Tents for Ground Teams

[Jerry Jacobs]

Quick Question;

The packing list for 72 hour pack says you must bring shelter material and a tent.  I'm thinking that things like a tent and sleeping pad are not really needed.  When I went to NESA we spent overnight in shelters and that worked out pretty well for me.  So do we really need a tent and a bed roll when I will usually be in a forest and be making a hammock shelter.

Thanks,


C/SMSgt Jerry Jacobs

[MIKE]

What do you do when you are stuck out in a field with no trees to tie your shelter to... particularly if you are bivouacking in a mission base area... Maybe for a few days?  IIRC this is the point of the 72 hour pack versus the fast and light 24 hour pack.

[N Harmon]

Hi Jerry. I am not sure what part of the country you live in, but I live in Michigan. And while an improvised shelter would be okay here from about June to September, you would really be in a pickle spending a night in one here in February.



Now, I will be the first to admit that a one-size fits all equipment list doesn't make sense for the national CAP. I mean, the same packing list for a GTM in Florida and another in Alaska? Because of that, I think the list can be somewhat flexible.

[CAPSGT]

Shelter material should be in the 24 hour gear, no?  That's to carry with you as a fast shelter to set up in a pinch.  I carry a tarp for this.  When I go to set up my creature comforts tent back at base, I use the tarp from my 24 hour gear as a ground cloth for my tent.

As for actually using either, I've never had to set up a shelter in the middle of the woods.  Heck, the closest I've ever come to that is one time setting up a tent in a cow pasture that was used as a staging area for a missing person search.  Other than that, I've stayed in a hotel once, inside mission base a couple times, an airport terminal, and my own home several times (when either I lived close to base or had to drive home to swap team members out).

In other parts of the country it may be different, but in this part of the country (Maryland), you are never so far from a road that you can't get back to the van and drive to civilization.  It's typically much quicker and easier than setting up a natural shelter.

[cnitas]

  It's typically much quicker and easier than setting up a natural shelter.

Maybe I am just getting old, but you will also be much more rested and ready for the next day if you sleep in relative comfort instead of a makeshift shelter in the woods. 

To me as a Leader and GBD, that is more important from a safety pov, as well as a 'good decision making' point of view.  Remember, on a REDCAP, we are not playing boyscout, we are trying to find the victims as quickly as possible.  Camping in general is not quick and it is not very restfull.

[BigMojo]

Here's how I roll...


Packs down to the size of a big loaf of bread. Give me two trees and I can be ready to sleep in 10min. MAX. Has a rainfly that drapes over and stakes out.

[cnitas]

Give me two trees and I can be ready to sleep in 10min. MAX. Has a rainfly that drapes over and stakes out.

Yeah, but what about the rest of your team? They all going to be ready for lights out in 10 min?  I have a 1-man bikers tent I use.  It sets up in 60 seconds.  It is rare indeed that I get to just crash after setting up my tent.

My experience with cadets is that you are lucky to get a camp setup in under an hour.
We have a SAREX this Friday where everyone is camping.  I will get to see how fast our team gets setup. 

[davedove]

Give me two trees and I can be ready to sleep in 10min. MAX. Has a rainfly that drapes over and stakes out.

Yeah, but what about the rest of your team? They all going to be ready for lights out in 10 min?  I have a 1-man bikers tent I use.  It sets up in 60 seconds.  It is rare indeed that I get to just crash after setting up my tent.

My experience with cadets is that you are lucky to get a camp setup in under an hour.
We have a SAREX this Friday where everyone is camping.  I will get to see how fast our team gets setup. 

Well, let's see.  The standard for setting up a shelter is under 30 minutes.  And onto that getting your gear inside and your sleeping bag and pad laid out.  Plus, extra time for some item that a person can't seem to find.  Extra time for cadets being cadets (and some seniors for that matter).

I don't think an hour is enough time.

Oh yeah, I forgot the time required to fire up the generator for my portable TV.

Of course, if we can get to a nearby hotel, I can be set up in about 5 minutes.

