Custom-embroidered polo shirt?

[foo]

It's already time to replace my faded, not-so-old polo shirt for the Corporate Working Uniform. I really don't want to buy another one from Vanguard if possible, so I'm looking into getting something of much higher quality and having it custom-embroidered. I own a couple of these Vertx "coldblack" polo shirts (http://wearvertx.com/Vertx-coldblack-Mens-Short-Sleeve-Tactical-Polo.aspx), and they are fantastic. I stay cool even in the hot sun, and the shirt stays fresh for two to four wears between washings. And it never fades, not even a little bit.

Couple things I'm wondering about...

The Vanguard shirt has a pocket. Is that required? I think not, since a pocket isn't specified for that shirt in 39-1.

Does it matter which CAP seal is used? Again, in 39-1 it's not specified for that shirt. When I search for "CAP seal" in eServices, this is all I find:

  http://capmembers.com/cap_national_hq/public_affairs/cap_pao_toolkit/seals-emblems-and-patches/
 
Nowhere else other than on the polo shirt can I find an image of a CAP seal with the light blue field and navy blue stars. If that version is required, it's going to be difficult to give a clean image of it to the place that will do the embroidering. Even if it's not required, I do prefer the seal to look as close as possible to the Vanguard shirts.

Has anyone actually done this? Can you share a picture of the embroidery work and provide any other good tips for accomplishing this? Better yet, does anyone have a high resolution image of the seal used on the Vanguard polo?

[Eclipse]

The only "seal" CAP has is the round one found here:



Nothing else is referred to as the "seal".

Considering the various materials, age, and poor embroidery quality over the years (not just a VG issue)
no one is likely to notice, other then anything you do yourself will probably be much clearer and adhere to
the actual image.

The only other issue is that as a 1-off, the setup for a complex insignia like that will probably cost 2-3x's the
cost of the shirt.

I've considered tackling this myself, but I have a fried with a 16-needle embroidery machine.

[LSThiker]

Does any one have any good pictures of the specialty track badges on the polo shirts?  I know there is an image of a man with the administration badge (I think) floating around, but was hoping for a clearing image.  I was thinking of getting one with the historian badge on it, but do not want to spend the money on something that is going to look horrible. 

[Eclipse]

Does any one have any good pictures of the specialty track badges on the polo shirts?  I know there is an image of a man with the administration badge (I think) floating around, but was hoping for a clearing image.  I was thinking of getting one with the historian badge on it, but do not want to spend the money on something that is going to look horrible.

The only ones I've seen look ridiculous - the specialty badge is as big or bigger then the seal.
They shouldn't be any larger the the actual badge.

[jeders]

Does any one have any good pictures of the specialty track badges on the polo shirts?  I know there is an image of a man with the administration badge (I think) floating around, but was hoping for a clearing image.  I was thinking of getting one with the historian badge on it, but do not want to spend the money on something that is going to look horrible.

The only ones I've seen look ridiculous - the specialty badge is as big or bigger then the seal.
They shouldn't be any larger the the actual badge.

Really? I've seen people with specialty track badges embroidered on the polo that were the same size as the metal badge and looked pretty decent, considering all the other low quality stuff Vanguard has been known to put out. Of course that was about 3 years ago, so maybe they've gotten worse.

[winterg]

I purchased a new polo from VG a few weeks ago and the first thing I noticed was that the ES badge was much larger than I expected.  It is more than 1.5 inches tall.  In comparison, the CAP seal is only 2.5 inches tall.  But I have no complaints about the embroidery.  The CAP seal looks like the CAP seal and is recognizable from 10 feet away and everything looks professional.  My only only heartache is the cost of the things.  Otherwise I might have a few to rotate out.

[Storm Chaser]

Does any one have any good pictures of the specialty track badges on the polo shirts?  I know there is an image of a man with the administration badge (I think) floating around, but was hoping for a clearing image.  I was thinking of getting one with the historian badge on it, but do not want to spend the money on something that is going to look horrible.

The only ones I've seen look ridiculous - the specialty badge is as big or bigger then the seal.
They shouldn't be any larger the the actual badge.

