Embroidered bag tags with CAP wings.
I like it!
The NB approved embroidered flight suit badges a while back, but a policy was never formalized and submitted to the AF for approval.
I think the gold border, blue background, and silver embroidery work great as a color scheme. I'd say we should mandate consistency across the board. No funky special unit or wing color schemes - at least for now.
But I would personally still like to see the second line with "GRADE" and "CAP" on there.
^ I like it as well. I too would like to see grade on there. I think we don't need "CAP" on there as other various badges already say that. However, I take whatever it is as long as it is embroidered.
I also agree with Mike that it should be consistent for every Wing. No local exceptions.
Quote from: Pylon on November 21, 2007, 11:09:38 PM
But I would personally still like to see the second line with "GRADE" and "CAP" on there.
Not for ocifers. The grade on your shoulders and the CIVIL AIR PATROL on the MAJCOM patch covers it. For NCOs and cadets, Yes.
I like the color scheme as well. We have to look at what was already approved by NB to see how it was done and if it includes RANK and CAP. Obviously, it will be up to USAF as to whether or not its on the badge.
These colors should be standard for all wings. They also match the colors of the Command Patch.
I like the embroidered patch....but if we standardize it across CAP....why not just keep with the leather.
If we go embroider we are just asking for local units/groups/wings to do their own thing.
On the other hand....taking a cue from our parent service....allowing lower echelons to customize their name tapes increases morale and esprit d'corps.
YMMV.
Col. Hodgkins recently came out and stated that the Air Force HAS NOT approved these
I know where you got those... ;D
Embroidered would be great. I'd sew everything to my bag. Be a lot easier than looking for things.
Quote from: Redfire11 on November 22, 2007, 12:48:48 AM
I know where you got those... ;D
Would you PM me, and let me in on it?
Quote from: isuhawkeye on November 22, 2007, 12:46:22 AM
Col. Hodgkins recently came out and stated that the Air Force HAS NOT approved these
Care to share what else is going on at CAP-USAF. They are very secretive there. In fact the whole USAF side of CAP-USAF is not as visible as it was say 5 years ago.
So did the Colonel shoot it down, or did he pass it on for review?
Mine is cardinal and Gold
Go Cyclones
QuoteCare to share what else is going on at CAP-USAF. They are very secretive there. In fact the whole USAF side of CAP-USAF is not as visible as it was say 5 years ago.
When he was in Iowa a few weeks ago he mentioned it, and I go the (Not Gunna Happen) Vibe.
Ours should parallel whatever the AF does with their badges. If they have grade and service on the badge, then so should ours.
Quote from: RiverAux on November 22, 2007, 01:03:34 AM
Ours should parallel whatever the AF does with their badges. If they have grade and service on the badge, then so should ours.
Well...that goes with our saying.....but for some reason the USAF don't like us being too close to their flier types. That is not to say the USAF doesn't like us, CAP. The flier types are very jealous of their status symbols even to other USAF types. Just look at the rules for who can wear a flight bag......it has nothing to do if you fly for a living but if you are on flight status or not.
So the old song and dance about it being for crew safety is about 95% crock.
Oh...BTW...there are a lot of AD USAF units that just ignore that section of the AFI and do what they want.
Just store that little tid bit next time someone blows a gasket because some CAP unit violates 39-1.
Considering all the fact that we've got absolutely nothing on the flight suit linking us with the Air Force in any way, there seems to be little chance for confusion.
Quote from: RiverAux on November 22, 2007, 01:23:12 AM
Considering all the fact that we've got absolutely nothing on the flight suit linking us with the Air Force in any way, there seems to be little chance for confusion.
The biggest thing is it's a green bag. That's all it takes. Even some of our Army pilots wearing the one-piece get asked if they're in the Air Force. And there are three military installations in the local area. It's crazy, but it does happen.
Quote from: lordmonar on November 22, 2007, 01:15:34 AM
Quote from: RiverAux on November 22, 2007, 01:03:34 AM
Ours should parallel whatever the AF does with their badges. If they have grade and service on the badge, then so should ours.
Well...that goes with our saying.....but for some reason the USAF don't like us being too close to their flier types. That is not to say the USAF doesn't like us, CAP. The flier types are very jealous of their status symbols even to other USAF types. Just look at the rules for who can wear a flight bag......it has nothing to do if you fly for a living but if you are on flight status or not.