[BigMojo]

Give me two trees and I can be ready to sleep in 10min. MAX. Has a rainfly that drapes over and stakes out.

Yeah, but what about the rest of your team? They all going to be ready for lights out in 10 min?  I have a 1-man bikers tent I use.  It sets up in 60 seconds.  It is rare indeed that I get to just crash after setting up my tent.

My experience with cadets is that you are lucky to get a camp setup in under an hour.
We have a SAREX this Friday where everyone is camping.  I will get to see how fast our team gets setup. 

With my Ground Team (There are 12 of us, 6 cadets) most of us use hammocks like mine, the remainder have ultralight two-man tents. YMMV but my team is highly mobile, and carry light. Just because I can be lights-out in 10min, doesn't mean I am obviously. But we made it a priority to be low impact, fast up, and fast struck.

[davedove]

Give me two trees and I can be ready to sleep in 10min. MAX. Has a rainfly that drapes over and stakes out.

Yeah, but what about the rest of your team? They all going to be ready for lights out in 10 min?  I have a 1-man bikers tent I use.  It sets up in 60 seconds.  It is rare indeed that I get to just crash after setting up my tent.

My experience with cadets is that you are lucky to get a camp setup in under an hour.
We have a SAREX this Friday where everyone is camping.  I will get to see how fast our team gets setup. 

With my Ground Team (There are 12 of us, 6 cadets) most of us use hammocks like mine, the remainder have ultralight two-man tents. YMMV but my team is highly mobile, and carry light. Just because I can be lights-out in 10min, doesn't mean I am obviously. But we made it a priority to be low impact, fast up, and fast struck.

Of course, I also see that you're in Ft. Lauderdale.  I don't imagine you need the gear to keep warm anywhere near as often as we would.

But, that only makes sense.  Every team has to adapt to their own environment.

[Stonewall]

Back in the day (a Wednesday, by the way), before there were national standards on what to carry, I only carried a mil-spec poncho and 550 cord for shelter.  And I'd only carry a fartsack during winter time.

My poncho hooch would generally look something like this:



Then, as I grew up, got a pay check, moved to a much colder environment, I spent some hard earned cash and bought a Goretex Bivvy shelter (basically a one man tent).

Here's me in those younger years as a new 1st Lt (circa '94) with my Goretex shelter:



Then, I realized I need something with some room to move.  Those bivy shelters can be quite chlosterphobic for a growing boy.  So I moved up to a lightweight tent made by Mountain Hardware, something like this:



Then, I needed something a little less colorful and learnd that Eureka made military tents:



As for a sleeping bag, I used to only carry an EMS down sleeping bag.  Then, I needed something a little more versatile and found the modular sleep system.  I highly recommend this if you can afford it.

[BigMojo]

Of course, I also see that you're in Ft. Lauderdale.  I don't imagine you need the gear to keep warm anywhere near as often as we would.

But, that only makes sense.  Every team has to adapt to their own environment.

Exactly...I'd never sleep in a hammock below about 40deg...which it almost never gets down here. I'm originally from Wisconsin, so, I'm no stranger to the cold, but it is funny to watch hats and gloves and Gore-text parkas come out when it dips below 50....

[Stonewall]

Real quick, just to clarify something (got a PM from a buddy), the picture of me above is from 1994 when we wore embroidered "CAP" cutouts on the left collar of the BDUs.  That is not a jacked up 1st Lt bar.

Here is a closer, but blurrier, image.

[_]

Give me two trees and I can be ready to sleep in 10min. MAX. Has a rainfly that drapes over and stakes out.

Yeah, but what about the rest of your team? They all going to be ready for lights out in 10 min?  I have a 1-man bikers tent I use.  It sets up in 60 seconds.  It is rare indeed that I get to just crash after setting up my tent.

My experience with cadets is that you are lucky to get a camp setup in under an hour.
We have a SAREX this Friday where everyone is camping.  I will get to see how fast our team gets setup. 

