I've been part of Color Guards and Honor Guards as cadet, but have been tasked with helping build up a unit CG or HG while I'm available this summer.
I'm looking for two things:
Online retailers which provide quality items at reasonable prices.
A recommendation for the best flag holders (the type a cadet wears when carrying the flag).
P.S. A source for rifle-shaped stock for practices would also be quite helpful!
For practice rifles, take a 2x4 and trace a rifle on it. Cut it out and round the edges. If you want a barrel, get a piece of 1" pvc pipe and screw or tape it on. When it breaks, it's a cheap easy fix or replacement.
There was a pattern floating around the internet a couple years ago.
For practice stocks.....best bet is to just buy a 2X4 and have someone with a bandsaw or jigsaw cut it down. Then give a file and sandpaper to the cadet to smooth it out.
go to paradestore.com for all your needs....they have everything from dirt cheap to super high end just like the honor guard uses.
Aslo note....
Units have Color Guards and Drill Teams.....only the wing can have an Honor Guard.
We have a whole rack of practice rifles, enough for every cadet in the squadron to have one out at th same time (heh)
but we cut them out of 2x6's as 2x4's weren't wide enough,
and we hit them with a quarter round router bit, to expedite rounding of the edges
the weight and balance are different from actual parade rifles,
and they are a lot different from deactivated actuals
so that can be problematic if you are spinning and throwing or other nonsense like that
but it's very good for teaching the basic moves.
the best part is they are a fraction of $30+ each,
so if one gets dropped or something, kind of who cares,
some of them are even duct taped which is fine until they actually disintegrate
at which time we can just jig and route out a new one for literally just a couple bucks.
Quote from: lordmonar on July 14, 2011, 09:22:07 PM
Units have Color Guards and Drill Teams.....only the wing can have an Honor Guard.
I don't know where you got the notion that "only the wing can have an Honor Guard."
CAPR 52-16 Para 8.8
Quote8-8. Honor Guards. Unit honor guard programs are opportunities for cadets to serve their communities and promote a drug-free ethic through excellence in drill and ceremonies.
CAPP 52-8
Unit Honor Guard Program
The two primary references to HG in CAP publications refer to
Unit honor guard and not
Wing honor guard.
If you ask around your local high school/jr high band directors, you may find that they have a dusty closet full of parade rifles.
I feel like I remember you're not close to my geographic location (PA), are you? I'd cut some 2x6's into rifles and round them properly if needed. Probably be easier than the actual firearm I made... 8)
Quote from: JC004 on July 15, 2011, 12:06:13 AM
I feel like I remember you're not close to my geographic location (PA), are you? I'd cut some 2x6's into rifles and round them properly if needed. Probably be easier than the actual firearm I made... 8)
I'm in IL...
Though, if the stocks are under 30" (I believe), the USPS has a Large Flat Rate Box (The Gameboard box). That would run under $15 to ship. Depending on dimensions, I'm thinking 2-4 would fit easy.
Quote from: ß τ ε on July 14, 2011, 10:37:55 PM
Quote from: lordmonar on July 14, 2011, 09:22:07 PM
Units have Color Guards and Drill Teams.....only the wing can have an Honor Guard.
I don't know where you got the notion that "only the wing can have an Honor Guard."
CAPR 52-16 Para 8.8
Quote8-8. Honor Guards. Unit honor guard programs are opportunities for cadets to serve their communities and promote a drug-free ethic through excellence in drill and ceremonies.
CAPP 52-8 Unit Honor Guard Program
The two primary references to HG in CAP publications refer to Unit honor guard and not Wing honor guard.
Quote from: CAPP 52-81.2. Authority. Wing commanders determine the scope of Unit Honor Guards within their wings. As
a result, squadrons wishing to start a Unit Honor Guard need the wing commander's approval. Wing and
region commanders may elect to have members of different Unit Honor Guards form a wing or region
Honor Guard as deemed necessary by the appropriate commander.
Honor guarads may be run at the squadron level...but they are authorised at the wing level only.....ergo a wing level program. I may be splitting hairs....but that is what I was pointing out.
