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CPPT & 18 Year Old Cadets

Started by MIKE, June 29, 2006, 06:38:45 PM

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MIKE

Quote from: CAPR 52-103. c. All cadets, within 6 months following their eighteenth birthday, must undergo the same Cadet Protection Program Training (CPPT) that senior members must complete. If a cadet promotion is due during that 6-month period, then this CPPT must be completed prior to the promotion.

So what do you do at the end of the 6-month period when a cadet hasn't taken CPPT?  What about cadets who are not participating, but remain on the MML?

Do you suspend a cadet from participation until CPPT is completed (for a cadet who would otherwise be participating actively), or should you terminate membership at the end of the 6 months? 

Edited to add:

Quote from: CAPR 50-173-4. Cadet Protection Program Training (CPPT).
This training is intended to increase awareness of child abuse for senior members and cadets 18 and over, thereby reducing
the potential for physical, emotional, and sexual abuse of cadets. CAP requires CPPT for all CAP senior members. Members
will not work with cadets or receive promotions without this training.
In addition, cadets must complete CPPT within 6
months following their 18th birthday or if a promotion is due during that 6-month period, then prior to receiving the
promotion. The CAPF 11 is used to certify completion of this requirement and is submitted to NHQ CAP/ETP for
processing.

Emphasis added.
Mike Johnston

SarDragon

I think you answered your own Q. I had a 20 yo in my class one time who had gone away to college and had no way to get CPPT. As soon as she could, she did.

As a reminder, cadets MUST already be 18 to take the class. The Form 11 WILL be rejected if the date of the class is before the cadet's 18th birthday. BTDT; big PITA.
Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
50 Year Member
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret

MIKE

I'm not sure I like the idea of just suspending a cadet for the remainder of their cadethood though.  If they won't be participating (No CPPT), what's the point?  Patron membership perhaps?

This is what I was thinking should happen.  Cadets have 6-months following their 18th birthday to complete CPPT.  Failure to complete CPPT within the 6-months as specified results in suspension of cadet membership until CPPT is completed and recorded... Or until the end of the cadet's membership year, at which point cadet membership terminates. 
Mike Johnston

SarDragon

Well, there are those times in a person's life where membership w/o participation becomes a sad reality. I took a break for what ended up being ten years, thinking that I might participate again someday. After my last membership lapse, and the ensuing paper shuffle that is still incomplete, I decided that I would only ever lapse again if I was 100% sure that I would NEVER participate again.

If that's what an over-18 cadet needs to, then so be it. The unit leadership needs to stay abreast of deficiencies in training and actively assist someone in that situation to get it taken care of.
Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
50 Year Member
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret

CAP428

This raises a question for me.  I was not aware of this regulation, and I just turned 18 about a month or so ago[I am still a cadet].  I am scheduled for the next CPPT class but my squadron gave me my last promotion last week.

Does this mean my promotion is revoked?  I barely have time to make Spaatz which is my goal.  Will this mess it up?

DNall

Quote from: CAP428 on November 09, 2006, 03:07:12 AM
This raises a question for me.  I was not aware of this regulation, and I just turned 18 about a month or so ago[I am still a cadet].  I am scheduled for the next CPPT class but my squadron gave me my last promotion last week.

Does this mean my promotion is revoked?  I barely have time to make Spaatz which is my goal.  Will this mess it up?
Couple things. First, you can & should do CPPT online here: http://level2.cap.gov/index.cfm?nodeID=6476

Second, you have six month after your b-day, and during that time there is no restriction against you promoting or participating in activities.

Third, the promotion item mentioned above applies to SMs only. If you fail to complete CPPT by 18.5 then you are restricted from participating in activities w/ other cadets. If I wanted to read that as you are unable to actively participate in the cadet program, a requirement for promotion, I could. Or I could have you doing Sq admin work during the meeting & test/CPFT separate from the others & that's perfectly fine too. However, you would be restricted from being around other cadets until you get it done. I'd tell you most people aren't aware of this requirement & so you probably won't be called on it anyway, but it is a serious legal issue if you're 18+ (even during that six months) & something happens but you don't have the course.