Well, let's see.  The standard for setting up a shelter is under 30 minutes.  And onto that getting your gear inside and your sleeping bag and pad laid out.  Plus, extra time for some item that a person can't seem to find.  Extra time for cadets being cadets (and some seniors for that matter).

I don't think an hour is enough time.

Oh yeah, I forgot the time required to fire up the generator for my portable TV.

Of course, if we can get to a nearby hotel, I can be set up in about 5 minutes.

I'm waiting for the cadet that brings the 10 person tent to house him and his buddies but ends up forgetting a tent pole and they spend the entire night trying to jerry rig something before finding the other pole in the bottom of the stuff sack. 

Looking at the photo of the bivouac site there is a nice little island in the middle of the river.  I may try to set up camp there.   Ought to be nice and quite out there.

As for a hotel room, those are for the aircrew going out there not us ground people.  I offered to loan a tent to any aircrew person but there were no takers.

[DNall]

I don't "camp." I'm in the Army. They force me to stay out in the woods for a few days a couple times a year. No showers, shelter is what I carry several miles in on my back.

24hr gear is an LBV. That's the vest/harness system you wear either all the time or at least whenever you get out the car. It doesn't have shelter material.

72hr gear is not for pulling out of the van & establishing a camp site next to it. It's for putting on your back & walking far enough away that you can't get back before dark. Really, it's made for moving on foot 36hrs into the woods & then 36hrs back unless resupplied (by helo) so you can continue on indefinitely. You need to be able to walk several miles with that stuff, not barely be able to drag it in & out of the vehicle.

With the experience of actually carrying such a load several miles on a semi-regular basis, I'll tell you I carry as absolutely little as humanly possible. I do the poncho half shelter like stonewall showed above, and got my 4-piece sleep system that'll keep me dry & warm down to at least zero. Plus a ground tarp, poncho liner, and sleeping pad. Comes with a nice big bug net too. I got no need for anything else, and no desire to carry the weight.

In the real world, I'm going to sleep in an FBO/base or out in my truck. If that's not going to work then I'm going to ask about an empty hanger, then I'm going to call in cots & GP tents from the national guard. I don't need any kind of tent. What I need is the above gear for emergency shelter when I get caught away from civilization on foot and can't get safely back in the dark.

[Stonewall]

^^^Never under estimate the Army Guard.  One time, I threw my Eureka tent in my ruck sack during drill weekend "just in case" and was pretty happy when we were in an "admin" bivouac.  When everyone else was in their hooch I popped my tent up in 3 minutes and stayed dry the whole night.

These days, some high quality tents will weigh in at less than 3 lbs.  That's 3 lbs I'd be willing to hump on my back to add some creature comforts during inclimate weather.

[BigMojo]

My Hammock, with Fly and Bug Net weighs in at 2.6lbs, and in a compression sack is 15" long tube, 8" in diameter...always have room for that, and comfort-wise sure beats the ground.

[DNall]

^^^Never under estimate the Army Guard.  One time, I threw my Eureka tent in my ruck sack during drill weekend "just in case" and was pretty happy when we were in an "admin" bivouac.  When everyone else was in their hooch I popped my tent up in 3 minutes and stayed dry the whole night.

These days, some high quality tents will weigh in at less than 3 lbs.  That's 3 lbs I'd be willing to hump on my back to add some creature comforts during inclimate weather.

Granted, but I use my guard gear for OCS & CAP. Not worth digging the CAP stuff out after the last move. I don't have a say in the OCS packing list, so have to go with it.

Far as creature comforts... if I were camping that'd be one thing. But emergency shelter, I'm looking to collapse from exhaustion & be generally protected from the enviro till I wake up & move out again. That's very different from what I want out of a base camp. Like I said, for a base camp I'm calling in resources if there isn't infrastructure in place. I give due credit to being able to do that faster than the classic hooch, but I like the adaptability of the hooch setup too.

[JesusFreak]

Here in Las Vegas, the closest thing we have to trees is Mount Charleston, barely But I really doubt we would get a mission to go there, unless it's a SAR. Either than that, we have deserts, mountains, and lots of cacti. A tent would really help if there is anyone who lives in the desert, unless you want to take your chances by setting up your shelter near a cactus.