So the old song and dance about it being for crew safety is about 95% crock.
Oh...BTW...there are a lot of AD USAF units that just ignore that section of the AFI and do what they want.
Just store that little tid bit next time someone blows a gasket because some CAP unit violates 39-1.
You done with yet another anti-flyer rant there Pat? It's getting kinda old, don't you think?
Quote from: RiverAux on November 22, 2007, 01:03:34 AM
Ours should parallel whatever the AF does with their badges. If they have grade and service on the badge, then so should ours.
Rated AF officers usually wear cloth name tags with their wings, first and last name. (Or callsign if it's Friday.) No grade or 'USAF'. You might see jump wings, chaplain or commander's badge on the tag, or some kind of emblem representing the squadron. I've seen very few leather nametags on RealAirForce® bags.
Enlisted aircrew include their grade with their nametag, since they don't wear grade on the bag.
Only time you see grade and USAF on a leather tag it's on the brown leather A-2 jacket.
USAFA and AFROTC cadinks have special nametag rules. USAFA's tag colors are the class year colors and add a second line 'USAFA CADET XX' (XX for class year) AFROTC cadinks have a similar tag, except the tag colors usually match the university's colors and read 'CADET AFROTC' on the second line.
Biggest reason why the RealAirForce's® zipper-suited-sun-god-mafia won't let us wear brown leather A-2s with the bag or with blues is because that's the initiation badge of an operational, mission-ready aircrew. I think the same goes with the cloth name tag in some communities, namely fighters.
Current AFI 36-2903 prohibits morale patches... but is someone gonna jack up the 'wing king' because he's wearing one?
If thats the way they're dealing with the Academy and ROTC, then I've got no problem keeping CAP on our name tags.
Personally, I think the cloth badges look terrible while the leather ones look more professional. Also, if our embroidered tags had rank, I would very quickly get fed up with replacing them as I moved up the ranks. It was already a pain replacing the rank insignia.
Quote from: Hawk200 on November 22, 2007, 12:50:20 AM
Quote from: Redfire11 on November 22, 2007, 12:48:48 AM
I know where you got those... ;D
Would you PM me, and let me in on it?
Can you add me to the list as well. If nothing else it will look nice as an identifier for my mission bag
Whats the purpose of that?
Quote from: AlphaSigOU on November 22, 2007, 02:21:50 AM
Quote from: RiverAux on November 22, 2007, 01:03:34 AM
Ours should parallel whatever the AF does with their badges. If they have grade and service on the badge, then so should ours.
Rated AF officers usually wear cloth name tags with their wings, first and last name. (Or callsign if it's Friday.) No grade or 'USAF'. You might see jump wings, chaplain or commander's badge on the tag, or some kind of emblem representing the squadron. I've seen very few leather nametags on RealAirForce® bags.
Enlisted aircrew include their grade with their nametag, since they don't wear grade on the bag.
Only time you see grade and USAF on a leather tag it's on the brown leather A-2 jacket.
USAFA and AFROTC cadinks have special nametag rules. USAFA's tag colors are the class year colors and add a second line 'USAFA CADET XX' (XX for class year) AFROTC cadinks have a similar tag, except the tag colors usually match the university's colors and read 'CADET AFROTC' on the second line.
Biggest reason why the RealAirForce's® zipper-suited-sun-god-mafia won't let us wear brown leather A-2s with the bag or with blues is because that's the initiation badge of an operational, mission-ready aircrew. I think the same goes with the cloth name tag in some communities, namely fighters.
Current AFI 36-2903 prohibits morale patches... but is someone gonna jack up the 'wing king' because he's wearing one?
Only place I've ever seen leather nametags on a USAF bag is on a UPT base. Studs wear a leather nametag formatted just like ours (name, grade, USAF), and if they happen to have an aeronautical rating (enlisted aircrew, nav, etc) or jump wings, they wear them. If none, it's just name, grade, USAF. Once the stud solos, they get a cloth nametag.
Quote from: PHall on November 22, 2007, 01:53:38 AM
Quote from: lordmonar on November 22, 2007, 01:15:34 AM
Quote from: RiverAux on November 22, 2007, 01:03:34 AM
Ours should parallel whatever the AF does with their badges. If they have grade and service on the badge, then so should ours.
