Suggested Change to Photo ID

[2ltAlexD]

Hi there everyone. I had a big problem today when I went to the bx for uniform items. They held me on base for twenty minutes, the people at the gate, and at first told me CAP can't access the base and I have been going for uniform items for a year there now. Finally they called someone and found the regulations regarding CAP and the bx and let me in, but I felt like a total criminal being held there waiting in the car to get in. I think on the back of the photo id it should say something like, "Authorized to patronize AAFES for uniform items" or something like the CG Aux ones do. Maybe it will help when I have my CG Aux id as well so I'll have two aux ids to show that I'm not bad.

[Al Sayre]

I'd recommend you keep a copy of CAPR 147-1 in your wallet or glove box...  http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/u_082503080356.pdf

[wuzafuzz]

I'd recommend you keep a copy of CAPR 147-1 in your wallet or glove box...  http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/u_082503080356.pdf

Is there a matching AF regulation or instruction?  The folks at the gate may not be impressed by a CAP regulation.

My ancient (circa 1981) Sea Cadet ID card did include a statement about exchange priviliges on the back.  It quoted the pertinent Navy regulation so doubters could look it up.  Getting through the gate was another story, but it worked like a charm at the exchange.

[Hawk200]

I'd recommend you keep a copy of CAPR 147-1 in your wallet or glove box...  http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/u_082503080356.pdf

Is there a matching AF regulation or instruction?  The folks at the gate may not care much about a CAP regulation.

They don't. But the Army Regulation 215-8/AFI 34-211(I) joint pub referenced in 147-1 would probably be useful.

Edit:

This will probably be useful: http://www.army.mil/usapa/epubs/pdf/r215_8.pdf

[Hawk200]

...My ancient (circa 1981) Sea Cadet ID card did include a statement about exchange priviliges on the back.  It quoted the pertinent Navy regulation so doubters could look it up.  Getting through the gate was another story, but it worked like a charm at the exchange.

That would be handy. Seems like it used to be on CAP ID's, but I don't remember when.

[RiverAux]

I think it would definitely need to reference a specific AF regulation to be useful.  Otherwise you've just got some ID they've never seen that claims to allow access.  No reason for them to believe a statement like that. 

[MIKE]

... Maybe it will help when I have my CG Aux id as well so I'll have two aux ids to show that I'm not bad.

You may be in the same boat (pun intended)... While you would be authorized to shop at AAFES MCSS or NEX for uniform items only, the back of the Aux ID states: "AUTHORIZED PATRONAGE COAST GUARD EXCHANGE/MWR".

[jimmydeanno]

While the regulation may state that you can use the MCSS for uniform supplies, ultimately it is up to the installation commander to authorize your visit to the base.  If, for some reason, he says "Those Civilian Air Patrolers are more of a headache than its worth..." he can stop CAP members from being on his base.

While it may be inconvenient to get stopped when there is a new guard at the gate, remember that you are  ultimately a guest to the base and if you want to get on, you have to play their game.

But, as was pointed out, it may be a little easier if you come prepared with a copy of some regulations.

[Eclipse]

Is there a matching AF regulation or instruction?

Yes - AFI 10-2701 wwwpublic.wpafb.af.mil/cap/forms/afi10-2701.pdf

However don't get your shorts bunched.  On a lot of bases who is allowed to get in is completely subjective to the personnel manning the gate or visitors center, and on occasion everyone gets randomly pulled over.

We have days where everyone is sent to the VC for a full day pass, and others where your ID and a smile are all you need.  And its not just CAP.  Recently a few of our reservists got stopped at the gate despite their CAC's because they didn't have decals and we are on the base of a service which still issues and requires them.

Putting verbiage about some regulation a civilian security guard has never heard of isn't going to help much.

[Pumbaa]

Ahhh... I get my CAC on Monday...