[flyerthom]

Here in Las Vegas, the closest thing we have to trees is Mount Charleston, barely But I really doubt we would get a mission to go there, unless it's a SAR. Either than that, we have deserts, mountains, and lots of cacti. A tent would really help if there is anyone who lives in the desert, unless you want to take your chances by setting up your shelter near a cactus.

Don't forget, we could, and have been called to Lake Tahoe and Ely. Elko and Winnnemcua are rather snowy in January. Also a call for assist in Northern AZ is always a distinct possibility. Flagstaff and East get a might bit cold in the winter.

[JesusFreak]

Here in Las Vegas, the closest thing we have to trees is Mount Charleston, barely But I really doubt we would get a mission to go there, unless it's a SAR. Either than that, we have deserts, mountains, and lots of cacti. A tent would really help if there is anyone who lives in the desert, unless you want to take your chances by setting up your shelter near a cactus.

Don't forget, we could, and have been called to Lake Tahoe and Ely. Elko and Winnnemcua are rather snowy in January. Also a call for assist in Northern AZ is always a distinct possibility. Flagstaff and East get a might bit cold in the winter.

True. I forgot about that. But you want to think on all three sides when your going on a mission, if there will be trees, and if there are, what happens if there aren't, any good trees around your area, and if there aren't any trees. So for those who live in areas that have mostly desert with some trees in an area near, it would be a good idea to put a small tent in your 72 hr pack just in case, like the one in The Hock Shop that is a two-man tent. You can use any normal poncho, but if you don't have trees to hang it up by, then it's only good for when it rains, if it rains that is.

[maverik]

how do you guys fold and carry your tents with poles? I have a standard army pup tent,but I have no clue how to pack it up so i can carry it at least six miles.

[Stonewall]

I have a standard army pup tent,but I have no clue how to pack it up so i can carry it at least six miles.

Step 1:  Get rid of standard army pup tent.

Step 2:  Learn to build a quality hooch with a mil-spec poncho (2 is better).

Step 3:  Mow lawns to earn money to buy a better tent.

[maverik]

Okay I can make the hooch but before I get rid of the tent may I ask why? Want tent would you suggest?

[Stonewall]

First, is this what you're calling an Army Pup Tent?



If so, it's actually called a "shelter half" because it's a 2-man system, each man carries half the tent.  Only time I stayed in one of these was at Army Basic Training and Infantry School. 

Why not?

1.  There is no bottom to the "tent".
2.  It's a heavy canvas.
3.  It's connected at the top by snaps that DO NOT keep out rain or snow
4.  It's bulky.
5.  You can have the same amount, if not more, protection and comfort from a poncho hooch which weighs about 1/3 of the weight.

There are lots and lots of different tents out there.  Just go to Gander Mountain, Dick's, EMS,  or REI (or whatever outdoor store you like) and take a look.  As a ground team member, you want something lightweight and durable as well as versatile. 

I have 3 tents and I think I showed pictures of them on page one of this thread.

I strongly suggest a tent with a good fly.  A fly is an outer shell that is water and wind proof.  You can put it on or keep it off depending on the weather.

Here is a picture of a tent with a full fly.

[Stonewall]

I just checked out REI and remembered that quality tents can cost quite a bit.  The Mountain Hardware tent that I carry most of the time costs about $325, but it is high quality and very light weight.  It's called a Skyledge.

Here is an awesome tent for $179.

[_]

First, is this what you're calling an Army Pup Tent?

I used shelter halves for several years.  Had fun with the condensation, needing to dig a trench around it when expecting rain, horrible ventilation, etc.  They are pretty nice in the winter though because they were a thicker material.  Several of the people in my old squadron had them.  During a winter training activity we put them all together and made a pill box type structure.  While everyone else was freezing we were quite comfortable. 

Ah the good ol days before I got a job and discovered REI.