Well...that goes with our saying.....but for some reason the USAF don't like us being too close to their flier types. That is not to say the USAF doesn't like us, CAP. The flier types are very jealous of their status symbols even to other USAF types. Just look at the rules for who can wear a flight bag......it has nothing to do if you fly for a living but if you are on flight status or not.
So the old song and dance about it being for crew safety is about 95% crock.
Oh...BTW...there are a lot of AD USAF units that just ignore that section of the AFI and do what they want.
Just store that little tid bit next time someone blows a gasket because some CAP unit violates 39-1.
You done with yet another anti-flyer rant there Pat? It's getting kinda old, don't you think?
I'm a maintence guy! It never get's old ragging the fliers! :)
But even if it is a rant....it's still true. ;D
As l look into my CAP crystal ball, I see a vision:
Someday the cloth nametags will be authorized, the announcement will come with great fanfare, the hungry masses will flock to Vanguard, only to find that there is a two four five month wait for them to become available.
Market-savvy entrepeneurs will attempt to fill the void, only to receive a nasty letter from the esquires at 105 S. Hansell Street.
When they become available, since they are personalized items, they will be sold at a premium.
THEN, the format/color/CAP name-of-the-week will change, and those compliant troopers who were the first on their block to get one will have to repeat the process.
. . . but hey, who believes in crystal balls? ;)
Quote from: lordmonar on November 22, 2007, 07:52:38 AM
Quote from: PHall on November 22, 2007, 01:53:38 AM
Quote from: lordmonar on November 22, 2007, 01:15:34 AM
Quote from: RiverAux on November 22, 2007, 01:03:34 AM
Ours should parallel whatever the AF does with their badges. If they have grade and service on the badge, then so should ours.
Well...that goes with our saying.....but for some reason the USAF don't like us being too close to their flier types. That is not to say the USAF doesn't like us, CAP. The flier types are very jealous of their status symbols even to other USAF types. Just look at the rules for who can wear a flight bag......it has nothing to do if you fly for a living but if you are on flight status or not.
So the old song and dance about it being for crew safety is about 95% crock.
Oh...BTW...there are a lot of AD USAF units that just ignore that section of the AFI and do what they want.
Just store that little tid bit next time someone blows a gasket because some CAP unit violates 39-1.
You done with yet another anti-flyer rant there Pat? It's getting kinda old, don't you think?
I'm a maintence guy! It never get's old ragging the fliers! :)
But even if it is a rant....it's still true. ;D
Ever get the feeling that you joined the wrong branch of the service?
As deep as your disgust for flyers is, maybe the Army would have been a better fit.
Quote from: O-Rex on November 22, 2007, 01:28:39 PM
As l look into my CAP crystal ball, I see a vision:
Someday the cloth nametags will be authorized, the announcement will come with great fanfare, the hungry masses will flock to Vanguard, only to find that there is a two four five month wait for them to become available.
Market-savvy entrepeneurs will attempt to fill the void, only to receive a nasty letter from the esquires at 105 S. Hansell Street.
When they become available, since they are personalized items, they will be sold at a premium.
THEN, the format/color/CAP name-of-the-week will change, and those compliant troopers who were the first on their block to get one will have to repeat the process.
. . . but hey, who believes in crystal balls? ;)
Or
I see them not being authorized
Because I've never actually met someone who wants one.
Quote from: PHall on November 22, 2007, 06:30:30 PMEver get the feeling that you joined the wrong branch of the service?
As deep as your disgust for fliers is, maybe the Army would have been a better fit.
Don't get me wrong....Got to love those fliers...it's why I'm a maintenance guy. But you can still make comments on reality with out having deep disgust.
The USAF flier community lives apart from the rest of the USAF...always have, always will. There is no good or bad about it, it just is.
Quote from: JThemann on November 22, 2007, 06:39:36 PM
Or
I see them not being authorized
Because I've never actually met someone who wants one.
Have you spent any time around CAP pilots, or folks who are primarily aircrew geeks lately? I wouldn't go so far as to say that a majority of them want cloth over leather, but I know quite a few who do, and I'm yet to meet anyone who just screams "keep the leather".
