Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
December 16, 2017, 01:18:51 AM
Home Help Login Register
News:

CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  The Lobby  |  Topic: The AFA Prep School "Incident"...
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Pages: [1] 2 3 4  All Print
Author Topic: The AFA Prep School "Incident"...  (Read 5275 times)
FW
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,145

« on: September 29, 2017, 01:52:38 PM »

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/09/29/air-force-academy-head-tells-racists-get-oudelivers-stern-lecture-wake-racial-slurs-found-prep-schoo/715755001/

I expect no less of our US Air Force...
Thank you Gen Silveria.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2017, 03:35:06 PM by SarDragon » Logged
NIN
VIP

Posts: 4,684
Unit: of issue

« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2017, 08:06:27 PM »

Man, love it when the general is completely unambiguous in his speech. Zero room for interpretation.

Logged
Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2017 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
LGM30GMCC
Seasoned Member

Posts: 318

« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2017, 08:46:00 PM »

This is exactly the kind of leadership that is needed to respond to this kind of incident.
Logged
Cicero
Forum Regular

Posts: 131
Unit: TBKS

« Reply #3 on: September 30, 2017, 01:46:19 AM »

http://www.kktv.com/content/news/BREAKING-Reported-active-shooter-at-the-United-States-Air-Force-Academy-448771323.html

U.S. AIR FORCE ACADEMY, (KKTV) - Officials and cadets at the Air Force Academy received an alert of an active shooter late Friday night.

The report came in at about 10 p.m., at about 11:25 p.m. the Academy tweeted, "We received reports of active shooter on Academy grounds. There are no confirmation of shots fired. Security forces are sweeping the area."

An alert came through text message and noted the reported shooting may have happened near the prep school or possibly near Vandenberg Hall .

The El Paso County Sheriff's Office confirmed via twitter they are investigating a report of shots fired.

11 News is working to confirm the incident with officials at the Academy. As of 11:25 p.m., it isn't clear if anyone was injured or who was involved.

A man reached out to 11 News stating he was the father of the woman who called police. He tells us his daughter heard shots, but is okay and with authorities.

This is a developing story and as more information becomes available this article will be updated.
Logged
Cicero
Forum Regular

Posts: 131
Unit: TBKS

« Reply #4 on: September 30, 2017, 02:28:50 AM »

http://www.kktv.com/content/news/BREAKING-Reported-active-shooter-at-the-United-States-Air-Force-Academy-448771323.html

U.S. AIR FORCE ACADEMY, (KKTV) - Officials and cadets at the Air Force Academy received an alert of an active shooter late Friday night.

The report came in at about 10 p.m., at about 11:25 p.m. the Academy tweeted, "We received reports of active shooter on Academy grounds. There are no confirmation of shots fired. Security forces are sweeping the area."

An alert came through text message and noted the reported shooting may have happened near the prep school or possibly near Vandenberg Hall .

The El Paso County Sheriff's Office confirmed via twitter they are investigating a report of shots fired.

11 News is working to confirm the incident with officials at the Academy. As of 11:25 p.m., it isn't clear if anyone was injured or who was involved.

A man reached out to 11 News stating he was the father of the woman who called police. He tells us his daughter heard shots, but is okay and with authorities.

This is a developing story and as more information becomes available this article will be updated.

EPCSheriff‏Verified account
@EPCSheriff

Law-enforcement has completed a search of the dorms on Air Force Academy grounds. No injuries and no active shooter.
Logged
PHall
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,884

« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2017, 10:50:48 AM »

Why would the El Paso County Sheriff Department even be on the Academy in the first place?
They have no jurisdiction and there's a whole squadron of Air Force Security Forces on base to handle security.
They might invite the Sheriff on base to help, but, the Air Force would be the lead agency and should be the only agency to make a news release.
Logged
Spam
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 970
Unit: GA-001

« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2017, 02:23:56 PM »


Great video there on clearly putting the position forward and cleaning house. Thanks FW for posting that.


