MK4 Sniffer Saves The Day!

[Fubar]

I'm still looking for the cost per unit. There doesn't appear to be any pricing information on the website. Just how many car washes are we gonna have to host to afford one?

[Larry Mangum]

Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 15:45:32 -0500

Subject: Re:
From: pgreaves23@gmail.com
To:

$5000 per unit


On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 3:35 PM, Mangum Larry <manguml@hotmail.com> wrote:


What is the cost per unit?

[Eclipse]

Did Flying Pig's unit ever actually take delivery of one?

[Eclipse]

The Circle of Life™ program was started in September 2010 in co-operation with the Civil Air Patrol (CAP) and Trimble's Mobile Computing Solutions Division (MCS) at the Civil Air Patrol National Convention where Firestorm™ Emergency Services donated five(5) Tigerstrike systems to selected CAP squadrons for purposes of Search & Rescue of wandering Alzheimer patients.

In the hands of a Civil Air Patrol squadron, the TigerStrike™ will provide search and rescue teams with the most advanced technology available to allow them to better perform their traditional SAR functions, while providing them with the newfound ability to search for any missing person—Alzheimer's wanderers, snowmobilers, mountain climbers, hikers, children (especially those with autism and other cognitive handicaps—anyone wearing a tiny bracelet containing a mini-beacon.

Anyone else ever heard of this? 

Where are the 5 donated unit today?

[Major Lord]

Not wanting to put words in Roberts Mouth, I understand that the squadrons payment was eventually refunded by Firestorm. I would love to talk to a representative from any of the Squadrons that have a unit. Any idea who these might be? ( I love the taste of crow, and identifying these Squadrons would be a great way to make me eat my words!) Tracking very low power Alzheimer patient transmitters is a tough challenge, and would be an excellent "Micro" application to validate the incredible claims about the unit. I don't know Major Grogan, so not immediately accepting his opinions at face value is no reflection on a man who I am confident must be an excellent officer. I would just prefer to have an evaluation from someone who is known to be a qualified and disinterested third party.

Major Lord

[Larry Mangum]

Major Grogan, was the DO for PLR at Beale AFB, until his retirement. Having said that, Major Grogan is not a SAR expert, and while he may have seen the units in action, I would want to see an evaluation conducted by accomplished SAR personnel.

[JoeTomasone]

-Demonstrated in a recent SAREX with CAP wing in Tampa where it located a ELT at 3.1 nautical miles in 30 seconds

Which SAREX, and to whom was it demonstrated?  I am located in Tampa and was not aware of this.

Incidentally, $5000 for one Tigerstrike = 16 MK4 Sniffer setups with mobile and handheld antennas.

[Major Lord]

The Circle of Life™ program was started in September 2010 in co-operation with the Civil Air Patrol (CAP) and Trimble's Mobile Computing Solutions Division (MCS) at the Civil Air Patrol National Convention where Firestorm™ Emergency Services donated five(5) Tigerstrike systems to selected CAP squadrons for purposes of Search & Rescue of wandering Alzheimer patients.

In the hands of a Civil Air Patrol squadron, the TigerStrike™ will provide search and rescue teams with the most advanced technology available to allow them to better perform their traditional SAR functions, while providing them with the newfound ability to search for any missing person—Alzheimer's wanderers, snowmobilers, mountain climbers, hikers, children (especially those with autism and other cognitive handicaps—anyone wearing a tiny bracelet containing a mini-beacon.

Anyone else ever heard of this? 

Where are the 5 donated unit today?

I can't find any reference to the "Circle of Life" program, or news releases relating to the cooperative arrangement between CAP and Trimble in either CAP or Trimble media archives. Trimble seems unaware of the relationship, but will hopefully point me in the right direction. I could find no publications referring to any agreements between CAP and Trimble. I could not find any mention of this relationship or the gift of the DF units in the 2010 Convention archives. Could you clarify this? Was there actually a Cooperative arrangement between Trimble and CAP? Or does this refer to an informal "handshake" deal between the CAP member principals of Firestorm and someone with Trimble? I am confused.

