CAP CAC Card Poll

[a2capt]

Just like "Automated Teller Machine Machine". As plain as Scotch Tape and Jello, it's well set and the mold is no longer necessary.

[SARDOC]

We do not need a CAC card.  However, I would like to see the Civil Air Patrol move to an identification card in lieu of a membership card that is more compliant with the requirements set forth in Homeland Security Presidential Directive 12.

[abdsp51]

Cadet Rainey,

I highly encourage you to stop posting for awhile and learn something.  Your postings are not giving you any credibility at all.  Take the advice given to you by members here. 

To the original topic, there is currently no need for us to have a CAC card in any aspect.  Now if you have NIPR net then you can jump through hoops for a VOLAC card but that's about it. 

[lordmonar]

We do not need a CAC card.  However, I would like to see the Civil Air Patrol move to an identification card in lieu of a membership card that is more compliant with the requirements set forth in Homeland Security Presidential Directive 12.

Other then not defining "is strongly resistant to identity fraud, tampering, counterfeiting, and terrorist exploitation" how is our CAP ID cards not meeting with Directive 12?

[NCRblues]

Mr. ILikePlanes, I strongly suggest you take a page out of my book.  Mouth...shut, ears (or in this case eyes)...open.  You learn a LOT more that way.

That's not the way I do it at school. I don't listen to the teacher most of the time, and figure it out myself. Then I find errors that the teacher made, and get it correct, and get good grades. Mostly in math and history, I sleep in history and get good grades, while in math I draw throughout the class and get good grades. The other teachers will kill you, except for in science. In science you are given instructions on what to do and then you do it.

This is a troll. A very good one at that. Just stop responding to him.

[Devil Doc]

Where I Work we have a CAC, there is no Geneva convention, rank etc. Prolly donsnt help that I work for the Govment.

[Critical AOA]

I was not familiar with Homeland Security Presidential Directive 12 so I looked it up.  From what I read it pertains to Federal employees and contractors and we are neither.  So why should our membership card need to conform? 

[Devil Doc]

I was not familiar with Homeland Security Presidential Directive 12 so I looked it up.  From what I read it pertains to Federal employees and contractors and we are neither.  So why should our membership card need to conform?

HSPD 12? I know all about it Anywho, what if we are working with FEMA and AUX ON, then would HSPD 12 Apply

[Eclipse]

CAP is very clear that we are never employees or contractors.

[Shuman 14]

CAC IDs or PIV Cards as civilian agencies call them, are the future.

I've worked as a contractor for a couple of Federal Government agencies and everyone is going to a CAC/PIV type card for ease of identification instead of 40 plus different IDs. As someone pointed out already, there are several Homeland Security Presidential Directives that address this.

Heck even private citizens can get one by applying for a Transportation Workers Identification Credential (TWIC Card) and forking over the $100.

USCGAux's version of a CAC is in the works as we speak, so why must the CAP be different?

BTW, just because you have a CAC/PIV/TWIC card doesn't mean you have instant access to Government systems, it just means IF your Service or Agency wants you to have access to system, it's easier for them to turn you on. Conversely, just as easy to shut you off too. 

[lordmonar]

If and when the Federal Government thinks that we need to conform to Directive 12......they will tell us.

Having said that.   The Gate guards told us a couple of weeks ago that Sept 1 our CAP ID will not be good enough to get onto base.

NOW DON'T GET YOUR PANTIES IN A WAD........

CAP is already in coordination through the Region Liaison and CAP-USAF to work out this issue.   I have nothing else to contribute to the discussion as we have been told "we are working it....and Y'all don't be running down to Pass and ID to get DBID cards."

[Shuman 14]

We do not need a CAC card.  However, I would like to see the Civil Air Patrol move to an identification card in lieu of a membership card that is more compliant with the requirements set forth in Homeland Security Presidential Directive 12.

Other then not defining "is strongly resistant to identity fraud, tampering, counterfeiting, and terrorist exploitation" how is our CAP ID cards not meeting with Directive 12?

Because a gate guard or other Federal security officer can't insert it into a CAC/PIV/TWIC reader and instantaneously tell if its real or fake or valid or expired.

That's one of the reasons that they did away with the vehicle stickers, so you have to present a scan-able ID.

[lordmonar]

We do not need a CAC card.  However, I would like to see the Civil Air Patrol move to an identification card in lieu of a membership card that is more compliant with the requirements set forth in Homeland Security Presidential Directive 12.

Other then not defining "is strongly resistant to identity fraud, tampering, counterfeiting, and terrorist exploitation" how is our CAP ID cards not meeting with Directive 12?

Because a gate guard or other Federal security officer can't insert it into a CAC/PIV/TWIC reader and instantaneously tell if its real or fake or valid or expired.

That's one of the reasons that they did away with the vehicle stickers, so you have to present a scan-able ID.