Finally, I understand why we don't give the course to all cadets & parents. They may not be happy about procedures designed to protect CAP in the case of legal action rather than making the cadet the first priority. I think it's a well balanced approach myself, and honestly think CAP members need much more risk mgmt education to understand how, why, & what to do in situations. I'd favor a rework of the course that presents in two parts. Require just the first one for cadets & open to parents & such, and then the both Part I & II for adults. The second focused on risk mgmt response & keep that one restricted. Structuring it that way would give you more latitude for cadets turning 18, cause they already have the basic CPPT, just not the risk mgmt response portion. It'd at least be appropriate to make all cadet officers regardless of age do that first part. They very typically supervise cadets out of adult view.

Eclipse

CPPT is not done online, nor is the level 1 - the PREPARATION is done there, and then discussion of the test and case studies is required with the Squadron Commander.   

There is no way to "complete" L1/CPPT w/o a form 11 to NHQ.


"That Others May Zoom"

DNall

I understand that, if you'll look:
QuoteStep 5 - Take your corrected pre-test to your unit. Your leaders will validate the test with you and answer any questions that you may have. Your leaders will ask you some additional questions about this material.

Step 6 - Your leaders will also give you one of two case studies to consider. You will be asked how you would respond in similar circumstances. You can review the case studies now so that you can frame your potential answers before your meeting:

I meant that he should begin the process now, especially if he's short on time & should be restricted from being around cadets soon, and then have those discussions at a meeting when his Sq CC or whomever can sit down with him for a little while. I agree it would be better if Lvl 1 & CPPT were done over a weekend with a group, which is how I did my original one, but that's not the standard. I'd prefer to have him do the formailities now & get a fm 11 out the door, and then audit the course the next time a batch of seniors are going thru.

CAP428

Quote from CAP 50-17
Quote3-4. Cadet Protection Program Training (CPPT).
This training is intended to increase awareness of child abuse for senior members and cadets 18 and over, thereby reducing
the potential for physical, emotional, and sexual abuse of cadets. CAP requires CPPT for all CAP senior members. Members
will not work with cadets or receive promotions without this training. In addition, cadets must complete CPPT within 6
months following their 18th birthday OR if a promotion is due during that 6-month period, then prior to receiving the
promotion.
The CAPF 11 is used to certify completion of this requirement and is submitted to NHQ CAP/ETP for
processing.

I don't understand how that doesn't apply.  I just promoted to C/SrA last week, but turned 18 about 1-2 months ago.  Will my promotion be revoked?  Or can it just be held until I get done with the CPPT?  Does that affect my two months between promotion time period?

In other words, if I just wore my C/A1C insignia until I get this completed, could I then pin on SrA immediately, and if I was up for promotion [two-months wise] the next week then pin on C/SSgt or do I have to stop all testing and everything until I get it done.  If that is the case, that means I would have to either retake SrA test or my two month time period wouldbegin as soon as I was done with CPPT instead of it going on simultaneously.

Do I make sense?  Probably not, but does anybody understand?

DNall

Wow I guess I misread that, my bad, & I'm just short of a Master rating in this stuff. It means your promotion to SrA should have been held till you completed CPPT & your two months prior to SSgt would begin when it's recorded. That's what the reg says & the official word.

If I were you, I'd do the first portion of the course from the online material as specified, then take your self-corrected pre-test & a printout of the case studies w/ you to the next meeting & ask your Sq CC to sit down with you & finish it out so the Fm11 can get sent off. Then I really would attend the next available session they're putting on.


Psicorp

Quote from: CAP428 on November 09, 2006, 04:03:09 AM
Quote from CAP 50-17
Quote3-4. Cadet Protection Program Training (CPPT).
This training is intended to increase awareness of child abuse for senior members and cadets 18 and over, thereby reducing
the potential for physical, emotional, and sexual abuse of cadets. CAP requires CPPT for all CAP senior members. Members
will not work with cadets or receive promotions without this training. In addition, cadets must complete CPPT within 6
months following their 18th birthday OR if a promotion is due during that 6-month period, then prior to receiving the
promotion.
The CAPF 11 is used to certify completion of this requirement and is submitted to NHQ CAP/ETP for
processing.

