Design a new CAP-distinctive Uniform

[kd8gua]

With the sudden, but expected demise of the CSU, a large discussion has been brought up about CAP vs USAF uniforms once again. Obviously the CSU blurred the lines and made some waves that did not go over well. However, the CSU was a good idea.

I would like to pose a new topic on a... well... old topic: A CAP-distinctive uniform. Too many people seem to think that the white/gray combo isn't good because, well, gray pants come in many different forms, from cargo to khaki, wool to denim, so there is no uniformity.

Here are some questions for discussion:
Should CAP-distinctive be for ALL members, or just seniors?
Should CAP-distinctive uniforms be of a military nature or a business nature (ie. service coat cut vs. blazer cut)?
What standards should be adhered to?
Will headgear be worn (flight cap, service cap, baseball cap, beanie with propellor)?
Should this CAP-distinctive uniform be the ONLY "dress" uniform, or should golf shirts/white grays still be authorized?
Should "dress" and "utility" uniforms be abolished and one "all-purpose" uniform be created?

I'd like to hear any and all ideas. I have some amateur ability to draw things on the computer and color them, if people would like to verbalize ideas I may be able to put them into a visual perspective.

[PhoenixRisen]

we don't need another CAP distinctive uniform.  We need less of them.

Edit: Halleluja, the call has been answered.  (I just noticed the TPU's going away!) 

[Eclipse]

Please, don't.

[Major Carrales]

Here Eclipse, allow me...

So, what is your opinion of President Obama?

Catholics versus Protestants, wha'cha think?

Did Pavel A. Chekov ever command a Starship in the Federation Star Fleet?

George W. Bush, best President in 50 years...what say you?

Orthodox versus Reformed Jews, which do you prefer?

More or less CAP uniforms...(I hear pantaloons are in this year)?

Cat or Dogs...which taste better?

There, that should kill this baby pretty fast.  Care to join me in killing this? (yeah, I know I'm being a schmuck, but we don't need another UNIFORM thread.)

[NC Hokie]

With the sudden, but expected demise of the CSU, a large discussion has been brought up about CAP vs USAF uniforms once again. Obviously the CSU blurred the lines and made some waves that did not go over well. However, the CSU was a good idea.

I would like to pose a new topic on a... well... old topic: A CAP-distinctive uniform. Too many people seem to think that the white/gray combo isn't good because, well, gray pants come in many different forms, from cargo to khaki, wool to denim, so there is no uniformity.

Here are some questions for discussion:
Should CAP-distinctive be for ALL members, or just seniors?
Should CAP-distinctive uniforms be of a military nature or a business nature (ie. service coat cut vs. blazer cut)?
What standards should be adhered to?
Will headgear be worn (flight cap, service cap, baseball cap, beanie with propellor)?
Should this CAP-distinctive uniform be the ONLY "dress" uniform, or should golf shirts/white grays still be authorized?
Should "dress" and "utility" uniforms be abolished and one "all-purpose" uniform be created?

I'd like to hear any and all ideas. I have some amateur ability to draw things on the computer and color them, if people would like to verbalize ideas I may be able to put them into a visual perspective.

Here are my two cents...

1) The distinctive uniform should be restricted to senior members as long as Ma Blue continues to supply uniforms to our cadets.

2) These uniforms should be of a more military nature to reflect our status as the USAF Auxiliary.  Sure, we're technically only an auxiliary when prosecuting AFAMs, but the general public is not aware of that distinction.

3) Standards should be the same as we currently have; weight and grooming for the AF threads and no such restrictions for the corporates.  That said, it should be expected that either uniform will be worn properly or not at all.

4) I'd like to see a blue flight cap with the gray and whites.  Yes, the colors won't match but that doesn't stop us from wearing them with sage green flight suits.

5) The golf shirt combo is working/casual attire, NOT a dress uniform.

6) There is still a need for utility uniforms.

With the demise of the CSU, I'd like to see an honest effort to standardize the gray and whites with the addition of a flight cap.

[notaNCO forever]

Please not another uniform thread.

[Chief2009]

Did Pavel A. Chekov ever command a Starship in the Federation Star Fleet?

LMAO!

DN

[MIKE]

Here Eclipse, allow me...

So, what is your opinion of President Obama?

Catholics versus Protestants, wha'cha think?

Did Pavel A. Chekov ever command a Starship in the Federation Star Fleet?

George W. Bush, best President in 50 years...what say you?

Orthodox versus Reformed Jews, which do you prefer?

More or less CAP uniforms...(I hear pantaloons are in this year)?

Cat or Dogs...which taste better?

There, that should kill this baby pretty fast.  Care to join me in killing this? (yeah, I know I'm being a schmuck, but we don't need another UNIFORM thread.)

You know Maj C, I think we have suspended people for less.  If you or anyone else would like a vacation from the forums, arrangements can be made.

[billford1]

Dont worry this will topic be back again and again. Yes I'm laughing like the rest on this forum with nothing else to do.

[Major Carrales]

Here Eclipse, allow me...

So, what is your opinion of President Obama?

Catholics versus Protestants, wha'cha think?

Did Pavel A. Chekov ever command a Starship in the Federation Star Fleet?

George W. Bush, best President in 50 years...what say you?

Orthodox versus Reformed Jews, which do you prefer?

More or less CAP uniforms...(I hear pantaloons are in this year)?

Cat or Dogs...which taste better?

There, that should kill this baby pretty fast.  Care to join me in killing this? (yeah, I know I'm being a schmuck, but we don't need another UNIFORM thread.)