My biggest reason for wanting them is quality. I've owned a total of four leather nametags from two different vendors, and all of them have the velcro separate from the nametag. Then, I have to pay extra to go to a boot shop and have the velcro stitched on, and hope that they come out looking OK. By the time it's all said and done, I've spent more keeping them servicable than I would have if I'd have just bought cloth in the first place. Of course, since the velcro is already sewn to the cloth tag, there's no issue with the adhesive wearing out, and no further modifications are necessary.
Quote from: Redfire11 on November 22, 2007, 08:10:41 PM
Quote from: JThemann on November 22, 2007, 06:39:36 PM
Or
I see them not being authorized
Because I've never actually met someone who wants one.
Have you spent any time around CAP pilots, or folks who are primarily aircrew geeks lately? I wouldn't go so far as to say that a majority of them want cloth over leather, but I know quite a few who do, and I'm yet to meet anyone who just screams "keep the leather".
My biggest reason for wanting them is quality. I've owned a total of four leather nametags from two different vendors, and all of them have the velcro separate from the nametag. Then, I have to pay extra to go to a boot shop and have the velcro stitched on, and hope that they come out looking OK. By the time it's all said and done, I've spent more keeping them servicable than I would have if I'd have just bought cloth in the first place. Of course, since the velcro is already sewn to the cloth tag, there's no issue with the adhesive wearing out, and no further modifications are necessary.
Not ordering from the right people. The right ones would come already stitched & high quality.
Cadets need a name tag for the Flight Suit/Utility Uniform. Could be the same as plastic nametag except cloth.
Quote from: thp on November 22, 2007, 08:22:28 PM
Cadets need a name tag for the Flight Suit/Utility Uniform. Could be the same as plastic nametag except cloth.
What? They already wear the same leather one everyone else does (sub "cadet" for grade). They don't need to designate grade in a flight suit, cause the only thing that matters is if they are 18 or not. The only thing that slightly matters is C/officer grade and that's on the hat. Even if they did need to designate it, the lesser expense of replacing cloth constantly versus leather is still too much, so no way. I guess I'm not understanding what your issue is.
On the larger issue, I really don't care if we get cloth or not. Bigger issues to worry about, even within the uniform spectrum.
Quote from: JThemann on November 22, 2007, 06:39:36 PM
Quote from: O-Rex on November 22, 2007, 01:28:39 PM
As l look into my CAP crystal ball, I see a vision:
Someday the cloth nametags will be authorized, the announcement will come with great fanfare, the hungry masses will flock to Vanguard, only to find that there is a two four five month wait for them to become available.
Market-savvy entrepeneurs will attempt to fill the void, only to receive a nasty letter from the esquires at 105 S. Hansell Street.
When they become available, since they are personalized items, they will be sold at a premium.
THEN, the format/color/CAP name-of-the-week will change, and those compliant troopers who were the first on their block to get one will have to repeat the process.
. . . but hey, who believes in crystal balls? ;)
Or
I see them not being authorized
Because I've never actually met someone who wants one.
I want one.
Quote from: thp on November 22, 2007, 08:22:28 PM
Cadets need a name tag for the Flight Suit/Utility Uniform. Could be the same as plastic nametag except cloth.
What are you talking about? I wore a leather nameplate as a cadet.
(http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff28/isuhawkeye/Photo_112407_001.jpg)
I thought I would share mine
After seeing all these, now I really want one.
Though I would have centered the CAP below the name. (Unless the pic's been photochopped.)
I had one made back when I was a cadet, moreso as a presentation piece and something I could stick on a flight bag. Plus, yeah, it looked cool. Background is a navy blue, w/ silver edging and silver text. It's a little dirty, but, it's also 4+ years old.
(http://a227.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/66/l_c95d38bc9b63ce070e2dffe4b8c78042.jpg)
Wouldn't mind getting one that says "Capt" now....
I had embroidered tags done up years ago. Had Observer over Jump and Jump over Master GTM.
I don't know if there is an "across the board standard" for the USAF, but both the AMC units I was in had the exact same colors scheme as Chris's. Gold border and writing, with silver (white) wings and blue background.
For CAP, I'd suggest (only a suggestion, I'm not aircrew anymore) silverish border, text and badge with a ultramarine background.