YouTube Video by Disgruntled Former Cadet[SFW]

[Archer]

I'll just leave this here...enjoy.

Thoughts about: civil air patrol

[SarDragon]

tl;dw

He spent 30 minutes on this? To what end?

[Archer]

He was just complaining about CAP as in:
-ES is a failure
-He got bullied at every squadron he switched to
-CoC never handled said bullies
-CoC extended way too far; it should stop at squadron level
-There's nothing you can do about people of higher rank than you giving you a hard time
-Everything is repetitive
-Nobody would ever sign off on his SQTR's
-Promotion boards are too easy
-He could never pass promotion boards(even though he made C/2d Lt)
-Promotion boards are pointless
-SDA's are pointless
-Sustainment promotions are pointless and designed to keep cadets from achieving highest grade
-CAP is unorganized
-CAP was too unprofessional
-CAP didn't let you socialize enough or have enough fun
-CAP FORCES cadets to do too much work which isn't right because he's a volunteer and he paid money   <---There are not enough ways to emphasize the word "force" in his meaning.
-He shouldn't have to be a C/AB because he paid money for CAP                                                                                                    Pretend it's even more emphasized.
-CAP fails at getting people to join the military. CAP is there to get people to join the military and fails at that mission.
-COWG is a fail.

[Eclipse]

This is an old video and serves no purpose being posted here.

He clearly had no idea how CAP worked, and little why he joined.

[JackFrost3k]

5k views in a year.  ... Dude sounds real butt hurt.

[coudano]

He's a natural to join this forum

[Devil Doc]

You sure that is not RM   

[Archer]

You sure that is not RM   

RM sounds intriguing. Link?

[HGjunkie]

I'm sitting here wondering how he got his Mitchell without understanding CAP.

[abdsp51]

He wanted things handed to him and didn't want to work for anything.  I don't see the sustained achievements as a bad thing at all.  Either way listening to him drone on and on cost me a good half hour tonight.  And I think he was the cause for all his issues.

[Devil Doc]

Anyone from the COWG here? Maybe they can shed some light on this guy.

[Peeka]

You sure that is not RM   

RM sounds intriguing. Link?

http://captalk.net/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=1028

[Private Investigator]

This is an old video and serves no purpose being posted here.

He clearly had no idea how CAP worked, and little why he joined.

Actually it should be posted here. It is a good after action report on his four years in CAP. Some people may get something out of it and others won't.

The highlight was AE and he became a pilot. ES and CP needs improving and I concur. No Squadron is perfect and that is the way it is. JMHO YMMV   

[jimmydeanno]

I watched 45 seconds, and in that time he was wrong about 90% of what he said.  I don't have time for the rest.

[Private Investigator]

I'm sitting here wondering how he got his Mitchell without understanding CAP.

Well that is no surprise to me. I know C/Captains that I have been disappointed in. It is like apples and oranges or the cup is half full or half empty thingy. What somebody thinks is awesome may be only mediocre to us. Saavy   

[Private Investigator]

I watched 45 seconds, and in that time he was wrong about 90% of what he said.  I don't have time for the rest.

So you made a judgement based on .0236% of lets say his AAR. I bet you got a opinion on everything   

[Private Investigator]

Anyone from the COWG here? Maybe they can shed some light on this guy.

When I was a Squadron Commander, when a member left I always followed up with a phone call. Nothing wrong with an 'exit interview'. Got a good insight on why people leave. Later as a Group Commander, when a member left from one of my Squadrons I would call that departing member. You will see a pattern. Maybe 67% it was the member but 33% it was a poor or bad Commander and/or him/her and their staff.

So "this guy" is no different from many others, coast to coast. He did get a Mitchell and he is a pilot today. What are we expecting, 'the guy should walk on water and blindly love CAP, for better or worse'?   

[jimmydeanno]

I watched 45 seconds, and in that time he was wrong about 90% of what he said.  I don't have time for the rest.

So you made a judgement based on .0236% of lets say his AAR. I bet you got a opinion on everything   

I could probably give you an opinion on just about anything, if you really want it.  Maybe I'll start doing 30 minute diatribes.  Or, maybe I'll just actually accomplish something and continue to make CAP better.  I know what the issues are facing local units, I don't need to watch this to understand.  Also, I don't have time to listen to 30 minutes of some disgruntled former member droning on and on about something he obviously understood very little despite spending nearly half a decade doing it. 

[NIN]

I'm sitting here wondering how he got his Mitchell without understanding CAP.