You know Maj C, I think we have suspended people for less.  If you or anyone else would like a vacation from the forums, arrangements can be made.

No, I'm good.  At least my point was made.  I think we can carry on without the vacation.

[Eclipse]

I have seen maybe 6 members in our wing with the $360.00 CSU jacket. I wouldn't buy it at that price. I bought the blue slacks before they amended the CSU uniform criteria to include grooming standards.

Where did you get the idea that the corporate service jacket is $360?  Its always been about $170 at VG (single source), which is not all that more that the $150 or so I spent on my USAF service coat.

And before you can make statements that appear to marginalize the CSU, you have to tell us
how many of the other people at these gathering were wearing services coats of any kind.

My experience locally has been that a number of "mid-career" CAP members were transitioning
to the CSU, especially more than a few former cadets, in recognition that they may not be
17 forever.

VG should be able to provide NHQ, and any member who asks, exactly how many of those coats
they sold, and if the number is into 5 digits, seriously reconsider this idea.

Just change the epaulets and move on.

[billford1]

If it's $150 I would maybe buy it. I think it looks great. I modified my post after I saw how the thread has gone off in the weeds. I really think the gray & white aviator or Blazer uniform should never be forced on any Cadet. I say away with the gray.

[Lt Oliv]

I have seen maybe 6 members in our wing with the $360.00 CSU jacket. I wouldn't buy it at that price. I bought the blue slacks before they amended the CSU uniform criteria to include grooming standards.

Where did you get the idea that the corporate service jacket is $360?  Its always been about $170 at VG (single source), which is not all that more that the $150 or so I spent on my USAF service coat.

And before you can make statements that appear to marginalize the CSU, you have to tell us
how many of the other people at these gathering were wearing services coats of any kind.

My experience locally has been that a number of "mid-career" CAP members were transitioning
to the CSU, especially more than a few former cadets, in recognition that they may not be
17 forever.

VG should be able to provide NHQ, and any member who asks, exactly how many of those coats
they sold, and if the number is into 5 digits, seriously reconsider this idea.

Just change the epaulets and move on.

If they changed the epaulets (or even just added a metal CAP cutout to them) and it was permitted for those who didn't meet grooming standards, I'd be behind that. Blue pants, gray pants, doesn't matter to me.

[Slim]

Here's my contribution:

• Keep all of the CSU components, including the sweaters, jackets, service jacket, etc.
• Change the nameplate and epaulets to the grey, same as worn on the AF style uniform, on both the white shirt and service jacket, and all outerwear (sweater, windbreaker, all weather coat, etc.)
  
  
• Change the sleeve braid on the service coat to a medium grey to match the epaulets and nameplate.
  
• Ditch the grey/white combo with the standard five year phaseout date

That should eliminate the concerns Ma Blue had with the current incarnation of the CSU, allow those members currently in the grey/white combo to wear them out, and give people time to start acquiring the components of the new uniform.

Amend the grooming standards for the CSU to the following:

• Allow neatly trimmed facial hair not to exceed 1/2 inch in bulk
• Hair must be neat/clean and not fall below the bottom edge of the collar or below the top of the opening in the ear.

Regarding the cost of the jacket, I looked at Vanguard earlier, and the price ranges anywhere from $176 to $194 dollars (rounded up).  Add in another $45 for pants to match, however much it costs for tailoring and sleeve braid application (one member I know paid almost as much for tailoring as he did for the jacket), and you could very easily be upwards of $300.  And that's not figuring in the cost of the nameplate, ribbons, badges, etc.  A few years back, I had come into some extra money and was considering buying the complete CSU.  By the time I added everything up, and considered the options and usage, that $500 was better spend on a suit, a sport jacket, a couple of shirts and ties at Men's Wearhouse.

BTW (and maybe this is better suited for the other thread), I understand that CAP has to buy out current inventories of discontinued items at Vanguard.  Anyone know where that money's going to come from?  It sure won't be appropriated funds.

[Cecil DP]

BTW (and maybe this is better suited for the other thread), I understand that CAP has to buy out current inventories of discontinued items at Vanguard.  Anyone know where that money's going to come from?  It sure won't be appropriated funds.

It would most likely come out of the CAP profits from all the other things they sell. I doubt that VG ever actually has more than 20-30 coats in stock at any one time. [/list]

[lordmonar]

Hunter Orange Beret.
Lime Green Unitard with Hot pink tutu.
Cowboy boots.


Edit.......RED Cowboy Boots!

[Eclipse]

Hunter Orange Beret.
Lime Green Unitard with Hot pink tutu.
Cowboy boots.

Um...are watching me...right...um...now?

[Pylon]

Hunter Orange Beret.
Lime Green Unitard with Hot pink tutu.
Cowboy boots.

That has WIN written all over it.

You must be on the same visionary team that designed the failed "bermuda shorts, tall athletic socks, and tucked-in polo" flying uniform.   

[Major Carrales]

Hunter Orange Beret.
Lime Green Unitard with Hot pink tutu.
Cowboy boots.

That has WIN written all over it.

You must be on the same visionary team that designed the failed "bermuda shorts, tall athletic socks, and tucked-in polo" flying uniform.   

"All I ask is a TALL HAT and a STAR to STEER her by." 

[Ozzy]

eh well you know we could go back to the OD uniform... it WAS kind of a field uniform and dress uniform in one... and we should still have the designs.... AND its not used anymore! Except for Hollywood of course...