Also the importance of a good tent with a good fly can not be overstated.  At a SAREX last weekend we had a lot of rain overnight.  By the morning there were quite a few indoor swimming pools. 

[Stonewall]

Also the importance of a good tent with a good fly can not be overstated.  At a SAREX last weekend we had a lot of rain overnight.  By the morning there were quite a few indoor swimming pools. 

+1

That last tent I bought, the Mountain Hardware lightweight tent, which costs about $300, was well worth the money.  In Virginia (Quantico, Ft. AP Hill, Ft. Pickett, Ft. Belvoir, Shenandoah Mtns, Massanutten Mtns and the like, got cold and wet.  that tent was so perfect because it was mostly mesh, but when I put the practically fully enclosed fly on, I didn't even know what the weather was like outside, nor did I care.

A good tent with a good fly can mean the difference in quality of rest you get, which could ultimately make huge difference on your physical stamina for day 2 or 3 of a multiple day mission.

[SarDragon]

My first time ever camping, I was on a w/e m/c trip in Japan, and slept in one of those shelter half things (solo). With a little advice from the Marine folks in the group, I actually had a pleasant, dry night. Soon thereafter, I acquired a better tent, and was even more comfortable.

[floridacyclist]

My kids and I got all of ours shelters for the bike ride from  www.hennesseyhammock.com as a partial sponsorship. Throw in a couple of hiking poles or saplings and you can make a half-useful tent out of it if nothing else is available.

Upside is that my back doesn't hurt in the slightest when I get up in the morning. Downside is that it's cold as all get-out unless you wrap a poncho liner or other insulation around it from the outside where your weight doesn't crush it flat. Oh yeah, and having my feet elevated after a long day standing causes the fluid to drain back into my body and makes me have to climb out every few hours to commune with nature.

[RiverAux]

Back in my skinnier days I used to do a lot of backcountry hiking for work and I managed pretty well with regular backpacking equipment, so thats what I've got in my CAP gear now.  You couldn't pay me enough to use an Army shelter half. 

Except for field training exercises, I bet it has been over a decade since anyone in my wing has had to hike away from the vehicle and camp out during an actual mission in the state.  I bet our ground teams would get quite a nasty surprise if they actually needed to do it for real. 

[Stonewall]

Except for field training exercises, I bet it has been over a decade since anyone in my wing has had to hike away from the vehicle and camp out during an actual mission in the state.  I bet our ground teams would get quite a nasty surprise if they actually needed to do it for real. 

Hopefully they're still training to such things (hiking, camping away from their vehicles, etc).  I personally have never had to camp away from a mission base.  In fact, only 2 or 3 times have I had to stay overnight at a mission base on extended missions over 21 years.  But, you still gotta train and have exercises that simulate the need for such capabilities.  The time to learn whether or not you can hump a pack with all your 24/72 hr gear is not during a REDCAP.

[floridacyclist]

It's not just about the missions or what it takes to prosecute one. More than likely, if I'm on a real mission (like in a hurricane zone), I'm going to be in my popup along with any team members I can fit in there with me comfortably...the rest can sleep in Le Hotel Du Ford. At that point, I'm more interested in getting quality rest so I can operate at my best, not showing how much I can take it like a cadet.

Let's be honest, for many of us camping is fun. If taking the cadinks camping with poncho shelters and hammocks while using map, compasses, and pacecounts to plow through two miles of palmettos to find geocaches as a team teaches them about leadership, teamwork, personal challenge, and pride in accomplishment, then I am all for it...which is why we spent this past weekend doing exactly that.  You can't learn these lessons from a book.

It is worth the itching in unmentionable places from all the bug bites to see them having fun, feeling proud, and being interested in CAP. We had even more of a payoff last night on the way home when we had a chance to talk about the need to rise above mediocrity and set the standards for the other cadets in all areas, not just ES....test scores, uniform wear, military bearing whatever...and in the interest of uniformity and team (squadron) cohesion, there are no orange ballcaps or white pistol belts allowed at the squadron meetings.