Well that is no surprise to me. I know C/Captains that I have been disappointed in. It is like apples and oranges or the cup is half full or half empty thingy. What somebody thinks is awesome may be only mediocre to us. Saavy   

And keep in mind, every unit is different from the next, and even different from its own iterations (commanders, cadets, seniors, etc) in terms of its program and the execution of that program.   Sure, we have 52-16 and its guidance, but there is often a difference between the headshed's intent and the field's ability to interpret and implement.  And lets not get into all the "unwritten" things that make units good or great.

Maybe this guy's unit was a Colorado squadron of the year 2 years before he was there, and his commander moved on and his replacement wasn't nearly so good, nor was the guy who replaced him, or the people who were appointed as deputy commanders, leadership officers, cadet commanders, etc.

I didn't watch the video. Like Jason, I really don't need to listen to a guy who was in CAP for 5 years explain that he really didn't "get" the cadet program.  Because what he "got" is something different than the cadet experience I've tried for ovaer 20 years to provide to cadets in my AOR.   Its likely not even his fault: Sounds like his unit continued to promote and advance him without a solid grounding in the program and didn't provide the kind of program that most of us here agree is really a "well rounded" cadet program.

I think this speaks to the need for better senior training to promote consistency across the board.  That way we don't have a unit that lets a guy spend 5 years in the program and advance to Phase IV and only get the equivalent of Phase I experiences and training.

[Archer]

I'm sitting here wondering how he got his Mitchell without understanding CAP.

Well that is no surprise to me. I know C/Captains that I have been disappointed in. It is like apples and oranges or the cup is half full or half empty thingy. What somebody thinks is awesome may be only mediocre to us. Saavy   

And keep in mind, every unit is different from the next, and even different from its own iterations (commanders, cadets, seniors, etc) in terms of its program and the execution of that program.   Sure, we have 52-16 and its guidance, but there is often a difference between the headshed's intent and the field's ability to interpret and implement.  And lets not get into all the "unwritten" things that make units good or great.

Maybe this guy's unit was a Colorado squadron of the year 2 years before he was there, and his commander moved on and his replacement wasn't nearly so good, nor was the guy who replaced him, or the people who were appointed as deputy commanders, leadership officers, cadet commanders, etc.

I didn't watch the video. Like Jason, I really don't need to listen to a guy who was in CAP for 5 years explain that he really didn't "get" the cadet program.  Because what he "got" is something different than the cadet experience I've tried for ovaer 20 years to provide to cadets in my AOR.   Its likely not even his fault: Sounds like his unit continued to promote and advance him without a solid grounding in the program and didn't provide the kind of program that most of us here agree is really a "well rounded" cadet program.

I think this speaks to the need for better senior training to promote consistency across the board.  That way we don't have a unit that lets a guy spend 5 years in the program and advance to Phase IV and only get the equivalent of Phase I experiences and training.

*units

The kid switched squadrons three times and almost switched a fourth time.

"Is everyone else crazy or am I the crazy one?" applies here.

[abdsp51]

Back in 98, I was looking at transfering units because I felt that the one I was currently involved with had become a bad fit.  So that would be a valid reason to transfer but to transfer that many times because of "bullies" that were running rampant in these units, IMHO I find highly unlikely.  After listening to his rant honestly I think that he wanted stuff handed to him and he didn't want to do what was needed.  And the line about oh we did the search right but they wouldn't sign off I am not buying for a second.  If the evaluator said it wasn't done right as per the SQTR then it wasn't done right and you shouldn't be signed off. 

Either way, I believe he brought alot of his issues upon himself in general with his lack of understanding of the organization and the programs.

[mwewing]

For some reason, I went ahead and subjected myself to that entire video. I won't waste time trying to break that nonsense down into anything too logical. It can all be summed up that this young man was only interested in CAP insofar as it could further his own personal agenda. He completely fails to understand the purpose of cadet promotion requirements, or how ES training is accomplished. He complains about thin aerospace texts, but doesn't want that mission expanded to include the likes of model rocketry. He believes the purpose of CAP is to encourage military service in our young people, and that volunteers shouldn't be expected to do any real work.  Finally, he believes CAP is bad because he didn't get everything that he wanted when he wanted it.

