Seniors Who Make Lt Col

[JAFO78]

My squadron just had a long time member (started as cadet) make LT Col. What is the percentage of Seniors who make LT Col.?

[SarDragon]

Are you talking about all LTCs, or just the folks who went all the way up through the ranks?

The percentage of the latter is probably decreasing, since it's harder to do now. As for a real percentage, it probably isn't easily determined.

[JAFO78]

In general sir. either from Cadet or from 2LT

[Spam]

Dunno the percentage, but lemme tell ya, its not as fun as you might think. I hit Lt Col at age 29, and "topped out early"...

It does seem to me (subjectively, no actual data) that there are far fewer field grades now in CAP than there were in the 1980s.

V/R
Spam

[LSThiker]

From my understanding there are no official numbers kept for those Senior Members reaching to the grade of Lt Col.  There is not even an official list of those members that have achieved Level V--Wilson Award as there is with the Gen Carl A. Spaatz Award. 

Published in 2014, NHQ released the percentages of SMs at each grade:
SM:  15%
2d Lt:  16%
1st Lt:  17%
Capt:  22%
Maj:  15%
Lt Col:  13%

My wing is relatively similar with Lt Col at 10%.

[SarDragon]

That might be a realistic overall percentage, but how many of those people got direct promotion on entry, based on military service? I know more of those than I do folks who worked their way up in CAP. We have 3 prior military LTCs in my unit.

[lordmonar]

From my understanding there are no official numbers kept for those Senior Members reaching to the grade of Lt Col.  There is not even an official list of those members that have achieved Level V--Wilson Award as there is with the Gen Carl A. Spaatz Award. 

Published in 2014, NHQ released the percentages of SMs at each grade:
SM:  15%
2d Lt:  16%
1st Lt:  17%
Capt:  22%
Maj:  15%
Lt Col:  13%

My wing is relatively similar with Lt Col at 10%.

That's of the current membership......of all people who join CAP as a Senior Member the number is probably a lot lower.
And it does not factor in how many of them came in as Lt Cols (ex military types).

And will get lower still as V Level is now required.

[JeffDG]

Interesting...if I had access to the National CAPWATCH file I could figure it out for you.

[dwb]

From a recent MER CAPWATCH download:

3,290 members with member type of "SENIOR" and status of "ACTIVE"
446 of those have a rank of "Lt Col"

So, about 13.6%. Stands to reason it'd be similar in other Regions; there's nothing unique about MER in this regard (lots of awesome things about MER in general, of course).

Those are stats for current members. The percentage of total people who join CAP and go on to become Lt Col? I'd put that in the low single digits, if not < 1%. We lose a lot of folks through attrition.

Kudos to your squadron colleague who earned the award. It's a great accomplishment.

[LSThiker]

That might be a realistic overall percentage, but how many of those people got direct promotion on entry, based on military service? I know more of those than I do folks who worked their way up in CAP. We have 3 prior military LTCs in my unit.

That's of the current membership......of all people who join CAP as a Senior Member the number is probably a lot lower.
And it does not factor in how many of them came in as Lt Cols (ex military types).

And will get lower still as V Level is now required.

Thank you.  I am well aware of the difference between all personnel that have achieved Lt Col and those that were sitting at that grade in 2014 and that it does not indicate those immediately promoted to Lt Col.  Otherwise, my comment would have contradicted itself.  Nevertheless, those figures, while not representing all personnel over the last 74 years, do give a general indication that that achievement is relatively low.  In addition, that CAP is not walking around with the majority of SMs at the grade of Lt Col. 

I agree that total number of personnel that have achieved Lt Col is probably <1% similar to that of the Spaatz.  In addition, those personnel that were once cadets and became SMs to achieve Lt Col is extremely low.  After all, I would be curious what percentage of SMs were once cadets in general, Phase 3 cadets, and Phase 4 cadets.  I am sure that exact figure does not exist, but would be willing to bet it is <0.5%.  Of course, that percentage will only become lower in the future.

[ProdigalJim]

Just as an aside, former CAP/CC Brig Gen Anderson lives just down the road from us and comes to our Tuesday nights from time to time to present cadet awards and so forth. He likes to point out that he started as a cadet and rose to CAP/CC...as did Maj Gen Vasquez, I think???

[dwb]

^ Yessir. Maj Gen Vazquez is also a former cadet.

[Garibaldi]

HWSNBN actually visited our unit, long before I joined. Spam wants the squadron patch and t-shirt we gave him back. He's even considering a special forces takedown.

Also, I see your former NatCC and raise you an astronaut. Eric Boe was a GAWG cadet in the 80s, rival units. We spent one joint meeting beating the you know what out of each other with pugil sticks. He's supposed to be semi-active out in Colorado or something, waiting for another chance to go up.