Perhaps the USAFA can go help the Army set things right and clean house at USMA, where a former CAP cadet, Spenser Rapone was apparently mentored by Rasheed Hosein, a now-suspended professor of islamic history, and (arguably) radicalized while inside USMA:

https://www.conservativereview.com/articles/7-things-you-need-to-know-about-the-west-point-communist-saga WARNING: STRONG LANGUAGE (from Rapone).


R/s
Spam


Logged
Nick
Seasoned Member

Posts: 473
Unit: SWR-TX-001

« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2017, 02:48:04 PM »

Why would the El Paso County Sheriff Department even be on the Academy in the first place?
They have no jurisdiction and there's a whole squadron of Air Force Security Forces on base to handle security.
They might invite the Sheriff on base to help, but, the Air Force would be the lead agency and should be the only agency to make a news release.
Bexar County Sheriff did the same thing when there was the shooter at Lackland that killed his squadron commander. I don’t particularly like the idea, but I understand the whys.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Logged
Nicholas McLarty, Lt Col, CAP
Texas Wing Staff Guy
National Cadet Team Guy
abdsp51
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,326
Unit: Classified

« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2017, 03:19:47 PM »

Why would the El Paso County Sheriff Department even be on the Academy in the first place?
They have no jurisdiction and there's a whole squadron of Air Force Security Forces on base to handle security.
They might invite the Sheriff on base to help, but, the Air Force would be the lead agency and should be the only agency to make a news release.

That you know of.  And contrary to popular belief not every piece of land on a DoD installation is sole jurisdiction of the base.  There are typically 4 different types of jurisdiction on the installation and they are:

Exclusive - DoD has sole jurisdiction
Concurrent - Shared between DoD and local Govt
Proprietary - DoD exercises property rights only (exception is offenses committed by those subject to Art 2 of the UCMJ)
Reciprocal - Shared between all branches. 

If the event occurred on an area not exclusive then it would stand to reason that it's the Sheriffs or local PDs baby to run with.  If in Proprietary then it is solely the Sheriffs or local PDs baby if the offense is committed by someone not falling under the UCMJ. 

Now there is a good chance that the Academy's SF has a MOU/MOA for mutual aide with the local authorities which is not uncommon.  And depending on what type of jurisdiction and the nature of the incident the AF would not be the lead agency. 

Plus these days LE skills are not as common within SFS units as they once were.
Logged
PHall
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,884

« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2017, 03:39:37 PM »

Why would the El Paso County Sheriff Department even be on the Academy in the first place?
They have no jurisdiction and there's a whole squadron of Air Force Security Forces on base to handle security.
They might invite the Sheriff on base to help, but, the Air Force would be the lead agency and should be the only agency to make a news release.

That you know of.  And contrary to popular belief not every piece of land on a DoD installation is sole jurisdiction of the base.  There are typically 4 different types of jurisdiction on the installation and they are:

Exclusive - DoD has sole jurisdiction
Concurrent - Shared between DoD and local Govt
Proprietary - DoD exercises property rights only (exception is offenses committed by those subject to Art 2 of the UCMJ)
Reciprocal - Shared between all branches. 

If the event occurred on an area not exclusive then it would stand to reason that it's the Sheriffs or local PDs baby to run with.  If in Proprietary then it is solely the Sheriffs or local PDs baby if the offense is committed by someone not falling under the UCMJ. 

Now there is a good chance that the Academy's SF has a MOU/MOA for mutual aide with the local authorities which is not uncommon.  And depending on what type of jurisdiction and the nature of the incident the AF would not be the lead agency. 

Plus these days LE skills are not as common within SFS units as they once were.

The only police vehicles I've ever seen on base at the Academy have been Air Force Security Forces.
Remember, this is one of the Air Force's showplaces. Image is everything there.
Logged
abdsp51
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,326
Unit: Classified

« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2017, 04:10:55 PM »

The only police vehicles I've ever seen on base at the Academy have been Air Force Security Forces.
Remember, this is one of the Air Force's showplaces. Image is everything there.