Really? I've seen people with specialty track badges embroidered on the polo that were the same size as the metal badge and looked pretty decent, considering all the other low quality stuff Vanguard has been known to put out. Of course that was about 3 years ago, so maybe they've gotten worse.

I ordered a polo from VG about 3 years ago with the Cadet Programs badge and had to returned it because the badge was ridiculously big. They were nice about it, but there seems to be a lack of consistency (or standard) when it comes to these.

[LSThiker]

I ordered a polo from VG about 3 years ago with the Cadet Programs badge and had to returned it because the badge was ridiculously big. They were nice about it, but there seems to be a lack of consistency (or standard) when it comes to these.

Was it embroidered with your name on it?

[Eclipse]

Does any one have any good pictures of the specialty track badges on the polo shirts?  I know there is an image of a man with the administration badge (I think) floating around, but was hoping for a clearing image.  I was thinking of getting one with the historian badge on it, but do not want to spend the money on something that is going to look horrible.

The only ones I've seen look ridiculous - the specialty badge is as big or bigger then the seal.
They shouldn't be any larger the the actual badge.

Really? I've seen people with specialty track badges embroidered on the polo that were the same size as the metal badge and looked pretty decent, considering all the other low quality stuff Vanguard has been known to put out. Of course that was about 3 years ago, so maybe they've gotten worse.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[winterg]

Wow!  My ES doesn't look so bad now.  Thanks.  I feel much better. 

[LSThiker]

Wow!  My ES doesn't look so bad now.  Thanks.  I feel much better. 

Well at the same time, the CP metal badge is larger than the metal shield badges.  Hmm, perhaps I will just order it to see depending on whether or not I can return with my name on it.  Has anyone called Vanguard to ask if they can send a picture before production?

[Eclipse]

Wow!  My ES doesn't look so bad now.  Thanks.  I feel much better. 

In your case the seal looks too small, which is the other issue I've seen, and of course has the infamous blue field.

[Storm Chaser]

I ordered a polo from VG about 3 years ago with the Cadet Programs badge and had to returned it because the badge was ridiculously big. They were nice about it, but there seems to be a lack of consistency (or standard) when it comes to these.

Was it embroidered with your name on it?

Yes, it had my name.

[Storm Chaser]

Wow!  My ES doesn't look so bad now.  Thanks.  I feel much better. 

Well at the same time, the CP metal badge is larger than the metal shield badges.  Hmm, perhaps I will just order it to see depending on whether or not I can return with my name on it.  Has anyone called Vanguard to ask if they can send a picture before production?

My shirt's embroidered badge wasn't proportional with the metal badge. I'll see if I can post a picture later.

[winterg]

If I had a magic wand, I would make the seal on the polo the same as the 3" seal they used to sell.  I just checked and I don't even see that one on VG anymore.

[foo]

... and of course has the infamous blue field.

And the solid dark blue stars, and dark blue shield, and dark blue lettering. Also notice the lack of detail on the eagle. I wonder how well an image of the official seal will translate to embroidery.

I'm tempted to cut the seal out of my old shirt and sew it on a new one. I'm not too bad with a sewing machine and I could probably make it look pretty good.

Or not...

[Eclipse]

If I had a magic wand, I would make the seal on the polo the same as the 3" seal they used to sell.  I just checked and I don't even see that one on VG anymore.

It would look a darn sight better if a patch were allowed instead of the direct embroidery.

[Eclipse]

And the solid dark blue stars, and dark blue shield, and dark blue lettering. Also notice the lack of detail on the eagle. I wonder how well an image of the official seal will translate to embroidery.

It all depends on the machine, the stitch count, and the vendor, the shirt material is an issue as well. 

I have seen incredibly detailed insignia rendered beautifully, and relatively simple designs that look like
they were done by hand with a pitchfork.

The nice thing is that these days the embroidery kisok at the mall can probably do it while you
wait for your Cinnabons.

[foo]

If I had a magic wand, I would make the seal on the polo the same as the 3" seal they used to sell.  I just checked and I don't even see that one on VG anymore.