Personally, I think that the vast majority of saves in the ES program come not from the victims that have been rescued, but from the cadets that have found some sort of purpose in being in CAP.

[BigMojo]

Hopefully they're still training to such things (hiking, camping away from their vehicles, etc). 

Our last SAREX was an 8 mile (each way) hike out in the everglades off the Florida Trail. No vehicles. Out friday night, back Sunday afternoon. The cadets were troopers, it was the Sr's that were whining the most. I think 2Lt Rudin can back me up on that one!

[Stonewall]

Hopefully they're still training to such things (hiking, camping away from their vehicles, etc). 

Our last SAREX was an 8 mile (each way) hike out in the everglades off the Florida Trail. No vehicles. Out friday night, back Sunday afternoon. The cadets were troopers, it was the Sr's that were whining the most. I think 2Lt Rudin can back me up on that one!

Awesome!

[RiverAux]

Except for field training exercises, I bet it has been over a decade since anyone in my wing has had to hike away from the vehicle and camp out during an actual mission in the state.  I bet our ground teams would get quite a nasty surprise if they actually needed to do it for real. 

Hopefully they're still training to such things (hiking, camping away from their vehicles, etc). 

Its getting better.  Most of our current wing leadership is a little more understanding of what it takes to actually train ground teams and we've had some good stuff lately. 

[gistek]

Instead of a sleeping bag, I carry a fleece bag liner and a "space blanket" emergency sleeping bag. I've used them in a poncho tent in below freezing weather. I think the low was upper 20's, so it wasn't much below freezing, but there was snow on my shelter in the morning. The only time I strap my mummy bag on top of my 72hr pack is the deep winter.

I did carry a tent for a while, but it wasn't worth the extra weight. One poncho as a ground cloth and the other held up with my walking stick at one end works just fine.

Off Deep Woods sprayed liberally where the top poncho tucks under the ground poncho and the ground poncho hole works just as good as mosquito netting.

[ThorntonOL]

The army tent in one of the above pictures is what our local 4-H sleep under here in upper PA. (For camp that is.)
Yes I live in upper PA just over the border from NY and I go to a squadron about an hour away when there is one a half hour away.
I have ties to the unit otherwise I probably would go the closer one.

[ThorntonOL]

What is a good tent to get that would work in the continental US? Literally anywhere in the US.

[IceNine]

Pretty much the coolest GT Tent on the planet.

Plenty of room for you, you're gear and a little extra.  Has both matched footprints and insulated paw print.  Inflatable, and has replacement reservoirs instead of the poles needing patched.  5 1/2 pounds and 7"x14" when packed.  Pricey but high on my list of things to pay for very soon

I have seen one of these in person, its pretty amazing.

[hatentx]

well my two cents is that 2 ponchos and 2 tent poles are the best thing.  I hate the army shelter halves.  One less thing to carry when the ponchos are lighter and serve more than one use.  keep you dry, keep a PT out of the sun and slow heat sickness.  In the worse case it can be used as a make shift stretcher.  Only thing I could think of that would be better is having panels on one side and it would serve even more.  Now this is in Texas and those of you in the cold I am sure you need a little more protection but hey adjust fire and move on.

[mikeylikey]

Yes I live in upper PA just over the border from NY and I go to a squadron about an hour away when there is one a half hour away.

You CANT do that!  You are supposed to be a member of PAWG.  You just don't want to wear the orange ball cap, do you?!?!?!   

[Tubacap]

Pretty much the coolest GT Tent on the planet.

Plenty of room for you, you're gear and a little extra.  Has both matched footprints and insulated paw print.  Inflatable, and has replacement reservoirs instead of the poles needing patched.  5 1/2 pounds and 7"x14" when packed.  Pricey but high on my list of things to pay for very soon

I have seen one of these in person, its pretty amazing.

That is definitely the coolest tent I have ever seen.  Unfortunately, my wife was there when I saw it and got excited.  I was immediately denied. 