I am well aware the AFA is an AF showplace and yes you will generally only find SF vehicles on the yard day to day, but it is not uncommon to find outside agencies on the yard as well. It will all depend on the incident and the jurisdiction.  I have had local PD and SO come to base numerous times to handle incidents, not because we wouldn't handle them but because of the jurisdictional lines. 

Logged
Mitchell 1969
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 693
Unit: PCR-CA-051

« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2017, 06:11:11 PM »

Why would the El Paso County Sheriff Department even be on the Academy in the first place?
They have no jurisdiction and there's a whole squadron of Air Force Security Forces on base to handle security.
They might invite the Sheriff on base to help, but, the Air Force would be the lead agency and should be the only agency to make a news release.

For all we know, they have MOUs, used “unified command” per ICS, and decided that sheriff would take the lead on media relations. (How many USAF PAO people have experience with media for incidents like this)?

But, we don’t know. Everything I wrote is as speculative as what you wrote.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Logged
_________________
Bernard J. Wilson, Major, CAP

Mitchell 1969; Earhart 1971; Eaker 1973. Cadet Flying Encampment, License, 1970. IACE New Zealand 1971; IACE Korea 1973.

CAP has been bery, bery good to me.
stillamarine
400,000th Post Author
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 816
Unit: SER-AL-134

« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2017, 11:07:05 AM »

First of all, we have no idea whose dispatch the initial 911 call went into. Dialing 911 while standing in the exact spot of an incident does not guarantee that you are connected with the exact jurisdiction for the location. Don't believe me. Stand on the edges of a city and call 911 and see how many times you are transferred til you get the right jurisdiction. In an active shooter situation or anything major like that the notifications go out to every agency nearby, local, state, county, federal, etc. We had an active shooter here a couple years ago. Everyone responded, including AFNG Security Forces from ANGB Birmingham. It's the nature of cops. My dispatcher put out a 10-33 (emergency call) when I was in a gun fight a long time ago. By the end there was 100 cops there from all 4 of our precincts, county, state and even federal. And I appreciated every one of them. Another reason outside agencies may have been brought in is that maybe the SF on USAFA don't have some of the equipment or training needed to successfully address an active shooter event. The way cops have responded to active shooter events has changed dramatically over the last few years. I'm an instructor in my state and it's changed 3 times in the 9 years I've been doing it.
Logged
Tim Gardiner, 1st LT, CAP

USMC AD 1996-2001
USMCR    2001-2005  Admiral, Great State of Nebraska Navy  MS, MO, UDF
tim.gardiner@gmail.com
raivo
Seasoned Member

Posts: 440
Unit: Migrant

« Reply #13 on: October 04, 2017, 02:05:36 AM »

Why would the El Paso County Sheriff Department even be on the Academy in the first place?
They have no jurisdiction and there's a whole squadron of Air Force Security Forces on base to handle security.
They might invite the Sheriff on base to help, but, the Air Force would be the lead agency and should be the only agency to make a news release.

For all we know, they have MOUs, used “unified command” per ICS, and decided that sheriff would take the lead on media relations. (How many USAF PAO people have experience with media for incidents like this)?

But, we don’t know. Everything I wrote is as speculative as what you wrote.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I wasn't exactly following play-by-play as far as who said what when, but the AF was doing their own PA thing at the same time. I got a text from Command Post about it shortly after it kicked off, which was right about the time the "BREAKING NEWS" articles started.
Logged

1Lt, CAP
Capt, USAF
Recipient of a Mitchell Award Of Irrelevant Number

"No combat-ready unit has ever passed inspection. No inspection-ready unit has ever survived combat."
Johnny Yuma
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 594

« Reply #14 on: October 13, 2017, 08:41:14 PM »

I'm hoping that the prep school determined the writings were legit and ID'd the doer's before the General made his statement. FWIW around here most every racial incident like this has been determined to have been a hoax or overblown out of proportion by design.