Actually they did away with the stickers because the DOD got a really really bad bunch of them 6-7 years ago....and then some bright boy in Robbins AFB said "why do we issue these stupid things anyway....we are doing 100% checks".

The Scanable ID thing only came about a couple of years ago.

Currently the USAF is going to DBIDs (or something like that) for all it's base contractors who don't rate CAC cards.  CAP is currently working with CAP-USAF to work a solution.

And yes I would assume that that solution would meet Directive 12 standards.

[dwb]

Also, the car decals made you a target. It's like having a bumper sticker that says "Ask me about the sensitive information I have access to!"

I used to have one of those novelty Area 51 access stickers on my car. The gate guards usually chuckled at that one. That was pre-9/11; I doubt they would laugh now.

[RiverAux]

USCGAux's version of a CAC is in the works as we speak, so why must the CAP be different?

Haven't heard anything about that.  However, there are a decent number of Auxies that need to have access to CG computer systems for various reasons, so it makes some sense that it is available to them.  Don't think most need them though.  Think I've had my Aux ID card checked once in almost 10 years. 

[SarDragon]

Over the years (a whole bunch of them) I've used a DD Form 2N, a DD Form 1173, and a DD Form 2 (Retired) to get on base. My vehicles have also have base stickers. I do not recall any instance where there was any need for the advanced features of a CAC. As noted above, my need to present a CAP ID card has been minimal, and again, not requiring those advanced features.

We have enough budget problems now. Why do we need to add the additional expense of some kool thing that we really don't need? I would guess that fewer than 20% of our membership meets on military bases, and most probably have reasonable arrangements for entry, so I really don't see any advantage to having a CAC.

[Critical AOA]

Over the years (a whole bunch of them) I've used a DD Form 2N, a DD Form 1173, and a DD Form 2 (Retired) to get on base. My vehicles have also have base stickers. I do not recall any instance where there was any need for the advanced features of a CAC. As noted above, my need to present a CAP ID card has been minimal, and again, not requiring those advanced features.

We have enough budget problems now. Why do we need to add the additional expense of some kool thing that we really don't need. I would guess that fewer than 20% of our membership meets on military bases, and most probably have reasonable arrangements for entry, so I really don't see any advantage to having a CAC.

Well perhaps...
because that is what gets some CAP folks excited or...
because Big Blue has them and we want to be like them or..
because they make us look like official gubment folks.

Take your pick.

[Shuman 14]

USCGAux's version of a CAC is in the works as we speak, so why must the CAP be different?

Haven't heard anything about that.  However, there are a decent number of Auxies that need to have access to CG computer systems for various reasons, so it makes some sense that it is available to them.  Don't think most need them though.  Think I've had my Aux ID card checked once in almost 10 years.

Which was nearly the same as the old green/red IDs of the day... except it was blue.

Like I said, a CAC card is just an ID, until you turn on the credentials in the chip.

[Devil Doc]

USCGAux's version of a CAC is in the works as we speak, so why must the CAP be different?

Haven't heard anything about that.  However, there are a decent number of Auxies that need to have access to CG computer systems for various reasons, so it makes some sense that it is available to them.  Don't think most need them though.  Think I've had my Aux ID card checked once in almost 10 years.

Which was nearly the same as the old green/red IDs of the day... except it was blue.

Like I said, a CAC card is just an ID, until you turn on the credentials in the chip.

Ya trying to do what I do as a job, and my "CREDENTIALS" on my CAC seems to not work, great. Its bad enough I need to remember 5 diff passwords to even get on my work computer and use the programs needed to work. When the credentials expire, its a PITA to redo everything.

[Slim]

Actually they did away with the stickers because the DOD got a really really bad bunch of them 6-7 years ago....and then some bright boy in Robbins AFB said "why do we issue these stupid things anyway....we are doing 100% checks".

The Scanable ID thing only came about a couple of years ago.

Currently the USAF is going to DBIDs (or something like that) for all it's base contractors who don't rate CAC cards.  CAP is currently working with CAP-USAF to work a solution.

And yes I would assume that that solution would meet Directive 12 standards.

Regarding DBIDS, I was speaking with a friend of mine a couple of weeks ago about this.  He's a MSgt in security forces at the local ANG base, and this topic came up.  They haven't fully implemented it there yet, but most of the pieces are pretty much in place.  CAP members with a steady need for base access (wing HQ and the squadron on base) will be able to get DBIDS cards.

What he tells me they've already done for the civilian agencies on base (there is a CBP air wing on base, plus a Border Patrol sector headquarters) is that they've incorporated the DBIDS required info into the bar codes already in place on their agency ID card.  The gate guard scans the bar code, as long as the ID is valid/current, off they go.  He also mentioned that it wouldn't be too hard for NHQ to incorporate the needed DBIDS info into the bar codes they print on our ID cards.  That is, if someone was able to do the legwork to coordinate it.  Shouldn't be too hard on CAP's end as someone-either at NHQ, or probably at the vendor-already has to program our CAPID number into the bar code.