[RiverAux]

Although I don't think this is a major issue, it is one of those minor irritants that makes me become less excited about being the "AF aux".  You would think between the two organizations they would be able to come to some sort of mutual agreement about the form of our IDs that would let us avoid some of the hassles other civilians go through to get on base.  After all, we do have to go through background checks to be a CAP senior member.  No, I don't expect a full easy-access pass, but it is ridiculous that we have to carry around copies of AF regulations on this issue. 

[PHall]

Although I don't think this is a major issue, it is one of those minor irritants that makes me become less excited about being the "AF aux".  You would think between the two organizations they would be able to come to some sort of mutual agreement about the form of our IDs that would let us avoid some of the hassles other civilians go through to get on base.  After all, we do have to go through background checks to be a CAP senior member.  No, I don't expect a full easy-access pass, but it is ridiculous that we have to carry around copies of AF regulations on this issue.

It's pretty much the Base Commander's option on who gets access to their base.

There have been times in the past when we had to be escorted to the MCSS from the Main Gate and back again because a Base Commander had a bad experience with somebody from CAP.

[aveighter]

Yes. Can be quite vexing.  As a result of my life circumstances I have occasion to visit a number of bases.

From Hickum to Vance, Columbus, Maxwell, Ft Rucker and the Air Force Academy just last week (and a few others in-between) I have never had a problem with my ID.  Sometimes in uniform, sometimes not, I have always been treated with respect and recognition.

Ironically, on the ARB here at home where wing HQ is located, I have to call at least a day in advance to get put on a list for admission.

I agree with the above in that we probably have ourselves to blame in large part.

[Smokey]

As the AF Aux we get dissed yet the guy working at Burger King on base gets on without a second look.  At least we are subjected to a FBI fingerprint check.  The criminal cooking up your Whopper has easier acces than CAP !!!!!!

[PHall]

As the AF Aux we get dissed yet the guy working at Burger King on base gets on without a second look.  At least we are subjected to a FBI fingerprint check.  The criminal cooking up your Whopper has easier acces than CAP !!!!!!

Haven't had too many Burger King guys buying stuff they're not authorised to buy in the BX.
And most of the people working at the on-base Burger Kings are usually military dependants.

[Capt Rivera]

As the AF Aux we get dissed yet the guy working at Burger King on base gets on without a second look.  At least we are subjected to a FBI fingerprint check.  The criminal cooking up your Whopper has easier acces than CAP !!!!!!

Haven't had too many Burger King guys buying stuff they're not authorised to buy in the BX.
And most of the people working at the on-base Burger Kings are usually military dependants.

are you sure these contractors don't get some sort of background check?

[Smokey]

From what I've been told, no background checks on the workers there or the vendors in the BX.  Others allowed on are folks like appliance repairmen (like Sears) cable TV folks, etc.  They just show ID, usually a drivers lic, at the gate and go right on through.

And although some of the Burger King workers are dependants, others are Joe off the street.  They get base access without question.

[Airrace]

While the regulation may state that you can use the MCSS for uniform supplies, ultimately it is up to the installation commander to authorize your visit to the base.  If, for some reason, he says "Those Civilian Air Patrolers are more of a headache than its worth..." he can stop CAP members from being on his base.

While it may be inconvenient to get stopped when there is a new guard at the gate, remember that you are  ultimately a guest to the base and if you want to get on, you have to play their game.

But, as was pointed out, it may be a little easier if you come prepared with a copy of some regulations.

I would perfer no changes. Just call ahead in advance to your local military base and get comfirmation that you can get on base. Don't forget to get the persons name that you talked to for a refrence just in case you are denied entrance to the base.

[Eclipse]

This is a place where your State Director can be of great help.

[AlphaSigOU]

My Department of the Army civilian contractor CAC card actually has imprinted on the face specific exchange/MWR privileges I can use. (AAFES is the only game in town on Kwajalein!)

I'll agree  that when - and if - they update the CAP ID card (not the library card membership card - that should go away) they could add the following blurb on the face of the card:

Authorized Patronage:

Limited Exchange (AR 215-8/AFI 34-211) and limited MWR with military support authorization (MSA) letter; MCSS and food court only without MSA.

My two cents' worth - before taxes take it all away!