The most recent was a Sukkah put up by some Jewish students at Kansas State for Sukkot was destroyed. The university president, ex- USAF General Richard Myers, made a big stink over it being an act of antisemitism before they discovered that it was actually a windstorm that knocked it down. Oops...

As far as the active shooter, military relations with civilian law enforcement is a complex relationship that seems to vry from bse to base. Back in the 80's it was common to see Wichita PD and Sedgewick Co. Sheriff on MCConnell AFB and despite being a locked down SAC base were routinely waved through as a matter of routine. The active shooter incident on Fairchilld AFB in 1994 at the Base Hospital not only did local LE agencies respond but local civilian LE took the lead investigating the homicides by both the shooter and the SP that put him down, along with AFOSI. So it wouldn't surprise me if the AFA had a similar working relationship with the local gendarmes.

« Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 08:45:21 PM by Johnny Yuma » Logged
"And Saint Attila raised the Holy Hand Grenade up on high saying, "Oh Lord, Bless us this Holy Hand Grenade, and with it smash our enemies to tiny bits. And the Lord did grin, and the people did feast upon the lambs, and stoats, and orangutans, and breakfast cereals, and lima bean-"
 
" Skip a bit, brother."
 
"And then the Lord spake, saying: "First, shalt thou take out the holy pin. Then shalt thou count to three. No more, no less. "Three" shall be the number of the counting, and the number of the counting shall be three. "Four" shalt thou not count, and neither count thou two, execpting that thou then goest on to three. Five is RIGHT OUT. Once the number three, being the third number be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade to-wards thy foe, who, being naughty in my sight, shall snuffit. Amen."

Armaments Chapter One, verses nine through twenty-seven:
abdsp51
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,326
Unit: Classified

« Reply #15 on: October 13, 2017, 09:08:22 PM »

I'm hoping that the prep school determined the writings were legit and ID'd the doer's before the General made his statement. FWIW around here most every racial incident like this has been determined to have been a hoax or overblown out of proportion by design.

The most recent was a Sukkah put up by some Jewish students at Kansas State for Sukkot was destroyed. The university president, ex- USAF General Richard Myers, made a big stink over it being an act of antisemitism before they discovered that it was actually a windstorm that knocked it down. Oops...

As far as the active shooter, military relations with civilian law enforcement is a complex relationship that seems to vry from bse to base. Back in the 80's it was common to see Wichita PD and Sedgewick Co. Sheriff on MCConnell AFB and despite being a locked down SAC base were routinely waved through as a matter of routine. The active shooter incident on Fairchilld AFB in 1994 at the Base Hospital not only did local LE agencies respond but local civilian LE took the lead investigating the homicides by both the shooter and the SP that put him down, along with AFOSI. So it wouldn't surprise me if the AFA had a similar working relationship with the local gendarmes.

Yep.  Sad things is for the Fairchild cop.  He got put through the ringer for it even after it was deemed a good shoot. 
Logged
Johnny Yuma
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 594

« Reply #16 on: October 13, 2017, 10:36:34 PM »

I'm hoping that the prep school determined the writings were legit and ID'd the doer's before the General made his statement. FWIW around here most every racial incident like this has been determined to have been a hoax or overblown out of proportion by design.

The most recent was a Sukkah put up by some Jewish students at Kansas State for Sukkot was destroyed. The university president, ex- USAF General Richard Myers, made a big stink over it being an act of antisemitism before they discovered that it was actually a windstorm that knocked it down. Oops...

As far as the active shooter, military relations with civilian law enforcement is a complex relationship that seems to vry from bse to base. Back in the 80's it was common to see Wichita PD and Sedgewick Co. Sheriff on MCConnell AFB and despite being a locked down SAC base were routinely waved through as a matter of routine. The active shooter incident on Fairchilld AFB in 1994 at the Base Hospital not only did local LE agencies respond but local civilian LE took the lead investigating the homicides by both the shooter and the SP that put him down, along with AFOSI. So it wouldn't surprise me if the AFA had a similar working relationship with the local gendarmes.