[ThorntonOL]

I used to live in NY and about 4 years ago. (About the time I became a Senior Member) my family moved over the border. Plus there are no units closer then two hours. (In PA) ((The NY ones are closer.))

[FlyingTerp]

I bought one of these from sportsmansguide.com

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=418291

Obviously, a fair weather, summer tent.

I haven't tried it yet, but for the price and size/weight I figured it was worth a try.

[JohnKachenmeister]

On actual missions, I have only had to stay out in the field once.

It was in Ohio, late fall, so it was not real cold.  There was a crash, and CAP was called in to locate it.  The aircrew spotted the wreckage, and the Highway Patrol got there before the Ground Team I was on was even fully loaded up.  (In fairness, the HP Station was about two miles south of the crash site.  They actually could have walked there and still beat us to the crash).

When the CAP team arrived, the Medics had already removed the survivor.  We waited with the HP for about an hour or so until the Coroner released the dead body, that of a 12-year old girl, the daughter of the pilot.

Once the body was gone, the HP said "Hasta la Vista, Baby!" and left us to protect the scene for the FAA/NTSB.  We pitched tents, set up a CQ/sentry schedule, and settled in for the night.

Frankly, for the few times we actually sleep under tentage, I can't see spending a lot of $$ for a tent.

[IceNine]

My wing tends to negotiate camp sites much better than actual facilities, so a decent tent is a must if you're a ground pounder of any type.  Likewise however there is usually the option of a hotel and on rare occasions college dorms, boy scout camps, and the like.  But again that is more of an exception than a rule, and I don't know many cadets that can foot the bill even if reimbursement is possible for a hotel. 

Which of course leaves some number of unfortunate seniors sleeping on the ground to take care of the cadets

[Thor]

Personally, I hate carrying a tent and sleeping pad. I have sleeping bag that packs down really good, but I hate the extra weight of the tent. Usually I will take a tarp and a couple milspec type ponchos so I can make a shelter if the weather is bad or if I'm really out in the boonies. If I'm in a park or something similar for a SAREX, I'll usually find a pavillion or something where I can spend the night; I'll lay down a tarp and use a camelbak as a pillow, it works well because you don't have to worry about packing anything up. I bought a Eureka single person tent yesterday; it's pretty compact and lightweight, so I'll be taking it along with me from now on.

[Al Sayre]

I've got a 2 man Bivy similar to this but it's a bit wider, floor is about 36" wide.  I've used it on a low 30's night and it was pretty comfortable...

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=328395

[isuhawkeye]

This is what I use for a bivy.  It's waterproof, light and you can get it for around 30.00 at a surplus store. 

With the nice handles you can use it as a hammock.

[_]

With the nice handles you can use it as a hammock.

or use it for it's intended use as a body bag for when a cadet annoys you a little too much

[isuhawkeye]

 :clap:

[JoeTomasone]

Well, just to resurrect this...

I have 2 CAP tents.


One is the "Chateau Tomasone" for regular bivouacs where the car is nearby.  It's a 6 man tent that comfortably holds an air mattress, gear, and a chair/table (if needed).  Obviously, this doesn't get carried.

For the 72 hour pack, I spent some $$$ (during that heady period of time BEFORE the economy went down the toilet!) and bought a very lightweight 1-man hiker tent -- a claustrophobic special to be sure -- but even on the ground it will beat getting eaten alive by flying or crawling things. 

[notaNCO forever]

 This is what I use.http://images.ems.com/media/images/products/210/21024/2102400/210240020/210240020_200-a_v1_m56577569830665853.jpg

I hiked with it for a week and had no problems with it.

[davidsinn]

Quick Question;

The packing list for 72 hour pack says you must bring shelter material and a tent.  I'm thinking that things like a tent and sleeping pad are not really needed.  When I went to NESA we spent overnight in shelters and that worked out pretty well for me.  So do we really need a tent and a bed roll when I will usually be in a forest and be making a hammock shelter.

Thanks,


C/SMSgt Jerry Jacobs

A poncho shelter is really all you need. A tent is overkill unless you are sleeping next to your car.