel for their achievements.

I don't see specifically that they are designated as "Specialty Badge" for proper placement according to CAPR 35-6

Currently, there is no insignia to denote an AOBD vs a MP/MO/MS.

Following U.S. Air Force (and CAP) tradition, we don't need an AOBD badge. Every AOBD must have an Observer or Pilot rating, which always take precedence over other aviation related qualifications or functions.

[RogueLeader]

What about this?
GT badges stay the same

MS= Basic MO Wings
MO=Senior MO Wings
ABOD= Command MO Wings
MP ratings stay the same

PSC= IC Basic Badge
OSC= IC Senior Badge
IC 3-1= IC Master badge

[Storm Chaser]

Again, it's unnecessary. A member can become a Mission Observer after a minimum of four sorties. In contrast, it takes a member three years and 100 flight hours as a Mission Observer to earn the Senior rating. Do we really want to water it down that much? The more badges we have and the easier they are to earn, the less meaningful they are. That's the big problem with CAP; we give badges and ribbons for everything. Making more badges is not the solution.

[HGjunkie]

I'd be in favor of dropping the GTM-specific badge and instead make it a general field qualification badge (UDF, GTM, CERT, what have you...). It would look cleaner on the badge as well to drop the GT or DR or UDF designators. You could then use the star levels to show progression in any non-specific track through experience/leadership levels.

[Eclipse]

We need to remove "CERT" from this conversation and CAP nomenclature in general.

It's not, by design, a "CAP Thing".  Local municipalities have CERT teams and perform the qualifications.  It's supposed to be
local people providing what is essentially self and neighbor care.

At the point CAP is involved, your incident has, by definition, exceeded "local" scope, and CAP isn't coming in as a
"CERT", even if the duties might look the same.

If I'm going to go and be on my village's CERT, I don't need CAP, and my experience as a Wing ESO is that when you talk to
these local agencies and orgs (SARCouncils, EMAs, ARC), they would love our mailing list to recruit more people, but have no particular
interest in CAP responding as an organization.

[Luis R. Ramos]

    ^
    +1

That is what I am seeing in New York City.

It seems the local Civil Defense is giving classes and organizing meetings, but with the intention on garnering volunteers.

[Storm Chaser]

I think there's value to having CERT type training, but should be conducted in house. A DR qualification would be more appropriate, if we ever get one. But nothing prevents us from doing the training.

[Spaceman3750]

I worked for quite a while to earn my GT master badge. The GT master badge wasn't why I became a GBD, mind you, but I'd like to not have it taken away because someone got their feelings hurt that they don't have one too.

[HGjunkie]

I worked for quite a while to earn my GT master badge. The GT master badge wasn't why I became a GBD, mind you, but I'd like to not have it taken away because someone got their feelings hurt that they don't have one too.

It wouldn't affect people who already earned the old badges, but certainly there is some merit in creating a unified "ground pounder" badge (and probably phasing out the GT-specific badge) to encompass most of the ES specialties. Plus it would give some people more incentives to actually pursue more qualifications than just GTM (like UDF) if they could earn a bit of bling for their training. Particularly cadets. A lot of cadets tend to get GT qualified, get the badge, and then do nothing with the rating.

[Angus]

Do we really need more badges?

I don't think we do, but apparently I'm alone on this, in the festival of Cosplay that CAP (and CAPTALK) occasionally become.

Todays stats on posts in Captalk:
"Uniforms and Awards" group: 95,772 posts

... where this isn't even a core Mission, but of those three, we have:
"ES and Operations" group: 37,408 posts (only 39% as much interest as badges)
"Cadet Programs" group: 24,980 posts (only 26% as much interest as uniforms)
"Aerospace Education" group: a paltry 4,348 posts (not even 5% as much interest in aerospace as in dress up).


What an organization this could be, were we to redirect this enthusiasm towards planning, organizing, and conducting meaningful training, on providing interesting and educational AE content, and having exciting and useful mentoring and development of cadets. (and yeah, once again, I've done my share of cosplay at 'Cons, in my day, so I get the impulse to play dress up and yeah, I get that the ribbons are they only pay for some).


Arajca, I apologize if this isn't the constructive commentary that you were looking for, but in honesty you seem to be a highly motivated, intelligent, well organized officer, who has so much to offer, beyond mere uniform proposals. I would LOVE to see AE, ES, or CP modules from you, instead - I'd bet they'd be outstanding.


V/R
Spam

I have to agree we don't need any more badges.  If we make them so every qualification wears a badge and make it easier to for lack of better term "move up a badge" it makes the badges mean less. 

[Eclipse]

I worked for quite a while to earn my GT master badge. The GT master badge wasn't why I became a GBD, mind you, but I'd like to not have it taken away because someone got their feelings hurt that they don't have one too.

This certainly needs to be considered.  Adding a badge for base staff jobs has been on the table for years, but the
current badges should probably stay as-is.

Another factor should probably be who would actually wear them - due I would hazard to age, maturity, and general bling fatigue - the base staff people tend to be less concerned about
the uniform in general, and many elect to wear just the golf shirt (despite the whites being required).

Not much point in casting badges for people who will never wear them. (yes, I know you can get them embroidered, most look terrible).