Yep.  Sad things is for the Fairchild cop.  He got put through the ringer for it even after it was deemed a good shoot.

Yep. Andy Brown was the Sky cop who took the BG down, he's recently written a book about that fiasco as well as the B52 crash that occurred earlier that week. To say that there was a fundamental failure of base leadership at the time is a massive understatement.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 11:33:31 PM by Johnny Yuma » Logged
"And Saint Attila raised the Holy Hand Grenade up on high saying, "Oh Lord, Bless us this Holy Hand Grenade, and with it smash our enemies to tiny bits. And the Lord did grin, and the people did feast upon the lambs, and stoats, and orangutans, and breakfast cereals, and lima bean-"
 
" Skip a bit, brother."
 
"And then the Lord spake, saying: "First, shalt thou take out the holy pin. Then shalt thou count to three. No more, no less. "Three" shall be the number of the counting, and the number of the counting shall be three. "Four" shalt thou not count, and neither count thou two, execpting that thou then goest on to three. Five is RIGHT OUT. Once the number three, being the third number be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade to-wards thy foe, who, being naughty in my sight, shall snuffit. Amen."

Armaments Chapter One, verses nine through twenty-seven:
Cicero
Forum Regular

Posts: 131
Unit: TBKS

« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2017, 09:29:25 AM »

To ponder in the absence of news: https://www.thecollegefix.com/post/37909/
Logged
zippy
Recruit

Posts: 38

« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2017, 08:48:17 PM »

I'm hoping that the prep school determined the writings were legit and ID'd the doer's before the General made his statement. FWIW around here most every racial incident like this has been determined to have been a hoax or overblown out of proportion by design.

The most recent was a Sukkah put up by some Jewish students at Kansas State for Sukkot was destroyed. The university president, ex- USAF General Richard Myers, made a big stink over it being an act of antisemitism before they discovered that it was actually a windstorm that knocked it down. Oops...

I agree with you. The general basically did what he thought would be good for PR and protect his position. He knew nothing beyond there was some writing on a board. It was in an area that cadets  do not normally go. Remember, this was a dorm for people that did not have the academics to get in, the group of people blamed do not go there.

Besides it sounding like slang, many civilian worker with private companies go in and out. Who knows.

Take a look at the quote below. Over 1/2 the college's athletes come from this program, and they are not even cadets, they are cadet candidates. I have long believed colleges should drop the athletics, it is a waste of money and most of the college crime is committed by athletes.

So the general blames scholarly cadets with no proof or investigation whatsoever.

More than 50% if these "cadet candidates" are let for the athletic program. They are selected by coaches, as far as I can tell never served in the military. Read this about how people get into the Air Force Academy these days. http://www.ncsasports.org/athletic-scholarships/football/colorado/united-states-air-force-academy#

Quote
The Colorado Springs-area prep school, whose student body traditionally includes more than 50% recruited athletes, gives cadet candidates a year of rigorous tutoring to help them meet the academy's strict academic standards.


Logged
FW
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,145

« Reply #19 on: October 29, 2017, 08:28:54 AM »

No one accused AFAPS cadet candidates OR AFA cadets with this! The General simply stated that the Air Force has no tolerance for such behavior or action.  Any other interpretation or rationalization of this incident should not be accepted. 

The AFA prep school also has a large contingent of CAP cadets enrolled as students/cadet candidates. ALL take the oath of enlistment when they arrive.  It would be against our "Core Values" to malign them, or any other AFAPS cadet candidate

Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3 4  All Print 
CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  The Lobby  |  Topic: The AFA Prep School "Incident"...
 


Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP SMF 2.0.13 | SMF © 2016, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.643 seconds with 20 queries.
click here to email me