[JAFO78]

I understand about professional appointments due to degrees can toss numbers off balance.  This is my 3rd time in CAP, 3rd time as 2LT. My Commander at the time(3rd time) gave me 2LT as soon as I finished Level One. We was my commander the first time through. I was close to Captain the first time, (when I left to raise my family and work issues) never got higher then 2LT second time, but my current Commander is making me wait until time in grade for 1LT. I don't think I should have had to wait. Even through regs say he can promote me without going higher then him but Group will approve Captain. Oh well I've play this game before. I have completed everything for 1LT and working on requirements for Captain, and TIME IN GRADE....

[N6RVT]

That might be a realistic overall percentage, but how many of those people got direct promotion on entry, based on military service? I know more of those than I do folks who worked their way up in CAP. We have 3 prior military LTCs in my unit.

That's of the current membership......of all people who join CAP as a Senior Member the number is probably a lot lower.
And it does not factor in how many of them came in as Lt Cols (ex military types).

And will get lower still as V Level is now required.

Thank you.  I am well aware of the difference between all personnel that have achieved Lt Col and those that were sitting at that grade in 2014 and that it does not indicate those immediately promoted to Lt Col.  Otherwise, my comment would have contradicted itself.  Nevertheless, those figures, while not representing all personnel over the last 74 years, do give a general indication that that achievement is relatively low.  In addition, that CAP is not walking around with the majority of SMs at the grade of Lt Col. 

I agree that total number of personnel that have achieved Lt Col is probably <1% similar to that of the Spaatz.  In addition, those personnel that were once cadets and became SMs to achieve Lt Col is extremely low.  After all, I would be curious what percentage of SMs were once cadets in general, Phase 3 cadets, and Phase 4 cadets.  I am sure that exact figure does not exist, but would be willing to bet it is <0.5%.  Of course, that percentage will only become lower in the future.

I was a Mitchell cadet in the late 70's.  Did 20 years in the Army and retired as a Captain (OCS as E6) so I came into the senior side of things with that rank, however I am now up for Major via the regular system as I fulfilled the regular promotion requirements.  In my unit we have a retired Navy Commander who also has the Wilson award.  He went through the entire PD system without ever getting promoted by it at all.

I'll have to have some kind of party when I make Major - my date of rank as a Captain is 15 May 1986......

[AlphaSigOU]

I started off as a cadink in Georgia Wing in December 1977, remained a cadet earning the Mitchell (2375) and Earhart (1257) (note: this is the current numbering sequence for the awards, which began in January 1979). Topped off at cadet major before other interests (my senior year of high school and my first - failed - year of college) took over and I let my cadet membership lapse at the end of 1984. Rejoined as a senior member briefly from October 1985 to October 1988 when another set of interests (competition model rocketry) took over. After a 17-year hiatus from CAP I rejoined in October 2005 and am still active.

Reinstated as a 1st Lt in January 1986 (from my previous stint as a senior member) then promoted at the regular intervals under the old-style promotion requirements in professional development and time-in-grade; Captain in July 2007, Major in July 2010 and Lt Col in July 2014. (Lt Col made permanent in July 2015.)

Gill Robb Wilson awards started with a new numbering system when it became the Level V PD award in July 1978. (Previously, it was the Level IV PD award.) I earned award number 2901 in December 2011. I think the award numbers are in the low 3000s these days.

[THRAWN]

This would be an interesting research project. Find the number of milestone cadets who went on to become milestone SMs, number of Spaatz cadets who became Wilsons, number of members who held every possible grade in the program....I see a lot of pie charts and graphs here...and statistics and spreadsheets....

[LSThiker]

This would be an interesting research project. Find the number of milestone cadets who went on to become milestone SMs, number of Spaatz cadets who became Wilsons, number of members who held every possible grade in the program....I see a lot of pie charts and graphs here...and statistics and spreadsheets....

I am trying that for my wing.  Needless to say, it has been more difficult than I predicted.  In fact, that is why I know there is no official list of Wilson Awards.  Currently for my wing:

1 Spaatz and Wilson Award awardee from Wing
1 Spaatz cadet from my wing with a Wilson Award from another Wing
1 CoP cadet from my wing to earn the Wilson Award but she was at Region at the time
1 or 2 Spaatz cadets that earned Level IV from our wing
1 or 2 Spaatz cadets that earned Spaatz in another Wing to complete the Level IV in our Wing

[LSThiker]

Gill Robb Wilson awards started with a new numbering system when it became the Level V PD award in July 1978. (Previously, it was the Level IV PD award.) I earned award number 2901 in December 2011. I think the award numbers are in the low 3000s these days.

From talking with NHQ along with some others, the Wilson Award has been renumbered 3 times.  The first time was when it was a Level IV award (pre-1978).  When it became a Level V award, the numbering was restarted.  Then a year or so later it was restarted.  The current numbering system is that last renumbering.  This is why NHQ does not keep an official list of Wilson Awardees.

[Гугл переводчик]

Would the legislative folks fall into the statistics? From what I understand, they are given Lt Col right away. Example: If you look up the governor of my state, he's a Lt Col