Major Lord

[Larry Mangum]

I saw Maj Craig and several other people present the units to CAP at the national boards in San Diego.  However were the units wound up at nobody seems to know.

[Major Lord]

I saw Maj Craig and several other people present the units to CAP at the national boards in San Diego.  However were the units wound up at nobody seems to know.

Roger that, there is probably a program or something on it somewhere.

Major Lord

[caprescue]

one last time........

Al ... who did you contact at Trimble for you to make that statement? Are you suggesting that his not true? Who did you talk to at CAP Natl about the arrangement? Clearly they are in place and why do you think you are entitled to see them?   Let's keep this civil .... Do you have any technology questions on what I posted I would be happy to answer.

As for pricing, the cost of the Yuma is about $3000 or the Nomad from Trimble is $1890, that is why the price is higher, but remember the functionality is more that we have had before. Look the Aircrews get Beckers that only work on one of the 406 frequencies for 22K, as ground teams why shouldnt we have new technology equipment?

[Major Lord]

Murray,

As I mentioned, my sources were based on the archives of public relations from Trimble and CAP. I am merely asking who made these agreements. If you say that they exist, like the Tigerstike, just show them to us. If this is too secret to reveal, super.  A significant donation like a Tigerstrike  would be on the Squadron or units property log, isn't that correct? So there should be no secret about who has them. I suspect that just raising the issues will help shed some light on these questions. I am not stating that your  representations are not true, I am just seeking clarification. After all, the PR archives are not authoritative. The actual location of the DF receivers seems to be (ironically enough) unable to be found. I am sure that in light of the fundraising regulations that CAP has in place, a paper trail authorizing the acceptance of the units should not be too hard to find.

Best regards,

Major Lord

[vento]

Let's see...
Eclipse made a statement and Major Lord ask for clarification because he couldn't find anything in the public sites.

Before Eclipse had a chance to respond, caprescue comes in and asks to "keep this civil..."

Why would a new CT member take all this so personal is beyond what my little brain with limited cell can handle. What I know is that we are drifting way off the original subject. Can a MOD either split this thread into something else or lock it for good? Please.

[Larry Mangum]

Let's see...
Eclipse made a statement and Major Lord ask for clarification because he couldn't find anything in the public sites.

Before Eclipse had a chance to respond, caprescue comes in and asks to "keep this civil..."

Why would a new CT member take all this so personal is beyond what my little brain with limited cell can handle. What I know is that we are drifting way off the original subject. Can a MOD either split this thread into something else or lock it for good? Please.

Because the new member is the Chief Technology Officer of the company that made the units and a CAP Major attached to NHQ as the head of the "CAP-Canadian SAR Actvities Committee".  See page 31 of the CAP/USAF Directory that can be down loaded from eServices.

[Major Lord]

The thread initially consisted of a discussion of the MK4 Sniffer, a newbie popped up redirecting the discussion to the new and amazing TigerStrike, which he alleged, would make everything else look like antiques ( or words to similar effect) The discussion has centered around the veracity of that and related claims. The newbie turned out to be a TigerStrike Operative, and was identified as such rather quickly. The "CTO" of Firestorm came to this board in a nearly identical way, inferring that he was a third party introducing us to a new product, and not identifying his affiliation with the product. Since these were CAP NHQ members marketing to CAP units, I was concerned about the possible conflict of interest. Firestorm went so far as to post photos of CAP members in "Caltrans" shirts on their old website.

Most of us have seen, used, tested, or handled the other RDF products on the market, and while many have proven to be lacking, none at least seen to be just complete vapor ware. I am merely asking for some evidence of the claims made by Firestorm about their alleged product and their company in general. Much like Murray, I would love to be able to focus on the technology, but so far, they have not been able to actually present a working product. Claims about endorsements, customers, donations, etc have not proven to be verifiable.