Well that shipping isn't so bad - would have to verify. I have to find out when all the CRAP is getting loaded out of my workshop (getting a big shed put in, and until then, all the crap is piled over my work area). I wouldn't mind making them for units as I had time and once I had a proper template. The rifles I have now would suck for any sort of drill. I COULD borrow one of the muskets from the National Park Service here and make cadets some muskets! Every cadet should know how to use a Brown Bess!
Of course in IL, they're probably "assault weapons." The good old flintlock Brown Bess is an "assault weapon" across the river in the swamp...I mean New Jersey.
What rifle do squadrons tend to use? M1903 Springfield, M1? I wonder how you set a balance/weight that doesn't suck.
Quote from: JC004 on July 15, 2011, 06:06:23 AMOf course in IL, they're probably "assault weapons." The good old flintlock Brown Bess is an "assault weapon" across the river in the swamp...I mean New Jersey.
Depends on which part of Illinois you're in...
Quote from: JC004 on July 15, 2011, 06:06:23 AM
What rifle do squadrons tend to use? M1903 Springfield, M1? I wonder how you set a balance/weight that doesn't suck.
The Springfield's are (at least IMO) the low end, most commonly seen in CAP Color Guards due to cost. The Drill America M1 is the top of the line, and a whopping 14 lbs.
Honor Guard Academy issued one of these to me: http://www.paradestore.com/detail.aspx?ID=311 (http://www.paradestore.com/detail.aspx?ID=311)
Since there were two of us that went, the unit inherited two. I like the design, and the material, as it holds up better than the Springfield. I'm not looking for rifles that are balance to be thrown. I'm looking more so for practice rifles to get more than two cadets into a practice and do the basic manual of arms.
Maybe a shape like this: http://images-cdn01.associatedcontent.com/image/A1090/109038/300_109038.jpg (http://images-cdn01.associatedcontent.com/image/A1090/109038/300_109038.jpg)
Item M here seems like what HGA gave us: http://dancecheer.net/pics2/rifles2.gif (http://dancecheer.net/pics2/rifles2.gif)
Quote from: JC004 on July 15, 2011, 06:06:23 AM
What rifle do squadrons tend to use? M1903 Springfield, M1? I wonder how you set a balance/weight that doesn't suck.
M1903 Springfields. M1 Garands are too expensive, too big, and too heavy for a lot of our cadets. Plus I like the traditional look of the bolt-action Springfields.
[darn]. I HAD a real one...
Quote from: titanII on July 15, 2011, 03:36:16 PM
Quote from: JC004 on July 15, 2011, 06:06:23 AM
What rifle do squadrons tend to use? M1903 Springfield, M1? I wonder how you set a balance/weight that doesn't suck.
M1903 Springfields. M1 Garands are too expensive, too big, and too heavy for a lot of our cadets. Plus I like the traditional look of the bolt-action Springfields.
Except the units available look like crap.
By the way, any specific suggestions on flag carriers?
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 15, 2011, 09:04:27 PM
Quote from: titanII on July 15, 2011, 03:36:16 PM
Quote from: JC004 on July 15, 2011, 06:06:23 AM
What rifle do squadrons tend to use? M1903 Springfield, M1? I wonder how you set a balance/weight that doesn't suck.
M1903 Springfields. M1 Garands are too expensive, too big, and too heavy for a lot of our cadets. Plus I like the traditional look of the bolt-action Springfields.
Except the units available look like crap.
too bad. M1 Garands
will do the job (obviously), I just prefer Springfields. It's more a matter of personal opinion/preference, I guess.
I don't like either. I prefer the middle options.
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 15, 2011, 10:29:25 PM
By the way, any specific suggestions on flag carriers?
We've used this (http://"http://www.paradestore.com/detail.aspx?ID=934") (white, double harness) at my squadron. I've also seen something like this (http://"http://www.paradestore.com/detail.aspx?ID=531") used, although I really like how ours looks better.
You only say that because your squadron is the best in the Region. ;D
All because of that year and a half I was the Cadet Commander I'm sure. 8)
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 03:29:58 AM
I don't like either. I prefer the middle options.
What do you mean by middle options?
Quote from: titanII on July 16, 2011, 12:12:53 PM
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 03:29:58 AM
I don't like either. I prefer the middle options.
What do you mean by middle options?
The Mark 1s?
(http://www.paradestore.com/images/401001.gif)
Mike got it.