It would look a darn sight better if a patch were allowed instead of the direct embroidery.

Well, technically, creating a patch must involve some embroidering. I don't see the term "direct embroidery" anywhere in 39-1. 

The nice thing is that these days the embroidery kisok at the mall can probably do it while you wait for your Cinnabons.

Say, that's just about all the motivation I need to take a trip to The Mall tomorrow! It's going to be -38° F wind chill here, so maybe there will be few people out and about.

[Eclipse]

If I had a magic wand, I would make the seal on the polo the same as the 3" seal they used to sell.  I just checked and I don't even see that one on VG anymore.

It would look a darn sight better if a patch were allowed instead of the direct embroidery.

Well, technically, creating a patch must involve some embroidering. I don't see the term "direct embroidery" anywhere in 39-1. 

More wonderful proof reading...

The definition of the CWU is twice on the same page, written differently.

"5.2.2.1.1. Dark blue knit shirt (long/short sleeves) with embroidered CAP seal on
the right breast. An embroidered name (first and last name) in white thread, and one‐service badge,
aviation badge, occupational badge, specialty track badge or duty title on the left breast is optional. A
female version of this shirt is available without a pocket; females may wear either the male or the female
version. "

By the above text, the badges could well be actual badges.

5.2.2.3.1. Dark blue knit shirt with embroidered CAP seal. First and last name
may be embroidered in white thread on the left breast. No rank designation is authorized. One CAP
aviation, occupational badge, specialty track, duty title badge may be embroidered ½ inch over the name.

By this it's clear everything needs to be embroidered, but I agree, there's nothing prohibiting a patch
instead of direct embroidery.

But why is it needed twice on the same page, and with different verbiage?

The proportions and alignment are clear, though.  To my eye the seal is too small, but KAY-SARA on that.
The badges are clearly supposed to be approximately the same size embroidered as their metal counterpart,
and I have personally seen a shield type badge the same size as the CP one, which is also absurdly large.



[attachment deleted by admin]

[JC004]

If someone wanted to get a shirt done elsewhere in my unit, I'd tell them the style must match the Vanguard style, for the purpose of uniformity (it is, after all, a uniform - at least in theory).  So I'd say the pocket is required for a male.  I'd also argue that the intent of the manual is to have a uniform shirt (embroidery issues aside - that's something CAP SPECs will hopefully fix), so it should match as the intent of the uniform regulations.

I'd suggest borrowing a shirt from a member and taking that to them, and also providing a CAP seal graphic (electronic) in case it would help them. 

[wuzafuzz]

The flimsy pockets on the Vanguard sourced polo shirts are nearly useless, IMHO.  I'd prefer a shirt with a sturdier pocket or none at all.  One of these with custom embroidery or screen printing would be slick:
http://www.511tactical.com/performance-short-sleeve-polo.html

Those are also available with long sleeves. 

I wouldn't lose much sleep over the pocket vs no-pocket shirts.  In fact the female embroidered polo already ships without pockets. The reg is vague in that it says the female version lacks a pocket but never actually says the male version must include a pocket.   As a unit commander I wouldn't give anyone grief if they showed up in an embroidered polo without pockets. 

The reg for the screen printed version is even more permissive.  There is NO mention of pockets on that one.
5.2.2.1.2. A dark blue knit shirt (long/short sleeves) with the CAP seal
screen‐printed in white lettering on the left breast.
5.2.2.3.2. Dark blue knit shirt with CAP seal screen-printed. No accoutrements
are authorized.
No option for other bling on that shirt.  I prefer the minimalist approach anyway.   

[JC004]

I would venture to guess they did not anticipate a need for giving members specifications to get their own shirts, or they would have done something like the embroidery standard for the lightweight blue jacket. 

I tell people the basic underlying rule is that you can't modify the general appearance of the uniform.  The Design Your Own Uniform Kit is only for general officers.  No matter how much I hate the STUPID PLASTIC *shakes fist* oak leaves for my flight suit, I can't change the general appearance by using Velcro, going with a Navy style, or using real metal insignia.  I can't even just attach them with magnets....(or can I?  wait a minute here...)