If the initiator of the thread feels that I have hijacked his thread, I sincerely apologize, and I would hate to have discussion of the an actual product from a proven source cutoff just because a few overeager salespeople jumped into the fray with unsubstantiated claims. There is a TigerStrike Yahoo Discussion group board, or there was, so I am more than happy to take the discussion there and spare you my obvious skepticism. Personally, I still like L-Pers, and like the Colt 1911, it has proven its worth time and time again. The MK4 is cool, but needs more users to go run actual missions before we have enough data to do a fair comparison.



Major Lord

[vento]

..... The MK4 is cool, but needs more users to go run actual missions before we have enough data to do a fair comparison.

Major Lord

I hear you Sir. Actually I like the standard CAP issued cheese block (better than the older wooden stick).

However the MK4 is cool because it is affordable. It's within my personal limit to spend my own money and acquire one MK4 to be kept in my car at all times. I myself and some other members that live in the same town are 45 minutes driving from the storage where our squadron equipment is stored.  Also, it is nice to have extra equipment around when the need arises in an actual mission where all CAP standard issued are deployed and more is needed. When every minute counts, having something is better than having nothing.

The TigerStrike looks good on paper and from what I am reading here it carries a large price tag with it too. I don't think I can shed that kind of money for a piece of equipment to be kept in my car at all tmes without some major compromise with my wife first.  :angel:

If the TigerStrike is as good as it claims to be, then IMHO it deserves a thread of its own instead of piggyback riding on the MK4 thread and comparing apples to oranges. Just my two cents.

[Major Lord]

I agree. One very cool thing about the MK4 is how easy and inexpensive it is to use for conventional ham radio "fox hunts". You don't even technically need to be a ham, since you are only receiving, not transmitting, and Fox hunting is a great way to keep those DF skills in tip top shape. The fact that it will cover a very wide band ( although you really need an antenna for 2 meters and one for 121.X to work well) and does not cost a lot, is icing on the cake. The directional ambiguity of a Yagi ( The Tigerstrike by the way does not use a Yagi, which Murray will enjoy addressing) is greater than a switched antenna, phase-shift or Time Difference of Arrival design, but the advantage of having a gain antenna allowing you to pull in those very weak signals makes up for the wider antenna lobes. I wish the MK4 guy hand an American distributor!

Major Lord

[Pyrrdin]

Hi all,
I am a amateur radio operator and a well seasoned T-Hunter, over 30 years.

I am reading your thread about the MK4 and I found a site that has a link to a guy who sells T-hunting antennas for Ham, CAP & custom DF antennas for your desired frequency.  I believe he also sells the MK4 as well.  I have used his antennas and they are very well made and very directional. The front to back & gain is superb.  As far as I know he is the only person the the US that sells the MK4 with his antennas or by it's self.

www.thunter.org  go to the link page and then to Ham site or something like that.  Sorry I don't have access to it from here.  The link your looking for will be something like  _____ Antennas. 

I am very interested in new designs and ways of hunting a transmitter so I keep an ear out and this thread caught my eye and I thought I would pop in and pass on the information I had.

Thanks you guys and gals for all the hard work you put into helping others.

I hope that helps for you who are looking for a supplier in the US for the MK4.

Problem for me is they are not water proof and don't take a beating very well but they work great!

~C

[Larry Mangum]

Hmm Bob Miller, who is the guy referred to in the above post, is oh wait, a partner in Firestorm Emergency Services.

[Major Lord]

Firestorm Ltd for the longest time was a Nevada Corporation in suspense , but they are now I believe a WA corporation. Its pretty clear that they have a number of very close "contacts" in Operations and other areas in CAP who could potentially be in a position to help them sell their products, if and when they become available. There is another prominent member of CAP in CAWG who I believe may be invested in Firestorm. It is remarkable that discussion of the TigerStrike seems to be such a powerful recruiting tool for Captalk; Lots of brand new anonymous newbies seem to pop up whenever the subject arises.

I hope that Al Sayre can gain access to a TS and let us know how it compares to other products. It is absolutely amazing that of 5 Units handed out just a few short months ago to "select units" none can be located, and no one seems to even know to whom they were given. Remarkable.

Major Lord