I don't understand how that doesn't apply.  I just promoted to C/SrA last week, but turned 18 about 1-2 months ago.  Will my promotion be revoked?  Or can it just be held until I get done with the CPPT?  Does that affect my two months between promotion time period?

In other words, if I just wore my C/A1C insignia until I get this completed, could I then pin on SrA immediately, and if I was up for promotion [two-months wise] the next week then pin on C/SSgt or do I have to stop all testing and everything until I get it done.  If that is the case, that means I would have to either retake SrA test or my two month time period wouldbegin as soon as I was done with CPPT instead of it going on simultaneously.

Do I make sense?  Probably not, but does anybody understand?

Sounds like some Officers in your squadron aren't completely up on this either.  I can't see that your promotion would be revoked...that wouldn't be right since a demotion/revocation is an administrative punishment action and you didn't do anything wrong.  Cadets, especially Phase I and II cadets cannot be expected to be on top of the regulations.   

At most what could happen is couple the promotion with the CPPT and have your next promotion eligibility be two months from the date of CPPT completion.   You've earned your C/SrAmn grade and were awarded it, so wear it.     An alternative would be to talk with your Officers and see how quickly you can get the CPPT done...if they can't/won't do it within the next two weeks, then perhaps you can find another squadron nearby who either is conducting it sooner or has someone who would be willing to present it to you outside of meetings.   

Either way, you shouldn't be punished for an administrative oops...unless you never told anyone you were turning 18.
Jamie Kahler, Capt., CAP
(C/Lt Col, ret.)
CC
GLR-MI-257

CAP428

So this will probably prevent me from getting Spaatz?  I only had about 2-3 weeks leeway if I hit every test on time and passed, which I have so far.  Now, if my two month period begins withthe completion of CPPT, I will not make this, will I?

Psicorp

Quote from: CAP428 on November 09, 2006, 04:46:54 AM
So this will probably prevent me from getting Spaatz?  I only had about 2-3 weeks leeway if I hit every test on time and passed, which I have so far.  Now, if my two month period begins withthe completion of CPPT, I will not make this, will I?

Are you assuming two months between C/LTCol and the taking of the Spaatz exam?  If so, then you have an additional two months to play with...the normal two month break between promotions doesn't apply there.
Jamie Kahler, Capt., CAP
(C/Lt Col, ret.)
CC
GLR-MI-257

CAP428

I'll have to recalculate to make sure, but I think I was.  That is good.  Thank you.

P.S. I forgot which publication that timetable is that shows the intervals between advancements and the tests required for each.  Can someone tell me which one that is?  Thank you very much.

MIKE

Quote from: CAPR 52-162-3. a. Sequence & Spacing. Cadets complete achievements and milestone awards sequentially. See Figure 2-1 for the Cadet Program's path of progression. Cadets may complete Achievement 1 any time after joining CAP. They may attempt the Spaatz Award exam any time after completing Phase IV (see paragraph 2-8g). All other achievements require a minimum separation of 2 months (approximately 8 weeks) between each achievement and milestone award (except as noted for JROTC in chapter 6).
Mike Johnston

SarDragon

Quote from: DNall on November 09, 2006, 03:59:52 AM[redacted] I'd prefer to have him do the formailities now & get a fm 11 out the door, and then audit the course the next time a batch of seniors are going thru.

Going through what? As I understand the new method, formal classroom Level I (Orientation + CPPT) training is history. Did I miss something here?
Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
50 Year Member
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret

DNall

A bunch of people are adamant that you do the coursework online/DVD & then go to the class, or do the whole thing in the class together. I applaud their thinking, but frankly lvl I is such a joke I tend to get the paperwork out the door on the formalities & then educate people right. The technical deal now is you do the online work & then come in for a discussion prior to the Fm11 going out. Certainly it would be best if that were a group discussion, more so for Lvl I than CPPT, but either way.