I find it hard to believe that 3 squadrons all had problems with bullying, and none of them addressed it according to our rather strict stance on bullying/hazing. I find it difficult to believe that at none of these squadrons did anyone try to correct his serious misconceptions about our programs, or develop him into a more productive young leader. I think this troubled young man has very specific interests, and had a very specific motivation for joining CAP. I suspect his problems emerged from an inability to recognize the value of our programs beyond his narrow lens, and his unwillingness to function as part of the team.

Frankly, I think we are better off that this person has decided to end his membership. Based on the overall knowledge and attitude displayed in his video, I have difficulty understanding how he made it through the Mitchell. Ultimately, I think the only possible way we failed him, is if no one during his 4 year membership made any attempt to develop him beyond the narrow-minded, egotism displayed in this unfortunate video.

Good Riddance!

[Flying Pig]

I was waiting to hear an old woman yell "Eugene.... Who you talking to in there?  Get out here dinner is ready!"

[Private Investigator]

I think this speaks to the need for better senior training to promote consistency across the board.  That way we don't have a unit that lets a guy spend 5 years in the program and advance to Phase IV and only get the equivalent of Phase I experiences and training.

Exactly. You ever do an event where the Cadet Officer is suppose to be the greatest Cadet ever and they turn out just average? The CC in some Cadet Squadrons have their own ego and use Cadets as their pawns. Back when the CC could be Squadron Commander forever I knew one that would quote he raised 36 C/Lt Cols, 92 C/Majs and 300+ C/Capts. If it was not him the Cadet Program could not survive the 1960s. 

[Archer]

I think this speaks to the need for better senior training to promote consistency across the board.  That way we don't have a unit that lets a guy spend 5 years in the program and advance to Phase IV and only get the equivalent of Phase I experiences and training.

Exactly. You ever do an event where the Cadet Officer is suppose to be the greatest Cadet ever and they turn out just average? The CC in some Cadet Squadrons have their own ego and use Cadets as their pawns. Back when the CC could be Squadron Commander forever I knew one that would quote he raised 36 C/Lt Cols, 92 C/Majs and 300+ C/Capts. If it was not him the Cadet Program could not survive the 1960s. 

Promotion farms are the worst, but while the case you mentioned happens too often, another aspect is this: it's a pretty risky environment for these days for commanders to withhold cadet promotions because the cadet isn't ready for that grade.

[SarDragon]

Whyzat? If I can document my reasons, there's no reason for me to fear retribution. Tell the cadet why he/she's not been promoted. suggest some corrective action, and move on.

[Private Investigator]

I find it hard to believe that 3 squadrons all had problems with bullying, and none of them addressed it according to our rather strict stance on bullying/hazing.

Frankly, I think we are better off that this person has decided to end his membership. Based on the overall knowledge and attitude displayed in his video, I have difficulty understanding how he made it through the Mitchell. Ultimately, I think the only possible way we failed him, is if no one during his 4 year membership made any attempt to develop him beyond the narrow-minded, egotism displayed in this unfortunate video.

Good Riddance!

#1, good point, usually if you get bullied at three different Units, it could be a race or religion issue. i.e. when I was in HS we had a Jewish kid try out for the Varasity Football. Who thought his kneecap would pop in half at his first football practice. Not judging, just saying I was there.

#2, exactly, but lets look at Senior Members. Sould each SM know something about AE, CP and ES? What about a Cadet in a Cadet SQ that the CC has minimal interest in ES and believes having a 'GES' rating satisfies ES knowledge?

#3, all of CAP's resources i.e. people are valuable. If they are a problem 2B them YMMV      

[Private Investigator]

Whyzat? If I can document my reasons, there's no reason for me to fear retribution. Tell the cadet why he/she's not been promoted. suggest some corrective action, and move on.

I agree with SarDragon. Either they are or are not ready for promotion. Too many Cadets tell me they want their Mitchell by Christmas and I tell them they should get the next promotion before dreaming on what happens in the future.  :clap:

[Archer]

Whyzat? If I can document my reasons, there's no reason for me to fear retribution. Tell the cadet why he/she's not been promoted. suggest some corrective action, and move on.

In a world...

...where if you do everything right, you're safe.

[Garibaldi]

I was waiting to hear an old woman yell "Eugene.... Who you talking to in there?  Get out here dinner is ready!"

Brighton Beach Memoirs?

[Private Investigator]

Whyzat? If I can document my reasons, there's no reason for me to fear retribution. Tell the cadet why he/she's not been promoted. suggest some corrective action, and move on.

In a world...

...where if you do everything right, you're safe.

Exactly. Or as John Wayne would say, "life is tough, it is tougher if you are stupid!"