[bflynn]

I'll just add a note - if you're ordering a shirt, I highly recommend putting your name on it.  It's like a permanent name tag, especially as people come and go.

Brian

[LSThiker]

Well I ultimately ordered the CAP Polo with Historian Badge on it.  Needless to say, I think I will be contacting Vanguard to send it back and just get the Duty Title "Historian" put on.  The picture makes it look a lot better.  The badge sits about 2 inches above my name.  It is the correct size.  That is, it is not overly gaudy like the CP badge. 

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Майор Хаткевич]

Because I had a cadet "goodies" order to place, another SM asked me to get him a Polo, and somewhat got me to agree to get one as well. We both went with just our names, no badges/titles.

[kwe1009]

Because I had a cadet "goodies" order to place, another SM asked me to get him a Polo, and somewhat got me to agree to get one as well. We both went with just our names, no badges/titles.

That is the way to go.  Just your name. It is too hard to get any badge to look good embroidered.

[watnny]

I'm ordering one off of e-bay, short sleeve for $18.00, $7 to add your name and specialty badge or wings, and $7-8 for shipping. STILL cheaper than Vanguard. It's a Hanes polo 50/50 - I'll let everyone know how it is when I get it.

Mike

[Eclipse]

Wow - I completely forgot about those.  I may grab one myself.

There's also a number of vendors doing nametapes, it never occurred to my until this moment to look there for those.

[Storm Chaser]

I just checked and they only have 2XL, 3XL and 4XL available.

[watnny]

Which is OK because I'm a 2X! They also have long sleeve polos if you're interested. NO 2X in them though  :-(

[Майор Хаткевич]

Got my VG polo. Nice quality, nice embroidery.

[Storm Chaser]

The main issue I have with the VG polos (besides the price) is that the seal doesn't conform with CAP standards. I've never had an issue with the embroidery quality itself. The specialty track badges tend to be embroidered too big, as has been stated before. The quality of the shirts is alright, although they tend to fade overtime.

[LTCinSWR]

Agreed on the sizing. I got a polo with the IC1 badge; it is bigger than the full size metal insignia! The polo I have with Master Observer wings is closer to the proper proportions.

[PHall]

I've avoided the "problem" by just having my name on the shirt.
Costs less and IMHO looks a lot better too.

[Storm Chaser]

I've avoided the "problem" by just having my name on the shirt.

This shouldn't be a "problem" we need to "avoid".

[PHall]

I've avoided the "problem" by just having my name on the shirt.

This shouldn't be a "problem" we need to "avoid".

It's called dealing with the conditions you're dealt.

[JeffDG]

I've avoided the "problem" by just having my name on the shirt.

This shouldn't be a "problem" we need to "avoid".

It's called dealing with the conditions you're dealt.

Semper Gumby

[LSThiker]

I've avoided the "problem" by just having my name on the shirt.
Costs less and IMHO looks a lot better too.

I have avoided the problem by returning it at Vanguard's expense.  If people do not like the quality, then return them. Vanguard looses money on the deal.

[PHall]

I've avoided the "problem" by just having my name on the shirt.

This shouldn't be a "problem" we need to "avoid".

It's called dealing with the conditions you're dealt.

Semper Gumby

Rigid Flexibility

[LSThiker]

I've avoided the "problem" by just having my name on the shirt.
Costs less and IMHO looks a lot better too.

I have avoided the problem by returning it at Vanguard's expense.  If people do not like the quality, then return them. Vanguard looses money on the deal.

Vanguard has contacted me to let me know that the digital image used for the design will be redone and a new shirt free of charge will be sent.  Cannot really complain with that especially since I do not need it immediately.

[lordmonar]

I've avoided the "problem" by just having my name on the shirt.
Costs less and IMHO looks a lot better too.

I have avoided the problem by returning it at Vanguard's expense.  If people do not like the quality, then return them. Vanguard looses money on the deal.

Vanguard has contacted me to let me know that the digital image used for the design will be redone and a new shirt free of charge will be sent.  Cannot really complain with that especially since I do not need it immediately.

And it does show that Vanguard is trying to satisfy their customers.