Weight is on par with the Springfield, so even the smallest of cadets can manage it, but it looks a lot more decent.
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 04:49:38 PM
Mike got it.
Weight is on par with the Springfield, so even the smallest of cadets can manage it, but it looks a lot more decent.
Are you talking the weight of a real Springfield? Mark 1s don't even come close. I have six in my basement right now and they are a toy compared to a real firearm.
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 04:49:38 PM
Mike got it.
Weight is on par with the Springfield, so even the smallest of cadets can manage it, but it looks a lot more decent.
Interesting, all the M1 type parade rifles I've ever used are dang heavy. Apparently YMMV.
Quote from: titanII on July 16, 2011, 07:53:52 PM
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 04:49:38 PM
Mike got it.
Weight is on par with the Springfield, so even the smallest of cadets can manage it, but it looks a lot more decent.
Interesting, all the M1 type parade rifles I've ever used are dang heavy. Apparently YMMV.
The plastic Mark 1s are not Garant M1s...
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 17, 2011, 08:41:02 AM
Quote from: titanII on July 16, 2011, 07:53:52 PM
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 04:49:38 PM
Mike got it.
Weight is on par with the Springfield, so even the smallest of cadets can manage it, but it looks a lot more decent.
Interesting, all the M1 type parade rifles I've ever used are dang heavy. Apparently YMMV.
The plastic Mark 1s are not Garant Garand M1s...
FTFY. ;)
Quote from: davidsinn on July 16, 2011, 05:42:33 PM
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 04:49:38 PM
Mike got it.
Weight is on par with the Springfield, so even the smallest of cadets can manage it, but it looks a lot more decent.
Are you talking the weight of a real Springfield? Mark 1s don't even come close. I have six in my basement right now and they are a toy compared to a real firearm.
Psss.....Dave...<look left><look right>...they are toys. >:D
Quote from: lordmonar on July 17, 2011, 02:24:41 PM
Quote from: davidsinn on July 16, 2011, 05:42:33 PM
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 04:49:38 PM
Mike got it.
Weight is on par with the Springfield, so even the smallest of cadets can manage it, but it looks a lot more decent.
Are you talking the weight of a real Springfield? Mark 1s don't even come close. I have six in my basement right now and they are a toy compared to a real firearm.
Psss.....Dave...<look left><look right>...they are toys. >:D
I know. ;) I've shot my fair share of real weapons...
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 17, 2011, 08:41:02 AM
Quote from: titanII on July 16, 2011, 07:53:52 PM
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 04:49:38 PM
Mike got it.
Weight is on par with the Springfield, so even the smallest of cadets can manage it, but it looks a lot more decent.
Interesting, all the M1 type parade rifles I've ever used are dang heavy. Apparently YMMV.
The plastic Mark 1s are not Garant M1s...
Actually, they look more like M1917 pattern rifles.
I missed the entire discussion about Honor Guard...
While at NHGA for two weeks. Go figure.
Quote from: MIKE on July 16, 2011, 12:42:58 PM
Quote from: titanII on July 16, 2011, 12:12:53 PM
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on July 16, 2011, 03:29:58 AM
I don't like either. I prefer the middle options.
What do you mean by middle options?
The Mark 1s?
(http://www.paradestore.com/images/401001.gif)
That brown one looks oddly like the one I got at HGA back in 2003 (and use to this day) except it has a white leather "sling". So I would say go with that. USAFaux2004 and HGjunkie, you should be familiar with them as well.
Also, last I checked (it's been a while), CAPP 52-8 has some resource locations available in the back.
My Brown rifle issued in 2005 came with a brown sling I believe.
The unit still has the two rifles two of us were issued. I'm looking to round out missing items such as chin straps.
Why do you not have a simple color guard that avoids needing to acquire all th extra bling? Services performed, particularly at the unit level, are the same.
Quote from: Bluelakes 13 on July 25, 2011, 02:48:32 PM
Why do you not have a simple color guard that avoids needing to acquire all th extra bling? Services performed, particularly at the unit level, are the same.
I believe the goal is to have a capability for both. Either way I'm just the guy that was pointed to when the idea came up due to previous experience. I was told HG, so I'm rounding out HG, but there is nothing (outside of the plain ascot) that can't be converted to make a regular CG in a pinch.